17:01:12 RRSAgent has joined #html-wg 17:01:12 logging to http://www.w3.org/2012/02/16-html-wg-irc 17:01:14 RRSAgent, make logs public 17:01:14 Zakim has joined #html-wg 17:01:16 Zakim, this will be html_wg 17:01:16 ok, trackbot, I see HTML_WG()12:00PM already started 17:01:17 Meeting: HTML Weekly Teleconference 17:01:17 Date: 16 February 2012 17:01:20 rubys has joined #html-wg 17:01:38 +glenn 17:01:52 +[Microsoft] 17:01:58 +[Microsoft.a] 17:02:02 Zakim, who's on the phone? 17:02:02 On the phone I see Radhika_Roy, +1.619.846.aaaa, Julian, glenn, [Microsoft], [Microsoft.a] 17:02:09 Zakim, mute me 17:02:09 Julian should now be muted 17:02:13 zakim, [Microsoft.a] is me 17:02:13 +adrianba; got it 17:02:21 Zakim, aaaa is me 17:02:21 +hober; got it 17:02:24 zakim, [Microsoft] has paulc 17:02:24 +paulc; got it 17:02:28 +Sam 17:03:37 Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-wg-announce/2012JanMar/0015.html 17:04:00 Judy has joined #html-wg 17:04:02 topic: ACTION items due by Thursday, February 16 17:04:06 paulc: none 17:04:08 scribe: rubys 17:04:15 Zakim, call Mike 17:04:15 ok, MikeSmith; the call is being made 17:04:17 +Mike 17:04:30 zakim, code? 17:04:30 the conference code is 4865 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 sip:zakim@voip.w3.org), Judy 17:04:34 topic: New Issues This Week 17:04:37 issue-204? 17:04:37 ISSUE-204 -- Exempt ARIA attributes from the rule that prohibits reference to hidden elements -- open 17:04:37 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/204 17:04:48 paulc: split off issue 30 17:04:54 issue-205? 17:04:54 ISSUE-205 -- Define what author guidance and/or methods should be provided to those that wish to create accessible text editors using canvas as a rendering surface. -- open 17:04:54 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/205 17:05:07 +Judy 17:05:14 paulc: split off issue 131, simplifying that issue 17:05:21 issue-80? 17:05:21 ISSUE-80 -- document conformance and device dependent display of title attribute content -- open 17:05:21 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/80 17:05:30 reopened: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2012Feb/0105.html 17:05:59 paulc: one tracker request (escallation on a non-last call item) 17:06:09 http://w3.org/Bugs/Public/buglist.cgi?product=HTML+WG&keywords=TrackerRequest 17:06:17 +mjs 17:06:18 paulc: chairs are prioritizing last-call items first, we have not processed this request 17:06:33 topic: Items Closed Last Week 17:06:52 judy: I have comments on 204 17:06:58 paulc: go ahead 17:07:35 judy: Janina and I are requesting a co-ordination call with you (paulc) on the split of issue-30 and the timing 17:08:26 paulc: can you put a link in the minutes to the concerns? 17:08:48 judy: it would be valuable to have a call 17:09:03 paulc: I will check my calendar 17:09:29 judy: if you aren't available, I would appreciate meeting with at least one of the co-chairs 17:09:51 paulc: send us an email, and we will find a slot that works 17:10:09 topic: Items Closed Last Week 17:10:18 issue-172? 17:10:18 ISSUE-172 -- restore as an optional element -- open 17:10:18 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/172 17:10:31 issue-183? 17:10:31 ISSUE-183 -- Enhance and simplify the time element -- open 17:10:31 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/183 17:10:36 issue-184? 17:10:36 ISSUE-184 -- Add a data element -- open 17:10:36 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/184 17:10:59 three call for alternate proposals above closed on Feb 11 17:11:03 issue-131? 17:11:03 ISSUE-131 -- Should we add a caret location API to canvas, or is the focus API sufficient? -- open 17:11:03 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/131 17:11:06 issue-179? 