IRC log of wai-wcag on 2012-05-03

Timestamps are in UTC.

20:00:33 [RRSAgent]
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logging to http://www.w3.org/2012/05/03-wai-wcag-irc
20:00:35 [trackbot]
RRSAgent, make logs public
20:00:35 [Zakim]
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20:00:37 [trackbot]
Zakim, this will be WAI_WCAG
20:00:37 [Zakim]
ok, trackbot, I see WAI_WCAG()4:00PM already started
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Meeting: Web Content Accessibility Guidelines Working Group Teleconference
20:00:38 [trackbot]
Date: 03 May 2012
20:00:42 [Zakim]
+Cooper
20:00:57 [Zakim]
+Andrew_Kirkpatrick
20:01:02 [MichaelC]
zakim, Microsoft is Alex_Li
20:01:02 [Zakim]
+Alex_Li; got it
20:01:06 [Zakim]
+Kathy
20:01:11 [Zakim]
+Bruce_Bailey
20:01:46 [Zakim]
+ifette
20:02:04 [MichaelC]
zakim, ifette is Loretta_Guarino_Reid
20:02:04 [Zakim]
+Loretta_Guarino_Reid; got it
20:02:09 [awk]
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20:02:16 [MichaelC]
agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-gl/2012AprJun/0055.html
20:02:20 [MichaelC]
chair: Loretta_Guarino_Reid
20:08:24 [MichaelC]
scribe: Kathy
20:08:27 [David]
scribe: David
20:08:31 [Kathy]
Finish up the discussion on headings
20:08:38 [MichaelC]
scribe: Kathy
20:08:42 [David]
scribe: Kathy
20:08:55 [David]
Yeahhhhh
20:10:43 [Kathy]
Does assistive technology handle a heading and a link?
20:11:01 [MichaelC]
topic: LC-2607: Headings https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35422/20120419TF/results#x2607
20:11:28 [Kathy]
It shows up in the heading list, David will check to see if it is in the links list
20:12:52 [Kathy]
Loretta suggests the following change: "WCAG only requires that the markup reflect what what authored." -> "Success Criterion 1.3.1 requires that if headings are used, they be marked up as headings. It does not require that headings be used at all, or that they be used in any particular way."
20:13:50 [Kathy]
Question is how much is up to author
20:14:17 [Zakim]
+[Microsoft]
20:14:24 [Kathy]
Area of judgement here
20:16:15 [Kathy]
Topic: LC-2607 : Headings
20:17:29 [Zakim]
+Gregg_Vanderheiden
20:18:07 [Zakim]
-Alex_Li
20:29:40 [awk]
So long as the heading structures provided match the content, there is no prohibition against an HTML page having multiple H1 heading elements or not following a strict heirarchy of headings, nor any similar prohibition for similar semantic structures in technologies other than HTML.
20:32:23 [Loretta]
WCAG does not require strict hierarchy in headings. It recommends it but does not require it. Using two <h1> headings would not violate any of the success criteria, so WCAG conformance would not prohibit it. Success Criterion 1.3.1 requires that if headings are used, they be marked up as headings. It does not require that headings be used at all, or that they be used in any particular way. If the author used heading level to emphasize the importance of a
20:34:03 [Loretta]
hierarchically, the content can still meet WCAG, since equivalent information is exposed to everyone.
20:35:52 [awk]
WCAG does not require strict hierarchy in headings. It recommends it but does not require it. Using two <h1> headings in an HTML document would not violate any of the success criteria, so WCAG would not prohibit it. Success Criterion 1.3.1 requires that if headings are in the content that the relationships are conveyed programmatically.
20:39:53 [Loretta]
http://www.w3.org/TR/2012/NOTE-WCAG20-TECHS-20120103/H69.html
20:43:41 [Loretta]
Success Criterion 1.3.1 requires that if headings are used, they be marked up as headings. It does not require that headings be used at all, or that they be used in any particular way. If the author used heading level to emphasize the importance of a topic, for instance, but did not create sections hierarchically, the content can still meet WCAG, since equivalent information is exposed to everyone.
20:43:52 [Loretta]
Success Criterion 1.3.1 requires that if headings are in the content that the relationships are conveyed programmatically.
20:49:52 [Kathy]
Conclusion: Rewrite the response to state that 2 h1 headings does not violate the success criteria so WCAG conformance would not prohibit it. Include a reference to technique h69 and g141. Current screen readers support navigation elments marked up as headings.
20:50:22 [Kathy]
Conclusion: Accepted as amended
20:51:06 [Kathy]
Topic: HTML5: Techniques for providing useful text alternatives
20:52:04 [Kathy]
Example 6.1
20:52:15 [MichaelC]
https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35422/20120503misc/results#xq1
20:58:56 [Kathy]
Conclusion: Example is fine
20:59:14 [David]
scribe: David
20:59:29 [Zakim]
-Kathy
20:59:36 [David]
Resolution: example 2.2, 6.1 ok
20:59:50 [Zakim]
-Robin_Tuttle
21:06:18 [David]
pure decoration
21:06:19 [David]
serving only an aesthetic purpose, providing no information, and having no functionality
21:06:21 [David]
Note: Text is only purely decorative if the words can be rearranged or substituted without changing their purpose.
21:06:22 [David]
Example: The cover page of a dictionary has random words in very light text in the background.
21:07:01 [David]
Decoration, Formatting, Invisible: If non-text content is pure decoration, is used only for visual formatting, or is not presented to users, then it is implemented in a way that it can be ignored by assistive technology.
21:21:24 [awk]
As decisions about when to provide a text alternative are based on context of use, both options are considered to be conforming, but it is recommended that a brief text alternative is provided as what different users may consider to be "pure decoration" and not necessary to understand the content is somewhat subjective.
21:52:23 [Zakim]
-Andrew_Kirkpatrick
21:52:24 [Zakim]
-[Microsoft]
21:52:25 [Zakim]
-Loretta_Guarino_Reid
21:52:26 [Zakim]
-Bruce_Bailey
21:52:29 [Zakim]
-Cooper
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-David_MacDonald
21:53:54 [Zakim]
-Gregg_Vanderheiden
21:53:56 [Zakim]
WAI_WCAG()4:00PM has ended
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Attendees were Robin_Tuttle, David_MacDonald, Cooper, Andrew_Kirkpatrick, Alex_Li, Kathy, Bruce_Bailey, Loretta_Guarino_Reid, [Microsoft], Gregg_Vanderheiden
21:57:38 [MichaelC]
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22:23:38 [MichaelC]
Action: Bruce Bailey and David to provide recommended edits to the group on “Techniques for providing useful text alternatives.”
22:23:38 [trackbot]
Created ACTION-172 - Bailey and David to provide recommended edits to the group on “Techniques for providing useful text alternatives.” [on Bruce Bailey - due 2012-05-10].
22:23:44 [MichaelC]
rrsagent, make minutes
22:23:44 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/05/03-wai-wcag-minutes.html MichaelC
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