IRC log of egov on 2012-06-19

Timestamps are in UTC.

07:24:25 [RRSAgent]
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logging to
07:25:00 [PhilA2]
rrsagent, make logs public
07:25:11 [leimdorfer]
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07:25:23 [Dirdigeng]
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07:25:30 [AlbertoCottica]
Context: Crossover is a project that is trying to come up with research directions for modeling policy in the connected age. Today we try to think around this issue in the context of Open Data.
07:26:07 [PhilA2]
DavidO: Highlights Crossover project web site
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07:27:30 [cgueret]
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07:27:43 [josema]
wow, it's been a long while since I've seen this channel so crowded
07:28:26 [cgueret]
hi there!
07:29:18 [AlbertoCottica]
Hello Josema :-)
07:30:11 [PhilA2]
Session 1 starts on time :-)
07:30:26 [PhilA2]
Nikos Loutas starts things off. Slides to follow
07:31:27 [PhilA2]
Nikos: Lots of discucssion about the data, but who knows it's there?
07:31:59 [PhilA2]
... Assumption it means things on a Google map
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07:34:11 [PhilA2]
Slides are informative for recording substance of Nikos' talk
07:35:07 [AlbertoCottica]
Interesting: "Singapore has become a new player in the OD space"
07:35:59 [Dirdigeng]
07:36:06 [AlbertoCottica]
Most OD apps developed by INDIVIDUALS, not organizations: freelancers and reseachers. Business is unconvinced.
07:36:19 [cgueret]
Interesting/worrying to see business not developing apps using Open Data
07:36:21 [PhilA2]
Nikos: Researches and individuals interested. Big business not so interested yet - why?
07:36:32 [Dirdigeng]
Over 90% of apps are free
07:36:34 [PhilA2]
... most apps are free
07:36:54 [PhilA2]
... so business model for those that do charge is interesting
07:36:57 [Julianlstar]
Businesses are interested but open data is just data to them
07:37:12 [Dirdigeng]
However some app devs (eg Malcolm Barclay) have fer
07:37:17 [Dirdigeng]
Freemium models
07:37:20 [PhilA2]
Nikos: Most apps are Web based, some platfrom-specific
07:37:42 [MartinKaltenboeck]
Regarding Business: the needed data is not there as well as the SLAs etc to attract e.g. enterprises - out of my opinion...
07:37:44 [AlbertoCottica]
Individuals, not organizations; free apps. You are looking at labor of love. Conclusion (as usual): better not to oversell the job creation potential of OD.
07:37:46 [cgueret]
90% of apps put things on a map
07:37:59 [Julianlstar]
We are starting to see a layer of infomediaries Placr, Geowise, Talis etc
07:38:37 [PhilA2]
This IRC channel is the record of the day, yes and is public. Twitter with #pmod is for telling the world what's going on now.
07:38:48 [AlbertoCottica]
Interesting! OD Apps are geodata-centered, with 90% using maps.
07:38:50 [PhilA2]
AlbertoCottica: See ^ :-)
07:39:15 [Dirdigeng]
Some UK data is available as either open data or as a service with an SLA; businesses tend to use the SLA-based service
07:40:03 [Dirdigeng]
@phila2 will papers and presentations be available online later p,ease?
07:40:13 [PhilA2]
Nikos: Emphasis on single, static data set, not integrating multiple or using real time data (due to availabilty I wonder?)
07:41:55 [Dirdigeng]
Is there any data about how much each app is used?
07:42:02 [PhilA2]
Nikos: Surprisingly - it's hard to find the apps. It took a lot of effort
07:42:03 [olivier]
Dirdigeng - all papers linked from, and I think slides will be too
07:42:26 [MartinKaltenboeck]
Is it important for the users what apps are based on open data?
07:42:46 [TimDavies]
Nikos highlighting the importance of having better ways of discovering applications - lightweight semantics and common meta-model
07:43:47 [Dirdigeng]
Nikos says hards to find data on apps usage
07:45:03 [AlbertoCottica]
Moving onto Twitter, I am better at commenting than note taking
07:49:26 [TimDavies]
From @Julianlstar on twitter: We need to think of what the definition of an #opendata app is. There are apps/services that exist that use #opendata if available #pmod / Companies such as Parkopedia, Geowise, Placr, Spikes Clavell all use #opendata its just they aren't based soley on open data #pmod
07:51:21 [PhilA2]
Noel Van Herreweghe from Citadel (paper ->
07:52:01 [PhilA2]
noel: Emphasises importance of local data
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07:52:51 [deirdrelee]
@Julianlstar and @TimDavies - I would think integratiing Open Data into existing product is a more realistic business model than trying to build an entire new enterprise around an Open Data app. What do you think?
07:52:56 [PhilA2]
Data often in silos - still...
07:53:43 [PhilA2]
Noel: Local gov really interested. Event last Friday very successful
07:54:19 [PhilA2]
Noel: Citizen needs - demand side!
07:55:35 [PhilA2]
Noel: Links open data to Living Labs concept
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07:58:33 [cgueret]
<pub>Example of usage of living labs concept for linked open data:</pub>
07:59:03 [PhilA2]
Noel: describes iPhone apps that use city data
07:59:05 [Dirdigeng]
@deirdrelee Open Data sometimes provides the core reference data (company register, geospatial refs) on which private adds value. That's the model for many existing uses of Public Sector Information
08:05:13 [PhilA2]
Dierdre: Shows various stages along the way from getting data out there and then... need more
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08:05:55 [AlbertoCottica]
Any link to Deirdre Lee's slides?
08:06:09 [Girts]
Q to Noel - any application in Flanders which would create data by citizen feedback (e.g. reports of communal problems in the neighborhood or so)?
08:06:44 [PhilA2]
Deirdre: Shows national impact of OGD work
08:07:48 [CaptSolo]
mentions - has embedded rdf
08:07:53 [PhilA2]
Volvo race is a big event
08:08:10 [PhilA2]
OGD and apps important part of the outreach
08:08:50 [katleen_]
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08:09:37 [PhilA2]
Deirdre: Needed to get machine readable data from Galway City. Managed to get that and then triplified
08:10:34 [CaptSolo]
using _linked_ open data
08:10:51 [CaptSolo]
converted all data (csv, xml, xls, ...) to rdf
08:11:02 [CaptSolo]
loaded into Virtuoso RDF server
08:11:25 [CaptSolo]
08:11:48 [PhilA2]
Deirdre: Highlight's DERI's Google Refine extension that exports RDF
08:13:50 [PhilA2]
Daniel: What was the total length of the project?
08:14:01 [Dirdigeng]
Enriching open government data with crowd sourced data
08:14:12 [PhilA2]
Deirdre: It's part of a bigger project which started around Christmas
08:14:54 [PhilA2]
... some issues of getting into App stores takes time
08:15:02 [CaptSolo]
takes time to get apps onto Android store and Apple Store
08:15:28 [PhilA2]
PhilipD: Do you convert from KML, then into RDF then back to KML to be in Google maps - seems lossy?
