IRC log of rd on 2011-08-25

Timestamps are in UTC.

14:54:00 [RRSAgent]
RRSAgent has joined #rd
14:54:00 [RRSAgent]
logging to http://www.w3.org/2011/08/25-rd-irc
14:54:02 [trackbot]
RRSAgent, make logs world
14:54:04 [trackbot]
Zakim, this will be 7394
14:54:04 [Zakim]
ok, trackbot; I see WAI_RDWG()11:00AM scheduled to start in 6 minutes
14:54:05 [trackbot]
Meeting: Research and Development Working Group Teleconference
14:54:05 [trackbot]
Date: 25 August 2011
14:54:09 [sharper]
zakim, agenda?
14:54:09 [Zakim]
I see 7 items remaining on the agenda:
14:54:11 [Zakim]
5. Timeline review - can be refined as needed: http://www.w3.org/WAI/RD/planning#seminar [from sharper]
14:54:13 [Zakim]
6. Timeline Logistics - Next milestone is to create and announce a proper call for papers for this teleconference seminar. Look ahead and select a date for the teleconference
14:54:20 [Zakim]
... seminar. [from sharper]
14:54:25 [Zakim]
7. Any Other Business [from sharper]
14:54:26 [Zakim]
8. Welcome & Logistics (Regrets, Agenda Requests, Comments). Topic - http://www.w3.org/WAI/RD/wiki/Benchmarking_Web_Accessibility_Metrics [from sharper]
14:54:29 [Zakim]
9. Question Review - http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-wai-rd/2011Aug/0014.html [from sharper]
14:54:32 [Zakim]
10. Review of Draft First Call [from sharper]
14:54:34 [Zakim]
11. Any Other Business [from sharper]
14:54:35 [sharper]
zakim, close item 5
14:54:35 [Zakim]
agendum 5, Timeline review - can be refined as needed: http://www.w3.org/WAI/RD/planning#seminar, closed
14:54:40 [Zakim]
I see 6 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
14:54:41 [Zakim]
6. Timeline Logistics - Next milestone is to create and announce a proper call for papers for this teleconference seminar. Look ahead and select a date for the teleconference
14:54:44 [Zakim]
... seminar. [from sharper]
14:54:44 [sharper]
zakim, close item 6
14:54:44 [Zakim]
agendum 6, Timeline Logistics - Next milestone is to create and announce a proper call for papers for this teleconference seminar. Look ahead and select a date for the
14:54:47 [Zakim]
... teleconference seminar., closed
14:54:48 [Zakim]
I see 5 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
14:54:49 [Zakim]
7. Any Other Business [from sharper]
14:54:50 [sharper]
zakim, close item 7
14:54:50 [Zakim]
agendum 7, Any Other Business, closed
14:54:51 [Zakim]
I see 4 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
14:54:52 [Zakim]
8. Welcome & Logistics (Regrets, Agenda Requests, Comments). Topic - http://www.w3.org/WAI/RD/wiki/Benchmarking_Web_Accessibility_Metrics [from sharper]
14:54:56 [sharper]
zakim, close item 8
14:54:56 [Zakim]
agendum 8, Welcome & Logistics (Regrets, Agenda Requests, Comments). Topic - http://www.w3.org/WAI/RD/wiki/Benchmarking_Web_Accessibility_Metrics, closed
14:54:59 [Zakim]
I see 3 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
14:55:05 [Zakim]
9. Question Review - http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-wai-rd/2011Aug/0014.html [from sharper]
14:55:09 [sharper]
zakim, agenda?
