14:55:59 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #rd
14:55:59 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2011/10/13-rd-irc
14:56:01 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs world
14:56:01 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #rd
14:56:03 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be 7394
14:56:03 <Zakim> ok, trackbot; I see WAI_RDWG()11:00AM scheduled to start in 4 minutes
14:56:04 <trackbot> Meeting: Research and Development Working Group Teleconference
14:56:04 <trackbot> Date: 13 October 2011
14:56:20 <sharper> Chair: Harper_Simon
14:56:20 <sharper> Agenda+ Welcome & Logistics (Regrets, Agenda Requests, Comments)
14:56:20 <sharper> Agenda+ Final Agreement on Evaluation Procedure - http://www.w3.org/WAI/RD/wiki/Paper_Selection_Criteria
14:56:20 <sharper> Agenda+ Upcoming Focus
14:56:20 <sharper> Agenda+ Any Other Business
14:56:30 <sharper> zakim, save agenda
14:56:36 <Zakim> ok, sharper, the agenda has been written to http://www.w3.org/2011/10/13-rd-agenda.rdf
14:56:38 <sharper> zakim, take up item 1
14:56:38 <Zakim> agendum 1. "Welcome & Logistics (Regrets, Agenda Requests, Comments)" taken up [from sharper]
14:56:48 <sharper> rrsagent, make logs public
14:56:48 <sharper> rrsagent, draft minutes
14:56:48 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/10/13-rd-minutes.html sharper
14:56:49 <shadi> zakim, call shadi-617
14:56:49 <Zakim> ok, shadi; the call is being made
14:56:50 <Zakim> WAI_RDWG()11:00AM has now started
14:56:51 <Zakim> +Shadi
14:57:00 <sharper> present+ Harper_Simon
14:57:16 <sharper> regrets+ Yesilada_Yeliz
14:57:21 <Joshue108> zakim, code?
14:57:21 <Zakim> the conference code is 7394 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 sip:zakim@voip.w3.org), Joshue108
14:57:27 <sharper> regrets+ Brajnik_Giorgio
14:57:39 <Zakim> +??P8
14:57:51 <Joshue108> zakim, ??P8 is Joshue
14:57:51 <Zakim> +Joshue; got it
14:58:05 <sharper> regrets+ Kouroupetroglou_Christos
14:58:15 <sharper> present+ O'Connor_Joshue
14:58:32 <sharper> present+ Abou-Zahra_Shadi
14:58:42 <sharper> rrsagent, draft minutes
14:58:42 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/10/13-rd-minutes.html sharper
15:01:01 <Joshue108> zakim, mute me
15:01:08 <Zakim> Joshue should now be muted
15:01:17 <Zakim> +??P31
15:01:26 <sharper> zakim, ??P31 is sharper
15:01:34 <Zakim> +sharper; got it
15:01:39 <peter> peter has joined #rd
15:01:52 <Mario-Batusic> Mario-Batusic has joined #rd
15:01:58 <sharper> present+ Thiessen_Peter
15:02:19 <Zakim> + +1.361.279.aaaa
15:02:29 <Mate> zakim, aaaa is me
15:02:43 <Zakim> +Mate; got it
15:02:44 <peter> (hello - sorry may be a bit late joining in, trying to release some software)
15:03:23 <shadi> scribe: Mate 
15:04:48 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
15:05:35 <shadi> zakim, ipcaller is vivienne
15:05:45 <Mate> thx
15:05:52 <Zakim> +vivienne; got it
15:06:35 <vconway> vconway has joined #rd
15:07:46 <shadi> zakim, who is on the phone?
15:07:46 <Zakim> On the phone I see Shadi, Joshue (muted), sharper, Mate, vivienne
15:08:42 <vconway> markel sends his regrets
15:09:15 <vconway> zakim, mute me
15:09:15 <Zakim> sorry, vconway, I do not know which phone connection belongs to you
15:09:24 <vconway> zakim, vconway is vivienne
15:09:24 <Zakim> sorry, vconway, I do not recognize a party named 'vconway'
15:10:25 <Joshue108> thats fine with me
15:10:39 <shadi> http://www.w3.org/WAI/RD/wiki/Paper_Selection_Criteria
15:10:45 <Zakim> + +43.680.306.aabb
15:10:46 <Joshue108> thats it
15:11:11 <Joshue108> Can we put that on the agenda for next week?
