15:51:37 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #i18n
15:51:37 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2012/01/25-i18n-irc
15:51:40 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #i18n
15:51:47 <aphillip> trackbot, prepare teleconference
15:51:50 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs world
15:51:52 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be 4186
15:51:52 <Zakim> ok, trackbot; I see I18N_CoreWG()11:00AM scheduled to start in 9 minutes
15:51:53 <trackbot> Meeting: Internationalization Core Working Group Teleconference
15:51:53 <trackbot> Date: 25 January 2012
15:57:40 <Zakim> I18N_CoreWG()11:00AM has now started
15:57:47 <Zakim> +[Microsoft]
15:57:58 <Gwyneth> Gwyneth has joined #i18n
15:59:27 <matial> matial has joined #i18n
15:59:49 <David> David has joined #i18n
16:00:06 <David> I'll be here properly in 2 minutes.
16:00:30 <aphillip> aphillip has joined #i18n
16:00:37 <Zakim> +aphillip
16:00:43 <Zakim> +??P16
16:01:00 <matial> zakim, ??P16 is me
16:01:00 <Zakim> +matial; got it
16:01:36 <r12a> zakim, dial richard
16:01:36 <Zakim> ok, r12a; the call is being made
16:01:38 <Zakim> +Richard
16:01:47 <aphillip> Agenda: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-i18n-core/2012Jan/0010.html
16:01:53 <aphillip> Scribe: Addison Phillips
16:01:57 <aphillip> ScribeNick: aphillip
16:02:07 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/01/25-i18n-minutes.html aphillip
16:02:14 <aphillip> rrsagent, set logs world
16:02:19 <aphillip> rrsagent, draft minutes
16:02:19 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/01/25-i18n-minutes.html aphillip
16:02:20 <Zakim> +??P22
16:02:32 <aphillip> Chair: Addison Phillips
16:03:46 <Zakim> + +1.408.536.aaaa
16:03:58 <Zakim> +David
16:04:38 <kojiishi> kojiishi has joined #i18n
16:05:18 <joconner> joconner has joined #i18n
16:05:36 <aphillip> Topic: Minutes/Agenda
16:05:52 <aphillip> Topic: Action Items
16:06:26 <aphillip> close ACTION-80
16:06:26 <trackbot> ACTION-80 Update the review radar and respond to WGs on pending reviews closed
16:06:55 <Zakim> +??P32
16:07:13 <r12a> http://www.w3.org/International/wiki/Review_radar
16:07:13 <kojiishi> zakim, ??P32 is me
16:07:13 <Zakim> +kojiishi; got it
16:07:23 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/01/25-i18n-minutes.html aphillip
16:08:15 <r12a> http://www.w3.org/International/wiki/Review_history
16:09:14 <aphillip> me zakim, +1.408 is joconner
16:09:40 <r12a> http://www.w3.org/International/wiki/Core_Pipeline
16:10:42 <aphillip> Topic: Info Share
16:11:21 <aphillip> felix volunteers richard.....
16:11:31 <fsasaki> http://www.w3.org/2011/12/mlw-lt-charter.html
16:11:40 <aphillip> felix: kickoff of project bring the mlw-lt-charter forward
16:11:52 <aphillip> ... find metadata for all kinds of language related processing on the web
16:12:05 <aphillip> ... includes things like localization, MT, etc.
16:12:24 <aphillip> ... influence developers to bring content metadata to the web
16:12:25 <fsasaki> https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/33280/mlw-lt/
16:12:36 <aphillip> ... please ask AC Reps to join the above group
16:13:04 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/01/25-i18n-minutes.html aphillip
16:13:22 <aphillip> richard: name of the WG is...
