IRC log of er on 2011-11-23

Timestamps are in UTC.

13:28:17 [RRSAgent]
RRSAgent has joined #er
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logging to http://www.w3.org/2011/11/23-er-irc
13:28:19 [trackbot]
RRSAgent, make logs public
13:28:19 [Zakim]
Zakim has joined #er
13:28:21 [trackbot]
Zakim, this will be 3794
13:28:21 [Zakim]
ok, trackbot; I see WAI_ERTWG()8:30AM scheduled to start in 2 minutes
13:28:22 [trackbot]
Meeting: Evaluation and Repair Tools Working Group Teleconference
13:28:22 [trackbot]
Date: 23 November 2011
13:28:52 [cstrobbe]
cstrobbe has joined #er
13:29:22 [Zakim]
WAI_ERTWG()8:30AM has now started
13:29:29 [Zakim]
+[IPcaller]
13:29:33 [shadi]
zakim, ipcaller is me
13:29:33 [Zakim]
+shadi; got it
13:30:33 [shadi]
agenda+ Welcome
13:30:33 [shadi]
agenda+ Complete log of issues
13:30:33 [shadi]
agenda+ EARL 1.0 Test Suite
13:30:33 [shadi]
agenda+ EARL 1.0 Checker(s)
13:30:33 [shadi]
agenda+ REC-track of EARL modules?
13:30:34 [shadi]
agenda+ Upcoming meeting schedule
13:30:58 [philipA]
philipA has joined #er
13:31:11 [Zakim]
+Christophe_Strobbe
13:31:33 [Zakim]
+??P10
13:31:57 [carlosV]
carlosV has joined #er
13:31:57 [philipA]
Zakim, ??P10 is philipA
13:31:57 [Zakim]
+philipA; got it
13:32:02 [Zakim]
+ +030001aaaa
13:32:25 [shadi]
zakim, aaaa is Emmanuelle
13:32:26 [Zakim]
+Emmanuelle; got it
13:32:36 [Zakim]
+??P12
13:32:55 [shadi]
zakim, ??p12 is CarlosV
13:32:55 [Zakim]
+CarlosV; got it
13:33:06 [shadi]
zakim, who is on the phone?
13:33:06 [Zakim]
On the phone I see shadi, Christophe_Strobbe, philipA, Emmanuelle (muted), CarlosV
13:33:54 [shadi]
agenda?
13:34:51 [shadi]
zakim, take up agendum 2
13:34:51 [Zakim]
agendum 2. "Complete log of issues" taken up [from shadi]
13:35:04 [cstrobbe]
scribe: cstrobbe
13:35:24 [shadi]
- <http://www.w3.org/WAI/ER/EARL10/issues>
13:35:24 [shadi]
- <http://www.w3.org/WAI/ER/EARL10/guide-issues>
13:35:24 [shadi]
- <http://www.w3.org/WAI/ER/HTTP/issues>
13:35:24 [shadi]
- <http://www.w3.org/WAI/ER/Content/issues>
13:35:26 [shadi]
- <http://www.w3.org/WAI/ER/Pointers/issues>
13:36:36 [cstrobbe]
Comments, open issues, pending issues, resolutions all logged at http://www.w3.org/WAI/ER/EARL10/issues and the other URLs
13:36:56 [cstrobbe]
EARL Guide needs editing.
13:37:41 [cstrobbe]
WG participants should check the list, the resolutions and the open issues.
13:38:29 [cstrobbe]
CarlosV: Talk to Semantic Web people on OWL etc?
13:38:53 [cstrobbe]
Shadi: See first 5 open issues.
13:39:30 [cstrobbe]
Shadi: Could use some help on design of the Schema (OWL constraints, conformance requirements).
13:40:17 [cstrobbe]
Shadi: Also, send your thoughts to the list.
13:40:41 [cstrobbe]
Shadi: Third issue: dc or dct prefix: conflicting comments.
13:40:56 [cstrobbe]
Shadi: Samuel was also going to look into this.
13:41:31 [cstrobbe]
CarlosV: Elsewhere comments preferred dct.
13:42:16 [cstrobbe]
Shadi: Fourth issue: profiles for conformance. About how to phrase conformance requirements.
13:42:51 [cstrobbe]
Shadi: Some other W3C specs use profiles. Please look into this and discuss it on the mailing list.
13:43:18 [cstrobbe]
Shadi: Fifth open issue: move conformance to the top of the document.
13:44:44 [cstrobbe]
CStrobbe: other W3C specs: no consistency in where they put the conformance section.
13:45:12 [cstrobbe]
Shadi: Pending = we took a resolution but action is required to update the draft.