08:15:46 [PhilA2]
Deirdre: Wanted to show potential of LOD so it gets enriched along the way
08:16:02 [katleen_]
@dirdigeng: enriching the data with crowdsourced data opens up a big pool of legal issues re quality, ownership and data protection
08:16:50 [katleen_]
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08:16:56 [PhilA2]
osimod: How can local authorities use the power of this to improve their planning and policy making?
08:17:30 [PhilA2]
Deirdre: It's not being used in that way by Galway... not aware of LOD and crowd sourced data being used in that way but there's a lot of potential
08:17:34 [miseru]
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08:17:44 [PhilA2]
... harvesting what people are saying in social media and integrating that
08:18:15 [PhilA2]
MartinKaltenboeck: Do you offer the triples for re-use?
08:18:36 [PhilA2]
Deirdre: Haven't had the discussion with the council about licences.
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08:18:42 [PhilA2]
... data sets are quite small
08:18:53 [PhilA2]
... want to extend the collaboration
08:19:07 [PhilA2]
MartinKaltenboeck: I was hoping that the work you've done is then available to others as data
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08:19:43 [PhilA2]
Q - which vocabularies did you use?
08:19:56 [PhilA2]
Deirdre: Dublin core, basic Geo etc.
08:20:31 [PhilA2]
Q - how did you realise the linkage. Triplification doesn't create links unless you make it do so
08:21:14 [PhilA2]
Deirdre: Within each data set, it will have it's own name space. Looking for common elements, esp terms in DBpedia - problem data is small and doesn't necessarily have many links to make there or geonames etc.
08:22:30 [PhilA2]
Vagner_br: Joins the discussion. Makes comments about what we've heard so far
08:22:52 [PhilA2]
Vagner_br: We saw simple data and not much integration
08:23:11 [PhilA2]
Vagner_br: Not being used to improve government decision making
08:23:28 [PhilA2]
Vagner_br: Noel told us that OGD is often difficult to use by end users
08:23:57 [PhilA2]
Vagner_br: We've seen lots of initiatives. many of them though are missing a use case and don't necessarily present real value to the public
08:24:12 [PhilA2]
Vagner_br: Common idea - OGD is not a trivial task
08:24:37 [PhilA2]
Vagner_br: It has become fashionable, but there are mnay countries with scarce resources opening their data without any concern about it being used or being useful
08:25:01 [PhilA2]
Vagner_br: Not concerned whether the community has the skill to make use of the data
08:25:10 [PhilA2]
Vagner_br: We need to look at the value chain
08:25:31 [PhilA2]
Vagner_br: I mentioned citizens as users and lawayers as protagonists
08:25:44 [PhilA2]
Vagner_br: Need to get different actors in the chain together
08:26:11 [PhilA2]
Vagner_br: Need to understand what kind data can be used and establoish a common agenda
08:26:35 [PhilA2]
Vagner_br: Putting data in an open format and publishing is not trivial. Need expert help, esp. with triplification
08:27:02 [PhilA2]
Vagner_br: Anotehr lesson - timing is different for both sides of the value chain - the guardians of hte data and the users of it
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08:27:26 [PhilA2]
Vagner_br: Maybe dialogue is asynchronous - we need to understand the value chain better
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08:27:53 [PhilA2]
Noel: I agree fully
08:28:13 [PhilA2]
... we called a round table and asked people what they wanted in terms of transparency, And OGD was the main factor
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08:29:10 [PhilA2]
Vagner_br: (Answering osimod) some govs just put the data out without much concerns about it use
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08:29:38 [PhilA2]
Vagner_br: So they have different view of timing
08:30:37 [TimDavies]
PhilA2 asking "If governments don't care about re-use, why do they do it?"
08:30:39 [Dirdigeng]
Does the value chain look something like http;//
08:31:22 [PhilA2]
Julianlstar: Any evidence of the government re-using their own data?
08:32:02 [PhilA2]
Vagner_br: I can't see any re-use of the data by the government. One benefit is to foster more cooperation between govs - but I've not seen it used by itself
08:32:06 [PhilA2]
Vagner_br: But I'd like to see it
08:33:00 [PhilA2]
Julianlstar: What we found in Manchester - they analysed how data was being used within their own departments. Having made the data more open, it's easier for the staff themselves to access it and they're owkting on making that better
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08:33:50 [PhilA2]
Yannis:OGD is a hot topic in academia
08:33:54 [Vagner_br]
Open data value chain by Janet Hughes
08:34:41 [PhilA2]
Yannis: We make apps so you can know things. We need more in the way of services so users can interact with the government
08:35:40 [PhilA2]
katleen_: In Felmmish community we've looked at data sharing within the government. We keep looking at this from the supply side. We should include the developers in the discussion
08:35:48 [PhilA2]
... terms like OGD prob won't reach them
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08:36:40 [PhilA2]
AndrewL: WE have an audience at the BBC what is not fascinated by data. We have a challenge to create something that is interesting
08:36:56 [PhilA2]
... focussing on the needs of the citizen is a good way of approaching this
08:38:22 [CaptSolo]
PhilA2: I wince every time someone says "we will open this data by creating an iPhone app"
08:38:49 [CaptSolo]
... iPhone is all nice if you are rich enough to own one
08:39:59 [Vagner_br]
s /http;/http:/
08:40:14 [CaptSolo]
coffee break now
08:40:26 [Dirdigeng]
I understand the concern about the deluge, but important not to let public agencies slip back into "we will judge what data to release when and how" mode of thinking
08:40:33 [PhilA2]
Gwyneth: Example from the US - immigration data isn't linked across each set. So crowd souring work can be useful for maiking those links. And I see lawyers using it rather than asking the government directly.
08:40:39 [PhilA2]
rrasgent, draft minutes
08:41:02 [PhilA2]
rrsagent, draft minutes
08:41:02 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate PhilA2
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09:02:48 [TimDavies]
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09:03:50 [CaptSolo]
there is a spare lightning talk slot
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09:04:56 [Jeanne]
AlbertoCottica: Works on Wikitalia. Chairing session on public engagement.
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09:05:18 [Jeanne]
AndreaP: The demand side of open data is taking center stage after working on getting open data out as fast as possible.
09:05:25 [Dirdigeng]
Native English speakers: do not use cricketing metaphors either...
09:05:48 [Jeanne]
AlbertoCottica: The pessimists among us worry about looking at an open data bubble. The growth and supply from cities is not going as fast.
09:06:21 [Jeanne]
AlbertoCottica: If you are judges in Apps contests, we are seeing the same people and apps in each contest. As the civil society fails to deliver, government might back off if they feel they have overpromised.
09:06:40 [Dirdigeng]
Growth in number of civic hackers is not matching growth in #opendata
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09:07:04 [Jeanne]
AlbertoCottica: Speakers will be looking at technical, legal, and social solutions to the problem. Starting with Tim Davies--human solutions.
