IRC log of webtv on 2012-03-15

Timestamps are in UTC.

14:55:17 [RRSAgent]

RRSAgent has joined #webtv

14:55:17 [RRSAgent]

logging to http://www.w3.org/2012/03/15-webtv-irc

14:55:22 [kaz]

zakim, this will be webtv

14:55:22 [Zakim]

ok, kaz; I see UW_WebTVIG()11:00AM scheduled to start in 5 minutes

14:55:32 [kaz]

zakim, call kazuyuki-617

14:55:32 [Zakim]

ok, kaz; the call is being made

14:55:33 [Zakim]

UW_WebTVIG()11:00AM has now started

14:55:34 [Zakim]

+Kazuyuki

14:56:41 [Zakim]

+??P29

14:56:51 [kaz]

zakim, ??P29 is Clarke

14:56:51 [Zakim]

+Clarke; got it

14:58:00 [Zakim]

+Mark_Watson

14:59:03 [Kilroy]

Kilroy has joined #webtv

14:59:36 [Zakim]

+ +1.415.839.aaaa

14:59:48 [Zakim]

+??P41

14:59:52 [Juhani]

Juhani has joined #webtv

15:00:26 [Zakim]

+[Microsoft]

15:00:27 [kaz]

zakim, aaaa is kilroy

15:00:29 [Zakim]

+kilroy; got it

15:00:43 [kaz]

zakim, kilroy is aaaa

15:00:46 [Zakim]

+aaaa; got it

15:00:48 [kaz]

zakim, Microsoft is Kilroy

15:00:50 [Zakim]

+Kilroy; got it

15:00:55 [kaz]

zakim, ??P41 is Juhani

15:00:55 [Zakim]

+Juhani; got it

15:01:06 [acolwell]

acolwell has joined #webtv

15:01:21 [kaz]

zakim, who is here?

15:01:21 [Zakim]

On the phone I see Kazuyuki, Clarke, Mark_Watson, aaaa, Juhani, Kilroy

15:01:23 [Zakim]

On IRC I see acolwell, Juhani, Kilroy, RRSAgent, Zakim, kaz, Clarke, glenn, timeless, masao, trackbot

15:01:39 [Zakim]

+??P49

15:01:49 [glenn]

zakim, ??p49 is glenn

15:01:49 [Zakim]

+glenn; got it

15:02:16 [Zakim]

+acolwell

15:02:28 [kaz]

zakim, who is here?

15:02:28 [Zakim]

On the phone I see Kazuyuki, Clarke, Mark_Watson, aaaa, Juhani, Kilroy, glenn, acolwell

15:02:28 [acolwell]

yes. Just joined

15:02:30 [Zakim]

On IRC I see acolwell, Juhani, Kilroy, RRSAgent, Zakim, kaz, Clarke, glenn, timeless, masao, trackbot

15:03:35 [Zakim]

+David_Corvoysier

15:03:58 [kaz]

zakim, drop aaaa

15:03:58 [Zakim]

aaaa is being disconnected

15:03:59 [Zakim]

-aaaa

15:04:38 [Clarke]

agenda: http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/wiki/MPTF/Agenda_Telco_15th_March_2012

15:04:56 [Zakim]

+aaaa

15:05:06 [David_Corvoysier]

David_Corvoysier has joined #webtv

15:05:33 [Zakim]

+ +1.408.536.aabb

15:05:35 [Iraj]

Iraj has joined #webtv

15:05:38 [joesteele]

joesteele has joined #webtv

15:06:34 [joesteele]

yes -- just joined

15:06:49 [kaz]

zakim, aabb is Joe_Steele

15:06:49 [Zakim]

+Joe_Steele; got it

15:06:54 [Zakim]

+??P66

15:07:18 [kaz]

zakim, ??P66 is Bob_Lund

15:07:19 [Zakim]

+Bob_Lund; got it

15:07:58 [kaz]

scribe: Juhani

15:07:59 [Clarke]

requirements dashboard: http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/wiki/MPTF

15:08:02 [kaz]

scribenick: Juhani

15:08:42 [kaz]

zakim, aaaa is Iraj(?)

15:08:42 [Zakim]

+Iraj(?); got it

15:08:49 [Juhani]

Content protection Req #8 reworded: "Content protection must be useable with specific HTML5 features such as media elements (and features (such as timed tracks) within these elements)."

15:09:08 [Zakim]

+Jan_Lindquist

15:09:08 [Juhani]

Agreed.

15:09:21 [kaz]

i/Content protection/topic: Content protection/

15:09:40 [kaz]

Present: Kazuyuki, Clarke, Mark_Watson, Juhani, Kilroy, glenn, acolwell, David_Corvoysier, Iraj(?), Joe_Steele, Bob_Lund, Jan_Lindquist

15:10:07 [Juhani]

Kilroy: want to be compatible with media source element, new Req #13 ?

