18:48:13 RRSAgent has joined #au 18:48:13 logging to http://www.w3.org/2012/06/25-au-irc 18:48:18 Zakim, this will be AUWG 18:48:18 ok, Jan; I see WAI_AUWG()3:00PM scheduled to start in 12 minutes 18:48:23 Meeting: WAI AU 18:48:45 Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-au/2012AprJun/0060.html 18:48:49 Regrets: Tim B. 18:49:01 Chair: Jutta Treviranus 19:00:26 zakim, code? 19:00:26 the conference code is 2894 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 sip:zakim@voip.w3.org), Jan 19:00:48 WAI_AUWG()3:00PM has now started 19:00:55 +Jeanne 19:02:19 +[Microsoft] 19:03:04 +[IPcaller] 19:03:29 zakim, [IPcaller] is really Jan 19:03:29 +Jan; got it 19:03:54 +[Microsoft.a] 19:03:56 zakim, [Microsoft] is really Alex 19:03:56 +Alex; got it 19:04:04 zakim, [Microsoft.a] is really Cherie 19:04:04 +Cherie; got it 19:06:29 +??P11 19:06:51 zakim, ??P11 is really Jutta 19:06:51 +Jutta; got it 19:07:07 http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-au/2012AprJun/0060.html 19:07:22 Topic: 1. Processing Last Call comments 19:07:28 http://www.w3.org/WAI/AU/2012/ATAG2-CommentResponses20124010LC-3.html 19:07:39 Jutta has joined #au 19:07:55 http://www.w3.org/WAI/AU/2012/ATAG2-CommentResponses20124010LC-3.html 19:09:28 + +1.571.765.aaaa 19:09:43 zakim, aaaa is really Greg 19:09:43 +Greg; got it 19:11:11 + +1.561.582.aabb 19:11:57 Greg has joined #au 19:12:35 Topic: MS3 19:12:50 AUWG: The Working Group agrees that this could be clarified and that the stem text should change to better synch with B.2.3.3 (the style also follows that employed for the stems of B.1.1.1 and B.1.1.2). 19:12:51 The text has been reworded as follows: "Repair of Text Alternatives During Authoring Sessions: If the authoring tool attempts to automatically or semi-automatically repair text alternatives for non-text content ("repair strings") during an authoring session, then the following are both true: (Level A) 19:12:53 (a) Suitable Text Sources: Repair strings are only ever derived from text sources designed to fulfill the same purpose as the text alternative (e.g., suggesting an image's "description" metadata field as a long description). Other text attributes (e.g., the file name, file format) or generic strings (e.g. "image") are not used. 19:12:54 (b) Author Control: Authors have the opportunity to accept, modify, or reject the repair strings prior to insertion in the content; and 19:15:29 JR: No change in meaning, just removing connotation and following pattern of other stems 19:15:34 AL: Sounds good 19:15:43 AUWG: The Working Group agrees that this could be clarified and that the stem text should change to better synch with B.2.3.3 (the style also follows that employed for the stems of B.1.1.1 and B.1.1.2). 19:15:45 The text has been reworded as follows: "Repair of Text Alternatives During Authoring Sessions: If the authoring tool attempts to automatically or semi-automatically repair text alternatives for non-text content ("repair strings") during an authoring session, then the following are both true: (Level A) 19:15:46 (a) Suitable Text Sources: Repair strings are only ever derived from text sources designed to fulfill the same purpose as the text alternative (e.g., suggesting an image's "description" metadata field as a long description). Other text attributes (e.g., the file name, file format) or generic strings (e.g. "image") are not used; and 19:15:48 (b) Author Control: Authors have the opportunity to accept, modify, or reject the repair strings prior to insertion in the content. 19:15:57 Resolved: All agree on language immediately above. 19:17:37 Topic: IBM19 19:17:39 AUWG: "Relevant Sources" is only the handle, not the testable part of the condition. See rewording under MS3. 19:17:56 Sueann has joined #au 19:18:08 AUWG: "Relevant Sources" is only the handle, not the testable part of the condition. See rewording under MS3. 19:18:35 Resolved: All agree on the response immediately above. 