15:59:25 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #rd
15:59:25 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2012/02/09-rd-irc
15:59:27 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs world
15:59:32 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be 7394
15:59:33 <trackbot> Meeting: Research and Development Working Group Teleconference
15:59:35 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #rd
15:59:35 <sharper> zakim, agenda?
15:59:35 <trackbot> Date: 09 February 2012
15:59:42 <Zakim> I see nothing on the agenda
16:00:13 <markel> markel has joined #rd
16:00:30 <sharper> Chair: Harper_Simon
16:00:30 <sharper> Agenda+ Welcome & Logistics (Regrets, Agenda Requests, Comments)
16:00:30 <sharper> Agenda+ W3C Note - You should be reading it...
16:00:30 <sharper> Agenda+ New Meeting Time
16:00:31 <sharper> Agenda+ Mobile Topic Timeline
16:00:31 <sharper> Agenda+ Next Topics Ordering
16:00:32 <sharper> Agenda+ Mobile Discussion re Topics and Call for Paper
16:00:34 <sharper> Agenda+ Any Other Business 
16:00:45 <sharper> zakim, save agenda
16:00:56 <sharper> zakim, take up item 1
16:01:12 <sharper> regrets+  Kouroupetroglou_Christos
16:01:12 <Zakim> ok, sharper, the agenda has been written to http://www.w3.org/2012/02/09-rd-agenda.rdf
16:01:26 <sharper> regrets+ McCathieNevile_Charles
16:01:32 <Zakim> agendum 1. "Welcome & Logistics (Regrets, Agenda Requests, Comments)" taken up [from sharper]
16:01:36 <sharper> rrsagent, make logs public
16:01:36 <sharper> rrsagent, draft minutes
16:01:36 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/02/09-rd-minutes.html sharper
16:01:36 <shawn> shawn has joined #rd
16:01:54 <shadi> zakim, who is on the phone?
16:02:39 <shawn> zakim, mute me
16:03:02 <Zakim> sorry, shadi, I don't know what conference this is
16:03:16 <shadi> zakim, this is rdwg
16:03:43 <Zakim> sorry, shawn, I don't know what conference this is
16:03:46 <shadi> zakim, who is on the phone?
16:03:56 <Zakim> On IRC I see shawn, markel, Zakim, RRSAgent, Peter, sharper, Klaus, giorgio, nonge__, shadi, Mate, trackbot
16:04:21 <Zakim> ok, shadi; that matches WAI_RDWG()11:00AM
16:04:40 <shawn> zakim, unmute me
16:04:58 <shadi> scribe: shadi
16:04:59 <Zakim> On the phone I see ??P49, ??P64, ??P62, ??P4, Shadi, Shawn, ??P60
16:05:15 <shadi> zakim, ??p60 is Simon
16:05:27 <shadi> zakim, take up agendum 1
16:05:32 <Zakim> Shawn was not muted, shawn
16:05:48 <giorgio> thanks!
16:05:57 <shadi> zakim, take up next
16:06:21 <shadi> SH: reminder to read the draft Note
16:06:28 <Zakim> +Simon; got it
16:06:28 <shadi> ...read it and it was a good read
16:06:32 <shadi> zakim, take up next
16:06:37 <Zakim> agendum 1. "Welcome & Logistics (Regrets, Agenda Requests, Comments)" taken up [from sharper]
16:06:49 <Zakim> agendum 1 was just opened, shadi
16:07:27 <shadi> zakim, close agendum 1
16:07:27 <Zakim> agendum 2. "W3C Note - You should be reading it..." taken up [from sharper]
16:07:31 <shadi> zakim, take up next
16:07:39 <shadi> zakim, close agendum 2
16:07:43 <Zakim> agendum 1, Welcome & Logistics (Regrets, Agenda Requests, Comments), closed
16:07:46 <Zakim> I see 6 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
16:07:47 <Zakim> 2. W3C Note - You should be reading it... [from sharper]
16:07:53 <Zakim> agendum 2 was just opened, shadi
16:07:54 <shadi> SH: new meeting time
16:07:57 <Zakim> agendum 2, W3C Note - You should be reading it..., closed
16:07:59 <Zakim> I see 5 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
16:08:01 <Zakim> 3. New Meeting Time [from sharper]
16:08:02 <shadi> ...Thursday next week
16:08:13 <shadi> ...new meeting time from Wednesday 22nd onwards
16:08:21 <shadi> zakim, take up next
16:08:21 <Zakim> agendum 3. "New Meeting Time" taken up [from sharper]
16:08:23 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
16:08:29 <shadi> zakim, close agendum 3
16:08:29 <Zakim> agendum 3, New Meeting Time, closed
16:08:30 <Zakim> I see 4 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
16:08:30 <Zakim> 4. Mobile Topic Timeline [from sharper]
16:08:33 <shadi> zakim, take up next
16:08:33 <Zakim> agendum 4. "Mobile Topic Timeline" taken up [from sharper]
16:08:41 <shadi> zakim, mute me
16:08:41 <Zakim> Shadi should now be muted
16:09:00 <shadi> present: Giorgio, Markel, Klaus, Peter
16:09:20 <shadi> SH: date for symposium
16:09:38 <shadi> q+ to suggest deadline for call for papers
16:10:12 <shadi> http://www.w3.org/WAI/RD/planning#seminar
16:10:16 <shawn> zakim, [IPcaller] is Josh
16:10:27 <shadi> present+ Joshue
16:10:32 <Zakim> +Josh; got it
16:11:00 <shadi> zakim, unmute me
16:11:10 <Zakim> Shadi should no longer be muted
16:11:20 <shadi> http://www.w3.org/WAI/RD/2011/metrics/
16:11:29 <shadi> http://www.w3.org/WAI/RD/2011/metrics/cfp.html
16:12:42 <shawn> last ones dates: Announcement on 2011-09-15: The Call for Papers is open until 1 November 2011.