17:11:06 ISSUE-179 -- {audio,video} require param child (or equivalent) -- open 17:11:06 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/179 17:11:19 both call for proposals closed Feb 11 17:11:46 paulc: this agenda doesn't cover items that closed yesterday (or today) 17:12:13 paulc: if there are no change proposals, expect the issue to be closed. If there are no counters, expect a call for consensus 17:12:26 topic: Items Closing This Week 17:12:28 issue-193? 17:12:28 ISSUE-193 -- Remove CSS example that promotes inaccessible content -- open 17:12:28 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/193 17:12:35 issue-194? 17:12:35 ISSUE-194 -- Provide a mechanism for associating a full transcript with an audio or video element. -- open 17:12:35 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/194 17:12:42 issue-195? 17:12:42 ISSUE-195 -- Enhance http request generation from forms -- raised 17:12:42 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/195 17:12:48 issue-196? 17:12:48 ISSUE-196 -- Define user agent http response handling behaviour -- raised 17:12:48 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/196 17:12:53 issue-197? 17:12:53 ISSUE-197 -- Accept attribute should allow file extensions in addition to the current allowed values -- open 17:12:53 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/197 17:13:10 paulc: all the above closed yesterday 17:13:18 issue-182? 17:13:18 ISSUE-182 -- Advice in spec about annotations promotes inaccessible content -- open 17:13:18 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/182 17:13:21 issue-185? 17:13:21 ISSUE-185 -- Drop the pubdate attribute -- open 17:13:21 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/185 17:13:29 issue-188? 17:13:29 ISSUE-188 -- Text tracks in HTML should be defined in a way agnostic of the specific caption format -- open 17:13:29 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/188 17:13:33 issue-189? 17:13:33 ISSUE-189 -- Prefix convention needs to be coordinated with IETF -- open 17:13:33 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/189 17:13:40 issue-198? 17:13:40 ISSUE-198 -- Ensure innerHTML and related APIs are subject to the W3C patent policy -- raised 17:13:40 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/198 17:13:45 issue-199? 17:13:45 ISSUE-199 -- Define complete processing requirements for ARIA attributes -- raised 17:13:45 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/199 17:13:55 issue-200? 17:13:55 ISSUE-200 -- Allow wrapping LEGEND (or new iLEGEND) in non-FIELDSET elements -- raised 17:13:55 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/200 17:14:02 issue-201? 17:14:02 ISSUE-201 -- Provide canvas location and hit testing capability to fallback content -- open 17:14:02 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/201 17:14:04 issue-202? 17:14:04 ISSUE-202 -- Missing alt should not be considered conforming in the presence of figcaptions over 50 words in length -- raised 17:14:04 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/202 17:14:09 issue-203? 17:14:09 ISSUE-203 -- All Media Elements should have the ability to have both short and longer textual descriptions associated to the element -- raised 17:14:10 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/203 17:14:29 paulc: the above closes today 17:14:31 With reference to agendum # 1 above, and the request to meet w/ Paul or another Co-Chair regarding procedural concerns about new issue #204, background is in Text Subteam minutes, with notes following "30: Longdesc" http://www.w3.org/2012/02/14-text-minutes.html#item01 17:15:12 topic: Items Closing Next Week 17:15:22 issue-187? 17:15:25 ISSUE-187 -- Document conformance has to be stable over the time -- open 17:15:25 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/187 17:15:36 issue-190? 17:15:36 ISSUE-190 -- Replace poor coding example for figure with multiple images -- open 17:15:36 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/190 17:15:44 issue-191? 