13:32:15 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #er
13:32:15 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2012/02/08-er-irc
13:32:17 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public
13:32:17 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #er
13:32:19 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be 3794
13:32:19 <Zakim> ok, trackbot; I see WAI_ERTWG()8:30AM scheduled to start 2 minutes ago
13:32:20 <trackbot> Meeting: Evaluation and Repair Tools Working Group Teleconference
13:32:20 <trackbot> Date: 08 February 2012
13:32:35 <shadi> zakim, call shadi-617
13:32:35 <Zakim> ok, shadi; the call is being made
13:32:41 <philipA> philipA has joined #er
13:33:06 <shadi> zakim, call shadi-617
13:33:06 <Zakim> ok, shadi; the call is being made
13:33:47 <shadi> zakim, who is on the phone?
13:33:47 <Zakim> WAI_ERTWG()8:30AM has not yet started, shadi
13:33:48 <Zakim> On IRC I see philipA, Zakim, RRSAgent, shadi, trackbot
13:35:15 <shadi> zakim, this is ert
13:35:15 <Zakim> ok, shadi; that matches WAI_ERTWG()8:30AM
13:35:17 <samuelm> samuelm has joined #er
13:35:20 <shadi> zakim, who is on the phone?
13:35:20 <Zakim> On the phone I see +1.602.824.aaaa, Shadi, ??P12
13:35:29 <shadi> zakim, aaaa is Don
13:35:29 <Zakim> +Don; got it
13:35:39 <shadi> zakim, ??p12 is philipA
13:35:39 <Zakim> +philipA; got it
13:35:53 <Zakim> +??P13
13:36:14 <shadi> zakim, ??p13 is samuelm 
13:36:14 <Zakim> +samuelm; got it
13:38:36 <shadi> scribe: philipA
13:38:48 <shadi> Topic: New ERT WG Participant
13:38:51 <shadi> Don Raikes
13:39:46 <shadi> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-wai-evaltf/2012Feb/0013.html
13:40:15 <shadi> Topic: Causality and EARL 
13:40:56 <shadi> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-earl10-comments/2011Dec/0000.html
13:42:14 <philipA> Shadi: any thoughts?
13:42:40 <shadi> earl:cause
13:42:58 <philipA> Shadi: Proposal is, to have a property called "cause", describing the cause of an error
13:43:09 <Zakim> -Don
13:43:43 <shadi> http://www.w3.org/TR/EARL10/#TestResult
13:43:45 <Zakim> +Don
13:44:02 <shadi>     earl:info
13:44:02 <shadi>     earl:outcome
13:44:02 <shadi>     earl:pointer
13:44:34 <philipA> Shadi: "cause" could be a kind of an "info"
13:44:46 <shadi> my:cause is sub-property of earl:info
13:46:12 <philipA> Shadi: ok to propose this?
13:46:27 <philipA> PhilipA: Can a sub-property extend the range?
13:46:50 <philipA> PhilipA: Or must it use a literal as in "earl:info"?
13:46:57 <shadi> http://www.w3.org/TR/rdf-schema/#ch_properties
13:47:03 <Zakim> -Don
13:47:26 <Zakim> +Don
13:48:14 <shadi> http://www.w3.org/TR/rdf-schema/#ch_subclassof
13:49:41 <philipA> Shadi: I think it would keep the range and cannot extend it, but not quite sure. Will look into it.
13:51:37 <philipA> SamuelM: I'm think it mixes application logic (cause of error) with the report
13:54:26 <philipA> Shadi: Do we need to have more structure?
13:55:09 <philipA> SamuelM: from the perspective of webid it could be useful, agreed
13:55:40 <philipA> Shadi: Are there other use cases than for for webid?
13:56:05 <Zakim> -Don
13:56:49 <Zakim> +Don
13:57:16 <philipA> Shadi: first question / action: check if sub-property inherits range or if it can change the range
13:57:37 <philipA> Shadi: maybe another approach is to drop the range for "earl:info"
13:58:04 <shadi> action: shadi to check if domain and range of a property are transposed to a sub-property
13:58:04 <trackbot> Created ACTION-136 - Check if domain and range of a property are transposed to a sub-property [on Shadi Abou-Zahra - due 2012-02-15].