16:13:19 <shadi> SH: Call for Papers beginning of March
16:13:38 <giorgio> q+
16:13:40 <shadi> ...Monday 5th
16:13:54 <shadi> ...maybe have 5th May as telecon date
16:15:21 <shadi> SAZ: had 6 weeks notification
16:15:36 <shadi> ack me
16:15:36 <Zakim> shadi, you wanted to suggest deadline for call for papers
16:15:58 <shawn> q+ to ask about situation in regards to 4 or 6 weeks
16:16:40 <sharper> ack
16:16:51 <shadi> ...critical part is when we have the call for papers ready
16:16:52 <shawn> ack g
16:17:03 <shadi> ...not sure can make it by 5 March
16:17:16 <shadi> GB: agree that call for paper will be difficult
16:17:22 <shadi> ...maybe more difficult this time
16:17:45 <shadi> ...need to see what Yeliz and Peter needs
16:18:06 <shadi> SH: maybe aim for mid-March
16:18:15 <shadi> ...don't want to leave it open-ended
16:18:23 <shadi> q+
16:18:34 <sharper> ack shawn
16:18:34 <Zakim> shawn, you wanted to ask about situation in regards to 4 or 6 weeks
16:18:48 <shadi> q+ to suggest actions for editors to bring in draft CfPs every week from now on
16:19:23 <shadi> SLH: are people writing about work they already have, in which case it is easy to write a paper
16:19:29 <giorgio> I would say option 1: they reported wotk already done
16:19:42 <shadi> ...versus if people are prompted to do new work, in which case they need more time
16:20:16 <shadi> MV: seen most people adapting what they have done so far to fit this call for papers
16:20:28 <shadi> ...something already done but adapted
16:20:56 <shadi> JoC: how would you describe that in the CfP?
16:21:10 <shawn> +1 to JoC
16:21:10 <markel> +1 to Josh
16:21:11 <shadi> ..maybe can a pre-call
16:21:33 <shadi> SH: good idea to have a pre-call
16:21:33 <sharper> ack shadi
16:21:33 <Zakim> shadi, you wanted to suggest actions for editors to bring in draft CfPs every week from now on
16:21:35 <shadi> ack me
16:21:44 <Peter> +1 josh - don't think it would hurt
16:22:10 <Peter> q+
16:22:20 <sharper> ack P
16:22:29 <shawn> Shawn & Josh -- maybe a pre-call to let people know ahead of time that a call on a specific topic will be coming up -- so people get more advanced warning & have time to do more original work possibility
16:22:36 <shadi> SAZ: suggest adding action items to the editors to being in a draft CfP every week
16:22:45 <shawn> q+
16:22:51 <shadi> ack peter
16:23:17 <shadi> PT: agree, good to have the pressure
16:23:24 <shadi> ...have a template to start with
16:23:50 <shawn> ack me
16:24:20 <sharper> Action: Peter, yeliz to create Mobile Pre-Call
16:24:20 <trackbot> Sorry, couldn't find user - Peter,
16:24:40 <shadi> http://www.w3.org/WAI/RD/2011/metrics/
16:24:47 <sharper> Action:  Peter yeliz to create Mobile Pre-Call
16:24:47 <trackbot> Created ACTION-8 - Yeliz to create Mobile Pre-Call [on Peter Thiessen - due 2012-02-16].