14:55:14 [Zakim]
I see 3 items remaining on the agenda:
14:55:15 [Zakim]
9. Question Review - http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-wai-rd/2011Aug/0014.html [from sharper]
14:55:18 [Zakim]
10. Review of Draft First Call [from sharper]
14:55:19 [Zakim]
11. Any Other Business [from sharper]
14:55:25 [sharper]
zakim, close item 9
14:55:25 [Zakim]
agendum 9, Question Review - http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-wai-rd/2011Aug/0014.html, closed
14:55:27 [Zakim]
I see 2 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
14:55:29 [sharper]
zakim, close item 10
14:55:29 [Zakim]
10. Review of Draft First Call [from sharper]
14:55:30 [Zakim]
agendum 10, Review of Draft First Call, closed
14:55:30 [sharper]
zakim, close item 11
14:55:31 [Zakim]
I see 1 item remaining on the agenda:
14:55:32 [Zakim]
11. Any Other Business [from sharper]
14:55:34 [Zakim]
agendum 11, Any Other Business, closed
14:55:35 [Zakim]
I see nothing remaining on the agenda
14:55:47 [sharper]
Chair: Harper_Simon
14:55:48 [sharper]
Agenda+ Welcome & Logistics (Regrets, Agenda Requests, Comments)
14:55:48 [sharper]
Agenda+ Discussion and Editing of the Call Ready for Release - http://www.w3.org/WAI/RD/wiki/Draft_version_of_the_call_for_papers
14:55:48 [sharper]
Agenda+ Any Other Business
14:56:22 [sharper]
zakim, close item 12
14:56:22 [Zakim]
agendum 12, Welcome & Logistics (Regrets, Agenda Requests, Comments), closed
14:56:24 [Zakim]
I see 2 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
14:56:24 [sharper]
zakim, close item 3
14:56:27 [Zakim]
13. Discussion and Editing of the Call Ready for Release - http://www.w3.org/WAI/RD/wiki/Draft_version_of_the_call_for_papers [from sharper]
14:56:31 [sharper]
zakim, close item 13
14:56:33 [Zakim]
agendum 3, Committees and Duties. Decide on planning committee for the teleconference seminar (proposal that the editors also be the planning committee)., closed
14:56:35 [sharper]
zakim, close item 14
14:56:36 [Zakim]
I see 2 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
14:56:38 [Zakim]
13. Discussion and Editing of the Call Ready for Release - http://www.w3.org/WAI/RD/wiki/Draft_version_of_the_call_for_papers [from sharper]
14:56:43 [Zakim]
agendum 13, Discussion and Editing of the Call Ready for Release - http://www.w3.org/WAI/RD/wiki/Draft_version_of_the_call_for_papers, closed
14:56:48 [Zakim]
I see 1 item remaining on the agenda:
14:56:52 [Zakim]
14. Any Other Business [from sharper]
14:56:54 [Zakim]
agendum 14, Any Other Business, closed
14:57:01 [Zakim]
I see nothing remaining on the agenda
14:57:04 [sharper]
zakim, save agenda
14:57:14 [Zakim]
ok, sharper, the agenda has been written to http://www.w3.org/2011/08/25-rd-agenda.rdf
14:57:19 [sharper]
Chair: Harper_Simon
14:57:19 [sharper]
Agenda+ Welcome & Logistics (Regrets, Agenda Requests, Comments)
14:57:19 [sharper]
Agenda+ Discussion and Editing of the Call Ready for Release - http://www.w3.org/WAI/RD/wiki/Draft_version_of_the_call_for_papers
14:57:20 [sharper]
Agenda+ Any Other Business
14:57:32 [sharper]
zakim, save agenda
14:57:32 [Zakim]
ok, sharper, the agenda has been written to http://www.w3.org/2011/08/25-rd-agenda.rdf
14:57:45 [sharper]
