14:58:00 RRSAgent has joined #xproc 14:58:00 logging to http://www.w3.org/2012/01/26-xproc-irc 14:58:11 Meeting: XML Processing Model WG 14:58:11 Date: 26 January 2012 14:58:11 Agenda: http://www.w3.org/XML/XProc/2012/01/26-agenda 14:58:11 Meeting: 207 14:58:12 Chair: Norm 14:58:14 Scribe: Norm 14:58:16 ScribeNick: Norm 14:58:18 rrsagent, set logs world-visible 14:58:59 alexmilowski has joined #xproc 15:00:13 XML_PMWG()10:00AM has now started 15:00:19 Vojtech has joined #xproc 15:00:20 +??P13 15:00:41 zakim, passcode? 15:00:41 the conference code is 97762 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 sip:zakim@voip.w3.org), Norm 15:01:03 +Norm 15:01:08 +Vojtech 15:01:22 +??P20 15:01:32 zakim, ??p20 is jfuller 15:01:32 +jfuller; got it 15:01:45 +Alex_Milows 15:01:49 zakim, who's here? 15:01:49 On the phone I see ht, Norm, Vojtech, jfuller, Alex_Milows 15:01:50 On IRC I see Vojtech, alexmilowski, RRSAgent, Zakim, Norm, jfuller, ht, caribou 15:01:59 zakim, alex_milows is alexmilowski 15:01:59 +alexmilowski; got it 15:02:07 zakim, who's here? 15:02:10 Regrets: Mohamed 15:02:12 On the phone I see ht, Norm, Vojtech, jfuller, alexmilowski 15:02:24 On IRC I see Vojtech, alexmilowski, RRSAgent, Zakim, Norm, jfuller, ht, caribou 15:02:38 +Cornelia 15:02:40 Present: Henry, Norm, Vojtech, Jim, Alex, Cornelia, Carine 15:02:44 +Carine 15:04:18 Topic: Accept this agenda? 15:04:18 -> http://www.w3.org/XML/XProc/2012/01/26-agenda 15:04:22 Accepted. 15:04:26 Topic: Accept minutes from the previous meeting? 15:04:26 -> http://www.w3.org/XML/XProc/2012/01/19-minutes.html 15:04:33 Accepted. 15:04:38 Topic: Next meeting: telcon, 2 February 2012 15:04:54 No regrets heard. 15:05:02 Topic: Review of open action items 15:05:16 A-206-01: continued 15:05:26 A-206-02: continued 15:05:40 A-206-03: completed 15:05:55 -> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xml-processing-model-wg/2012Jan/0041.html 15:06:13 Topic: Processor profiles WD published 15:06:17 Norm: Yay us. 15:06:24 -> http://www.w3.org/TR/2012/WD-xml-proc-profiles-20120124/ 15:06:40 ACTION: Norm to setup the last call comment list for new LCWD 15:07:01 Topic: Rechartering troubles 15:07:46 cornelia has joined #xproc 15:08:19 Norm: We got pushback on the charter; one of the possible solutions is to put FPWD of 2.0 in the charter. 15:08:36 Carine: We got pushback because the goals weren't defined clearly enough. 15:08:52 PGrosso has joined #xproc 15:09:38 ...I was also surprised to see that issue of Rec-track documents as pushback. We've done that before for requirements and use cases. 15:10:57 Some discussion of the clarity of our goals. 15:12:34 Norm: So, basically, if we want to do V.next, we'll need to have a workshop or some other event to gauge interest. And if we don't put V.next in the charter, we won't get chartered. 15:12:52 Carine: I think that's basically the case. 15:14:05 Norm: Liam suggests putting FPWD of 2.0 and the possibility of a workshop in the charter. Maybe we should do that. 15:14:20 Cornelia: And why wouldn't we do that, isn't that what we want to do? 15:14:32 Henry: Yes, but earlier conversations suggested that we weren't ready to do 2.0. 15:14:39 Alex: But we have community feedback for 2.0 15:14:49 Henry: Yes, I think Liam just needs help writing that: point to wiki, point to mailing list. 15:15:23 ACTION: Norm to work with Liam to get a new charter proposal drafted along those lines. 15:15:45 Topic: XProc V.next discussion 15:15:57 Norm: I sent a list of low-hanging fruit items. 15:16:02 -> http://www.w3.org/TR/2012/WD-xml-proc-profiles-20120124/ 15:16:14 Norm: And Vojtech observes that it doesn't anything about non-XML. 15:16:25 ...And I think maybe we could do something smallish about that. 15:16:51 Vojtech: I was thining especially about small stuff. 15:17:02 ...Like if you could save binary data, with p:store. 15:18:10 ...To make it more symetrical. We have p:load with p:document and p:data but we have nothing to store binary data. 15:18:27 Norm: Yes, and an option on p:store seems pretty straightfoward. 