16:13:26 <r12a> MultilingualWeb-LT
16:13:28 <aphillip> felix: Multilingual Web LT
16:13:39 <aphillip> ... where LT == Language Technologies
16:13:57 <aphillip> ... ITS Interest Group to be closely associated
16:14:11 <aphillip> felix: I am co-chair and staff contact
16:14:27 <r12a> Dave Lewis
16:14:28 <aphillip> ... other chair is Dave Lewis
16:14:31 <r12a> David Filip
16:14:41 <fsasaki> http://www.cngl.ie/index.html
16:14:43 <aphillip> s/Lewis/Filip/
16:14:52 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/01/25-i18n-minutes.html aphillip
16:16:42 <aphillip> richard: getting closer to the ML Web Workshop
16:16:52 <aphillip> ... last one organized by the ML Web project
16:17:04 <aphillip> ... felix's new project may organize similar in the future
16:17:09 <aphillip> ... registration is quite high
16:17:13 <aphillip> ... so get registrations in
16:17:21 <aphillip> ... be aware of it and tell others about it
16:17:37 <r12a> http://multilingualweb.eu/register
16:17:58 <aphillip> chair: welcome new member: John O'Conner from Adobe
16:18:53 <aphillip> john: adobe just joined the WG and asked me to represent them
16:19:10 <aphillip> ... been involved for 16-17 years
16:19:21 <aphillip> ... interested in web services and technologies
16:19:59 <aphillip> richard: hixie has proposed addition of @translate to HTML5
16:20:06 <aphillip> ... as a global attribute
16:20:35 <fsasaki> s/other chair is Dave Lewis/other two co-chairs are Dave Lewis and David Filip/
16:20:42 <aphillip> Topic: JLReq v2 Publication Request
16:20:57 <aphillip>   https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-i18n-core/2012Jan/0008.html
16:21:22 <aphillip> richard: may be a little early
16:21:33 <aphillip> ... but they think they're done with the content
16:21:43 <aphillip> ... next step is for me to edit their English
16:21:59 <aphillip> ... they are publishing a paper version in Japanese in Japan
16:22:05 <aphillip> ... and the date for that is 10 April
16:22:16 <aphillip> ... so they want to release W3C Note document about the same time
16:22:21 <aphillip> ... perhaps a week earlier
16:22:32 <aphillip> ... we need to approve as a working group for it to go forward
16:22:43 <fsasaki> s/influence developers/influence developers and all kinds of content producers/
16:24:09 <aphillip> Topic: CSS Escape Sequences
16:24:19 <aphillip>    https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-i18n-core/2012Jan/0007.html
16:24:45 <aphillip> I18N-ISSUE-147
16:24:48 <r12a> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2012Jan/0536.html
16:24:59 <aphillip> https://www.w3.org/International/track/issues/147
16:25:30 <aphillip> richard: some browsers implement escapes in CSS incorrectly
16:25:48 <aphillip> ... and you have to enter UTF-16 surrogate pairs to get a supplementary character
16:26:01 <aphillip> ... and it's not supposed to work that what; charmod frowns upon it
16:26:40 <aphillip> addison: goodness gracious!!
16:27:40 <aphillip> richard: call on the mustard in CharMod
16:28:27 <aphillip> ACTION: addison: write to CSS style list strongly opposing surrogate pair escapes in CSS and citing CharMod
16:28:27 <trackbot> Created ACTION-91 - Write to CSS style list strongly opposing surrogate pair escapes in CSS and citing CharMod [on Addison Phillips - due 2012-02-01].
