15:56:08 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #css
15:56:08 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2011/08/24-css-irc
15:56:16 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #css
15:56:26 <plinss> zakim, this will be style
15:56:26 <Zakim> ok, plinss; I see Style_CSS FP()12:00PM scheduled to start in 4 minutes
15:56:34 <plinss> rrsagent, make logs public
15:56:49 <Zakim> Style_CSS FP()12:00PM has now started
15:56:56 <Zakim> +??P0
15:57:12 <florian> Zakim, I am ??P0
15:57:12 <Zakim> +florian; got it
15:57:50 <Zakim> +plinss
15:58:45 <Zakim> +nimbu
15:59:14 <Zakim> +stearns
15:59:28 <Zakim> -plinss
16:00:03 <Zakim> +plinss
16:00:05 <Zakim> -plinss
16:00:17 <Zakim> +[Microsoft]
16:00:50 <Zakim> +hober
16:02:02 <nimbupani> paging TabAtkins
16:02:03 <Zakim> + +1.858.354.aaaa
16:02:08 <plinss> zakim, aaaa is me
16:02:08 <Zakim> +plinss; got it
16:02:38 <dsinger> dsinger has joined #css
16:02:38 <alexmog> alexmog has joined #css
16:03:24 <Zakim> +dsinger
16:03:37 <TabAtkins_> TabAtkins_ has joined #css
16:03:57 <Zakim> + +2aabb
16:04:01 <Zakim> +fantasai
16:04:04 <vhardy> vhardy has joined #css
16:04:10 <nimbupani> i can do that.
16:04:16 <sylvaing> sylvaing has joined #css
16:04:17 <nimbupani> fantasai: sez she cant take minutes
16:04:39 <nimbupani> hahhahahahaaa
16:04:42 <Zakim> +??P15
16:05:16 <Zakim> +[Microsoft.a]
16:05:35 <JohnJansen> JohnJansen has joined #css
16:05:48 <JohnJansen> zakim, microsoft has JohnJansen
16:05:48 <Zakim> +JohnJansen; got it
16:05:58 <Zakim> +TabAtkins_
16:06:12 <Zakim> +SteveZ
16:06:22 <Zakim> -fantasai
16:06:31 <Zakim> -TabAtkins_
16:06:52 <Zakim> +fantasai
16:07:07 <nimbupani> yes
16:07:23 <nimbupani> plinss: anyone else has anything to add to the agenda?
16:07:39 <nimbupani> plinss: bunch of publishing requests
16:07:46 <nimbupani> plinss: css3-texts and writing modes.
16:08:04 <nimbupani> SteveZ: John sent a note about writing modes
16:08:18 <nimbupani> florian: the wording is not strong enough about being an unresolved problem here and he put out an alternative wording
16:08:28 <Cathy> Cathy has joined #css
16:08:30 <nimbupani> fantasai: is that something I can fix and publish? or should I hold off?
16:08:55 <nimbupani> SteveZ; the wording was only two sentences. Cant speak for John
16:09:01 <Zakim> +alexmog
16:09:51 <nimbupani> fantasai: that is not actually possible. we can get close to itb ut there is a problem with characters like quotes, where default orientation needs to be upright if its supported.
16:09:54 <Zakim> -florian
16:10:10 <nimbupani> stevez: that is not how vertical tables work
16:10:11 <Zakim> +??P0
16:10:13 <Zakim> +TabAtkins_
16:10:22 <TabAtkins_> Excellent, now my phone works.
16:10:28 <florian> Zakim, I am ??P0
16:10:28 <Zakim> +florian; got it
16:10:46 <nimbupani> stevez: that is separate. you cant expect a vertical table to tell you what to do for the orientation
16:10:48 <Zakim> + +2aacc
16:10:58 <arno> Zakim, I am aacc
16:10:58 <Zakim> +arno; got it
16:11:23 <nimbupani> florian: we agree there is a difficult problem here, rather than saying we "may" try we should say we "will" try. 
16:11:40 <nimbupani> florian: it is not guaranteed that we will successfully find a solution.
