13:51:23 RRSAgent has joined #ldp 13:51:23 logging to http://www.w3.org/2012/06/25-ldp-irc 13:51:25 RRSAgent, make logs 181 13:51:25 Zakim has joined #ldp 13:51:27 Zakim, this will be 13:51:27 I don't understand 'this will be', trackbot 13:51:28 Meeting: Linked Data Platform (LDP) Working Group Teleconference 13:51:28 Date: 25 June 2012 13:52:04 Agenda: http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/wiki/Meetings:Telecon2012.06.25 13:53:25 ruben1 has joined #ldp 13:53:45 ruben1 has left #ldp 13:54:05 ruben1 has joined #ldp 13:57:01 krp has joined #ldp 13:57:25 SteveS has joined #ldp 13:59:14 zakim, who is here? 13:59:14 sorry, ruben1, I don't know what conference this is 13:59:15 On IRC I see SteveS, krp, ruben1, Zakim, RRSAgent, svillata, rgarcia, ghard, Arnaud, JohnArwe, LeeF, oberger, MacTed, AndyS, betehess, achille-zappa, sandro, Yves, trackbot, ericP 13:59:29 ruben1 has left #ldp 13:59:45 Ruben has joined #ldp 13:59:52 cgueret_work has joined #ldp 14:00:18 zkim, this is 53794 14:00:21 zakim, this is 53794 14:00:21 ok, AndyS; that matches SW_LDP()10:00AM 14:00:29 +Steve_Speicher 14:00:31 zakim, who is on the phone? 14:00:31 On the phone I see ??P0, ??P1, +329331aaaa, Arnaud, ??P4, ??P5, ??P6, Steve_Speicher 14:00:37 -??P5 14:00:44 + +1.510.206.aabb 14:00:44 zakim, this is aaaa 14:00:45 sorry, Ruben, I do not see a conference named 'aaaa' in progress or scheduled at this time 14:00:47 +OpenLink_Software 14:00:59 Zakim, OpenLink_Software is temporarily me 14:01:01 Zakim, mute me 14:01:02 zakim, this is Steve_Speicher 14:01:04 +MacTed; got it 14:01:04 Zakim, who's here? 14:01:06 MacTed should now be muted 14:01:09 Zakim, I am aaaa 14:01:10 sorry, SteveS, I do not see a conference named 'Steve_Speicher' in progress or scheduled at this time 14:01:12 JacekKopecky has joined #ldp 14:01:17 +??P12 14:01:19 On the phone I see ??P0, ??P1, +329331aaaa, Arnaud, ??P4, ??P6, Steve_Speicher, +1.510.206.aabb, MacTed (muted), ??P12 14:01:19 zakim, I am aaaa 14:01:23 zakim, ??P12 is me 14:01:23 +??P11 14:01:25 + +1.845.433.aacc 14:01:28 Zakim, aaaa is Ruben 14:01:31 zakim, this JohnArwe 14:01:31 +Ruben; got it 14:01:35 On IRC I see JacekKopecky, cgueret_work, Ruben, SteveS, krp, Zakim, RRSAgent, svillata, rgarcia, ghard, Arnaud, JohnArwe, LeeF, oberger, MacTed, AndyS, betehess, achille-zappa, 14:01:40 ... sandro, Yves, trackbot, ericP 14:01:42 sorry, Ruben, I do not see a party named 'aaaa' 14:01:49 Zakim, Steve_Speicher is SteveS 14:01:50 +AndyS; got it 14:01:54 sorry, MacTed, I do not recognize a party named 'aaaa' 14:01:56 I don't understand 'this JohnArwe', JohnArwe 14:02:06 +SteveS; got it 14:02:22 zakim, mute me 14:02:42 +Yves 14:02:58 Ruben should now be muted 14:03:10 mkerrin has joined #ldp 14:03:16 Zakim, who's noisy? 14:03:36 cygri has joined #ldp 14:03:40 +??P19 14:03:48 MacTed, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: ??P0 (28%), ??P1 (48%), Arnaud (22%), ??P19 (82%) 14:03:50 zakim, code? 14:03:59 +LeeF 14:03:59 Zakim, mute ??p0 14:04:00 cygri, it's 53794 14:04:01 Zakim, mute ??p1 14:04:03 +EricP 14:04:10 the conference code is 53794 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 sip:zakim@voip.w3.org), cygri 14:04:10 Zakim, mute ??p19 14:04:13 ??P0 should now be muted 14:04:15 ??P1 should now be muted 14:04:19 ??P19 should now be muted 14:04:27 +mhausenblas 14:04:40 zakim, i'm with