17:15:44 ISSUE-191 -- Replace/complement and elements by a cleaner wysiwyg-safe attribute-based solution -- open 17:15:44 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/191 17:15:47 issue-192? 17:15:47 ISSUE-192 -- title attribute definition does not match reality -- open 17:15:47 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/192 17:15:54 paulc: these four close Feb 23 17:16:07 topic: New Calls this week 17:16:09 issue-80? 17:16:10 ISSUE-80 -- document conformance and device dependent display of title attribute content -- open 17:16:10 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/80 17:16:31 paulc: this was reopened, and as we got a change proposal, we have issued a call for alternate or counter proposals closing March 14 17:16:40 issue-131? 17:16:40 ISSUE-131 -- Should we add a caret location API to canvas, or is the focus API sufficient? -- open 17:16:40 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/131 17:16:42 JVoracek has joined #html-wg 17:17:10 paulc: we have proposals, so we have issued a call for alternate or counters, also closing on march 14th 17:17:14 issue-158? 17:17:15 ISSUE-158 -- HTML4's content-model for should continue -- open 17:17:15 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/158 17:17:20 +??P6 17:17:24 J_Voracek has joined #html-wg 17:17:28 paulc: also closed on March 14th 17:17:33 janina has joined #html-wg 17:17:35 issue-204? 17:17:35 ISSUE-204 -- Exempt ARIA attributes from the rule that prohibits reference to hidden elements -- open 17:17:35 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/204 17:17:47 paulc: we granted until March 10th to provide a proposal 17:17:53 issue-205? 17:17:53 ISSUE-205 -- Define what author guidance and/or methods should be provided to those that wish to create accessible text editors using canvas as a rendering surface. -- open 17:17:53 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/205 17:18:09 paulc: call for alternate or counter proposals closes march 14th 17:18:17 zakim, who's here? 17:18:17 On the phone I see Radhika_Roy, hober, Julian (muted), glenn, [Microsoft], adrianba, Sam, Mike, Judy, mjs, ??P6 17:18:19 [Microsoft] has paulc 17:18:19 On IRC I see janina, J_Voracek, JVoracek, Judy, rubys, Zakim, RRSAgent, paulc_, adrianba, Julian, MFoladare, myakura, shepazu, dveditz, drublic, davidb, anne, glenn, ArtB, nonge__, 17:18:19 ... tantek_, krijnh, mjs, arronei, tantek, Hixie, [tm], gavin, MikeSmith, rektide, Jedi, webben, heycam|away, johndrinkwater, ed, pingo, Dashiva, jgraham, inimino, CIA-1, trackbot, 17:18:22 ... lgombos, hiro, hober, hsivonen, gsnedders, paul___irish, Philip, jmb 17:18:25 topic: New Surveys this week 17:18:28 paulc: there are none 17:18:37 topic: Decisions this week 17:18:40 plh has joined #html-wg 17:18:41 paulc: there are none 17:18:51 topic: Other Business 17:18:58 http://www.w3.org/QA/2012/02/openweb-weekly-27.html 17:19:10 paulc: this is nearly two weeks old, there may be a more recent one 17:19:19 topic: re-open request for issue 31 17:19:29 http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2012Feb/0139.html 17:19:34 plh has joined #html-wg 17:19:50 paulc: we originally could not find new information, and the a11y task force is working on a revised version 17:20:35 janina: we have a strong interest in having this taken up again; the proposal has significantly been beefed up. 17:21:11 janina: unclear that this was dealt with appropriately originally 17:22:12 janina: we are now pointing to the original decision to justify the reopening 17:22:38 Revised request is in: http://www.w3.org/html/wg/wiki/ChangeProposals/movealt 17:22:42 janina: we should have a email to the chairs and wg by monday 17:23:18 topic: Request to Reconsider Meta Generator Alt Exception 17:23:34 paulc: the chairs have reviewed this request and will be responding today 17:23:44 topic: i18n WG position on Issue-172 "restore as an optional element" 17:23:49 http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2012Feb/0103.html 17:23:55 http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2012Feb/0197.html 17:24:26 paulc: chairs want to make it clear what the next status is 17:24:34 topic: Change proposal reviews 17:24:42 issue-30? 