16:12:28 <vhardy> s/itb ut/it but
16:12:37 <nimbupani> stevez: JOhn publsihed a test case that shows that there is no uniform implementation across browsers, and none of the existing unicode properties would allow you to map to the upright characters. The point being there is no simple solution and cant say what the browsers do, and cant say do what unicode does. 
16:12:56 <nimbupani> stevez: there is a separate effort to define a unicode property to define implementation, but thats separate.
16:13:03 <nimbupani> fantasai: we have a very long list of exceptions.
16:13:24 <nimbupani> fantasai: in some cases intentionally so, and we do not have a good answer yet.
16:14:29 <nimbupani> plinss: are we in agreement with John's sentiment here?
16:14:35 <nimbupani> plinss: anyone opposed to that.
16:14:40 <nimbupani> plinss: i take that as a consensus
16:14:57 <nimbupani> florian: i am not sure about how to resolve the issue, but i am with him on the concern on that.
16:15:08 <nimbupani> fantasai: i would like to take a quick look at florian's issue.
16:15:24 <nimbupani> fantasai: i have a patch for that I want to check with the rest of the people here before I check that in.
16:15:25 <oyvind> oyvind has joined #css
16:15:35 <nimbupani> florian: i have not been able to look at my mail last weekend
16:15:41 <bradk> bradk has joined #css
16:15:42 <nimbupani> fantasai: i think its a good idea. 
16:15:53 <szilles> szilles has joined #css
16:16:03 <nimbupani> fantasai: i linked to it from my message requesting publication. 
16:16:22 <florian> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2011Aug/0427.html
16:16:57 <nimbupani> florian: there are 2 types of values in text-combine-horizontal property.
16:17:20 <nimbupani> florian: i am suggesting we can split these into two properties. the vis effect of squeeze text in is likely to be the same across document
16:17:31 <nimbupani> florian: if you split them it would reduce repetition
16:17:37 <nimbupani> florian: I do not have a good name for that.
16:17:55 <nimbupani> florian: what do people think about the idea.
16:18:18 <nimbupani> szilles: i have not thought about it, what you are saying makes sense. I prefer in general binary switch for turning things off and on, and a different property for the variance
16:18:23 <nimbupani> florian: thats my idea as well
16:18:35 <nimbupani> plinss: do we have any suggestions on this?
16:18:39 <Zakim> +[Microsoft.aa]
16:18:40 <nimbupani> florian: so we agree to split? 
16:18:47 <arronei> zakim, microsoft.aa is me
16:18:47 <Zakim> +arronei; got it
16:18:48 <nimbupani> fantasai: i put text-combine-mode in my draft
16:18:53 <nimbupani> florian: its better than what I said
16:19:04 <nimbupani> plinss: are we happy to publish with that change
16:19:09 <nimbupani> szilles: yeah, it is still a draft
16:19:44 <nimbupani> szilles: i think the principle that florian is espousing is a good princile
16:19:49 <nimbupani> s/princile/principle
16:20:05 <nimbupani> RESOLVED publish writing mode working draft with updates mentioned
16:20:38 <nimbupani> florian: I am convinced the wording we now have is a good representation of the conclusion we reached at F2F. so that is solved as far as I am concerned. 
16:20:41 <plinss> s/mode/mode and css3 text/
16:21:23 <Zakim> -fantasai
16:21:34 <nimbupani> plinss: when are we going to publish the first draft of Selectors 4. W3C decided to wait until namespaces is out. Should we wait until selectors 3 is a rec or decide to publish it now. Anyone has strong opinions on that?
16:21:53 <Zakim> +fantasai
16:21:56 <nimbupani> ???: with selectors 3 is it just held up by namespaces right now?
16:22:09 <TabAtkins_> s/???/arronei
16:22:15 <TabAtkins_> zakim, mute fantasai
16:22:15 <Zakim> fantasai should now be muted
16:22:33 <nimbupani> szilles: you get less confusion if you wait and publish selectors 4 after the 3 rec goes out
16:22:47 <nimbupani> plinss: i agree, but I am not sure if its that big of a deal
16:23:20 <nimbupani> florian: i think we said the same thing at last f2f. as long as selectors 3 went to rec quickly then we have no issue, how long as we willing to wait.