mhausenblas 14:04:42 +cygri; got it 14:04:48 -??P6 14:04:49 +??P28 14:04:56 zakim, mkerrin is with mhausenblas 14:04:56 +mkerrin; got it 14:05:12 http://www.w3.org/2001/12/zakim-irc-bot 14:05:15 for help 14:05:27 +??P6 14:05:31 svillata on phone 14:05:37 zakim, aabb is dret 14:05:37 +dret; got it 14:05:43 -??P28 14:05:51 Zakim, mute ??p6 14:05:54 ??P6 should now be muted 14:06:08 ??p6 is the noisy line... I don't know who that is 14:06:19 +??P28 14:06:23 +1! much nicer sound 14:06:24 -??P4 14:06:39 +??P4 14:06:51 Zakim, unmute me 14:06:51 MacTed should no longer be muted 14:06:52 zakim, ??P4 is ghard 14:06:52 +ghard; got it 14:07:10 Zakim, mute ghard 14:07:10 ghard should now be muted 14:07:13 zakim, aacc is JohnArwe 14:07:13 +JohnArwe; got it 14:07:17 Zakim, umute ghard 14:07:17 I don't understand 'umute ghard', MacTed 14:07:20 Zakim, unmute ghard 14:07:20 ghard should no longer be muted 14:07:29 wrong guess about the echoer... 14:07:40 Zakim, who's noisy? 14:07:44 zakim, ??P0 may be me 14:07:44 +JacekKopecky?; got it 14:07:50 MacTed, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: Arnaud (9%), MacTed (25%), Yves (10%), ??P28 (24%) 14:07:56 Zakim, mute ??p28 14:07:56 ??P28 should now be muted 14:08:11 zakim, mute me 14:08:11 JacekKopecky? should now be muted 14:08:30 Zakim, who's here? 14:08:30 On the phone I see JacekKopecky? (muted), ??P1 (muted), Ruben (muted), Arnaud, SteveS, dret, MacTed, AndyS, ??P11, JohnArwe, Yves, ??P19 (muted), LeeF, EricP, mhausenblas, ??P6 14:08:34 ... (muted), ??P28 (muted), ghard 14:08:34 mhausenblas has cygri, mkerrin 14:08:34 On IRC I see cygri, mkerrin, JacekKopecky, cgueret_work, Ruben, SteveS, krp, Zakim, RRSAgent, svillata, rgarcia, ghard, Arnaud, JohnArwe, LeeF, oberger, MacTed, AndyS, betehess, 14:08:37 ... achille-zappa, sandro, Yves, trackbot, ericP 14:09:20 -??P11 14:09:29 Zakim, unmute ??p1 14:09:29 ??P1 should no longer be muted 14:09:31 -??P19 14:09:31 Arnaud: if you are not in the list of 'present' given by Zakim, please tell us 14:09:33 +??P11 14:09:38 Zakim, unmute ??p11 14:09:38 ??P11 was not muted, MacTed 14:09:41 zakim, ??p11 is me 14:09:41 +cgueret_work; got it 14:09:45 reluctant to suggest this, but... could 1 by 1 unmute a single IP caller, have all of them attempt to talk, see who we hear 14:10:00 Zakim, who's here? 14:10:00 On the phone I see JacekKopecky (muted), ??P1, Ruben (muted), Arnaud, SteveS, dret, MacTed, AndyS, JohnArwe, Yves, LeeF, EricP, mhausenblas, ??P6 (muted), ??P28 (muted), ghard, 14:10:04 ... cgueret_work 14:10:04 mhausenblas has cygri, mkerrin 14:10:04 On IRC I see cygri, mkerrin, JacekKopecky, cgueret_work, Ruben, SteveS, krp, Zakim, RRSAgent, svillata, rgarcia, ghard, Arnaud, JohnArwe, LeeF, oberger, MacTed, AndyS, betehess, 14:10:05 ... achille-zappa, sandro, Yves, trackbot, ericP 14:10:07 +??P19 14:10:16 people can also quit and come back, and check what shows up on IRC 14:10:27 are you discussing anything that no secretary is typing or just looking for the noisy one ? 