15:11:50 [Juhani]

Req. #9. "Media element features that are available in an implementation must be available for encrypted content as well as unencrypted content."

15:12:08 [Juhani]

Q??

15:12:29 [kaz]

(question by Joe)

15:12:35 [Iraj]

Iraj has joined #webtv

15:13:07 [Juhani]

Clarke: Intention is that certain elements are not eliminated due to encryption ... like locating ... accessibility ...

15:13:13 [mark]

mark has joined #webtv

15:14:08 [Juhani]

Bob Lund: Two issues: what source of access to media stream, accessibility thorugh various A/V tracks

15:14:26 [kaz]

s/Bob Lund:/Bob_Lund:/

15:14:50 [Juhani]

Joe: Issue with the proposal ...

15:15:28 [kaz]

s/thorugh/through/

15:16:04 [Juhani]

Bob: Enumerate text tracks .... sign, descriptive audio to be encrypted etc. ... to be detailed

15:16:30 [kaz]

zakim, who is speaking?

15:16:40 [Zakim]

kaz, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: Kilroy (19%), Joe_Steele (2%), acolwell (100%), Bob_Lund (11%)

15:16:56 [Juhani]

?: Text tracks out-of-band not covered by encryotion spec ....

15:17:10 [kaz]

s/?:/Aaron:/

15:17:32 [kaz]

s/encryotion/encryption/

15:18:20 [Juhani]

mark W: Agree wiht the out-band statment by Aaron ...

15:18:31 [kaz]

s/mark W:/markW:/

15:18:38 [kaz]

s/wiht/with/

15:18:46 [Juhani]

Mark W: Open what to do with the issue

15:18:56 [kaz]

s/statment/statement/

15:19:01 [kaz]

s/mark W:/markW:/

15:19:10 [kaz]

q?

15:19:11 [Clarke]

q?

15:19:24 [Juhani]

Bob: Describe / identify the traks in minimum

15:19:38 [kaz]

s/traks/tracks/

15:19:47 [Juhani]

Kilroy: Encryption in two levels ....

15:20:43 [Juhani]

out-of-band for the Kilroy part ....

15:21:25 [Juhani]

Mark W: clear key not specified yet where to apply to whihc extent

15:21:38 [kaz]

s/mark W:/markW:/

15:21:44 [kaz]

s/whihc/which/

15:22:26 [kaz]

zakim, who is noisy?

15:22:27 [Juhani]

Clarke: Reqs for out-of-band ... ?

15:22:38 [Zakim]

kaz, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: Kilroy (35%), Clarke (5%), Joe_Steele (66%)

15:23:19 [Juhani]

?: Limit acceptance of the solution if out-of-band not taken into account ... like Caption data

15:23:26 [kaz]

s/?:/joe:/

15:23:31 [Juhani]

?: Enough of value to protect

15:23:33 [JanL]

JanL has joined #webtv

15:23:35 [kaz]

s/?:/joe:/

15:24:07 [Juhani]

Joe ?: Support some of it encrypted

15:24:30 [kaz]

zakim, who is noisy?

15:24:40 [Juhani]

?: ...

15:24:41 [Zakim]

kaz, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: Joe_Steele (19%), acolwell (9%), Bob_Lund (52%)

15:25:34 [Juhani]

Bob: Strt and end of trakcs not ot encrypt for browsrs to make any use of the tracks (captions)

15:26:13 [Juhani]

clarke: discussion to continue, people responses asked for

15:26:21 [BobLund]

BobLund has joined #webtv

15:26:33 [kaz]

action: Clarke to work with Bob and modify the text om content protection requirement under consideration #9 based on today's discussion

15:26:33 [trackbot]

Created ACTION-96 - Work with Bob and modify the text om content protection requirement under consideration #9 based on today's discussion [on Clarke Stevens - due 2012-03-22].

15:26:56 [Juhani]

#10.The particular content protection method required to use the content must be identifiable. ---> Change to methods

15:29:03 [kaz]

Kilroy: would propose adding identifiable priority to downloading

15:29:11 [Juhani]

Kilroy: Add: ... prior to downloading the media

15:29:13 [Zakim]

-Jan_Lindquist

15:29:39 [Juhani]

... metadata before the media

15:29:59 [Juhani]

Mark W: Supported in the proposal

15:30:11 [kaz]

s/Mark W:/MarkW:/

15:30:16 [Iraj]

Iraj has joined #webtv

15:31:00 [kaz]

s/not ot/not to/

15:31:00 [Juhani]

MIME type is not completely descripttive .... answer of support is 'probably', not strong 'YES'

15:31:10 [kaz]

s/MIME/... MIME/

15:31:27 [Juhani]

Joe: Link to MIME type extnesions ?

