<scribe> scribe: janina

<Judy> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2011Apr/0451.html

<Judy> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/wiki/ChangeProposal/meta_name%3Dgenerator_does_not_make_missing_alt_conforming

<Judy> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2012Feb/0237.html

<Judy> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-a11y/2012Feb/0141.html

PFWG ARIA task force report, including update on future thoughts about aria describedAT, and implications (or not) on longdesc and on issue 204

Janina: PF looked at the Issue-204 page and has no problem with the suggested exemption as stated
... However, we also did not see that it did anything to make DescribedBy an acceptable alternative for longdesc.
... We see 204 is a nice to have, that's completely orthagonal to @longdesc
... We continue to se DescribedBy as inappropriate for longdesc
... We did also agree on several documentation clarifications to help the HTML-WG reach appropriate conclusions about ARIA

<Judy> John: My concern is that if we allow describing mechanisms to point to hidden content, it becomes dangerous the moment it is combined with tab order focus.

<Judy> Janina: agreed

<Judy> John: pls clarify face to face discussion on that?

<Judy> Janina: our clarifications in the documentation will indeed directly address that so that it will work

<Judy> John: pls be more specific about how pointing to hidden content will work when combined with tab order content? they are mixing and matching at-hidden, and aria-hidden. if that hidden content has anything beyond string text, you create an interaction problem for screen reader users

<Judy> Janina: true, but....

<JF> Judy: concerned about messaging from PF about pointing to hidden content

jf: Issue-204 concerns both HTML and ARIA features together

judy: So ther're several issues, it doesn't help longdesc because it doesn't solve rich text

jf: also it's messing with ARIA specification

john: putting longdesc aside ... concerned that namely multiple ways of hiding content

<JF> I have 3 concerns: Process issue (Issue 204 talks about aria-hidden), issue aroudn pointing to "rich-text", and messaging problems (re: feedback from PF F2F)

judy: What's the status of 204 and longdesc

john: Extention for Jonas to Mar 10
... on 23:30 Mar 10 Matt put up a CP
... I've asked for time to respond with a cp

<JF> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/204

general discussion that longdesc needs a fair hearing and resolution

<JF> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/wiki/ChangeProposals/DeprecateLongdesc

<Judy> "This will not eliminate the need for longdesc because we cannot introduce tab-focusable content that is hidden from sighted users; and because you will not get rich content if you hide it."

some thoughts about further revisions on meta-name generator proposal; background links:

confirm CP revisions for WG location of alt guidance http://www.w3.org/html/wg/wiki/ChangeProposals/movealt

judy: This is about moving the Alt Text doc to WCAG WG space
... Rejected by HTMl Chairs, but still on our table

discussion that judy will address with steve issues on location of the alt doc

<JF> http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/aria-implementation/#include_elements

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Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00)

Succeeded: s/content is hidden/content that is hidden/
Found Scribe: janina
Inferring ScribeNick: janina
Default Present: Judy, John_Foliot, Janina
Present: Judy John_Foliot Janina

WARNING: No meeting title found!
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<dbooth> Meeting: Weekly Baking Club Meeting


WARNING: No meeting chair found!
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<dbooth> Chair: dbooth

Got date from IRC log name: 13 Mar 2012
Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2012/03/13-text-minutes.html
People with action items: 

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