17:57:30 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #webperf
17:57:30 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2011/12/14-webperf-irc
17:57:32 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs world
17:57:32 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #webperf
17:57:34 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be WPWG
17:57:34 <Zakim> I do not see a conference matching that name scheduled within the next hour, trackbot
17:57:35 <trackbot> Meeting: Web Performance Working Group Teleconference
17:57:35 <trackbot> Date: 14 December 2011
17:59:30 <Karen_> Karen_ has joined #Webperf
17:59:40 <plh> plh has joined #webperf
18:00:32 <plh> zakim, list conferences
18:00:32 <Zakim> I see T&S_Track(dnt)12:00PM, RWC_web-per()1:00PM, WAI_PF()12:00PM, Style_CSS FP()12:00PM, XML_EXI()12:30PM active
18:00:34 <Zakim> also scheduled at this time is INC_(CGINF)1:00PM
18:00:40 <plh> zakim, this will be web-per
18:00:40 <Zakim> ok, plh, I see RWC_web-per()1:00PM already started
18:00:50 <Zakim> +Plh
18:00:54 <Zakim> +Michelle_Park
18:00:55 <Alois> Alois has joined #webperf
18:00:56 <Zakim> -Michelle_Park
18:00:58 <Zakim> +Michelle_Park
18:01:00 <Zakim> + +1.604.875.aaaa
18:01:03 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
18:01:27 <JatinderMann> present+ Karen
18:01:29 <JatinderMann> present+ plh
18:01:32 <JatinderMann> present+ Jatinder
18:01:58 <Zakim> + +1.650.253.aabb
18:02:14 <JatinderMann> present+ Arvind
18:02:58 <Zakim> + +43.732.908.2aacc
18:04:19 <JatinderMann> present+ SteveSounders
18:04:23 <JatinderMann> present+ Jan
18:04:37 <Zakim> +Jon_Gunderson
18:04:42 <JatinderMann> Topic: HAR Format and Navigation Timing
18:04:51 <JatinderMann> present+ Zhiheng
18:05:05 <JatinderMann> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-web-perf/2011Nov/0049.html
18:05:19 <JatinderMann> http://www.softwareishard.com/blog/har-12-spec/
18:05:37 <zhihengw> zhihengw has joined #webperf
18:05:39 <JatinderMann> Arvind: Does it make sense to standarize the HAR spec in the W3C?
18:05:52 <Zakim> +Michelle_Park.a
18:05:59 <simonjam> simonjam has joined #webperf
18:06:25 <JatinderMann> ...Another issue is that does it make for the browser to implement this
18:06:52 <JatinderMann> Jatinder: Can we get some background on when this was designed and how widely adopted is it?
18:08:18 <JatinderMann> Jan: Three years ago we created HAR format v1 to create a common template to send data up for many uses like analytics and test cases. We currently have HAR v1.2. HAR v1.3 will eventually include Navigation Timing.
18:09:03 <JatinderMann> ...HAR currently has a <timings> tag. 
18:09:40 <JatinderMann> Steve: I think its important to mention where HAR is supported today. Firebug, Chrome Dev Tools, IE9/10.
18:11:47 <JatinderMann> http://www.softwareishard.com/blog/har-12-spec/
18:12:44 <JatinderMann> James: Whats the action here?
18:13:17 <JatinderMann> Arvind: The questions are: Should the HAR spec be included in the W3C spec?
18:16:21 <JatinderMann> Jatinder: I think generally the HAR format sounds like a good idea. But I think our timing specs shouldn't take any dependency on a particular format.
18:16:50 <JatinderMann> Arvind: The two are independent. If anything, HAR format would take a dependency on the Timing specs, not the other way around.
18:19:41 <Karen_> I would want to ensure that if there are 2 mthods of getting the data that they can align together and there are no discrepancies
18:23:38 <JatinderMann> Steve: I would bet that over 50% of web pages storing performance data use the HAR format. The value here is that in can be interoperable between other tools.
18:24:15 <JatinderMann> ...Another point is to bring a JavaScript API to output a HAR format
18:28:22 <JatinderMann> James: Would this be a W3C spec? I was under the impression that the W3C specs were browser related.
18:29:47 <JatinderMann> plh: The web is more than just the browser. We can include this in the W3 spec.
18:34:34 <JatinderMann> Jan will propose the HAR format in the Web Perf spec format.
18:37:40 <Zakim> -Michelle_Park
18:39:06 <JatinderMann> Arvind: Seems like it doesn't make sense to expose this to JavaScript, as there may be privacy and security concerns. This is in fact mostly designed to be used by developer tools. Do you agree Jan?
18:39:24 <JatinderMann> Jan: Yes, I think this is for developer tools rather than from script.
18:39:44 <Zakim> -Plh
18:41:58 <JatinderMann> Topic: Conference Call Schedule 
18:42:20 <JatinderMann> Jatinder: Let's keep next week's meeting as tentative and cancel 12/28 meeting. We can reconvene in the new year.
18:42:40 <Zakim> -Michelle_Park.a
18:42:42 <Zakim> - +1.650.253.aabb
18:42:45 <Zakim> - +1.604.875.aaaa
18:42:46 <Zakim> -Jon_Gunderson
18:42:48 <Zakim> -[Microsoft]
18:42:49 <Zakim> -[IPcaller]
18:42:50 <Zakim> - +43.732.908.2aacc
18:42:50 <Zakim> RWC_web-per()1:00PM has ended
18:42:52 <Zakim> Attendees were [Microsoft], Plh, Michelle_Park, +1.604.875.aaaa, [IPcaller], +1.650.253.aabb, +43.732.908.2aacc, Jon_Gunderson
18:43:17 <JatinderMann> Jatinder: We can discuss Alois' topic of tool apis on the Jan 11 meeting.
18:43:40 <JatinderMann> rrsagent, generate minutes
18:43:40 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/12/14-webperf-minutes.html JatinderMann
20:28:03 <Zakim> Zakim has left #webperf
22:00:55 <Karen_> Karen_ has joined #webperf
22:01:09 <JatinderMann> trackbot, start telecon
22:01:11 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs world
22:01:11 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #webperf
22:01:13 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be WPWG
22:01:13 <Zakim> I do not see a conference matching that name scheduled within the next hour, trackbot
22:01:14 <trackbot> Meeting: Web Performance Working Group Teleconference
22:01:14 <trackbot> Date: 14 December 2011
22:02:07 <Karen_> present+Karen
22:02:17 <JatinderMann> present+ Jatinder
22:02:20 <JatinderMann> present+ Ganesh
22:55:26 <trackbot> trackbot has joined #webperf
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