09:07:30 [Jeanne]
TimDavies: Supporting open data use through active engagement:
09:08:06 [Jeanne]
TimDavies: The conventional narrative is that we get open data and that leads to applications. That's not always true. We often go from data to interfaces to ways of manipulating data.
09:08:59 [Jeanne]
TimDavies: We might go to fixing data, data journalism, and analysis. Many uses initially go from one dataset to create other datasets. The highlighter pen is the most often used visualizer tool.
09:09:38 [CaptSolo]
... highlighter pen (+ a spreadsheet) is the most common open data visualization tool
09:09:39 [PhilA2]
love the idea that most common tool for analysing open data is a highlighter pen
09:09:55 [CaptSolo]
... people print data out, highlight parts of it, talk about
09:10:05 [Jeanne]
TimDavies: All the ways we use data actually involve many different technical steps. Whether making presentations or sites. We have to dig deeply into the creation of individual apps.
09:11:10 [Jeanne]
TimDavies: With George Cook in Nottingham, we looked at what is involved in the open data sets. Example: release of Coins, public spending data set in UK. Lot of work in creating a tab-separated file to a clean, interactive version. People provide APIs and add context and linkable with common identifiers.
09:11:22 [CaptSolo]
... people clean up the data, put it out for others to use
09:11:27 [CaptSolo]
... next: add context to data
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09:12:17 [Jeanne]
TimDavies: Shared source code, configurations of tools, that leads to a stock of information about how to use the data. Most of these steps are invisible to others. All these stages can become unstable.
09:12:25 [CaptSolo]
Open Data -> Cleaned Data -> Linkable Data -> Mashups and Apps ->
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09:14:07 [Jeanne]
TimDavies: Open data and democracy project was the basis for the study. Many of the apps fail because one or more of the stages of cleansing, linking, or visualizing fails. This creates a challenge in the open data ecosystem. We publish the raw data because that's the mandate for the project. Different end users build from different places on the system. The data stewards have a big challenge.
09:14:51 [PhilA2]
TimDavis: Openness of the data is important - but we need to link the people using the data as well
09:15:33 [Jeanne]
TimDavies: Challenge is hearing about the uses of the data to let them connect and document the value chain and allow interactions. Some of the data in project is crowdsourced, and not government data. If we architect our ecosystems around gov vs. other data we create an artificial gulf.
09:16:12 [Jeanne]
TimDavies: Users of data have diverse needs. Effective use of open data requires more than the dataset. Open data for policy making for governance comes from both government and from other data providers.
09:17:07 [PhilA2]
TimDavis: 5 stars of engagemetn
09:18:39 [Jeanne]
TimDavies: Some of the best responses to this challenge involve deep engagement of publishers with data users. Looked at the 5 stars of open engagement: 1) be demand driven, 2) put data in centext, 3) support conversations around data...
09:19:10 [Jeanne]
TimDavies: People are challenged because when gov releases data it is often after gov publishes an analysis.
09:20:14 [Jeanne]
TimDavies: 3 stars of engagement: Engage with hack-a-thons, online and offline engagements around datasets
09:20:52 [Jeanne]
TimDavies: 4 stars: Invite people in to shadow in organizations, "School of Data" for online learning to working with data, run skill-building sessions in community
09:21:31 [Jeanne]
TimDavies: 5 stars: Build in feedback loops, collaborate with community for new resources, provide support to sustain and build new apps and resources
09:21:55 [CaptSolo]
09:22:12 [Jeanne]
TimDavies: Support citizen empowerment through open data needs greater attention to open data policy and practice, research needs to detail practicies, architectu open data technologies
09:22:38 [Jeanne]
Question: How does survey relate to findings?
09:23:16 [Jeanne]
TimDavies: Survey was in 2010 around based on survey, and followed up in depth with 10-12 cases documenting journey.
09:23:39 [Jeanne]
TimDavies: Questions are also available on that page:
09:23:47 [MartinKaltenboeck]
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09:24:18 [A]
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09:24:21 [Jeanne]
AlbertoCottica: Miel Vander Sande from Ghent on the legal solutions
09:24:26 [Jeanne]
09:25:01 [Jeanne]
MielVDS: Challenges for Open Dat aUsage: Open Derivatives and Licensing:
09:25:48 [Jeanne]
MielVDS: Research group on Multimedia Lab around semantic web and linked data solutions. With local governments we are trying to do a bottom up approach to make local governments open more data.
09:26:41 [Jeanne]
Phil--this would be a great topic for a future eGov IG on the findings and outcomes of Tim's survey.
09:27:40 [Jeanne]
MielVDS: Neelie Krooes noted that open data increases transparency and makes evidence-based decisions possible. So we all asked for the data and many governments responded with open data portals.
09:28:34 [PhilA2]
Nice to see examples of open licences other than UK!
09:28:46 [Jeanne]
MielVDS: Published now under an open data license. Show UK open gov license--do what you want with the data including making money, but need to show a contribution. Same in France and Vienna. Licenses are needed. But concerns as well
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09:30:15 [Jeanne]
MielVDS: Since governments are giving open data to the public, but want benefits to get to the public via open data. But does it really? Perhaps should add extensions to existing licenses.
09:31:29 [Jeanne]
MielVDS: Two evolutions: data co-ownership and feedback loop of applications. Most open data models: gov opens an open data portal, uses a platform, if data is wrong then uses a different channel to notify the government. Government then changes the data if we are lucky.
09:32:09 [Jeanne]
MielVDS: Evolution should be working towards one channel where public reads and writes and also notifies the government about what needs to be changed--mono-channel system.
09:33:22 [Jeanne]
MielVDS: Changes from government feeding data to the public and then creating a platform where others can change the data. This allows for data co-ownership.
09:33:40 [Dirdigeng]
Restrictions to open create opportunitities for bureaucrats to use remote control - cf first version of Canada's licence
09:34:14 [Jeanne]
MielVDS: This would allow additional information to be added, crowdsourced, etc. This lets people improve the quality of the data and takes care of it.
09:35:04 [Dirdigeng]
Need to find ways of avoiding IP ownership mess as data is corrected/enriched by numerous people
09:36:06 [Jeanne]
MielVDS: Should use a standard protocol to communicate--OpenID, full feedback, well-described information. Data owners need to invest in infrastructure rather than create reports and visualizations. Servers need same communication protocol, flexible technologies, linked data applications, version management, conflict management, trust and provenance management.
09:36:22 [Jeanne]
MielVDS: Relates back to Linked Gov Data group in W3C.
09:37:08 [PhilA2]
Details of (new) W3C Linked Data Platform WG are at
09:37:11 [TimDavies]
MielVDS presentation reminding me of discussion of Open Data Ecosystems (
09:37:46 [Jeanne]
MielVDS: Feedback on the communications have to go back into the story of the data itself. Usage statistics need to connect. Perhaps Google (or other dominant force) has the primary statistics on usage and need to be open as well. Mashups and aggregations should show sources and provenance.
