15:33:34 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #css
15:33:34 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2011/09/14-css-irc
15:33:41 <glazou> Zakim, this will be Style
15:33:41 <Zakim> ok, glazou; I see Style_CSS FP()12:00PM scheduled to start in 27 minutes
15:33:46 <glazou> RRSAgent, make logs public
15:43:06 <florian> florian has joined #css
15:49:47 <glazou> if I understood correctly, all mozillians are at the Mozilla AllHands and Microsofties at BUILD...
15:50:13 <glazou> arronei: are you MSFTies going to attend today's call?
15:50:20 <glazou> or are you at BUILD?
15:51:23 <florian> I have understood the same about mozz, but I didn't see anything about BUILD in the regrets mail. I am just late on catching up with my mail, or did you hear this in another channel?
15:51:53 <glazou> well, the whole twitter universe is about the BUILD announcements
15:52:36 <florian> I see. I don't use twitter all that much
15:52:58 <dsinger_> dsinger_ has joined #css
15:55:48 <Zakim> Style_CSS FP()12:00PM has now started
15:55:55 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
15:56:12 <danielweck> danielweck has joined #css
15:56:19 <florian> Zakim, I am [IPcaller]
15:56:19 <Zakim> ok, florian, I now associate you with [IPcaller]
15:56:54 <Zakim> +??P13
15:57:09 <Zakim> +dsinger
15:57:21 <danielweck> Zakim, ??P13 is me
15:57:21 <Zakim> +danielweck; got it
15:57:57 <glazou> grrr zakim does not me in
15:58:01 <dsinger_> dsinger_ has changed the topic to: cool synchronized swimming (dsinger_)
15:58:06 <Zakim> +??P15
15:58:12 <glazou> Zakim, ??P15 is me
15:58:12 <Zakim> +glazou; got it
15:59:27 <Zakim> + +1.206.550.aaaa
15:59:34 <nimbupani> nimbupani has joined #css
15:59:45 <stearns> Zakim, aaaa is me
15:59:45 <Zakim> +stearns; got it
15:59:50 <dsinger_> Zakim, who is making noise?
15:59:56 <Zakim> +[Apple]
16:00:00 <Zakim> dsinger_, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: danielweck (85%)
16:00:01 <hober> Zakim, Apple has me
16:00:02 <Zakim> +hober; got it
16:00:08 <glazou> Zakim, mute danielweck 
16:00:09 <Zakim> danielweck should now be muted
16:00:34 <Zakim> +[Microsoft]
16:00:36 <arronei> zakim, microsoft is me
16:00:36 <Zakim> +arronei; got it
16:00:54 <bradk> bradk has joined #css
16:01:08 <Zakim> + +1.650.275.aabb
16:01:24 <bradk> zakim, aabb is me
16:01:26 <Zakim> +bradk; got it
16:02:07 <Zakim> +smfr
16:02:10 <smfr> smfr has joined #css
16:02:31 <Zakim> +fantasai
16:03:09 <Zakim> + +47.23.69.aacc
16:03:38 <dsinger_> zakim, who is here?
16:03:38 <Zakim> On the phone I see [IPcaller], danielweck (muted), dsinger (muted), glazou, stearns, [Apple], arronei, bradk, smfr, fantasai, +47.23.69.aacc
16:03:41 <Zakim> [Apple] has hober
16:03:43 <Zakim> On IRC I see smfr, bradk, danielweck, dsinger_, florian, RRSAgent, Zakim, glazou, stearns, kojiishi, miketaylr, Bert, myakura, plinss_, krijnh, anne, Martijnc, karl, arronei, lhnz,
16:03:45 <Zakim> ... plinss, gsnedders, TabAtkins, CSSWG_LogBot, hober, ed, fantasai, trackbot, shepazu, Hixie
16:04:32 <glazou> Zakim, aacc is howcome
16:04:32 <Zakim> +howcome; got it
16:04:59 <glazou> bradk: sick?