15:20:24 Vojtech: What I did is just what Norm did, I added an extension to p:store. But mine was a bit more generic in the sense that both and XML and non-XML data can flow through the pipeline. Whatever the p:store gets, it saves it. 15:20:59 ...I was thinking about p:document and p:data and their relationship. At the moment I didn't want to change that much. I changed p:data so that it can produce binary data that's not base64 encoded. 15:21:19 ...But I wonder if p:document, if you point it to binary data, whether it should do the same thing. Or if p:data should return XML. 15:23:24 -> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xml-processing-model-wg/2012Jan/0041.html 15:23:51 Norm: We should consider a proposal to do some work in this area; being able to load XML, HTML, JSON, etc. 15:24:05 Jim: In the past, have we ever talked about p:document*s*? 15:24:25 Henry: Yes, the possibility of having a set of documents flowing through the pipeline was there in the Markup pipeline. We did discuss it briefly, a while ago. 15:24:53 ...But it's not low-hanging fruit. You have to talk about how to generate names for these things; it really has to be a map so that steps down the pipeline can extract documents from the set. 15:25:37 Jim: But multiple p:document elements can be used. That might let you implement something like an ant fileset. 15:26:46 Vojtech: So like in ant, you could specify a base URI and some sort of mask, so you get a sequence of files. 15:27:44 Jim: it's a little awkward to work with sets of files and baking in at that level would remove the contortion from some pipelines. 15:28:38 Norm: That seems like it might be low hanging fruit; you could implement it yourself. 15:28:45 Jim: Yes, but it wouldn't bake in at the p:input level. 15:29:40 Norm: Yeah, I can see that. 15:30:01 ...I'll add that to the low-hanging fruit. 15:30:26 Alex: With AVTs, I can imagine that we might be able to do the same sort of thing with HTTP URIs. 15:30:44 ...So if you had a set of documents, you could iterate with numerical positions, perhaps. 15:31:10 Vojtech: You can also imagine doing this on the p:load step. 15:32:22 Jim: I've got one other thing. I did an experiment with my implementation, I enabled "AVT-everywhere". 15:32:39 Norm: You mean you made "{" and "} expand everywhere all the time. 15:32:56 Vojtech: But what if you want to include an XSLT pipelien? 15:33:02 Jim: You can turn it on and off. 15:33:50 Norm: I don't understand how that works. 15:34:00 Jim: There are lots of details; I just made them up. 15:34:48 Alex: That sounds a little bit like an alternative pipeline syntax. 15:35:19 Norm: I'd like to see some examples. 15:36:13 Norm runs through his list 15:36:56 completely agree on xpath 2.0 going forwards 15:41:45 Vojtech: There's also the question of optional not-specified options. 15:45:29 https://github.com/jpcs/rbtree.xq 15:48:45 Discussion inevitably returns to parameters. 15:51:27 Cornelia: I think another area we should be looking at is mashup-technologies. Those should be using XProc. 15:51:47 be great Cornelia if you have any links to mashups tech 15:52:39 Norm: I'll summarize again the low-hanging fruit and then I'd like everyone to think about whether or not that list is complete. 15:52:52 Topic: Any other business 15:52:58 None heard. 15:53:13 -Vojtech 15:53:14 -jfuller 15:53:14 -Norm 15:53:17 -Cornelia 15:53:19 -alexmilowski 15:53:21 rrsagent, draft minutes 15:53:21 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/01/26-xproc-minutes.html Norm 15:53:22 -Carine 15:53:24 cornelia has left #xproc 15:53:42 -ht 15:53:44 XML_PMWG()10:00AM has ended 15:53:45 Attendees were ht, Norm, Vojtech, jfuller, alexmilowski, Cornelia, Carine 15:55:39 leave 15:55:42 PGrosso has left #xproc 16:07:18 ht has joined #xproc 17:07:15 ht has joined #xproc 17:07:18 Zakim has left #xproc 17:59:47 ht has joined #xproc