present+ Harper_Simon
14:57:55 [giorgio]
giorgio has joined #rd
14:57:56 [sharper]
Regrets+ Yesilada_Yeliz
14:58:12 [sharper]
regrets+ O'Connor_Joshue
14:58:23 [sharper]
present+ Brajnik_Giorgio
14:58:32 [sharper]
rrsagent, make logs public
14:58:32 [sharper]
rrsagent, draft minutes
14:58:32 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/08/25-rd-minutes.html sharper
14:58:39 [Peter]
Peter has joined #rd
14:58:42 [sharper]
zakim, take up item 1
14:58:42 [Zakim]
agendum 1. "Welcome (Regrets, Agenda Requests, Comments)." taken up [from sharper]
14:58:54 [Zakim]
WAI_RDWG()11:00AM has now started
14:59:12 [Zakim]
+??P5
14:59:42 [Zakim]
+??P56
15:00:06 [sharper]
zakim, ??P56 is sharper
15:00:07 [Zakim]
+sharper; got it
15:00:17 [sharper]
zakim, ??P5 is giorgio
15:00:24 [Zakim]
+giorgio; got it
15:00:38 [Zakim]
+??P59
15:00:54 [markel]
markel has joined #rd
15:01:05 [Zakim]
-??P59
15:01:40 [sharper]
present+ Thiessen_Peter
15:01:59 [sharper]
present+ Vigo_Markel
15:02:00 [vivienne]
vivienne has joined #rd
15:02:02 [Zakim]
+??P63
15:02:10 [Zakim]
+??P59
15:02:18 [sharper]
zakim, ??P63 is markel
15:02:30 [shadi]
zakim, who is on the phone?
15:02:31 [sharper]
zakim, ??P59 is sharper Peter
15:02:44 [Zakim]
+markel; got it
15:02:46 [Zakim]
+??P1
15:03:01 [Zakim]
On the phone I see giorgio, sharper, markel, ??P59, ??P1
15:03:03 [Zakim]
I don't understand '??P59 is sharper Peter', sharper
15:03:10 [sharper]
zakim, ??P1 is shadi
15:03:31 [sharper]
member:zakim, ??P59 is really member:Peter
15:03:45 [sharper]
zakim, ??59 is really Peter
15:03:47 [Zakim]
+shadi; got it
15:04:06 [thiessenp]
(changed name to thiessenp just to simplify)
15:04:09 [Zakim]
+??P65
15:04:15 [sharper]
zakim, ??P56 is sharper
15:04:32 [vivienne]
zakim,mute me
15:04:34 [shadi]
zakim, agenda?
15:04:36 [Zakim]
sorry, sharper, I do not recognize a party named '??59'
15:05:33 [Zakim]
I already had ??P56 as sharper, sharper
15:06:00 [Zakim]
sorry, vivienne, I do not know which phone connection belongs to you
15:06:06 [Zakim]
I see 3 items remaining on the agenda:
15:06:07 [Zakim]
15. Welcome & Logistics (Regrets, Agenda Requests, Comments) [from sharper]
15:06:11 [Zakim]
16. Discussion and Editing of the Call Ready for Release - http://www.w3.org/WAI/RD/wiki/Draft_version_of_the_call_for_papers [from sharper]
15:06:14 [giorgio]
shadi, I hear a lot of echo when you are talking.
15:06:16 [Zakim]
17. Any Other Business [from sharper]
15:07:13 [sharper]
zakim, P56 is really thiessenp
15:07:32 [vivienne]
I have no idea
15:07:37 [sharper]
zakim, ??P65 is vivienne
15:08:00 [Zakim]
sorry, sharper, I do not recognize a party named 'P56'
15:08:14 [Zakim]
+vivienne; got it
15:08:32 [sharper]
zakim, ??P65 is really thiessnp
15:08:42 [Zakim]
+thiessnp; got it
15:09:01 [shadi]
zakim, who is on the phone?
15:09:04 [Zakim]
On the phone I see giorgio, sharper, markel, ??P59, shadi, thiessnp
15:09:31 [shadi]
zakim, thiessenp is really vivienne
15:09:31 [Zakim]
sorry, shadi, I do not recognize a party named 'thiessenp'
15:09:43 [shadi]
zakim, thiessnp is really vivienne
15:09:43 [Zakim]
+vivienne; got it
15:09:55 [shadi]
zakim, ??p59 is thiessenp
15:09:55 [Zakim]
+thiessenp; got it
15:10:00 [shadi]
zakim, who is on the phone?