14:10:28 zakim, ??P19 is me 14:10:28 +rgarcia; got it 14:10:33 zakim, ??p6 is me 14:10:33 +krp; got it 14:10:35 Topic: last week minutes 14:10:42 ah ;) 14:10:42 oberger - just starting content now... 14:10:49 Arnaud: did people look at the minutes? objection to approve them? 14:11:04 +1 to the minutes 14:11:25 Arnaud: we take minutes and the week later , after review, we approve the minutes 14:11:33 Zakim, has 14:11:34 sorry, svillata, I do not recognize a party named '' 14:11:39 RESOLUTION: last week minutes approved 14:11:47 -JacekKopecky 14:11:49 kalpa has joined #ldp 14:11:51 + +1.615.891.aadd 14:11:52 Zakim, svillata has ??P6 14:11:52 sorry, svillata, I do not recognize a party named 'svillata' 14:11:55 I was here but it's not recorded in the minutes :/ 14:11:55 note that attendee list from last time is suspect; SteveS shown in log, but not captured up top, as 1 example. 14:12:10 Arnaud: there is one action pending review on Sandro 14:12:11 - +1.615.891.aadd 14:12:14 ACTION-2? 14:12:14 ACTION-2 -- Sandro Hawke to set up commonscribe -- due 2012-06-25 -- PENDINGREVIEW 14:12:14 http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/actions/2 14:12:32 Eric: no idea if it was completed 14:12:34 q+ 14:12:42 +??P0 14:12:52 zakim, ??P0 is me 14:12:52 +JacekKopecky; got it 14:12:59 it's here: https://www.w3.org/2009/CommonScribe/panel/ 14:13:13 Erik: Sandro sent an email saying it was setup 14:13:26 ACTION-1? 14:13:26 ACTION-1 -- Eric Prud'hommeaux to ask sandro about how difficult it is to set up CommonScribe -- due 2012-06-25 -- OPEN 14:13:26 http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/actions/1 14:13:29 zakim, ??P0 is not me 14:13:29 I don't understand '??P0 is not me', JacekKopecky 14:13:31 + +1.937.775.aaee 14:13:41 q- 14:13:43 close ACTION-1 14:13:43 ACTION-1 Ask sandro about how difficult it is to set up CommonScribe closed 14:13:43 +??P36 14:13:49 ACTION-3? 14:13:49 ACTION-3 -- Arnaud Le Hors to create a wiki page to capture use cases and requirements -- due 2012-06-28 -- OPEN 14:13:49 http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/actions/3 14:13:50 zakim, ??P36 is me 14:13:50 +JacekKopecky; got it 14:13:56 close ACTION-3 14:13:56 ACTION-3 Create a wiki page to capture use cases and requirements closed 14:14:18 Zachim, ??P6 is /me 14:14:25 Topic: next meeting 14:14:28 http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/wiki/Use_Cases_And_Requirements 14:14:38 achille-zappa has joined #ldp 14:14:45 Zakim, ??P6 is me 14:14:45 I already had ??P6 as krp, svillata 14:15:09 Zakim, ??P1 is me 14:15:09 +svillata; got it 14:15:13 Arnaud: next meeting is next monday, however we might have a summer schedule, as people take vacation 14:15:39 I think we should keep the normal schedule. 14:15:44 +1 for summer schedule 14:15:44 +1 to keep 14:15:52 +1 to keep 14:15:52 +1 to slacking 14:15:56 +1 summer schedule 14:16:07 +1 summer schedule 14:16:10 +1 summer schedule 14:16:10 +1 summer schedule 14:16:18 (given that most are in northern hemisphere ? ;) 14:17:47 Arnaud: July 9 then every other week until end of august ? 14:17:52 +1 to that 14:18:04 +1 14:18:07 +1 14:18:13 +1 14:18:19 +1 to Arnaud's proposed schedule 14:18:19 +1 every other week 14:18:19 +1 14:18:28 +1 14:18:30 eric: missing one out of 3 is a sure way to be confused 14:19:08 Arnaud: no objections? 14:19:09 can we do anything for the time? 14:19:14 noone screaming, so 14:19:16 earlier or later? 14:19:23 Zakim, mute me 14:19:23 MacTed should now be muted 14:19:23 RESOLUTION: July 9 then every other week until end of august 14:19:33 :) 14:19:34 Topic: telcon time 14:19:43 Arnaud: telcon time. earlier or later? 