13:45:53 [shadi]
http://www.w3.org/WAI/ER/EARL10/guide-issues
13:46:01 [cstrobbe]
Shadi: Open issues for the EARL Guide.
13:46:46 [cstrobbe]
Shadi: dc vs dct prefix issue propagates through all the EARL docs.
13:48:41 [cstrobbe]
Shadi: open issue on overlap between TAP and xUnit : no overlap; see we could take a resolution today.
13:49:06 [cstrobbe]
Shadi: subsequent discussion with TAP people: e.g. TAP also supports streaming.
13:50:42 [cstrobbe]
RESOLUTION: The use cases for TAP and xUnit are significantly different from EARL so that further work is not necessary.
13:51:11 [shadi]
zakim, take up agendum 3
13:51:12 [Zakim]
agendum 3. "EARL 1.0 Test Suite" taken up [from shadi]
13:51:18 [shadi]
http://www.w3.org/WAI/ER/EARL10/tests/
13:51:57 [cstrobbe]
Shadi: EARL can't pass Candidate Recommendation phase without a test suite.
13:52:16 [cstrobbe]
Shadi: A test suite would help evaluate an implementation.
13:52:40 [cstrobbe]
Shadi: We need to think about both EARL input and EARL output.
13:52:47 [shadi]
http://www.w3.org/WAI/ER/EARL10/tests/test0001.rdf
13:53:01 [cstrobbe]
Shadi: minimal test file / EARL report.
13:53:36 [cstrobbe]
Shadi: The second test could be a complete example with example code from the spec.
13:53:49 [cstrobbe]
Shadi: We have something like that in the EARL Guide.
13:54:38 [cstrobbe]
Shadi: A complete working example that we can use throughout. Using all the features.
13:55:21 [cstrobbe]
CarlosV: Working on HTTP-in-RDF.
13:55:51 [philipA]
<rdf:RDF
13:55:52 [philipA]
xmlns:cs="http://imergo.com/ns/2012/compliancesets#"
13:55:54 [philipA]
xmlns:rdf="http://www.w3.org/1999/02/22-rdf-syntax-ns#"
13:55:55 [philipA]
xmlns:foaf="http://xmlns.com/foaf/0.1/"
13:55:57 [philipA]
xmlns:dct="http://purl.org/dc/terms/"
13:55:58 [philipA]
xmlns:rdfs="http://www.w3.org/2000/01/rdf-schema#"
13:56:00 [philipA]
xml:base="http://imergo.com/ns/tests/F30.rdf">
13:56:01 [philipA]
<cs:ComplianceTest rdf:about="">
13:56:03 [philipA]
<dct:source rdf:resource="http://www.w3.org/TR/WCAG20/#media-equiv-av-only-alt"/>
13:56:04 [philipA]
<dct:source rdf:resource="http://www.w3.org/TR/WCAG20/#text-equiv-all"/>
13:56:06 [philipA]
<cs:type rdf:resource="http://imergo.com/ns/2012/compliancesets#failure"/>
13:56:07 [philipA]
<dct:license rdf:resource="http://www.imergo.com/LICENSE.html"/>
13:56:09 [philipA]
<dct:rightsHolder>
13:56:10 [philipA]
<foaf:Organization rdf:about="http://www.fit.fraunhofer.de"/>
13:56:12 [philipA]
</dct:rightsHolder>
13:56:13 [philipA]
<dct:conformsTo rdf:resource="http://www.w3.org/TR/2010/NOTE-WCAG20-TECHS-20101014/F30"/>
13:56:15 [philipA]
<dct:description>This describes a failure condition for all techniques involving text alternatives. If the text in the "text alternative" cannot be used in place of the non-text content without losing information or function then it fails because it is not, in fact, an alternative to the non-text content.</dct:description>
13:56:18 [philipA]
<dct:title>F30: Failure of Success Criterion 1.1.1 and 1.2.1 due to using text alternatives that are not alternatives (e.g., filenames or placeholder text)</dct:title>
13:56:21 [philipA]
</cs:ComplianceTest>
13:56:23 [philipA]
<foaf:Organization rdf:about="http://www.fit.fraunhofer.de">
13:56:25 [philipA]
<rdfs:label>Fraunhofer Gesellschaft</rdfs:label>
13:56:27 [philipA]
<foaf:homepage rdf:resource="http://www.fit.fraunhofer.de"/>
13:56:29 [philipA]
</foaf:Organization>
13:56:31 [philipA]
</rdf:RDF>
13:56:57 [carlosV]
carlosV has joined #er
13:58:42 [cstrobbe]
CarlosV: working on test case description; cf TCDL.
13:59:04 [cstrobbe]
Carlos: Also have expected outcome and pointers.