09:38:33 [Jeanne]
MielVDS: Results should contribute to the original. Legal framework: Defining domains of society concerning openness; stimulating governmental investment in recalculation platform, well thought licensing.
09:40:06 [Jeanne]
MielVDS: Licenses need to enforce restrictions and engagement--who is obligated to particate in open data: governments, users, suppliers (private and public), monopoly with wide public coverage.
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09:40:53 [TimDavies]
Miel_VDS talking about the need for a legal framework. Also need to articulate norms of good behaviour on the web...
09:41:55 [Jeanne]
The new Open Government Platform is architected to connect engagement and feedback in a single place: This is free, open-source software for anyone to download for an open data portal:
09:42:07 [Jeanne]
Question: How do you see the ownership/custodianship idea?
09:43:47 [Jeanne]
MielVDS: A restriction might be that a government has to invest in the improvement of the data. If you get co-ownership of updated versions, then the license should state that everything is open.
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09:44:35 [Jeanne]
Question: Symmetry--open data is a push in one direction toward citizens, but needs to be feedback?
09:45:04 [Jeanne]
MielVDS: Homogeneous--the channel the government and public are on should be the same.
09:46:34 [Jeanne]
Michalis Vafopoulos: We need public datasets with public ownership, and we also need infrastructure. We need big infrastructure for big data.
09:48:52 [Jeanne]
Question: The information system is going to be open, but we are focusing on the data only right now. Soon it will be about an open bus--all the specifications of the bus will be published. You can apply and be issued a passport. Millions of small players with a few big publishers. In private world, many channel masters opened up to their partners to allow response just in time and benefitted from it. Then we can design good apps.
09:49:26 [Jeanne]
09:49:36 [MartinKaltenboeck]
here we go
09:49:50 [MartinKaltenboeck]
David Osimo starts presentation
09:50:18 [MartinKaltenboeck]
Title: Opinion Mining and Sentiment Analysis
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09:51:08 [CaptSolo]
09:51:45 [MartinKaltenboeck]
David Osimo: chanllenges are manifold as making sense of thousands of voices and identify the good ideas
09:53:14 [MartinKaltenboeck]
David Osimo: state of the art technology is used to manage content sentiments - content analysis
09:53:48 [MartinKaltenboeck]
David Osimo: therefore social networks are evaluated using sentiments
09:54:36 [MartinKaltenboeck]
David Osimo: argument mapping tools are used
09:55:58 [MartinKaltenboeck]
David Osimo: furthermore similarity patterns on the several opinions are used. As well as crowd soursing mechanism by voting opinions (what is important for the crowd) and thereby cluster and identify ideas
09:56:59 [MartinKaltenboeck]
David Osimo: all of this used tools are freely available or of very low cost - what is very important that it can be used by everyone...
09:57:12 [PhilA2]
David seems to be saying that tools like Twitterart are easy to use and popular but unreliable. Also, simple tools to gather opinions from Web users are easy to use but unreliable... Hm.. that's a theme then!
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09:58:37 [MartinKaltenboeck]
David Osimo: mentioned as opinion mining tool example
09:59:34 [Jeanne]
Interesting comments on democratization on content production and visualization, but not on the analysis of the data.
09:59:40 [CaptSolo]
- let people filter content by voting (e.g., UserVoice service)
09:59:59 [CaptSolo]
-- ineffective for identifying good ideas, generating innovation (people vote on simple things)
10:00:18 [MartinKaltenboeck]
David Osimo: democratisation of content analysis is missing because the respective software is too expensive
10:01:37 [MartinKaltenboeck]
Question: there are different tools available as
10:01:55 [MartinKaltenboeck]
David Osimo: only freely available for R&D projects
10:03:32 [Dirdigeng]
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10:04:10 [MartinKaltenboeck]
David Osimo: for real opinion mining there is a lack of tools available for everyone - it is a difference to sentiment analysis.
10:05:45 [frogmella]
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10:06:31 [MartinKaltenboeck]
David Osimo: future challenges for opinion mining: reduce human efforts; identify GOOOD ideas (not only ideas); question of investment because of costs of the available software; usability: tools are very very technical and lack of usability and thereby are less inclusive;
10:07:07 [MartinKaltenboeck]
David Osimo: more information available in the slides - available soon
10:08:24 [MartinKaltenboeck]
Question: also 'big elephants' as facebook, Google etc see things that govs does not see...
10:09:18 [MartinKaltenboeck]
David Osimo: this should be taken into account for the future research - to include this opportunities
10:09:50 [Dirdigeng]
10:09:55 [MartinKaltenboeck]
PhilA2: you cannot extract meaningful information from tweets cause of the length of the text
10:09:56 [froglegstew]
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10:10:51 [MartinKaltenboeck]
PhilA2: free tools use generic algorithms - to produce good tools is lots of efforts
10:13:25 [MartinKaltenboeck]
Remark: we can put specific opinions into several places by pressing 'one button' and can also collect all reactions on this with pressing another 'button' - this is dangerous.
10:13:52 [olivier]
s/Remark/Remark by Yannis/
10:15:09 [TimDavies]
David Osimo has highlighted inequality of access to analytic tools between citizens and governments. Can address this by promoting greater availability of open tools to an extent. But John Erickson has highlighted that Corporations may always have more access to data and tools than citizens or governments that they can use for influencing policy. Can this be solved technically? Or does it require regulatory response on how corporations can input into policy,
10:15:24 [MartinKaltenboeck]
Katleen: are you using personal data for this research? Frida: riot tweet analysis: learned that using only machines is dangerous - human beings are needed for this.
10:18:17 [katleen]
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10:18:52 [MartinKaltenboeck]
David Osimo: only dealwith public opinion mining; but also this data collected at scale brings different output; loudest voices: there are methods how to treat to avoid just to hear & take into account the loudest voices...
10:19:28 [deirdrelee]
insightful vs inciteful......interesting use of words in deliberation sphere :)
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10:19:29 [MartinKaltenboeck]
Efthimios Tambouris, University of Macedonia - starts presentation: Augmenting Open Government Data with Social Media Data
10:21:00 [CaptSolo]
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10:21:57 [MartinKaltenboeck]
Efthimios Tambouris: OGD characteristiscs as an introduction (various formats, domains,large numbers, ...)
10:24:12 [MartinKaltenboeck]
Efthimios Tambouris: OGD and SMD (social media data) comparison. Aim of research: integration of OGD and SDM
10:24:34 [MartinKaltenboeck]
Efthimios Tambouris: proof of concepts done by elections 2012 (Greece)
10:27:03 [MartinKaltenboeck]
Efthimios Tambouris: showcases a classification scheme of OGD for better understanding of OGD - the project also evaluated ~ 60 publications on SMD
10:30:06 [MartinKaltenboeck]
Efthimios Tambouris: Integration of OGD and SMD - challenges: e.g. identify relevant OGD data sets, transforming noisy SMD into structured data, integration issues, how to show results on a GUI (dashboard), AND: meaningful CASE STUDIES!!