15:10:00 [Zakim]
On the phone I see giorgio, sharper, markel, thiessenp, shadi, vivienne
15:10:18 [shadi]
scribe: shadi
15:10:37 [shadi]
zakim, take up agendum 16
15:10:37 [Zakim]
agendum 16. "Discussion and Editing of the Call Ready for Release - http://www.w3.org/WAI/RD/wiki/Draft_version_of_the_call_for_papers" taken up [from sharper]
15:11:12 [vivienne]
there's a shocking echo
15:11:54 [shadi]
SH: Giorgio and Markel will introduce draft call and talk about next steps
15:12:12 [shadi]
...want to make sure we all agree on it on this call
15:12:27 [shadi]
...so that we can announce maybe end next week
15:13:18 [shadi]
MV: changed requirement from 2 pages to 1000 words
15:13:38 [shadi]
...modified accessibility conformance versus accessibility in use
15:14:31 [shadi]
...section about attribution as discussed last week
15:15:16 [shadi]
...dates still depend on when the webinar will take place
15:15:48 [shadi]
GB: thank you for writing it Markel, only had initial input
15:16:09 [shadi]
...also need to consider how much time people have for writing the white paper
15:16:44 [shadi]
...need to allow some time to disseminate the call, and for people to think about what they want to contribute
15:17:10 [shadi]
q+ to agree with giorgio and to talk about editorial changes
15:17:18 [shadi]
MV: agree
15:17:30 [shadi]
GB: what kind of constraints do we have for dates?
15:18:09 [shadi]
SH: not a particular constraint but want to do ~4 seminars per year so need one on a quartely basis
15:18:27 [shadi]
...1000 words is not even two pages so quite ok
15:19:00 [shadi]
...can be a bit more liberal for this first seminar but should not go beyond 1st december week
15:19:04 [vivienne]
There are a couple of 'typos' in paragraphs 3&4. I'm not sure about the time - maybe too short?
15:19:07 [shadi]
ack me
15:19:07 [Zakim]
shadi, you wanted to agree with giorgio and to talk about editorial changes
15:20:42 [markel]
if the weminar can take place in the beginning of Sep we can postpone the submission deadline to mid Oct
15:21:13 [sharper]
q+
15:21:21 [thiessenp]
+1 a little more time (CSUN deadline conflict, and 1-month short time)
15:22:00 [sharper]
ack me
15:22:48 [shadi]
SAZ: agree that need to be more linient, also competing with CSUN call for papers
15:22:50 [markel]
I'm happy with that too, Si
15:24:20 [giorgio]
q+
15:24:33 [shadi]
...but certainly not have beyond early december
15:24:50 [shadi]
...also think the draft call needs quite some work
15:24:53 [thiessenp]
+1 more structure (good for skimming :)
15:25:08 [shadi]
...can draft a suggested change
15:26:03 [markel]
q+
15:26:22 [sharper]
ack giorgio
15:26:26 [shadi]
SH: concerned that this is going on but happy to see suggested change
15:26:30 [shadi]
ack g
15:26:55 [shadi]
GB: also have number of suggested changes
15:27:12 [shadi]
...why don't we go over some of the most important issues?
15:27:29 [sharper]
sck markel
15:27:30 [shadi]
ack markel
15:28:01 [shadi]
MV: very different call for papers from the last one
15:28:33 [shadi]
...trying to give a more typical conference call for papers
15:29:00 [shadi]
...happy to discuss now
15:29:02 [vivienne]
q+
15:29:08 [vivienne]
zakim, unmutr me
15:29:08 [Zakim]
I don't understand 'unmutr me', vivienne
15:29:08 [shadi]
ack vi
15:29:11 [vivienne]
unmute me
15:29:17 [vivienne]
zakim, unmute me
15:29:17 [Zakim]
vivienne was not muted, vivienne
15:29:56 [shadi]
VC: happy with all of it but just see some typograhpical issues
15:30:13 [shadi]
SH: can you make the changes directly to the wiki?