19:19:47 q+ to say that since pattern and context recognition is continually improving, I would not want to see us forbid it. 19:19:58 ack j 19:19:58 jeanne, you wanted to say that since pattern and context recognition is continually improving, I would not want to see us forbid it. 19:22:43 Jan: But then a checker will give a pass to the author, even though they have not created meaningful alt text. 19:23:34 ... but examples such as Facebook automatically flagging a photo as "Jan's Profile Picture" 19:24:05 ... but it would still fail the part where the user has to approve it. 19:24:45 ... perhaps it could be flagged as automatically repaired, and that could be brought to the author's attention when the author ran the checker. 19:24:49 ... it could be a note. 19:24:59 +1 for the note 19:25:41 Possible note: If the tool does auto-correct during the session, the alt needs to be flagged as auto-generated... 19:25:52 Greg: the author would need to have their attention drawn to a change in content, to make sure the system did it correctly. 19:26:23 ... and upon initial content creation -- an opportunity to verify that it is, in fact, meaningful. 19:27:31 Jan: B.2.3.2 - a type of repair that is "almost" suitable text source, but it needs to be verified by the author. 19:29:37 Action: JR to write note re: If the tool does auto-correct during the session, the alt needs to be flagged as auto-generated. 19:29:37 Created ACTION-381 - Write note re: If the tool does auto-correct during the session, the alt needs to be flagged as auto-generated. [on Jan Richards - due 2012-07-02]. 19:29:51 "Repair of Text Alternatives During Authoring Sessions: If the authoring tool attempts to automatically or semi-automatically repair text alternatives for non-text content ("repair strings") during an authoring session, then the following are both true: (Level A) 19:29:53 (a) Suitable Text Sources: Repair strings are only ever derived from text sources designed to fulfill the same purpose as the text alternative (e.g., suggesting an image's "description" metadata field as a long description). Other text attributes (e.g., the file name, file format) or generic strings (e.g. "image") are not used; and 19:29:54 (b) Author Control: Authors have the opportunity to accept, modify, or reject the repair strings prior to insertion in the content. 19:30:12 Resolved: Alll accept the text above for B.2.3.2. 19:30:20 Topic: MS4 19:31:45 B.2.3.3 Repair of Text Alternatives After Authoring Sessions: If the authoring tool attempts to automatically repair text alternatives for non-text content after an authoring session has ended, then any repair strings do not include text that is also available to user agents (e.g. the file name, metadata stored in non-text content) or generic text strings (e.g., "image"). 19:31:47 Note: Examples of acceptable repair strings include those derived from contextual information (e.g., that an image is the author's profile picture) or from performing pattern recognition on the non-text content. (Level A) 19:33:38 JT: Does is this address awkwardness of wording? 19:37:09 B.2.3.3 Repair of Text Alternatives After Authoring Sessions: If the authoring tool attempts to automatically repair text alternatives for non-text content after an authoring session has ended, then must do so from text sources that are otherwise still available to user agents (e.g. the file name, metadata stored in non-text content) or generic text strings (e.g., "image"). 19:37:31 B.2.3.3 Repair of Text Alternatives After Authoring Sessions: If the authoring tool attempts to automatically repair text alternatives for non-text content after an authoring session has ended, then it must do so only from text sources that are otherwise still available to user agents (e.g. the file name, metadata stored in non-text content) or generic text strings (e.g., "image"). 19:38:02 B.2.3.3 Repair of Text Alternatives After Authoring Sessions: If the authoring tool attempts to automatically repair text alternatives for non-text content after an authoring session has ended, then it must not do so from text sources that are otherwise still available to user agents (e.g. the file name, metadata stored in non-text content) or generic text strings (e.g., "image"). 