16:05:07 <nimbupani> nimbupani has joined #css
16:05:14 <bradk> yeah, gettinh over bad cold
16:05:31 <Zakim> +??P6
16:05:33 <glazou> back
16:05:40 <kojiishi> zakim, ??p6 is me
16:05:45 <Zakim> +Bert
16:05:47 <Zakim> +kojiishi; got it
16:06:08 <howcome> howcome has joined #css
16:06:57 <glazou> ScribeNick: arronei 
16:07:18 <glazou> http://www.doodle.com/7r9kee8rt5sqwqfv#table
16:07:31 <arronei> glazou: f2f meeting in paris
16:07:53 <arronei> glazou: please fill in the doodle
16:08:06 <cesar> cesar has joined #css
16:08:09 <arronei> glazou: need a good head count
16:08:10 <alexmog> alexmog has joined #css
16:08:16 <Zakim> +SteveZ
16:08:52 <Zakim> + +569003aadd
16:09:33 <arronei> glazou: the best date for the f2f in Paris is between the 6th and 8th of Feb
16:10:04 <dsinger_> Week if 23rd is out I assume?
16:10:09 <glazou> yes
16:10:17 <Zakim> -arronei
16:10:18 <dsinger_> S/if/of/
16:10:37 <arronei> ack I just lost my phone
16:10:40 <Bert> (Doodle's interface used to be fine, but they seem to have changed. I can't see the results :-( I *think* I filled the survey last week... Time to switch to Dudle?)
16:10:41 <glazou> arronei: waiting for you
16:10:42 <Zakim> -dsinger
16:10:45 <arronei> Trying to dail in again
16:11:00 <dsinger_> Bother. 3gpp and mpeg the two doodle weeks
16:11:10 <Zakim> + +1.425.246.aaee
16:11:20 <szilles> szilles has joined #css
16:11:34 <glazou> Zakim, aaee is alexmog 
16:11:34 <Zakim> +alexmog; got it
16:11:40 <Zakim> +dsinger
16:11:51 <glazou> ScribeNick: glazou
16:12:10 <glazou> howcome: issue is how margin collapsing works on spanner
16:12:14 <Zakim> +Andrew_Kirkpatrick
16:12:21 <glazou> … current spec in CR does not say anything about that
16:12:29 <glazou> … I suggest to add language for that
16:12:48 <glazou> … it should happen if two consecutive spanning elements but not with other elements
16:12:56 <glazou> … spanning lets are usually wider
16:13:05 <glazou> … collapsing should be messy
16:13:15 <arronei> arronei has joined #css
16:13:17 <glazou> … http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2011Aug/0457.html
16:13:26 <glazou> arronei: I'm minuting
16:13:37 <glazou> fantasai: please read it
16:13:41 <glazou> howcome reads
16:13:43 <arronei> well I was my machine rebooted on me 
16:13:53 <glazou> fantasai: seems ok
16:14:35 <glazou> howcome: two h elements, they should collapse
16:14:52 <glazou> alexmog: spanning elements are kind of like floats
16:15:01 <glazou> alexmog: floats don't collapse margins
16:15:05 <glazou> florian: I see it differently
16:15:27 <glazou> florian: you intend things to collapse when there is only 1 column
16:15:50 <glazou> florian: they should collapse then
16:15:55 <glazou> howcome: yep, least surprise
16:16:07 <glazou> howcome: but what will happen column-span integer value
16:16:40 <glazou> alexmog: we are trying to optimize for cases that are rare
16:16:51 <glazou> alexmog: use cases that don't really exist
16:16:59 <Zakim> -bradk
16:17:08 <glazou> alexmog: make sure elements don't have margins ?
16:17:48 <glazou> howcome: what if you column span all and margin 10em, does not look like it multicolor at all ; no collapsing then?
16:18:02 <glazou> howcome: very natural to have collapsing happen then
16:18:12 <glazou> … not really insisting on this edge case
16:18:19 <Bert> (Typical case in favor of collapsing: <div><h1><h2.subtitle><p>...</div> with 'div {columns: 20em} h1, h2 {span: all}')
16:18:28 <glazou> fantasai: I agree with howcome but would make more sense to have them collapse
16:18:33 <glazou> … two things make sense to me
16:18:37 <Zakim> +bradk
16:18:42 <glazou> … be a formatting context root
16:19:22 <glazou> … take all consecutive lets that have same column span value and wrap them in anon formatting context root and in that margins collapse
16:19:50 <Bert> s/lets/elements/
16:19:51 <glazou> .. children would collapse margin with column spanning parent
16:20:37 <glazou> howcome: reasonable but what if column span all or one let and 2 on next
16:20:55 <Bert> s/column-span integer/if column-span has integer/
16:21:13 <glazou> howcome: fine solution to the problem
16:21:23 <glazou> … but I would like to have alexmog with me on that
16:21:32 <glazou> … msft has not done it that way
16:21:46 <glazou> alexmog: I did not have a chance to think about it before
16:21:56 <glazou> … if we can avoid margin collapsing it would be nice here
16:22:02 <Zakim> -bradk
16:22:03 <glazou> … no decision yet
16:22:08 <glazou> howcome: need a week to review it?