17:24:42 ISSUE-30 -- Should HTML 5 include a longdesc attribute for images -- open 17:24:42 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/30 17:24:53 paulc: we have having a dialog with Laura on 30 17:24:59 issue-170? 17:24:59 ISSUE-170 -- make URIs valid link relations -- open 17:24:59 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/170 17:25:12 paulc: we are having dialogs with the authors of the proposals on 170 17:25:16 issue-134? 17:25:16 ISSUE-134 -- Provide tablist and tab states for menu and command elements respectively -- open 17:25:16 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/134 17:25:44 paulc: the chairs are having dialogs with the various authors and the WG can expect more 17:26:34 janina: Thanks for 134, I am concerned about recent developments around longdesc, this is not just Laura's proposal but a TaskForce backed proposal 17:27:02 janina: we are disappointed that a split off happened based on ARIA, it would have been helpful to have been coordinating that more closely 17:27:03 adrianba_ has joined #html-wg 17:27:34 paulc: janina is repeating judy's concerns about issue 204 17:28:03 q+ 17:28:13 paulc: the feedback on 30 was to put the material relevant to the change proposal in the proposal itself 17:28:20 ack judy 17:28:35 judy: there appears to have been changes in the advice over time over this 17:29:08 judy: in the past, we were advised to put in links; perhaps we could get more uniform guidance? 17:30:28 paulc: the underlying principle is to help the CP authors to make their case as possible; in this case we found some arguments that we thought the author could use to make their proposal stronger; if the authors don't wish to make their proposal stronger, that's their choice. 17:31:07 judy: I'm hearing that you prefer all of the text to be a single page? 17:32:04 paulc: we review each on their merits, and in this case we thought this particular proposal would be improved by making this specific text into the base text. 17:32:48 paulc: any other business to raise? 17:32:58 topic: Chair and Scribe for next meeting 17:33:05 paulc: Maciej likely will be the chair 17:33:09 glenn: I can scribe 17:33:23 topic: Adjournment 17:33:31 rrsagent, publish minutes 17:33:31 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/02/16-html-wg-minutes.html rubys 17:33:37 -Mike 17:33:38 -Julian 17:33:41 -glenn 17:33:43 -adrianba 17:33:44 -Sam 17:33:44 -Judy 17:33:45 -??P6 17:33:45 -hober 17:33:47 -Radhika_Roy 17:33:48 janina has left #html-wg 17:33:54 -mjs 17:33:55 -[Microsoft] 17:33:55 HTML_WG()12:00PM has ended 17:33:57 Attendees were Radhika_Roy, +1.619.846.aaaa, Julian, glenn, adrianba, hober, paulc, Sam, Mike, Judy, mjs 17:36:18 adrianba_ has left #html-wg 18:00:25 plh has joined #html-wg 18:04:48 drublic has joined #html-wg 18:24:03 tantek_ has joined #html-wg 18:28:39 tantek_ has joined #html-wg 18:36:53 plh has joined #html-wg 18:54:21 mjs has joined #html-wg 18:57:27 plh has joined #html-wg 19:07:24 myakura has joined #html-wg 19:08:15 DJVoracek has joined #html-wg 19:27:27 MikeSmith has joined #html-wg 19:44:39 Zakim has left #html-wg 19:46:29 Judy has left #html-wg 19:48:01 rubys has left #html-wg 20:04:44 karl has joined #html-wg 20:34:29 J_Voracek has joined #html-wg 20:56:50 Lachy has joined #html-wg 21:14:49 ksweeney has joined #html-wg 21:16:59 J_Voracek has joined #html-wg 21:25:09 ksweeney has left #html-wg 21:43:58 karl has joined #html-wg 22:14:02 glenn has joined #html-wg 22:34:52 ksweeney has joined #html-wg 22:46:13 ksweeney has left #html-wg 22:53:27 davidb has joined #html-wg 23:22:30 karl has joined #html-wg