16:24:51 <shadi> http://www.w3.org/WAI/RD/2011/metrics/cfp.html
16:25:18 <markel> go for it
16:27:07 <shadi> SH: pre-call in 6 weeks then full call in 4 weeks
16:27:23 <shawn> http://www.w3.org/WAI/RD/wiki/Text_Customization
16:27:24 <Peter> (reading topic now :)
16:29:08 <Zakim> -Josh
16:30:54 <shadi> SLH: been working at this for the previous year+
16:31:16 <shadi> ...also with Wyne Dick who will be presenting a tool at CSUN
16:31:42 <shadi> SH: had lecture about this by the BBC lately
16:31:59 <shadi> ...also on the User Agent group
16:32:13 <shadi> ...may also relate to television
16:32:19 <sharper> Penny Allen
16:32:23 <sharper> BBC
16:32:33 <shadi> SLH: not about what the optimum text is
16:32:48 <shadi> ...but rather what optimizations need to be in place
16:33:03 <shadi> ...there is no single optimal formatting for all users
16:33:05 <giorgio> q+ interation between factors
16:33:13 <shadi> ...more about the needs for customization
16:33:55 <shadi> SH: Penny Allen working on optimal font for different types of screens/devices etc
16:34:06 <shadi> ...also developed some guidelines and tools
16:34:30 <shadi> ...interactive TV using SMILE
16:34:39 <shadi> s/SMILE/SMIL
16:34:44 <shadi> ack g
16:35:07 <shadi> GB: not only individual aspects like font size, color, etc
16:35:16 <shadi> ...but also the interaction aspects
16:35:22 <shadi> ...probably combination is key
16:35:40 <shadi> ...also the context is important
16:35:56 <shadi> ...for example moving objects like ads
16:37:07 <shadi> SH: looks mature?
16:37:13 <shadi> PT: looks quite extensive
16:37:28 <markel> http://www.w3.org/WAI/RD/2011/metrics/paper5/
16:37:54 <shadi> GB: people in barecolona working on spelling errors
16:38:12 <shadi> SAZ: could relate more to the "Easy to Read" topic?
16:38:17 <shawn> [ Shawn would hope for more input after people get a chance to read it :-]
16:38:17 <shadi> SLH: agree
16:38:21 <shadi> PT: agree
16:39:18 <shadi> ...looks to me more like tools to customize rather than readability
16:39:42 <shadi> SH: does this look ready for a seminar?
16:39:51 <shadi> ...will we have many or few submissions?
16:40:16 <shadi> ...not aware of much research in that field
16:40:32 <shadi> ...may be ahead of our time
16:41:19 <shadi> SLH: maybe do a public call saying we are considering this topic, to see what reactions are?
16:41:35 <shadi> SH: may be confusing, seem that we are unsure
16:41:54 <shadi> zakim, mute me
16:41:54 <Zakim> Shadi should now be muted
16:42:38 <shadi> MV: might be an idea to put several topics under one call
16:42:48 <shadi> q+
16:43:04 <shadi> ack me
16:43:59 <Peter> (missed most of that - breaking up - could just be me though)
16:44:22 <shawn> saz: maybe say something now, then people coule do new-related work
16:44:29 <shadi> SAZ: we have more time for this one, so could do a slightly different call where as for new work
16:44:57 <shadi> ...contact specific people who may be encouraged
16:45:36 <shadi> SH: at W4A usually get 1 paper for an advanced topic, then 6 in the next
16:45:57 <shawn> [ shawn OK with joining the two together... as long as the text customization doesn't get lost ;-]
16:46:05 <shadi> ...difficult to get submissions for topics that are head of themselves
16:46:35 <shadi> ...could be better to put together the related one
16:46:45 <shadi> SLH: torn on this
16:47:01 <shadi> ...agree with the approach but do not want text customization to get lost
16:47:31 <shadi> SH: agree trying to avoid it getting lost
16:47:39 <shadi> ...need to message carefully
16:47:55 <shadi> ...but also done its job if we prompt people to think about it
16:48:23 <shawn> s/agree with the approach/agree that they are related and interested that it may be ahead of its time/
16:48:51 <shadi> ...need to carefully craft this call for paper
16:49:27 <christos> christos has joined #rd
16:49:33 <giorgio> q+
16:49:44 <shawn> ACTION: Shawn talk with Andrea about idea of combining topics (Easy to Read & Text Customization)
16:49:44 <trackbot> Created ACTION-9 - Talk with Andrea about idea of combining topics (Easy to Read & Text Customization) [on Shawn Henry - due 2012-02-16].
16:49:53 <sharper> ack g
16:50:00 <shadi> SAZ: think editors need to get coordinated
16:50:20 <shawn> ACTION: Shawn talk informally with people about interest and work in Text Customization
16:50:20 <trackbot> Created ACTION-10 - Talk informally with people about interest and work in Text Customization [on Shawn Henry - due 2012-02-16].
16:50:40 <shadi> GB: maybe better to collect additional information first then decide
16:51:46 <sharper> Benchmarking Web Accessibility Evaluation Tools (Evaluation, Benchmarking, Metrics, Samples.) 