15:11:23 <shadi> q+
15:11:29 <Mario-Batusic> zakim +43 is me
15:11:58 <vconway> zakim, mute me
15:11:58 <Zakim> sorry, vconway, I do not know which phone connection belongs to you
15:12:28 <shadi> ack me
15:12:46 <Mate> zakim, vconway is vivienne
15:12:46 <Zakim> sorry, Mate, I do not recognize a party named 'vconway'
15:12:57 <Mario-Batusic> zakim, "">> is me!
15:12:59 <Zakim> sorry, Mario-Batusic, I do not recognize a party named '"">>'
15:13:37 <Mario-Batusic> zakim, "+43." is me!
15:13:37 <Zakim> sorry, Mario-Batusic, I do not recognize a party named '"+43."'
15:14:26 <Mario-Batusic> zakim, aabb is me!
15:14:26 <Zakim> +me!; got it
15:14:31 <shadi> zakim, vivienne is really vconway
15:14:31 <Zakim> +vconway; got it
15:15:01 <shadi> zakim, me! is really Mario-Batusic 
15:15:01 <Zakim> +Mario-Batusic; got it
15:15:59 <Mario-Batusic> zakim, mute me
15:15:59 <Zakim> Mario-Batusic should now be muted
15:16:15 <vconway> zakim, mute me
15:16:15 <Zakim> vconway should now be muted
15:17:53 <Mate> sorry, I have some noise on my phone
15:18:04 <Mate> I can not hear you clearly
15:18:52 <Joshue108> zakim,unmute me
15:18:52 <Zakim> Joshue should no longer be muted
15:19:00 <Joshue108> scribe: Joshue
15:19:17 <shadi> scribenick: Joshue108 
15:19:32 <Joshue108> zakim, mute me
15:19:32 <Zakim> Joshue should now be muted
15:19:53 <Joshue108> SH: We can put this to be and the editors can discuss this.
15:19:57 <Joshue108> zakim, close item 1
15:19:57 <Zakim> agendum 1, Welcome & Logistics (Regrets, Agenda Requests, Comments), closed
15:19:59 <Zakim> I see 3 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
15:20:01 <Zakim> 2. Final Agreement on Evaluation Procedure - http://www.w3.org/WAI/RD/wiki/Paper_Selection_Criteria [from sharper]
15:20:03 <Joshue108> zakim, item 2
15:20:03 <Zakim> I don't understand 'item 2', Joshue108
15:20:09 <Zakim> +??P37
15:20:09 <Joshue108> zakim,unmute me
15:20:11 <Zakim> Joshue should no longer be muted
15:20:21 <sharper> zakim, take up item 2
15:20:21 <Zakim> agendum 2. "Final Agreement on Evaluation Procedure - http://www.w3.org/WAI/RD/wiki/Paper_Selection_Criteria" taken up [from sharper]
15:20:28 <Joshue108> zakim, who is making noise?
15:20:34 <sharper> zakim, who is making noise?
15:20:35 <Zakim> -??P37
15:20:40 <Zakim> Joshue108, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: Joshue (5%), sharper (28%), Shadi (19%)
15:20:42 <peter> Sorry that background noise was me
15:20:49 <Joshue108> zakim, mute me
15:20:49 <Zakim> Joshue should now be muted
15:20:51 <Zakim> sharper, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: sharper (29%)
15:20:57 <peter> Will try to find a better headset around the office
15:21:10 <peter> oh right :)
15:21:31 <Joshue108> SH: If we can resolve this now, that we are happy how the selection criteria are going. For now its done.
15:21:37 <Mate> zakim, mute me
15:21:37 <Zakim> Mate should now be muted
15:21:52 <Joshue108> SAZ: Did editorial edits.
15:22:21 <Joshue108> zakim,unmute me
15:22:21 <Zakim> Joshue should no longer be muted
15:22:43 <sharper> RESOLVED: All happy with the selection criteria for now, can be opened up by editors later if they wish.