16:22:19 <glazou> alexmog: need to get in touch with implementors
16:22:24 <glazou> howcome: fine
16:22:39 <glazou> glazou: next week's agenda?
16:23:00 <glazou> stevez: technical question
16:23:03 <Zakim> +bradk
16:23:37 <dsinger> dsinger has joined #css
16:23:37 <glazou> fantasai: default value of column-span?
16:23:42 <glazou> Bert: none
16:23:44 <glazou> howcome: yeah
16:23:50 <glazou> howcome: used to be 1 but changed
16:23:57 <Zakim> -dsinger
16:23:59 <Zakim> +[Apple.a]
16:24:11 <dsinger> zakim, [apple.a] has dsinger
16:24:12 <Zakim> +dsinger; got it
16:24:35 <florian> steve's question was: where there is only 1 column, do spaning elements' margin collapse with non spanning ones? answer was no.
16:25:01 <Zakim> -fantasai
16:25:08 <glazou> glazou: Shepherd, please send feedback
16:25:23 <glazou> glazou: checklist for WD publications
16:25:26 <glazou> glazou: comments?
16:25:27 <Bert> (I wonder if that means that we can replace 'overflow: auto' with 'column-span: all' now in order to contain child floats in the element's height...)
16:25:43 <glazou> http://wiki.csswg.org/spec/publish
16:25:50 <glazou> Bert: comment about the blog
16:25:57 <glazou> Bert: some people don't have a blog account 
16:25:57 <arronei> arronei has joined #css
16:26:09 <glazou> Bert: new blog system next week, all accounts will be renewed
16:26:22 <glazou> Bert: if you don't have an account now, you'll have one next week
16:26:39 <Zakim> +fantasai
16:26:50 <glazou> Bert: if you have no account and have something to blog about, please wait until next week and the new system
16:26:56 <glazou> Bert: termporary state...
16:27:58 <glazou> fantasai: Anton as IE?
16:28:07 <glazou> glazou: Anton joined a few days ago as IE
16:28:35 <Zakim> -[Apple.a]
16:28:37 <Zakim> -danielweck
16:28:38 <Zakim> -glazou
16:28:38 <Zakim> -howcome
16:28:39 <Zakim> -kojiishi
16:28:39 <Zakim> -fantasai
16:28:40 <Zakim> -stearns
16:28:40 <Zakim> -[Apple]
16:28:42 <Zakim> -[IPcaller]
16:28:44 <Zakim> - +569003aadd
16:28:44 <glazou> short meeting, fantasai to release the minutes
16:28:46 <Zakim> -Andrew_Kirkpatrick
16:28:48 <Zakim> -alexmog
16:28:50 <Zakim> -smfr
16:28:52 <Zakim> -bradk
16:28:54 <Zakim> -Bert
16:29:04 <cesar> zakim, aadd is me
16:29:04 <Zakim> sorry, cesar, I do not recognize a party named 'aadd'
16:29:17 <Zakim> -SteveZ
16:29:18 <Zakim> Style_CSS FP()12:00PM has ended
16:29:20 <Zakim> Attendees were [IPcaller], dsinger, danielweck, glazou, +1.206.550.aaaa, stearns, hober, arronei, +1.650.275.aabb, bradk, smfr, fantasai, +47.23.69.aacc, howcome, Bert, kojiishi,
16:29:23 <Zakim> ... SteveZ, +569003aadd, +1.425.246.aaee, alexmog, Andrew_Kirkpatrick, [Apple]
16:29:34 <florian> florian has left #css
16:30:28 <cesar> zakim, +569003aadd is me
16:30:28 <Zakim> sorry, cesar, I do not recognize a party named '+569003aadd'
16:46:13 <karl> Have you compiled a timeline of the CSS properties across spec versions
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