15:31:29 [Clarke]

q?

15:31:41 [Juhani]

Will be provided by Mark

15:32:14 [Juhani]

#11.Any parameters required for use of the content protection method must be identified and specifiable.

15:32:18 [kaz]

zakim, who is noisy?

15:32:30 [Zakim]

kaz, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: Kilroy (10%), Mark_Watson (86%), Juhani (5%), glenn (4%)

15:32:39 [Juhani]

Mark W: Paramters in the content file itself

15:32:46 [kaz]

s/Mark W:/MarkW:/

15:33:39 [Juhani]

...: scripts independent of protection systems in the proposal

15:33:51 [Juhani]

... core idea there

15:34:15 [Juhani]

Mark W: What paramters to pass .. please provide examples

15:34:23 [glenn]

zakim, mute glenn

15:34:23 [Zakim]

glenn should now be muted

15:34:34 [kaz]

s/...:/.../

15:34:46 [kaz]

s/Mark W:/MarkW:/

15:34:53 [kaz]

zakim, who is noisy?

15:34:59 [Juhani]

....: CP specific parmaters as a requirement may be more difficult ...

15:35:04 [Zakim]

kaz, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: Juhani (33%), Bob_Lund (5%)

15:35:40 [kaz]

s/....:/.../

15:35:58 [Juhani]

Joe ?: Enforcement in CDM ... general purpose applications not able to use ... ?

15:36:07 [kaz]

s/Joe ?:/Joe:/

15:36:11 [glenn]

zakim, mute juhani

15:36:11 [Zakim]

Juhani should now be muted

15:36:53 [Juhani]

Clarke: Proposal does not violate the req ... but is the req useful ?

15:37:13 [Juhani]

Req. #11 to be deleted

15:37:39 [Juhani]

#12.Specific errors relevant to content protections must be identified and reportable.

15:38:28 [Juhani]

Req. #12 is according to our previous detailed error requirements

15:39:03 [joesteele]

http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/wiki/MPTF/HTML_Error_codes

15:39:51 [joesteele]

http://dvcs.w3.org/hg/html-media/raw-file/tip/encrypted-media/encrypted-media.html#error-codes

15:40:22 [Juhani]

Is it ?

15:41:54 [Juhani]

Mark W: Earlier errors more on network etc. errors ... still to be addressed in LC

15:42:20 [kaz]

s/Mark W:/MarkW:/

15:42:28 [Juhani]

Clarke: #12 to satisfy CP proposal ... ? ---> OK

15:42:45 [mark]

mark has joined #webtv

15:43:00 [Juhani]

#13.The content protection method must be compatible with the (new) media source element as described in the adaptive bit rate proposal.

15:43:38 [Juhani]

Aaron: Compatibility should not require implementation mandatory, otherwise OK

15:43:57 [kaz]

zakim, who is noisy?

15:44:08 [Zakim]

kaz, listening for 10 seconds I could not identify any sounds

15:44:12 [Clarke]

new ABR proposal: http://html5-mediasource-api.googlecode.com/svn/tags/0.4/draft-spec/mediasource-draft-spec.html

15:44:16 [Juhani]

Adaptive Streaming - revised proposal ...

15:44:29 [Juhani]

Aaron: Source ID added ...

15:45:27 [Juhani]

...: allows two sepeate streams

15:45:46 [kaz]

s/...:/.../

15:46:04 [Juhani]

...: enables swithcing lang, different decoders, ...

15:46:16 [Juhani]

SOurce ID main API change

15:46:22 [kaz]

s/...:/.../

15:46:43 [joesteele]

s/sepeate/separate/

15:46:46 [Juhani]

...: overlapping regions, rules, ... clarifications

15:46:48 [kaz]

s/SOurce/... Source/

15:47:14 [kaz]

s/...:/.../

15:47:15 [Juhani]

...: for compatibility reasons ... to nail down details

15:47:20 [kaz]

s/...:/.../

15:47:35 [Juhani]

....: Pipesteram format ?

15:47:41 [kaz]

s/...:/.../

15:48:09 [Clarke]

bytestream?

15:48:10 [Juhani]

...: WebM and ISO file formats ... examples of usage

15:48:43 [kaz]

s/Pipesteram/Byte stream/

15:48:47 [kaz]

s/...:/.../

15:49:20 [Juhani]

Aaron: How to limit the ...