15:22:57 <Joshue108> zakim,close item
15:22:57 <Zakim> I don't understand 'close item', Joshue108
15:22:59 <Joshue108> zakim,close item 2
15:22:59 <Zakim> agendum 2, Final Agreement on Evaluation Procedure - http://www.w3.org/WAI/RD/wiki/Paper_Selection_Criteria, closed
15:23:01 <Zakim> I see 2 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
15:23:02 <Zakim> 3. Upcoming Focus [from sharper]
15:23:15 <Joshue108> zakim, take up item 3
15:23:15 <Zakim> agendum 3. "Upcoming Focus" taken up [from sharper]
15:23:26 <Joshue108> SH: We are at a point when we are waiting for papers etc
15:23:34 <Joshue108> zakim, mute me
15:23:34 <Zakim> Joshue should now be muted
15:23:47 <Joshue108> SH: SO to be productive, what do we want to do next?
15:24:04 <Joshue108> SH: Should we look at new topics, notes etc after this one?
15:24:17 <Mario-Batusic> No.
15:24:23 <Joshue108> SH: I am open to suggestions, please share thoughts, have we missed anything etc?
15:24:50 <Joshue108> SH: Shadi, do we need any more discussion?
15:24:59 <Joshue108> SH: Can we link the issue tracker to the calendar?
15:25:05 <Joshue108> SAZ: Am still looking at that.
15:25:20 <Joshue108> SH: I can't think of much more we need to do until we get papers.
15:25:38 <Joshue108> SH: Any one else with ideas for topics etc?
15:25:43 <vconway> I think we should leave this until papers come in and would love to look at new topics
15:25:59 <shadi> http://www.w3.org/WAI/ER/2011/eval/eval-tf
15:26:15 <Joshue108> SAZ: We can start looking ahead, the eval method TF was attempted to look at existing methods etc.
15:26:32 <Joshue108> SAZ: I am wondering where to collect this info, in the wiki or seperate?
15:26:38 <Joshue108> SAZ: Thoughts?
15:26:47 <Joshue108> SH: I have been thinkin about this.
15:27:21 <Joshue108> SH: We have the benchmarking metrics, and the eval tools. Could this be spread out to web a11y in general?
15:27:22 <vconway> q+
15:27:36 <Mario-Batusic> Do you mean for the next simposium?
15:27:38 <Joshue108> SH: This should be a part of the wiki, but we may want to combine topics.
15:28:22 <vconway> ack me
15:28:23 <Joshue108> SAZ: Thats fine, the eval WG will be looking at it. It may be good to keep that in the R&D space
15:28:25 <sharper> ack v
15:29:02 <vconway> zakim, mute me
15:29:02 <Zakim> vconway should now be muted
15:29:04 <Joshue108> VC: Besides the current topics, there are others such as accreditation methods and look at where the paths cross and can work together.
15:29:06 <Joshue108> SH: Good idea
15:29:33 <Joshue108> SAZ: I'll start a page on the wiki, to collect existing Web site eval methods and allow other WG to browse parts etc.
15:29:46 <Joshue108> SH: Cross pollination!
15:29:48 <sharper> http://www.w3.org/community/cssacc/
15:30:05 <vconway> Is this related to the LinkedIn group?
15:30:16 <Joshue108> SH: Discssion on new WG, CSS Access group. There may be things here that are of interest to us.
15:30:48 <Joshue108> SH: Any other ideas?
15:31:04 <Joshue108> zakim, unmute me
15:31:04 <Zakim> Joshue should no longer be muted
15:31:06 <Joshue108> +q
15:31:10 <shadi> q+
15:31:11 <vconway> I'm particularly interested in accreditation methods
15:31:12 <Joshue108> ack me
15:31:39 <Peter> Peter has joined #rd
15:31:51 <shadi> JOC: discussion about user testing evaluation
15:32:14 <shadi> ...exploration of user testing methodology may be interesting
15:32:29 <shadi> ...don't want to use the term "metrics" too restrictively
15:32:42 <vconway> I'd love to look at the user testing issue as well
15:32:55 <vconway> Its on the Wiki page
15:33:05 <sharper> http://www.w3.org/WAI/RD/wiki/User_Evaluation_Methods_for_Web_Accessibility_Evaluation
15:34:50 <Zakim> +??P58
15:35:09 <Joshue108> SH: Any other ideas?
15:35:10 <shadi> ack me
15:35:19 <Joshue108> zakim, mute me
15:35:19 <Zakim> Joshue should now be muted
15:35:56 <shadi> http://www.w3.org/community/
15:36:27 <Joshue108> SAZ: Regarding the CSS group, the structural stuff will be interesting, there were talks about Microformats etc - there are the technical aspects, and also the community groups and the business groups to get people together to make suggestions etc
15:37:06 <Joshue108> SAZ: When we are writing our notes etc this is something to consider to get groups to talk together
15:37:50 <Joshue108> SAZ: SteveF etc are trying to use this as way of talking and prestandardize something.