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10:31:23 [MartinKaltenboeck]
Efthimios Tambouris: stage model for OGD that more and more integrates other data
10:33:07 [MartinKaltenboeck]
Proof of Concept: UK elections 2012 - 2 views to integrate: objective OGD view and subjective SMD view
10:33:15 [MartinKaltenboeck]
UK election 2012 (not 2012)
10:33:29 [MartinKaltenboeck]
election 2010 (not 2012)
10:35:50 [MartinKaltenboeck]
Example: children in poverty: integrated view of OGD and SMD - single views available - integrated view in progress by project team
10:36:38 [MartinKaltenboeck]
Aim of the project is to provide the infrastructure for OGD and SMD integration soon
10:37:06 [MartinKaltenboeck]
Anneke Zuiderwijk, TU Delft introduces herself
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10:37:38 [MartinKaltenboeck]
Points out that meta data is very important in the field of OGD - asks presenters about there opinion
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10:39:35 [MartinKaltenboeck]
David Osimo: in opinion mining e.g. the labels of differet systems including opinions are compared
10:40:14 [MartinKaltenboeck]
Federico Remiti, ETNA announces his demo at 05.00pm at the workshop
10:42:35 [MartinKaltenboeck]
Question: to David Osimo & audience: industry products could be used for policy issues also?
10:44:31 [MartinKaltenboeck]
David Osimo: it is a question of algorithms - the available products come from marketing areas, politics field (not policy making), etc...
10:45:05 [MartinKaltenboeck]
David Osimo: process design is curial to set up such a opinion mining system
10:45:15 [MartinKaltenboeck]
LUNCH break ;-)
10:45:26 [Vagner_br]
s/Vagner_br: I mentioned citizens as users and lawayers as protagonists/Vagner_br: In particular, citizens as protagonist of open e-government and lawyers as protagonists of license issue/
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10:46:02 [CaptSolo]
PhilA2: a lightining talk slot is still open. do volunteer.
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11:54:51 [PhilA2]
rrsagent, draft minutes
11:54:51 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate PhilA2
12:03:10 [olyerickson]
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12:03:28 [olyerickson]
Topic: Open Data and the Media
12:03:30 [Vagner_br]
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12:03:51 [olyerickson]
program note: Oluseun couldn't make it in time; please see his paper
12:03:55 [FaridaVis]
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12:04:27 [olyerickson]
Paper 1: Christophe Gueret
12:04:29 [MartinKaltenboeck]
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12:04:29 [deirdrelee]
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12:04:35 [olyerickson]
...Decentralized Open Data
12:04:45 [olyerickson]
...focused on European countries
12:04:57 [olyerickson]
..."Common facets of Open Data"
12:05:12 [olyerickson]
...We think of Open Data Portals
12:05:25 [olyerickson]
...Single point-of-entry
12:05:32 [olyerickson]
... usually in @en
12:05:41 [schegi]
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12:05:49 [olyerickson]
...txt oriented
12:06:02 [olyerickson]
...Facet: Open Data Users
12:06:17 [olyerickson]
...(several assumptions about users)
12:06:27 [olyerickson]
...facet: Open Data Producer Hardware
12:06:27 [TimDavies]
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12:06:42 [olyerickson]
... datacentres, max uptime, hgh speed., reliability
12:07:01 [olyerickson]
...Putting hte facets together: Who are we targeting>
12:07:43 [olyerickson]
...Data consumers and producers that are a SMALL FRACTIOn of reality
12:08:01 [charmander]
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12:08:02 [olyerickson]
...So: Data sharing need and issues
12:08:30 [olyerickson]
...(rural farmer example)
12:09:01 [olyerickson]
...issues with sharing from this example: distances, limited infrasgtructure, language/dialect, etc
12:09:37 [olyerickson]
..."A simple question: How can everyone benefit from Open Data?"
12:09:51 [olyerickson]
...They organized workshop on that theme
12:10:27 [olyerickson]
..aspects of the olution: voice interfaces, "down-scaled" infrastructure
12:10:58 [olyerickson]
...Why voice: everyone can at least speak; good mobile penetration in sub-sahara africa
12:11:37 [olyerickson]
...How: T2S, ASR technologies need to be adopted and further developed
12:12:32 [olyerickson]
...Downscaling Infrastructure? Adopt swarm model of micro-servers instead of larger central one
12:13:16 [olyerickson]
...u-servers less costly, increase robustness, de-centralized/closer to users (consumers, producers)
12:13:57 [olyerickson]
...<image> Target hardware, portal and users
12:14:20 [PhilA2]
Can't help pointing out the lack of iPhones in that picture...
12:14:38 [olyerickson]
@phila and lots of those nokias...
12:15:07 [olyerickson]
...Some of the ongoing projects: RadioMarche, Foroba Blon, semanticXO
12:15:47 [PhilA2]
Agenda updated
12:15:47 [olyerickson]
...radioMarche: sharing market prices (NGO is in the center)
12:16:39 [olyerickson]
...<image> RadioMarche node
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12:17:12 [olyerickson], tiny server, power strip
12:17:50 [olyerickson]
...learning: with voice command, must have famliar voices for prompts (people the famers know)
12:18:05 [olyerickson]
...Foroba Blon: Timely Data Sharing
12:18:44 [olyerickson]
...Tweet-like status updates on map interface
12:18:47 [sproing]
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12:19:03 [olyerickson]
...enables/encourages citizen journalists
12:19:18 [olyerickson]
...users call service, leave message
12:19:53 [olyerickson]
...SemanticXO: sharing data 6 to 12 using mesh based on OLPC
12:20:31 [olyerickson]
...designed to be very easy to use for ids
12:20:57 [olyerickson] sharing stack for XO (aka OLPC)
12:21:24 [olyerickson]
...every XO is data publisher and consumer
12:21:34 [olyerickson]
...does not rely on central host
12:22:07 [olyerickson]
...Q: Do you have a linked data application (e.g. mashup) framework
12:23:06 [leimdorfer]
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12:24:16 [ferminter]
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12:25:24 [olyerickson]
...Answer to John's question: Data is added/consumed via "Sugar activities" (which consume the API)
12:26:24 [olyerickson]
paper 2: How Open Data is Redefining the Rols of Journalist (et al) (Andrew Leimfdorfer (BBC))
12:26:48 [olyerickson]
...will be a little off topic; they don't work with "large" datasets
12:27:27 [olyerickson]
...but relevant wrt meeting the needs of the "audience" needs
12:27:43 [Jeanne]
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12:27:51 [olyerickson]
...their team: "bbc secials" ... lots of multimedia itneractives
12:28:06 [olyerickson]
... developers, designers, etc
12:28:27 [olyerickson]
...BBC: Reach, Quality, Impact, Value
12:29:13 [olyerickson]
...They have various tangible metrics --- how many clicks, time spent on page, etc
12:29:30 [olyerickson]
... Example: Infographic for Eurozone crisis
12:30:15 [olyerickson]
...positive feedback, BUT in user feedback, "too much maths..."