14:00:04 [cstrobbe]
CarlosV: SPARQL was also under consideration.
14:01:48 [shadi]
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-wai-ert/2005Oct/att-0014/wcag10.rdf
14:04:13 [samuelm]
samuelm has joined #er
14:06:04 [Zakim]
+??P14
14:06:14 [Zakim]
-Emmanuelle
14:06:53 [shadi]
zakim, ??p14 is samuelm
14:06:53 [Zakim]
+samuelm; got it
14:09:30 [cstrobbe]
Shadi: We should generate tests, each of which highlights a different feature, e.g. subclass Info, ...
14:10:06 [cstrobbe]
CarlosV: We need test files and derived EARL reports for these test files.
14:13:10 [cstrobbe]
Shadi: For the test suite, we want test reports rather than test descriptions.
14:14:33 [cstrobbe]
Shadi: First example is minimal; could use earl:Assertor instead.
14:15:23 [cstrobbe]
Shadi: If everyone generates 5-10 files, we have a nice set.
14:15:33 [cstrobbe]
CarlosV: CVS access?
14:16:05 [cstrobbe]
Shadi: Yes, or just send them to me. But we will need to think about where to put them for public access.
14:16:37 [cstrobbe]
ChristopheS: Then, what exactly do we do with the test files?
14:17:05 [cstrobbe]
Shadi: Tools that input EARL...
14:17:36 [shadi]
zakim, take up agendum 4
14:17:36 [Zakim]
agendum 4. "EARL 1.0 Checker(s)" taken up [from shadi]
14:18:14 [cstrobbe]
Shadi: We need EARL checkers: software that checks the report to check that it is valid. Cf conformance requirements.
14:18:58 [cstrobbe]
Shadi: There are PHP RDF libraries and libraries in other languages. A checker could be fairly simple.
14:23:33 [cstrobbe]
Shadi: We'll need at least the test suite to enter CR; we will also need the EARL checker to exit Candidate Recommendation phase.
14:23:41 [shadi]
zakim, take up agendum 5
14:23:41 [Zakim]
agendum 5. "REC-track of EARL modules?" taken up [from shadi]
14:24:14 [cstrobbe]
Shadi: Open issue: other specification on Recommendation track.
14:24:47 [cstrobbe]
Shadi: This would imply more test suites, implementation documentation and more checkers.
14:25:35 [cstrobbe]
Shadi: Keeping modules off REC track, to avoid getting locked in CR phase?
14:26:05 [cstrobbe]
Shadi: Currently, only EARL Schema is on REC track; all other documents are planned to become WG Notes.
14:26:23 [cstrobbe]
Shadi: Any objections or comments?
14:27:22 [cstrobbe]
CarlosV: Implementation could be quite complex with some of the specs.
14:28:29 [cstrobbe]
RESOLUTION: Keep EARL modules as Working Group Notes.
14:29:15 [cstrobbe]
Shadi: Open action items.
14:29:52 [cstrobbe]
samuelm: Contradictory sources regarding dc versus dct namespace prefix.
14:30:23 [cstrobbe]
Shadi: On Dublin Core site: contact them on the latest status.
14:31:18 [cstrobbe]
samuelm: dc or dct is just a convention; we may not get a definitive answer from Dublin Core.
14:31:37 [shadi]
zakim, take up agendum 6
14:31:37 [Zakim]
agendum 6. "Upcoming meeting schedule" taken up [from shadi]
14:31:51 [Zakim]
-CarlosV
14:32:11 [cstrobbe]
Shadi: No meeting next week, nor on 7 December.
14:33:03 [cstrobbe]
Shadi: By next meeting (14 December): drafts for WG member to look at. Please also work on the test suites and possibly an EARL checker.
14:33:15 [Zakim]
-samuelm
14:33:16 [Zakim]
-philipA
14:33:18 [Zakim]
-Christophe_Strobbe
14:33:19 [samuelm]
samuelm has left #er
14:33:21 [Zakim]
-shadi
14:33:22 [Zakim]
WAI_ERTWG()8:30AM has ended
14:33:25 [Zakim]
Attendees were shadi, Christophe_Strobbe, philipA, +030001aaaa, Emmanuelle, CarlosV, samuelm
14:33:33 [shadi]
trackbot, end meeting
14:33:33 [trackbot]
Zakim, list attendees
14:33:33 [Zakim]
sorry, trackbot, I don't know what conference this is
14:33:34 [trackbot]
RRSAgent, please draft minutes
14:33:34 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/11/23-er-minutes.html trackbot
14:33:35 [trackbot]
RRSAgent, bye
14:33:35 [RRSAgent]
I see no action items