13:59:32 <philipA> Shadi: second question: think about other use cases for this
13:59:44 <Zakim> -Don
14:00:13 <shadi> Topics: Close open issues
14:00:31 <shadi> http://www.w3.org/WAI/ER/EARL10/issues#overall
14:00:55 <shadi> [[Drop rdfs:Domain and rdfs:Range for OWL constraints to increase reusability of the terms]]
14:01:12 <Zakim> +Don
14:01:34 <philipA> Shadi: 1.) drop rdfs:Domain and rdfs:Range
14:01:54 <philipA> Shadi: 2.) use OWL constraints
14:02:14 <philipA> Shadi: I did ask a semantic web colleague about this
14:02:33 <philipA> Shadi: conflicting comments from the semantic web people
14:02:52 <philipA> Shadi: there isn't any reason to change it
14:04:27 <philipA> Shadi: my proposal to close this item without dropping rdf:Domain and rdfs:Range and withoud using OWL constraints
14:04:46 <philipA> Shadi: any objections?
14:04:49 <shadi> RESOLUTION: close issue "Drop rdfs:Domain and rdfs:Range for OWL constraints to increase reusability of the terms"
14:05:14 <shadi> RESOLUTION: close issue "Use OWL constraints to express conformance requirements"
14:05:47 <shadi> [[Use of prefix "dc" vs "dct"]]
14:06:40 <philipA> SamuelM: we have two different namespaces, one pointing to dc terms and to dc elements
14:07:14 <philipA> SamuelM: in case of dc terms we use the prefix "dct", in case of dc elements we use "dc"
14:08:33 <philipA> SamuelM: but we will align to the community
14:08:46 <shadi> http://dublincore.org/schemas/rdfs/#NAMESPACE
14:08:58 <samuelm> http://dublincore.org/documents/dcmi-terms/
14:09:08 <philipA> SamuelM: but we need to be consistent in the EARL specification
14:09:16 <shadi> http://dublincore.org/documents/dcmi-namespace/
14:10:56 <philipA> Shadi: "dc" seems to be more widely used as "dct"
14:10:56 <shadi> "dc" usually more than "dct" or "dc-terms"
14:11:11 <philipA> SamuelM: but "dc" refers to the older specification
14:11:26 <shadi> "dcmi-terms"
14:11:56 <shadi> [[suggestion "dct" or "dc-terms"]]
14:12:09 <philipA> SamuelM: suggestion would be to use "dct" or "dc-terms"
14:12:27 <philipA> SamuelM: in no case use "dc", because it points to the older specification
14:13:39 <shadi> RESOLUTION: use prefix "dc" with namespace http://dublincore.org/documents/dcmi-terms/
14:13:49 <shadi> RESOLUTION: use prefix "dct" with namespace http://dublincore.org/documents/dcmi-terms/
14:15:07 <shadi> http://www.w3.org/WAI/ER/EARL10/guide-issues#serialization
14:15:50 <philipA> Shadi: EARL can represent TAP and xUnit
14:16:45 <philipA> Shadi: TAP seems to be more line-based with sequentially output
14:17:43 <philipA> Shadi: mabe put in a paragraph in the EARL guide
14:18:01 <philipA> Shadi: clarifying the relationship from EARL to TAP an xUnit
14:19:06 <shadi> RESOLUTION: no overlapping use cases even though all three specifications allow the representation of test results; could mention that EARL results can be serialized as TAP and/or xUnit, and vice-versa, in the corresponding section
14:20:35 <shadi> Topic: Upcoming Meetings
14:21:03 <shadi> 22 February 2012
14:21:23 <shadi> 7 March 2012
14:22:42 <Zakim> -Don
14:22:46 <Zakim> -philipA
14:22:50 <Zakim> -Shadi
14:22:52 <Zakim> -samuelm
14:22:54 <Zakim> WAI_ERTWG()8:30AM has ended
14:22:54 <Zakim> Attendees were +1.602.824.aaaa, Shadi, Don, philipA, samuelm
14:22:59 <philipA> philipA has left #er
14:23:08 <samuelm> samuelm has left #er
14:45:07 <shadi> trackbot, end meeting
14:45:07 <trackbot> Zakim, list attendees
14:45:07 <Zakim> sorry, trackbot, I don't know what conference this is
14:45:15 <trackbot> RRSAgent, please draft minutes
14:45:15 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/02/08-er-minutes.html trackbot
14:45:16 <trackbot> RRSAgent, bye
14:45:16 <RRSAgent> I see 1 open action item saved in http://www.w3.org/2012/02/08-er-actions.rdf :
14:45:16 <RRSAgent> ACTION: shadi to check if domain and range of a property are transposed to a sub-property [1]
14:45:16 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2012/02/08-er-irc#T13-58-04