12:30:55 [olyerickson]
...User feedback can be an eye-opener. Remember the vacuum in which you operate...
12:31:27 [olyerickson]
...Another example: "user friendly" Eurozone criss infographic (the one with circles)
12:32:23 [olyerickson]
...Q: What was the reaction from the dataviz experts?
12:33:18 [olyerickson]
...Another learning: audience loves infographics/apps that help them
12:33:37 [Jeanne]
Interesting BBC perspective on how readership changes with the ability for people to be drawn to the graphics, personalization of data like how much tax do I pay based on my behavior?
12:33:39 [olyerickson]
...example: personal finance app that people wanted to share
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12:35:01 [olyerickson]
...Answer to John's Q: "Junk charts" review; BBC made some changes, explanations, but held strong on other issues.
12:35:28 [olyerickson]
...Another example: "Deaths on Every Road" --- fed by FOI request
12:35:53 [olyerickson]
...Partnered with Talis
12:36:15 [olyerickson]
...hit a dead-end w.r.t. back-end implementation
12:37:34 [B]
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12:37:35 [olyerickson]
...example: eerie, artistic "roads lit up' visualization of accidents
12:38:40 [olyerickson] BBC does what it thinks its audience will get the most value out of
12:39:03 [olyerickson]
...BBC well-known for exposing data from its core domains
12:40:05 [olyerickson]
.....BBC music --- rich data because it has the program's own adat
12:40:13 [olyerickson]
12:40:56 [olyerickson]
...BBC falls in the spectraum between just users and just publishers
12:41:47 [olyerickson]
...The media has an important role
12:42:45 [olyerickson]
...Example: public sector pay (application)
12:43:44 [olyerickson]
...enables the extraction of the "real story" from the raw data
12:44:27 [olyerickson]
...looking at BBC's work as not publihsing, not consumg, but a mix
12:45:17 [olyerickson]
Q: Are comments to BBC web being analyzed?
12:46:00 [olyerickson]
...BBC comment system is not high quality; attracts lots of trolls
12:46:54 [olyerickson]
......still trying to work out a better way to do beak....
12:47:44 [olyerickson]
...Q: What is BBC doing with different kinds of visualization
12:48:35 [olyerickson]
...Answer: The analysis is still largely textual
12:48:58 [olyerickson]
...hasn't gone over to mostly visual (still an area of work)
12:49:33 [olyerickson]
...and gets ported to alternative languages...
12:50:23 [olyerickson]
...Q: Cool dataviz have front-end effective but do they lead to long-term action?
12:50:58 [olyerickson]
...Q: What does it mean in terms of technology and methods? Open-sourced, etc?
12:52:12 [olyerickson]
...Answer: doing follow-up research to see if coverage is having an effect.
12:54:16 [olyerickson]
...Also: in regular contact with NYTimes, Guardian, etc. on methods
12:54:42 [ot]
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12:56:00 [olyerickson]
Paper 3: Anneke Zuiderwijk (TU Delft) excerpt from Workshop on Linked data: "Challenges and Solutions
12:56:09 [cgueret]
PhilA2, I'm not very good at it but I could try...
12:56:13 [olyerickson]
...ENGAGE project (FP7)
12:56:32 [olyerickson]
...ENGAGE Questionaire
12:57:40 [olyerickson]
...distributed to email lists, ENGAGE web site, LinkedIn contacts, etc
12:58:16 [olyerickson] return: 246 respondents; by Mar 9, 192
12:58:38 [olyerickson]
...(early results presented)
12:59:39 [olyerickson]
...Survey included 'What types of data used," "How often?' etc
13:00:39 [olyerickson]
...Results: breakdown of where they got the data from...
13:01:30 [olyerickson]
...Results; Purposes for which the users used the data
13:01:57 [olyerickson]
...Results: Does the data meet the users requirements?
13:02:55 [olyerickson]
...RE: meeting requirements, difference between meets requirements ("able") and simply making it easier
13:03:31 [A]
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13:03:35 [olyerickson]
...Results; metadata --- 79% said they "used metadata..."
13:04:47 [olyerickson]
...Results: Which metadata would be useful?
13:05:48 [olyerickson]
Topic: Lightning Talks (Jeanne Holm)
13:07:07 [olyerickson]
Talk 1: Farida Vis (Univ of leicester) "Allotment (publics)"
13:07:19 [olyerickson]
...combines several topics we've heard about today
13:07:30 [olyerickson]
...allotment is rented land form town govt
13:08:04 [olyerickson]
...standard allotment: 10 "rods"
13:08:30 [olyerickson]
...why? Interested in understanding user participation, prodicing data people care about, etc
13:09:02 [olyerickson]
...Clause 23 of Allotment Act applies
13:09:27 [olyerickson]
...allotments are the responsibility of local councils
13:09:52 [olyerickson]
...return of monies is specified to be returned to local councils
13:10:17 [olyerickson]
...uproar over potential loss; 'threat to the good life"
13:10:26 [wippler]
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13:10:46 [Jeanne]
Farida Vis' analysis of the UK Allotment Act data shows influence of citizen feedback driving gov policy.
13:11:04 [olyerickson]
...major response to govt (over half of all rsponses)
13:11:27 [olyerickson]
...history: dates to WWII/'Dig for Victory"
13:12:06 [olyerickson]
...enormous demand, tiny supply, cycles of interest/popularity
13:12:47 [olyerickson]
...who's done research on allotment data?
13:12:56 [Jeanne]
Farida's paper is at
13:13:22 [olyerickson]
...TTWK, Guerrilla gardening movement, etc
13:13:54 [olyerickson]
...What data is available? Example: greater manchester open data
13:14:18 [olyerickson]
...locations, waiting list data, councils that have closed waiting litss
13:14:37 [olyerickson]
...FOIA results for specific key data
13:15:01 [olyerickson]
...Published on guardian data blog
13:15:28 [olyerickson]
...picked up by UK press
13:15:28 [CaptSolo]
13:16:02 [olyerickson]
...Ginormous waiting lists...
13:16:55 [olyerickson]
...Now what? Building a national allotment data hub
13:17:03 [olyerickson]
...working with local councils
13:17:19 [olyerickson]
...locating who actually has this data
13:17:30 [olyerickson]
...much of it is the local allotment holders
13:18:15 [olyerickson] and @allotmentdata
13:21:17 [olyerickson]
Talk 2: "BuitenBeter" ???
13:21:19 [olyerickson]
13:21:41 [olyerickson]
...(technical difficulties...)