16:28:52 <aphillip> Topic: Ruby Discussion
16:29:54 <aphillip> koji: I see a few threads running in parallel
16:30:25 <aphillip> ... Ian doesn't believe double-sided ruby is common enough
16:30:34 <aphillip> ... so I gathered some example
16:31:20 <aphillip> addison: waiting for statistics to share
16:31:29 <aphillip> koji: another thread is about fallback
16:31:47 <aphillip> ... supporting idea of <rb><rb><rt><rt> sequence
16:34:38 <aphillip> addison: concerned about the word-by-word thread
16:35:02 <aphillip> koji: fallback issue
16:35:19 <aphillip> ... similarity to letter-by-letter example because 
16:35:27 <aphillip> ... we want to join words when we do fallback
16:36:02 <aphillip> richard: eric made some comments along those lines
16:36:14 <aphillip> ... assumed that if you wanted to find word boundaries, as in jukugo
16:36:23 <aphillip> ... then use mutliple ruby elements
16:38:14 <aphillip> <ruby><rb>tokyo</rb><rt>tok</rt><rt>yo</rt></ruby>
16:39:22 <r12a> <ruby><rb>tok</rb><rb>yo</rb><rt>tok</rt><rt>yo</rt></ruby>
16:41:20 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/01/25-i18n-minutes.html aphillip
16:41:28 <r12a> http://rishida.net/blog/?p=469
16:42:54 <aphillip> http://www.w3.org/TR/jlreq/#en-subheading2_3
16:45:54 <aphillip> richard: think mono ruby and jukugo ruby use same markup
16:46:01 <aphillip> ... and group ruby is different
16:46:11 <aphillip> ... jukugo looks sometimes *like* group ruby
16:47:23 <aphillip> koji: changing markup to build group ruby is a hack until we have css-ruby spec
16:51:06 <aphillip> koji: when text is unbreakable, then using group ruby markup is okay
16:51:16 <aphillip> ... but when text is breakable, but can style as group
16:51:19 <aphillip> ... so change markup
16:52:14 <aphillip> koji: if text can break, markup should always indicate where breaks are
16:52:22 <aphillip> ... and then can style as breaking or non-breaking
16:53:03 <aphillip> richard: don't have to change markup, just style with no-break
16:53:29 <aphillip> koji: might need one more style then
16:53:47 <aphillip> richard: marked up as mono ruby, but want to behave as group ruby
16:53:51 <aphillip> ... without markup change
16:54:12 <aphillip> ... want it to behave and look like group ruby
16:54:28 <aphillip> ... so if six base characters and four hiragana character
16:54:36 <aphillip> ... you want the four distributed evenly across
16:56:12 <matial> sorry, have to leave now
16:58:05 <aphillip> richard: 11 february date
16:58:20 <aphillip> richard: reading threads, it's very complicated
16:58:29 <aphillip> ... and really need something very simple to summarize
16:58:57 <aphillip> ... and would like additional pros/cons in short simple prose to wiki
17:00:02 <aphillip> richard: do we need <rb> mandatory or optional
17:00:32 <aphillip> ... may be a case, as in A12Y, for it in simple ruby
17:02:16 <aphillip> richard: IE doesn't do a lot of the newer elements except via the shiv
17:02:34 <joconner> must drop off the phone now but will remain on IRC
17:03:02 <Zakim> -joconner
17:03:26 <Zakim> -fsasaki
17:03:35 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/01/25-i18n-minutes.html aphillip
17:05:14 <Zakim> -Gwyneth
17:06:44 <aphillip> richard: does (someone) have more time to go through the pile of emails and pull out key points to add to wiki?
17:07:28 <aphillip> Topic: AOB?
17:07:53 <Zakim> -David
17:07:55 <Zakim> -kojiishi
17:07:56 <Zakim> -aphillip
17:08:03 <aphillip> rrsagent, make minutes
17:08:03 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/01/25-i18n-minutes.html aphillip
17:08:26 <aphillip> zakim, who is here?
17:08:26 <Zakim> On the phone I see matial, Richard
17:08:26 <Zakim> On IRC I see joconner, kojiishi, aphillip, matial, Gwyneth, Zakim, RRSAgent, r12a, trackbot
17:08:49 <aphillip> Present: Addison, Richard, Gwyneth, Mati, John, Koji, Felix
17:08:58 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/01/25-i18n-minutes.html aphillip
17:09:21 <aphillip> rrsagent, bye
17:09:21 <RRSAgent> I see 1 open action item saved in http://www.w3.org/2012/01/25-i18n-actions.rdf :
17:09:21 <RRSAgent> ACTION: addison: write to CSS style list strongly opposing surrogate pair escapes in CSS and citing CharMod [1]
17:09:21 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2012/01/25-i18n-irc#T16-28-27