15:02:30 RRSAgent has joined #webevents 15:02:30 logging to http://www.w3.org/2012/06/12-webevents-irc 15:02:50 zakim, who is on the call? 15:02:50 sorry, sangwhan, I don't know what conference this is 15:02:54 On IRC I see RRSAgent, Zakim, ArtB, Cathy, rbyers, sangwhan, shepazu, scott_gonzalez, lgombos, timeless, trackbot, mbrubeck1 15:03:00 Present+ Cathy_Chan 15:03:56 ScribeNick: ArtB 15:03:58 Scribe: Art 15:04:15 Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-webevents/2012AprJun/0008.html 15:04:24 Meeting: Web Events WG Voice Conference 15:04:28 Date: 12 June 2012 15:04:36 Chair: Art 15:05:18 Present: Art_Barstow, Cathy_Chan, Doug_Schepers, Scott_González, Rick_Byers, Sangwhan_Moon 15:06:03 sangwhan has left #webevents 15:06:09 sangwhan has joined #webevents 15:06:21 Topic: Tweak Agenda 15:06:28 AB: I posted a draft agenda yesterday http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-webevents/2012AprJun/0008.html. Any change requests? 15:07:16 Topic: Announcements 15:07:24 AB: any short announcements for today? The only one I had is that the IndieUI WG has finally started http://www.w3.org/2012/05/indie-ui-charter and we will talk about its Task Force with WebEvents WG during today's meeting. 15:09:00 AB: any other announcements? 15:09:19 RB: I work for Google 15:09:26 … lead a team here 15:09:37 … one item is adding touch to Chrome 15:09:46 … and want to do it in a standard way 15:10:00 … would be best if the TE spec was already a Recommendation 15:10:12 … would like to add semantics on top of the Touch API 15:11:36 AB: thanks Rick and welcome to the group 15:11:48 Topic: Update on Touch Events PAG 15:11:58 AB: The Touch Events PAG http://www.w3.org/2012/01/touch-pag-charter had a call last week for the first time since April https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-te-pag/. 15:12:10 AB: the set of disclosures http://www.w3.org/2004/01/pp-impl/45559/status#current-disclosures is one patent and five patent applications, all from Apple. 15:12:28 AB: the PAG's discussions are all Member confidential. 15:14:30 DS: WGs do not discuss specific patents 15:14:35 … and we will not do so today 15:14:47 … PAGs, however, are the right place to discuss patents 15:15:12 … PAGs look at the disclosed patents and/or patent applications 15:15:32 … and ultimately, the PAG makes a recommendation to the WG on what to do next 15:15:54 … Among the possible recommendations are: proceed with the spec as is, change the spec, stop the work, etc. 15:21:18 [ Art and Doug summarized the Member-confidential discussions of the PAG … ] 15:25:17 https://dl.dropbox.com/u/7479257/pointevents_strawman.txt 15:26:39 Topic: Status of IndieUI Task Force 15:26:51 AB: as previously announced (http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-webevents/2012AprJun/0001.html), the IndieUI Task Force (TF) http://www.w3.org/WAI/IndieUI/IUITF had its first call on June 6 http://www.w3.org/2012/06/06-indie-ui-minutes.html. 15:26:59 zakim, mute me 15:26:59 sorry, sangwhan, I don't know what conference this is 15:27:16 AB: the IndieUI WG is under the Web Accessibility Initiative (WAI). AFAIU, it is the first WG within WAI to do its technical work in Public. 15:27:24 AB: as described in the IndieUI WG's charter http://www.w3.org/2012/05/indie-ui-charter#deliverables, a joint WG TF is used to make provide flexibility for Members that may have some IP/patents in this area. 15:27:52 AB: anyone in the WebEvents WG may participate in this TF but you have to ask Doug to register you. I agreed to do some "recruiting" within this WG so please consider joining this TF and telling other people about it. I think the work is going to be very interesting and useful. 15:28:37 AB: the TF will work on two specs: 1) IndieUI User Events; 2) IndieUI User Context. Based on discussion during the TF's June 6 call, my expectation is that at least Apple will provide input(s) for the User Events spec and that at least IBM will provide inputs for the User Context. 15:29:16 AB: any questions, comments, concerns, etc. re this TF? 15:29:50 AB: I want to push the TF to make Calls for Input for the 2 specs 15:30:36 AB: any questions, comments, concerns, etc. re this TF? 15:31:14 SM: I don't think there are any browser vendors participating 15:31:24 DS: yes, I can understand that concern 15:31:40 … but Apple is of course a browser vendor 15:32:01 s/any browser vendors/enough browser vendors/ 15:32:04 … I think people familiar with API design and implementation would be welcome in the TF 15:32:12 RB: I am interested 15:32:19 … but not sure on the time commitment 15:32:27 … A11Y is important to us 15:32:41 … If can do something like "capture the semantics of zoom" 15:32:47 … then I'd be very interested 15:33:05 … and could help get an implementation into Webkit and Chrome 