16:23:22 <TabAtkins_> zakim, unmute fantasai
16:23:22 <Zakim> fantasai should no longer be muted
16:23:39 <nimbupani> plinss: did you see note about updating drafts for epub? 
16:23:50 <nimbupani> fantasai: i dont know if fonts draft needs to be published or not.
16:24:03 <nimbupani> plinss: we will discuss those two over email and get some feedback from the editors (who are not here)
16:24:09 <nimbupani> TOPIC: regions
16:24:19 <nimbupani> plinss: display-inside and content property
16:24:31 <nimbupani> plinss: where are we on this
16:24:41 <nimbupani> alexmog: we had a conversation with vhardy we havenot agreed on a resolution.
16:25:00 <TabAtkins_> Darn, I've been muted this whole time.
16:25:05 <nimbupani> alexmog: my issue is using content it has a lot of meaning and behaviour in gneerated content as it interacts iwth model of before and after.
16:25:32 <nimbupani> alexmog: the use of that kind of content, might change the meaning of the element it is in and blows away before and after and we do not mean that content property
16:25:46 <nimbupani> alexmog: display property could be one way to do that or a separate from-flow property
16:26:09 <nimbupani> alexmog: if we had a display-inside property it would say display-inside: region and something else that would say where content comes from. It may be content property
16:26:49 <nimbupani> szilles: we have talked about having a region be a multicol, which is why i am not happy about display-inside: region. I like the principle of having a separate property that turns smthing into region and hten say what properties apply to region rather than putting of content in it turning on.
16:27:06 <nimbupani> alexmog: multicol will be display-inside if display-inside existed
16:27:32 <nimbupani> szilles: why not create a diff property with region yes/no with no as default
16:28:20 <nimbupani> vhardy: we could also go with the option of alexmog which is you have a flow-from property which would be what you are asking for and also say which region u are applying content form. the only tweak from your proposal alex is that before and after work on a region
16:28:34 <nimbupani> vhardy: we would be okay using flow-from proposal as it is close to what szilles is saying
16:28:57 <nimbupani> szilles: yes and no. it is using to say where text comes from to turn it into a region and I was trying to separate those two, but I am not strongly of any position. I can live with either
16:29:33 <nimbupani> alexmog: similar to float: positioned which we used to trigger exclusions and appears redundant as you also have to use wrap-type everytime you use that property. 
16:29:46 <nimbupani> alexmog: so we ended up adopting adobe's solution, and here we use the same 
16:29:53 <nimbupani> szilles: it is a valid point, and i can live either way
16:30:36 <nimbupani> fantasai: i think having two properties seems like too many levels of interaction.
16:30:52 <nimbupani> vhardy: i propose we try to resolve on flow-from and having before and after work with current pseudo selectors
16:31:05 <nimbupani> TabAtkins: what happens when you do flow-from form elements that is also a grid or flexbox
16:31:20 <nimbupani> vhardy: we have a resolution that sez you can only turn smthing into a region if it is a block container box
16:31:32 <nimbupani> TabAtkins: the point i wanted display-inside was to prevent unwanted interactions.
16:31:44 <nimbupani> TabAtkins: it is similar to what columns do.
16:32:08 <nimbupani> fantasai: still concerned about the interaction but have nothing concrete to say
16:32:23 <nimbupani> fantasai: interaction with display, and the content property as we are overriding with a different property
16:32:30 <nimbupani> alexmog: flow-from has a very diff meaning from content
16:32:38 <nimbupani> alexmog: content overrides WITHIN the element. 
16:32:42 <bradk> What if we had content:flow-from() take the children of the named element, instead of the item itself?
16:32:46 <nimbupani> alexmog: flow-from overrides everything.
16:33:03 <nimbupani> alexmog: that is inside this element. it does not change the meaning of content. it just replaces everything within.
16:33:26 <nimbupani> fantasai: content property was intended to control what the contents are, and now we have another property that does essentially the same thing.