15:30:31 [shadi]
q+
15:30:41 [sharper]
ack shadi
15:30:44 [vivienne]
zakim, mute me
15:30:44 [Zakim]
vivienne should now be muted
15:31:58 [giorgio]
q+
15:33:41 [markel]
q+
15:34:09 [sharper]
ack giorgio
15:34:36 [shadi]
SAZ: concerned about setting the expectation of "defining and benchmarking" metrics
15:35:07 [shadi]
...also about the references to W3C Note which may promote people to write W3C Notes that are not from W3C
15:35:19 [shadi]
...also suggest more headings and less repetiveness
15:35:57 [shadi]
GB: agree we will not be defining metrics but it is an important venue to propose metrics
15:36:17 [shadi]
...concerned about "white paper" which may be daunting
15:37:10 [shadi]
...maybe also describe coined terms "conformance accessibility" and "accessibility in use"
15:37:51 [shadi]
...also add request for people to describe how they validated the quality of their framework
15:37:54 [shadi]
q+
15:38:20 [shadi]
SH: will provide template
15:38:23 [sharper]
ack markel
15:39:18 [shadi]
MV: we are not knowledgeable of wording about W3C Notes etc, so shadi please edit directly
15:40:05 [shadi]
...decided to use "white paper" rather than "position paper" to avoid less scientific positions
15:40:07 [giorgio]
shall we call them 'research abstracts'?
15:40:28 [markel]
yes
15:40:31 [markel]
+1
15:40:37 [shadi]
SH: maybe also "extended research abstracts"
15:40:40 [sharper]
ack shadi
15:42:11 [thiessenp]
+1 research abstracts - unambiguous for industry and practitioners about what's expected
15:42:48 [vivienne]
I have just made the couple of typographical corrections I saw that were required.
15:43:20 [shadi]
SAZ: please add content issues to the wiki straight away
15:43:42 [shadi]
...will try to be much more editorial rather than content
15:44:21 [giorgio]
I agree with simon
15:45:03 [shadi]
GB: will work on the changes today
15:45:06 [markel]
we should release the CFP next week at the latest
15:46:37 [markel]
q+
15:47:10 [markel]
are we sure we want a call for review?
15:48:13 [giorgio]
I agree; we should get it out sooner.
15:48:26 [vivienne]
I think the sooner we get it out, the better. Everyone on the list has already been asked to contribute.
15:48:28 [thiessenp]
agreed: will give wiki a close read this week for edits / comments
15:49:00 [sharper]
ack markel
15:50:08 [shadi]
SH: will send a note out the group after the changes early next week
15:50:10 [giorgio]
I agree with simon, to close it next week.
15:50:24 [shadi]
...will take a decision on next week's call
15:50:40 [shadi]
SAZ: will try to prepare related announcement in parallel
15:50:51 [markel]
Ok with that
15:50:54 [thiessenp]
sounds good
15:50:55 [giorgio]
ok with me
15:50:56 [vivienne]
I'm okay with that
15:51:00 [sharper]
+1 from me
15:51:39 [giorgio]
ok, cheers
15:51:40 [vivienne]
okay thanks
15:51:42 [thiessenp]
cheers everyone - thanks Shadi for joining on vacation!
15:51:52 [shadi]
trackbot, end meeting
15:51:52 [trackbot]
Zakim, list attendees
15:51:52 [Zakim]
As of this point the attendees have been sharper, giorgio, markel, shadi, vivienne, thiessenp
15:51:53 [giorgio]
bye
15:51:53 [trackbot]
RRSAgent, please draft minutes
15:51:53 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/08/25-rd-minutes.html trackbot
15:51:54 [vivienne]
bye
15:51:54 [trackbot]
RRSAgent, bye
15:51:54 [RRSAgent]
I see no action items