14:19:56 it's 7am in California, so doing earlier would be difficult 14:20:03 depends if summer siesta time ? ;) 14:20:37 Arnaud: we tried a doodle with just 5 people, and even finding one slot was quite hard 14:20:52 ok 14:21:08 +??P40 14:21:15 zakim, ??P40 is me 14:21:15 +JacekKopecky; got it 14:21:52 Yves: let's continue with this time and see if it works for most people or if too inconvenient 14:22:10 Arnaud: it is customary with a WG to start with a f2f 14:23:03 there is a notification period for F2F (because of travel planning) 14:23:33 antonis has joined #ldp 14:23:58 the Technical Plenary once a year, for 2012 it's here: http://www.w3.org/2012/10/TPAC/ 14:24:12 would people be able to attend that meeting? 14:24:42 +1 I "should" be able to get to tpac but would recommend a 3Q F2F meeting 1st 14:24:43 no known conflicts w TPAC for me 14:24:47 should be able to go to TPAC 14:25:03 Seems to work for me 14:25:07 +1 14:25:16 +1 14:25:22 +1 probably 14:25:22 +1 14:25:23 no conflicts for me "right now" 14:25:24 +1 14:25:30 Erik: it's more up to the group to decide. at worst we can have a small group there 14:26:04 SteveS: we could also do transatlantic f2f, with two locations 14:26:27 Nice place. Was there for VLDB 14:26:34 was not me, was AndyS I believe 14:26:39 s/SteveS/AndyS/ 14:27:28 Arnaud: if we get a transatlantic presence, it should be east soact US to reduce the time diff 14:28:07 SteveS: having the first f2f in 5 monthes is a bit late 14:28:30 SteveS_ has joined #ldp 14:28:32 Arnaud: the WG started right before summer, with lower attendance, so meeting in september while TPAC is in november... 14:29:00 -JacekKopecky.a 14:29:05 -1 to sept f2f 14:30:54 Notes on SPARQL Graph Store Protocol : http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-ldp-wg/2012Jun/0030.html 14:34:26 oberger has joined #ldp 14:34:31 AndyS: there are 3 protocols, issuing query, requests 14:35:18 sparql update allows you to manipulate the graph store 14:35:43 this is used for fined-grain graph control 14:35:54 there is also bulk modification, like adding a graph store 14:36:32 -JacekKopecky.aa 14:37:01 you can delete a graph 14:37:13 the specification is just translating what HTTP says 14:37:25 +??P40 14:37:31 zakim, ??P40 is me 14:37:31 +JacekKopecky; got it 14:37:36 it defines POST of RDF data to add things to a graph 14:38:52 you don't get hierarchy of containers, like stores of graph stores 14:39:30 PATCH is proposed to mean a SPARQL update 14:40:55 as in the first example, a URI can identify a graph in a graph store 14:41:30 a more complex example is doing indirect graph identification, using ?graph= 14:41:50 ?graph=http://foo.example/graph1 14:42:02 POST to a graph means append, POST to a graph-store means create a graph 14:42:20 q+ 14:42:33 -JacekKopecky 14:42:47 Arnaud: do you have comments on how it compares to the IBM submission? 14:42:57 q+ to ask about uptake 14:43:20 AndyS: the IBM submission has more complex things like what you put in containers 14:43:42 in the SPARQL graph protocol, you only manipulate graphs in the graph-store 14:44:07 there is only one case 14:44:12 ack cygri 14:44:12 cygri, you wanted to ask about uptake 14:44:26 -EricP 14:44:47 cygri: how about implementations? 14:45:01 Redstore implements it too: http://www.aelius.com/njh/redstore/ 14:45:23 AndyS: ??? is implementing it. 14:45:32 s/???