16:51:51 <shadi> zakim, take up agendum 7
16:51:51 <Zakim> agendum 7. "Any Other Business" taken up [from sharper]
16:51:54 <sharper> http://www.w3.org/WAI/RD/wiki/Benchmarking_Web_Accessibility_Evaluation_Tools
16:52:39 <giorgio> q+
16:52:53 <shadi> SH: after reading the draft Note and the wiki entry
16:53:06 <shadi> ...useful to leave the topic there?
16:53:18 <sharper> ack g
16:53:21 <shadi> ...or how do we clean that up?
16:53:41 <shadi> GB: not sure what the issue is of leaving the wiki topic there
16:54:20 <shadi> ...solution not a webinar lke we did but probably something larger
16:54:54 <shadi> ...wiki page can change over time, not a snapshot of a webinar
16:55:27 <shadi> SH: see this as a conference
16:55:40 <shadi> SH: see this as a conference?
16:55:45 <shadi> GB: yes
16:56:01 <shadi> MV: not sure what new questions we have in the research note
16:57:12 <giorgio> I was not really think of that conference. it was a generic a vagiue statement of mine
16:58:46 <giorgio> yes
16:59:24 <shadi> SH: may want to come back to it at some poin
16:59:29 <giorgio> something like a new category "follow up activities"
16:59:29 <shadi> http://www.icchp.org/node/370
17:00:08 <shawn> saz: I put up a track related to this as an STS for ICCHP 
17:00:24 <shawn> ... opportunities for followon work
17:01:12 <markel> q+
17:01:14 <shadi> HCII
17:01:33 <shadi> ...several other possibilities
17:02:11 <shadi> ...conferences with several tracks
17:02:15 <shadi> ack m
17:02:30 <shadi> MV: do we need a special track on this?
17:02:35 <shadi> ...good papers make it anyway
17:02:47 <shadi> ...just need to keep track of work
17:02:52 <shawn> q+ to say interesting to think of these Symposiums as being a catalyst for future research. (I had thought more about gathering current research -- but like the 
17:03:18 <shawn> ack me
17:03:18 <Zakim> shawn, you wanted to say interesting to think of these Symposiums as being a catalyst for future research. (I had thought more about gathering current research -- but like the
17:03:23 <sharper> ack shawn
17:03:42 <shadi> SH: might be motivator to tell people that will contribute to a Note
17:04:03 <markel> yes agree SLH
17:04:05 <shadi> SLH: one of the goals is to be a catalyst for future research
17:04:12 <markel> but we can make the right questions in our seminars
17:04:32 <markel> a community can address identified issues in their reseach
17:04:41 <shadi> SH: paper on metrics has a good future roadmap
17:04:52 <shadi> ...incubator kind of concept
17:05:35 <Peter> +1 shawn's idea for future research
17:05:57 <sharper> +1 incubator / shawn's idea
17:06:26 <Klaus> have to leave, sorry, bye to all
17:07:02 <shadi> Topic: Next meeting
17:07:02 <giorgio> ok. bye.
17:07:09 <Zakim> -??P4
17:07:09 <shadi> next week on Thursday
17:07:10 <Zakim> -??P49
17:07:10 <Peter> bye everyone
17:07:11 <Zakim> -??P64
17:07:13 <Zakim> -Shawn
17:07:16 <markel> markel has left #rd
17:07:20 <sharper> sharper has left #rd
17:07:24 <Zakim> -Shadi
17:07:26 <Zakim> -Simon
17:07:28 <Zakim> -??P62
17:07:28 <Zakim> WAI_RDWG()11:00AM has ended
17:07:28 <Zakim> Attendees were Shadi, Shawn, Simon, Josh
17:08:56 <markel> markel has joined #rd
17:48:40 <shadi> trackbot, end meeting
17:48:40 <trackbot> Zakim, list attendees
17:48:40 <Zakim> sorry, trackbot, I don't know what conference this is
17:48:48 <trackbot> RRSAgent, please draft minutes
17:48:48 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/02/09-rd-minutes.html trackbot
17:48:49 <trackbot> RRSAgent, bye
17:48:49 <RRSAgent> I see 4 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2012/02/09-rd-actions.rdf :
17:48:49 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Peter, yeliz to create Mobile Pre-Call [1]
17:48:49 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2012/02/09-rd-irc#T16-24-20
17:48:49 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Peter yeliz to create Mobile Pre-Call [2]
17:48:49 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2012/02/09-rd-irc#T16-24-47
17:48:49 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Shawn talk with Andrea about idea of combining topics (Easy to Read & Text Customization) [3]
17:48:49 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2012/02/09-rd-irc#T16-49-44
17:48:49 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Shawn talk informally with people about interest and work in Text Customization [4]
17:48:49 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2012/02/09-rd-irc#T16-50-20