13:22:16 [olyerickson]
..."BuitenBeter: a free mobile app"
13:23:09 [olyerickson]
...Take photo...GPS location...problem problem to correct city
13:23:27 [olyerickson]
...Citizen needs, Government needs
13:24:28 [olyerickson]
..."citizen-centric communication channel.."
13:25:20 [olyerickson]
...Impact: Sustainable...100K users, 60K real issues reported
13:26:07 [olyerickson]
..."Good simplicity hides necessary complexity"
13:26:20 [olyerickson]
...<architecture diagram>
13:27:01 [olyerickson]
...Twitter and blog activity demonstrating impact
13:27:40 [olyerickson]
...<collage of BuitenBeter images>
13:28:10 [olyerickson]
...emphasis on active engagement
13:28:25 [olyerickson]
...helps to create "smart cities"
13:28:48 [olyerickson]
... partner with
13:28:59 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate ot
13:29:50 [olyerickson]
Q: Do problems "fix themselves" because of twitter activity about them?
13:31:30 [olyerickson]
... See also
13:34:01 [olyerickson]
TOPIC: Full Break, return at 3:50p
13:35:05 [PhilA2]
rrsagent, draft minutes
13:35:05 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate PhilA2
13:55:35 [PhilA2]
scribe: cgueret
13:55:59 [gsutherlin]
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13:56:02 [cgueret]
Topic: Impact of Open Data on Policy Modeling (panel)
13:56:45 [cgueret]
Andrew Stott, Public Sector Transparency Board, former UK Government Director of Transparency & Digital Engagement
13:57:15 [cgueret]
unit dealing with geospatial information
13:57:36 [cgueret]
... Joint Research Center (JRC)
13:58:11 [cgueret]
...the INSPIRE directive is a law to establish an infra to share geospatial information
13:58:32 [cgueret]
... based on SDIs (Spatial Data Infrastractures)
13:59:05 [deirdrelee]
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13:59:07 [cgueret]
...does not affect property rights, started in May 2007
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14:00:04 [cgueret]
...november 2011: EU member states had to provide inspire-compliant discovery and view services
14:00:31 [cgueret]
...200000 resources from 15 members now
14:00:44 [cgueret]
...(still in testing phase)
14:01:32 [cgueret]
... purpose of INSPIRE was to allow interoperability
14:02:04 [cgueret]
... through harmonization
14:02:30 [cgueret]
... inspire is based on XML
14:03:15 [cgueret]
... INSPIRE is also an architecture: contributors can register their services to it
14:03:56 [cgueret]
... INSPIRE is not only about geospatial information, also buildings, administrative units, etc
14:04:14 [MacTed]
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14:04:45 [cgueret]
... 20 different objects - list agreed over all the members
14:05:16 [cgueret]
... metadata in inspire describe de services that are available through it
14:05:45 [cgueret]
... in machine readable format
14:06:03 [cgueret]
... make use of SKOS thesauri
14:06:51 [cgueret]
... the metadata is not necessarily in English
14:07:04 [cgueret]
... can be in any of the official EU language
14:07:14 [cgueret]
... highlights the importance of thesauri
14:08:18 [cgueret]
... inspire is already using standards, why shall it moved to Linked Data?
14:08:48 [cgueret]
... would allow cross-domain search and data aggregation by joining other eGov framework
14:09:24 [cgueret]
... this integration need a domain-independent data model => RDF/LOD provides this
14:10:37 [cgueret]
... what needs to be done to make inspire LOD-compliant, without having to rebuild it from scratch>
14:10:38 [cgueret]
14:11:03 [cgueret]
... inspire ok up to three stars on Tim's scale
14:11:12 [cgueret]
... 4 and 5 partially
14:11:43 [cgueret]
... no commitment to use URIs for identifiers, some may be using them, some may not
14:11:55 [cgueret]
... no links
14:12:40 [cgueret]
... need to define mappings and build an abstraction layer
14:13:33 [cgueret]
... issues: agree on minimal common terminology (vocabularies) and foster semantic multilingual search
14:13:55 [cgueret]
... for vocabularies, c.f. ISA program
14:14:35 [cgueret]
... core vocabularies define a minimal but extensible set of terms to describe eGov resources
14:15:06 [cgueret]
... but not enough to represent crossdomain temporal geo-graphical entities
14:15:56 [cgueret]
... spatial / temporal queries: should allow for expressing geometries
14:16:28 [cgueret]
... several approaches available
14:16:34 [cgueret]
... still an issue
14:17:14 [cgueret]
... pionnering work by Ian Davis on
14:18:08 [cgueret]
... ADMS + eGov core vocabularies are to enable cross-domain integration
14:18:30 [cgueret]
... two other new initiatives: European Union Location Framework (EULF) and
14:19:59 [cgueret]
... LOD enabled INSPIRE prototype:
14:20:11 [cgueret]
... exposes 200,000 resources
14:20:23 [cgueret]
... metadata served in XML, JSON and HTML
14:21:29 [cgueret]
... conclusion, important points: vocabularies and encoding of geospatial things and coordinates
14:22:14 [cgueret]
Q: indeed no agreement for geo in RDF but you are using geosparql anyway?
14:22:51 [cgueret]
A: use whatever is available to compensate for the lack of standard
14:23:30 [cgueret]
Q: metadata is three stars, what about the data itself?