/Garlik 14:46:54 I am 14:46:58 LeeF: difficult to figure out all implementations 14:47:00 but my mic does not work :/ 14:47:03 works fine 14:47:15 sorry... :P 14:47:29 +EricP 14:48:01 We don't implement it all in Anzo but will be completing an implementation of it in the coming months 14:48:21 (I use RedStore for a graph-centric data management stack and the graph protocol works just fine in it) 14:49:01 -> http://www.w3.org/2001/Annotea/User/Protocol Annotea Protocol 14:49:09 Topic: Annotea Protocol 14:51:15 -> http://www.w3.org/2012/Talks/0717-egp-API4KB/#%284%29 Linked Data API 14:51:24 Linked data API: http://code.google.com/p/linked-data-api/ 14:52:12 implementation: http://elda.googlecode.com/hg/deliver-elda/src/main/docs/index.html 14:52:50 -JacekKopecky.a 14:53:00 the main difference with LDBP is the link list (next/prev ones) 14:53:18 provides random access in a big container 14:53:18 +q Was Annotea adopted? what happened to it after it was published? 14:53:21 +??P53 14:53:28 zakim, ??P53 is me 14:53:28 +JacekKopecky; got it 14:53:43 app using LDA: http://environment.data.gov.uk/lab/bwq-web.html 14:53:47 (and I'm watching the server stats :-) 14:53:57 it's using URI templates 14:54:45 short-string to predicate mapping 14:55:01 q+ to explain the interaction model 14:55:01 FYI: Virtuoso has some support for HTTP CRUD operations for graphs as well. Uses special endpoint /sparql-graph-crud 14:56:01 EricP: annotea was mostly a demonstrator, paired with Amaya to show annotations 14:57:17 Zakim, who's noisy? 14:57:28 MacTed, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: LeeF (70%) 14:57:32 Zakim, mute LeeF 14:57:32 LeeF should now be muted 14:57:42 Zakim, unmute me 14:57:45 MacTed should no longer be muted 14:57:49 Zakim, mute me 14:57:49 MacTed should now be muted 14:58:29 EricP: it's just a random document, not a Team Note 14:58:55 -EricP 15:01:20 Arnaud: scribe duties is a shared responsibility, so we will start a scribe list 15:01:35 default order will be alphabetical list 15:01:39 +1 for alpha list :) 15:01:55 next meeting in two weeks. 15:02:02 ADJOURNED 15:02:06 -SteveS 15:02:07 -mhausenblas 15:02:07 -dret 15:02:09 -Ruben 15:02:09 -Yves 15:02:10 -Arnaud 15:02:12 Ruben has left #ldp 15:02:12 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/06/25-ldp-minutes.html Yves 15:02:15 -MacTed 15:02:17 -LeeF 15:02:19 -AndyS 15:02:21 -svillata 15:02:23 -rgarcia 15:02:25 -krp 15:02:28 -??P28 15:02:29 -ghard 15:02:33 - +1.937.775.aaee 15:02:37 -JohnArwe 15:02:48 svillata has left #ldp 15:02:51 mkerrin has left #ldp 15:03:10 yves, use commonscribe now? https://www.w3.org/2009/CommonScribe/panel/ 15:03:11 -cgueret_work 15:03:25 SW_LDP()10:00AM has ended 15:03:26 Attendees were +329331aaaa, Arnaud, +1.510.206.aabb, MacTed, +1.845.433.aacc, Ruben, AndyS, SteveS, Yves, LeeF, EricP, mhausenblas, cygri, mkerrin, dret, ghard, JohnArwe, 15:03:29 ... JacekKopecky, cgueret_work, rgarcia, krp, +1.615.891.aadd, +1.937.775.aaee, svillata 15:03:37 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/06/25-ldp-minutes.html Yves 15:04:08 thanks Yves for scribing today 15:14:22 rrsagent, make logs public 15:15:38 yves, you need to start by saying "rrsagent, make logs public" 15:15:46 yvesr, then you can use the panel 15:15:53 s/yvesr/yves/ 15:16:23 but there's still some error on the panel when saying "copy log", i don't know what that is. probably need sandro's help here 15:18:54 oberger has joined #ldp