15:49:36 [Juhani]

How much data buffered by browser

15:49:58 [Juhani]

waht tpyes of splices

15:50:17 [Juhani]

sample rate cahgnes

15:50:34 [Juhani]

Appending byte ranges ...

15:51:56 [Juhani]

Clarke: Comments to authors ?

15:52:10 [Juhani]

Joe: Issues identified ?

15:52:17 [Juhani]

In section 8

15:52:43 [kaz]

-> http://html5-mediasource-api.googlecode.com/svn/tags/0.4/draft-spec/mediasource-draft-spec.html#open-issues Open Issues

15:53:49 [Juhani]

Clarke: Administrative issue ... next week not chaired by Clarke

15:54:17 [Juhani]

Joe: Progress in the new TF ? If no, then can skip next week telco

15:54:46 [Juhani]

Clarke: Proceeding well, rules under creation, to become memebr of HTML WG to contirbute

15:54:56 [kaz]

zakim, unmute me

15:54:56 [Zakim]

Kazuyuki should no longer be muted

15:55:15 [kaz]

-> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2012Mar/0450.html HTML WG discussion

15:55:17 [Juhani]

Mark W: Call for Consensus coming

15:55:31 [kaz]

s/Mark W:/MarkW:/

15:55:46 [Juhani]

...: timing open

15:56:33 [Juhani]

Kaz: join HTML WG to participate ... name Encrypted Media TF

15:56:58 [Juhani]

... not much an issue as TF only to create

15:57:42 [Juhani]

Clarke: Content protection is the first priority ... reqs to be ready ... next telco after two weeks ?

15:57:44 [Juhani]

Agreed

15:58:08 [kaz]

s/...:/.../

15:58:36 [kaz]

-> http://html5-mediasource-api.googlecode.com/svn/tags/0.4/draft-spec/mediasource-draft-spec.html#introduction Section 1 Introduction

15:58:40 [Zakim]

-David_Corvoysier

15:58:42 [Zakim]

-Iraj(?)

15:58:42 [Juhani]

Kilroy: Flow diagram sect. 1 in , CDM diagram in Protection proposal ...how to look as one

15:58:43 [Zakim]

-Joe_Steele

15:58:46 [Zakim]

-acolwell

15:58:48 [Zakim]

-Mark_Watson

15:58:50 [Zakim]

-Kilroy

15:58:50 [Zakim]

-Clarke

15:58:52 [Iraj]

Iraj has left #webtv

15:58:53 [Zakim]

-glenn

15:59:00 [Zakim]

-Bob_Lund

15:59:03 [Zakim]

-Juhani

15:59:33 [Zakim]

-Kazuyuki

15:59:34 [Zakim]

UW_WebTVIG()11:00AM has ended

15:59:34 [Zakim]

Attendees were Kazuyuki, Clarke, Mark_Watson, +1.415.839.aaaa, Kilroy, Juhani, glenn, acolwell, David_Corvoysier, +1.408.536.aabb, Joe_Steele, Bob_Lund, Iraj(?), Jan_Lindquist

16:00:14 [Clarke]

Clarke has left #webtv

16:01:24 [kaz]

-> http://dvcs.w3.org/hg/html-media/raw-file/tip/encrypted-media/encrypted-media.html#introduction Section 1 of "Encrypted Media Extensions" proposal

16:01:29 [kaz]

[ adjourned ]

16:01:37 [kaz]

zakim, who is here?

16:01:37 [Zakim]

apparently UW_WebTVIG()11:00AM has ended, kaz

16:01:38 [Zakim]

On IRC I see mark, BobLund, joesteele, David_Corvoysier, Juhani, RRSAgent, Zakim, kaz, glenn, timeless, masao, trackbot

16:01:53 [kaz]

rrsagent, make log public

16:01:59 [kaz]

rrsagent, make draft minutes

16:01:59 [RRSAgent]

I'm logging. I don't understand 'make draft minutes', kaz. Try /msg RRSAgent help

16:02:08 [kaz]

rrsagent, draft minutes

16:02:08 [RRSAgent]

I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/03/15-webtv-minutes.html kaz

16:02:38 [kaz]

Meeting: Media Pipeline Task Force

16:02:41 [kaz]

rrsagent, draft minutes

16:02:41 [RRSAgent]

I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/03/15-webtv-minutes.html kaz

16:02:50 [kaz]

Chair: Clarke

16:02:52 [kaz]

rrsagent, draft minutes

16:02:52 [RRSAgent]

I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/03/15-webtv-minutes.html kaz

16:03:26 [kaz]

s/Mark W:/MarkW:/g

16:03:28 [kaz]

rrsagent, draft minutes

16:03:28 [RRSAgent]

I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/03/15-webtv-minutes.html kaz

16:04:14 [kaz]

rrsagent, stop