19:39:54 q+ 19:45:31 ack jeanne 19:46:29 AL: The text is an improvement...I'd like tot think about it more. 19:46:36 jeanne: wants to add an additional example (e.g. the file name, metadata stored in non-text content), generic text strings (e.g., "image") or marking the image as decorative. 19:46:40 JT: Let's cycle back to this next week 19:46:52 Topic: GZ5 19:47:54 AUWG: While the Working Group recognizes that "range" is a weak term, the Working Group considered stronger language, but no workable solution was found. For example, if we required an accessible template for every use case, would we be prepared to fail an entire tool if it included many accessible templates, but lacked one for a challenging domain, such as a calendar? The Working Group... 19:47:56 +1 to the response 19:47:56 ...decided to use wording that clearly conveyed our intent while remaining testable. 19:48:32 JT: Could we move to addressing this, by putting our strong support in as a note or other measure 19:51:48 +1 19:52:37 AUWG: While the Working Group recognizes that "range" is a weak term, the Working Group considered stronger language, but no workable solution was found. For example, if we required an accessible template for every use case, would we be prepared to fail an entire tool if it included many accessible templates, but lacked one for a challenging domain, such as a calendar? The Working Group... 19:52:38 ...decided to use wording that clearly conveyed our intent while remaining testable. 19:52:40 We have repeated the informative note under "Range" ("Note: ATAG 2.0 uses the term "range" in several success criteria in which absolute measurements may not be practical (e.g., the set of all help documentation examples, the set of all templates). While the strict testable requirement is the definition "More than one item within a multi-item set", implementers are strongly encouraged to... 19:52:41 ...implement the success criteria more broadly.") under the intent sections of all of the SCs where it is used. 19:52:56 Resolved: Accept text above (response and changes to the various intent sections) 19:53:16 Topic: IBM21 19:53:56 AUWG: A note will be added: 19:53:57 Note: The nature of the accessibility status indicator is not specified and will depend on the type of content. For example, a widget gallery might indicate a WCAG 2.0 conformance level for each widget, while a clip-art gallery might simply indicate whether an alt text string is provided for each image. 19:54:03 SN: Sounds fine. 19:57:01 -Jutta 20:00:14 Resolved: All accept "Note: The nature of the accessibility status indicator is not specified and will depend on the type of content. For example, a widget gallery might indicate a WCAG 2.0 conformance level for each widget, while a clip-art gallery might simply indicate whether an alt text string is provided for each image." 20:00:25 Topic: F2F Scheduling 20:01:32 http://www.w3.org/WAI/AU/2012/ATAG2-CommentResponses20124010LC-3.html 20:05:27 - +1.561.582.aabb 20:05:33 -Greg 20:05:35 -Alex 20:05:42 -Cherie 20:05:46 zakim, who's here? 20:05:46 On the phone I see Jeanne, Jan 20:05:47 On IRC I see Sueann, Greg, RRSAgent, Zakim, Jan, jeanne, trackbot 20:23:50 -Jeanne 20:23:53 -Jan 20:23:55 WAI_AUWG()3:00PM has ended 20:23:55 Attendees were Jeanne, Jan, Alex, Cherie, Jutta, +1.571.765.aaaa, Greg, +1.561.582.aabb 20:33:02 RRSAgent, make minutes 20:33:02 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/06/25-au-minutes.html Jan 20:33:08 RRSAgent, set logs public 20:33:13 Zakim, bye 20:33:13 Zakim has left #au 20:33:17 RRSAgent, bye 20:33:17 I see 1 open action item saved in http://www.w3.org/2012/06/25-au-actions.rdf : 20:33:17 ACTION: JR to write note re: If the tool does auto-correct during the session, the alt needs to be flagged as auto-generated. [1] 20:33:17 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2012/06/25-au-irc#T19-29-37