15:33:10 s/zoom/zooming/ 15:33:25 … Gestures like rotate are important too 15:33:33 … We need standards for this 15:34:43 AB: I think Doug and I have an ongoing action to keep the WebEvents WG up to date on the status of the TF 15:34:55 RB: theres' a lot of stuff that could be done in this area 15:35:03 … so some prioritization work needs to be done 15:35:08 AB: agree 15:35:31 … and I think the TF already had some discusssion about the need for UCs and Requirements 15:35:39 DS: good point 15:35:51 … it needs to get on the agenda for a TF call 15:36:00 … as that will help with the prioritization 15:36:21 … We will get to UCs and Reqs in an upcoming TF meeting 15:36:46 AB: yes, that's an important task for Doug and I to push 15:37:34 … Sangwhan, I agree with the concern about browser vendors 15:37:47 DS: remember, one can join the TF and lurk 15:38:49 … Since there are Joint deliverables, if IndieUI specs are important, it makes sense to join the TF 15:39:00 Present+ Matt_Bruebeck 15:39:18 zakim, this is RWC_WebEven 15:39:18 ok, mbrubeck1; that matches RWC_WebEven()11:00AM 15:39:22 Zakim, who is here? 15:39:22 On the phone I see +1.717.578.aaaa, +1.519.513.aabb, ??P26, Doug_Schepers, +358.718.00aadd, +1.206.792.aaee 15:39:23 s/Bruebeck/Brubeck/ 15:39:25 On IRC I see sangwhan, RRSAgent, Zakim, ArtB, Cathy, rbyers, shepazu, scott_gonzalez, lgombos, timeless, trackbot, mbrubeck1 15:39:36 Zakim, aeee is Matt_Brubeck 15:39:36 sorry, mbrubeck1, I do not recognize a party named 'aeee' 15:39:36 RB: thanks for the feedback on the participation 15:39:43 Zakim, aaee is Matt_Brubeck 15:39:43 +Matt_Brubeck; got it 15:39:44 … I was concerned about overcommitment 15:39:53 DS: I don't think that will be a problem 15:39:53 Zakim, nick mbrubeck1 is Matt_Brubeck 15:39:53 ok, mbrubeck1, I now associate you with Matt_Brubeck 15:40:04 … Do you agree Art? 15:40:08 AB: yes 15:40:34 RB: I was concerned about the Good Standing requirement 15:40:42 DS: I will push back about the GS requirement 15:41:01 AB: I have already pushed back about the GS requirement 15:41:08 Also, if you are going to miss a telcon (or have just missed one) you can send regrets by email instead. 15:42:40 AB: do you know Matt if Mozilla is interested in IndieUI? 15:42:55 MB: yes, there is interest 15:43:05 DS: we would love to have implementers involved 15:43:11 AB: +1 to what Doug said 15:43:21 CC: is Microsoft a member of the IndieUI WG? 15:43:28 AB: no, not at the moment 15:43:47 Topic: AoB 15:44:00 AB: then next call will be when there is a need for a meeting 15:47:52 AB: anything else for today? 15:48:13 RB: has there been discussion about what a browser should to emulate a touch? 15:48:26 s/should to/should do to/ 15:48:34 MB: we talked about that a little 15:48:42 … there is a little non-normative info about that 15:49:08 … and deliberately vague until implementers can give us something more concrete to say 15:49:41 RB: I don't think we have enough data either 15:50:01 … but will be difficult to write apps to handle mouse and touch events 15:50:25 MB: we do have some info in the spec about the start and stop events 15:51:05 RB: we have some apps that break when touch and mouse events are used together 15:51:38 … RIM uses a meta tag to help with this problem 15:52:59 SM: think moving to a unified event model makes sense 15:53:53 SG: agree we need to move to a unified event model 15:54:12 DS: yes, moving to something like Msft's pointer model may be good 15:54:30 … or to see what Sangwhan has specified 15:54:58 RB: so, it's good to see this is in scope for the WebEvents WG 15:55:17 DS: good to have more implementers 15:55:35 MB: yes, and getting someone from Android browser would be good too 15:55:45 RB: I can try to find the right person 15:56:13 SM: if anyone has comments on my proposal or the Msft pointer model, that would be great 15:56:59 SM: fyi, Anders_Höckersten left Opera 15:58:41 AB: meeting adjourned 15:58:45 - +1.519.513.aabb 15:58:47 - +1.717.578.aaaa 15:58:48 -Doug_Schepers 15:58:48 -??P26 15:58:52 - +358.718.00aadd 15:58:59 -Matt_Brubeck 15:59:00 RWC_WebEven()11:00AM has ended 15:59:00 Attendees were +1.717.578.aaaa, +1.519.513.aabb, +358.718.00aacc, Doug_Schepers, +358.718.00aadd, +1.206.792.aaee, Matt_Brubeck 15:59:32 RRSAgent, make minutes 15:59:32 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/06/12-webevents-minutes.html ArtB 16:00:09 sangwhan has left #webevents 16:10:09 RRSAgent, make log Public 16:10:15 RRSAgent, make minutes 16:10:15 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/06/12-webevents-minutes.html ArtB 16:42:46 scottgonzalez has joined #webevents 16:43:50 scott_gonzalez has joined #webevents 16:44:25 scottgonzale has joined #webevents 16:58:05 zakim, bye 16:58:05 Zakim has left #webevents 16:58:08 rrsagent, bye 16:58:08 I see no action items