14:24:05 [cgueret]
A: inspire says that metadata and discover services have to be open, nothing is imposed on the data
14:24:45 [cgueret]
... should not be imposed by law, it's up to the data owners to see the interest they have in opening it
14:25:16 [cgueret]
Topic: Panel Session: Impact of Open Data on Policy Modeling Chair: Gianluca Misuraca, JRC-IPTS/EC
14:28:26 [PhilA2]
Panel members: Jeanne Holm ( evangelist); Andrew Stott UK Cabinet office Transparency Board; Simona de Luca Ministry of Economic Development, Department for Cohesion, Italy; Franco Accordino, Head of the European Commission's Task Force Digital Futures
14:30:37 [cgueret]
Jeanne Holm: background in space, joined open data a few years ago
14:31:00 [cgueret]
... Obama signed a memo for transparency in his early days of presidency
14:31:13 [cgueret]
... even before, transparency driven by popular demand
14:31:30 [cgueret]
... have a feedback mechanism
14:31:49 [cgueret]
... evolved other time, from rating to conversations on Twitter
14:31:57 [cgueret]
14:32:57 [cgueret]
... initiative "we the people" in the white house
14:33:18 [cgueret]
... petition based data driven
14:33:34 [cgueret]
... everyone can suggest to change something in the gov and get support for it
14:33:49 [cgueret]
... most petitions have many signatures
14:34:11 [cgueret]
... move policy to being driven by data and transarency
14:34:53 [cgueret]
Andrew Stott: background in Gov IT and large scale systems + policy making
14:36:02 [cgueret]
... big data movement close to the open data movement
14:36:23 [cgueret]
... now govs have to deal with increasing amount of data in order to make their policies
14:37:19 [PhilA2]
Interesting - used to be a 6 month wait for a policy maker to be able to scan the UK Social Security database (which took a weekend). Now it's on your laptop
14:37:33 [cgueret]
... did some work on reviewing data from new zealand: many feedback from users
14:37:58 [PhilA2]
National UK crime-maps at
14:38:28 [PhilA2]
Police complaining about all the feedback :-)
14:38:37 [cgueret]
... police complained they have to revise their priorities to cope with the feedback
14:39:07 [cgueret]
... a lot of time gov spend some time looking for info internally
14:39:35 [cgueret]
... people in govs use open data sites to get the data they need
14:39:58 [cgueret]
... improve dialog within government
14:40:10 [cgueret]
... no systematic measure of it but visibly happening
14:40:29 [PhilA2]
UK MPs more likely to use than to get info about parliament
14:41:45 [cgueret]
Simona de Luca: recently published study on situation
14:42:03 [cgueret]
... not a lot of data, no central point of access
14:42:15 [schegi]
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14:42:22 [cgueret]
... data re-use showed to go with central point of access
14:42:45 [cgueret]
... in Italy, experiments to speed up publication process
14:43:24 [PhilA2]
Interesting that Italian 'technical government' is accelerating progress on open data
14:43:28 [cgueret]
... at the moment, working on opening information on cohesion policies
14:44:09 [cgueret]
... opening data means cleaning the data
14:44:17 [cgueret]
... choose criteria to publish
14:44:49 [cgueret]
... means need to work on metadata. Open data is a first step, next comes visiualisation and tools to collect feedback
14:45:16 [cgueret]
... not thinking about modelling and linking now
14:46:05 [PhilA2]
Focussing on mapping 'interventions' and assessing impact
14:46:42 [cgueret]
Franco Accordino: digital future task force
14:46:58 [cgueret]
... start July 4th
14:47:24 [cgueret]
... by 2013, deliver inspiring ideas (with evidence) for policy making for 2020
14:47:30 [cgueret]
... c.f. euro 2020
14:47:43 [cgueret]
... digital agenda is ont of the 7 pilars of this document
14:47:59 [cgueret]
... goal of -20% carbon footprint by 2020
14:48:09 [cgueret]
... for instance, several other targets establoshed
14:49:19 [cgueret]
... hard to assess if goals are realistic or not, but important is to find what is needed to reach them
14:49:36 [PhilA]
Digital Futures brings in scientific data together with opinions "we want to elimiate poverty by..." etc.
14:50:08 [PhilA]
Then mixes in contradictory opinions and see what comes out
14:50:11 [cgueret]
... their could be competing visions to achieve a given goal
14:50:29 [cgueret]
... we want to engage more and more the citizens
14:50:40 [cgueret]
... make every european a policy maker
14:50:46 [PhilA]
Digital Futures: To Make Every European A Policy Maker
14:51:11 [cgueret]
... to do that, will develop a platform
14:52:01 [cgueret]
... open to everyone with data access and also reasoning on the data
14:52:11 [cgueret]
... goal is to offer the same experience to everyone
14:52:42 [cgueret]
... important to work closely with the US because it's all global problems
14:52:48 [cgueret]
... "data has no borders"
14:53:34 [cgueret]
... the all commission is moving towards Open Data
14:55:21 [cgueret]
Q: petitioning mechanism sounds like a rough mean, which is also easy to manipulate. What are the limits to filter?
14:56:03 [cgueret]
A: (Jeanne) Petitions are proposed by people - most popular is to legalise Marijuana, was against many local laws
14:56:31 [cgueret]
... some less controversial
14:57:10 [cgueret]
... the government is clear about why something is possible or not
14:57:36 [cgueret]
(Andrew) first petition in UK in 2007, had an up and down history
14:58:13 [cgueret]
... one famous one was against the taxes for congestion
14:58:56 [cgueret]
... in 2009 act required every council to have a petition system
14:59:24 [cgueret]
... if more that 200000 signatures, there is a debate in parliament
15:00:04 [cgueret]
... "spending challenge" crowd-source ideas for saving public money
15:00:59 [cgueret]
... UK gov has hiered Wikipedia founder to think about ways to get more feedback from public consultations
15:01:46 [cgueret]
(Franco) 1500 responses to a call about horizon2020 ideas
15:02:30 [cgueret]
... 29 questions, big chjallenge was to process the data
15:02:52 [cgueret]
... everything had to be done manually because contained text like "you should do this and that"
15:03:32 [cgueret]
... 6 months of processing time => too much
15:03:47 [cgueret]
... writting a directive takes 2 years from consultation to end
15:04:44 [cgueret]
... aim at making it more evidence based and participatory (less reacting)
15:05:30 [cgueret]
(Simona) start by opening the data to incite for collaboration within the citizens
15:07:49 [cgueret]
Q: are we to the point where a country could no more not publish his data?
15:08:55 [cgueret]
Q: Open data enmphasises more the supply than the demand side, does that reflect some difficulties from the gov to talk with the consumers side?
15:10:56 [cgueret]
Q: how can the participatory approaches be brought forward? How can be re-define the policy making cycle to consider this?
15:16:00 [cgueret]
(Jeanne) whatever entity you represent, it's important we all share our information
15:16:25 [cgueret]
... it's more important than to worry about the number of stars (but that's legitimate too)
15:18:23 [cgueret]
(Simona) governements have a short time in front of them so need to act quickly
15:19:57 [cgueret]
(Andrew) already saw two times a redisign of policy making process
15:20:05 [cgueret]
... one for ISO compliance
15:20:34 [cgueret]
... one for not only having quality standards but also have predictive results
15:21:08 [cgueret]
... lot of policy makers don't have good data scale
15:22:09 [cgueret]
... a bit like "minority report" now: it is possible to predict which kids will be at risk before they are even born, how do we deal with that for policy making?
15:22:32 [cgueret]
(Franco) that's the beauty of opening
15:22:47 [cgueret]
... we are one big crowd that can reach consensus on things
15:23:25 [cgueret]
... we're moving onto having a way to influence a system that has been working for years in some way
15:23:39 [cgueret]
... swiss already have the right culture for it
15:24:07 [cgueret]
... and they can afford it (referendums)
15:24:19 [cgueret]
... now with ICT, new systems will be developed
15:24:38 [cgueret]
... govs have to adapt faster to an ever changing world
15:25:29 [cgueret]
... data is about the past but can be used to extrapolate to people's desire
15:26:32 [cgueret]
... it's important that the community of Open Data make it so they can reach non specialists
15:26:59 [cgueret]
... politicians that are not in the US, UK or Italy have to understand the whereabouts too
15:47:25 [Jeanne_]
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15:51:38 [PhilA]
rrsagent, generate minutes
15:51:38 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate PhilA