15:37:58 <Joshue108> SAZ: I want to raise awareness
15:38:14 <Peter> Zakim, ??P58 is me
15:38:14 <Zakim> +Peter; got it
15:38:22 <Peter> Zakim, mute me
15:38:22 <Zakim> Peter should now be muted
15:38:39 <Joshue108> SH: Please feel free to populate the wiki, there is also Digital TV which would be interesting
15:38:46 <Joshue108> JOC: +1 to Digital TV
15:38:58 <Joshue108> SAZ: I see you added the multitouch stuff.
15:39:28 <Joshue108> SH: The UAAG wg thought this was interesting stuff to look at.
15:39:46 <Joshue108> SH: Ok, we are done with this topic for this week.
15:40:11 <Mario-Batusic> q+
15:40:12 <Joshue108> SH: AOB
15:40:18 <Joshue108> zakim, unmute me
15:40:18 <Zakim> Joshue should no longer be muted
15:40:20 <Mario-Batusic> zakim, ack me
15:40:21 <sharper> ack ma
15:40:22 <Zakim> unmuting Mario-Batusic
15:40:22 <Zakim> I see no one on the speaker queue
15:40:40 <shadi> scribe: shadi
15:40:46 <Peter> q+
15:40:46 <Joshue108> zakim, mute me
15:40:48 <Zakim> Joshue should now be muted
15:40:48 <Joshue108> bye
15:40:58 <Zakim> -Joshue
15:41:19 <shadi> MB: would be got to develop more materials about WAI-ARIA
15:41:35 <shadi> ...very important as many applications are developed in this area
15:41:37 <shadi> q+
15:42:05 <shadi> ...to which extent browsers and assistive tools support particular aspects
15:42:31 <shadi> ack me
15:42:33 <Peter> (no worries :)
15:43:32 <Joshue> Joshue has joined #rd
15:44:05 <Peter> Zakim, unmute me
15:44:05 <Zakim> Peter should no longer be muted
15:44:06 <sharper> ack p
15:44:10 <shadi> SAZ: WAI is working on an accessibility support database
15:44:35 <shadi> ...but there are tons of challenges related to web applications and accessibility
15:45:08 <sharper> http://www.w3.org/WAI/RD/wiki/Touch_Interfaces
15:45:08 <Peter> Zakim, mute me
15:45:08 <Zakim> Peter should now be muted
15:45:11 <Peter> q-
15:45:11 <shadi> Peter: what is the level of detail we want on the wiki
15:45:33 <shadi> ...also agree it would be good to have more information on accessibility support
15:45:36 <Mario-Batusic> zakim, mute me
15:45:36 <Zakim> Mario-Batusic should now be muted
15:45:51 <Peter> ok, sounds good!
15:45:53 <shadi> Simon: doesn't need too much detail but should be decriptive
15:46:11 <shadi> ...does not need to be fully though out or developed but explanatory
15:46:21 <shadi> ...can add more sub-pages with more detail
15:46:55 <shadi> ...do not think we should hesitate to have the accessibility support stuff on the wiki
15:47:10 <shadi> ...should not discount but keep ideas there
15:47:30 <shadi> ...may also help advertise exisiting work where available
15:47:51 <shadi> ...researchers may stumble over it and find something deployable
15:48:02 <Peter> great - thanks - will do :)
15:48:56 <shadi> ...some overalp is good, shows relevance
15:49:13 <Mario-Batusic> I agree
15:50:30 <Mario-Batusic> I understand this wiki as a kind of database for research ideas for all people
15:50:33 <vconway> no, all sounds good
15:50:56 <shadi> trackbot, end meeting
15:50:56 <trackbot> Zakim, list attendees
15:50:56 <Zakim> As of this point the attendees have been Shadi, Joshue, sharper, +1.361.279.aaaa, Mate, +43.680.306.aabb, vconway, Mario-Batusic, Peter
15:50:57 <trackbot> RRSAgent, please draft minutes
15:50:57 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/10/13-rd-minutes.html trackbot
15:50:58 <trackbot> RRSAgent, bye
15:50:58 <RRSAgent> I see no action items
15:50:58 <vconway> bye now
15:51:01 <Peter> cheers