16:33:51 <nimbupani> fantasai: the most obvious thing that is changing is the contents of the element are not being displayed in favour of something else. 
16:33:57 <nimbupani> fantasai: seems like a problem to me.
16:34:04 <nimbupani> vhardy: i think it is slightly different
16:34:12 <nimbupani> vhardy: u specify what content goes into the element
16:34:22 <nimbupani> vhardy: pull the content and this will be figured out atlyout. 
16:34:37 <nimbupani> alexmog: what content property does is replaces the content of the element
16:34:49 <nimbupani> alexmog: flow-from does is what the box is showing
16:34:54 <TabAtkins_> zakim, mute fantasai
16:34:54 <Zakim> fantasai should now be muted
16:35:03 <TabAtkins_> zakim, unmute fantasai
16:35:03 <Zakim> fantasai should no longer be muted
16:35:09 <hober> Zakim, who is making noise?
16:35:10 <nimbupani> plinss: i had a proposal in kyoto we use flow-from property and then use content property
16:35:20 <Zakim> hober, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: nimbu (100%), plinss (9%), fantasai (24%), TabAtkins_ (14%)
16:35:24 <TabAtkins_> zakim, mute nimbu
16:35:24 <Zakim> nimbu should now be muted
16:36:11 <nimbupani> plinss: maybe we need another keyword to access actual content of the element rather than the flow content
16:36:29 <nimbupani> fantasai: the initial value of content property is normal, so normal computes to diff things depending on what the lement is
16:36:38 <bradk> content:flow-from() could replaces the content of the element with the contents of the flow. 
16:36:44 <nimbupani> fantasai: it computes to list marker on a list marker, etc
16:37:02 <nimbupani> plinss: normal could compute to flow-from on elements that have a flow-from
16:37:17 <nimbupani> vhardy: i am not sure i understand what this means
16:37:36 <nimbupani> szilles: the normal behaviour of content is if you say flow-from it sez use it.
16:37:56 <nimbupani> plinss: if you say flow-from and content, content wins so you have a keyword within content.
16:38:01 <nimbupani> vhardy: i think flow-from should win
16:38:09 <nimbupani> s/vhardy/alexmog
16:38:44 <nimbupani> fantasai: i dont want to hold off progress on resolving other issues. i dont want to consider this resolved, but I amf ine with picking a solution and working with it.
16:38:51 <nimbupani> vhardy: what is the solution we are going for?
16:39:18 <nimbupani> alexmog: i completely disagree with that
16:39:36 <nimbupani> szilles: if you want to be able to use ::before and ::after you want to fit it into the model
16:39:43 <nimbupani> alexmog: before and after does not feed into region flow
16:39:54 <nimbupani> szilles: vhardy said he would like to feed into the regions model
16:40:11 <nimbupani> alexmog: i dont know what it would mean to have content before that is float right and ahve that merge with multicol flow
16:40:26 <nimbupani> vhardy: the feedback I got was that we should specify the behavior of before and after when element is a region
16:40:27 <Zakim> + +1.650.766.aadd
16:40:41 <nimbupani> alexmog: for before and after that would be special meaning do something different when they apply to a region
16:40:50 <nimbupani> szilles: it isnt completely different which is why people suggest we use it
16:41:25 <nimbupani> vhardy: can we go with doing a new iteration on ED using flow-from and trying to resolve what we can do with before/after
16:41:59 <nimbupani> vhardy: plinss you talked about using another keyword to define actual content. the proposal in kyoto, there is a separate proposal on adding a 'contents' keyword so you can combine the content that is already there.
16:42:07 <nimbupani> oops
16:42:15 <nimbupani> vhardy: plinss you talked about using another keyword to define actual content. 
16:42:22 <nimbupani> plinss: the proposal in kyoto, there is a separate proposal on adding a 'contents' keyword so you can combine the content that is already there.
16:42:38 <nimbupani> plinss: i dont know if we need that, that was a separate proposal
16:42:43 <nimbupani> vhardy: for now we can live without that.
16:43:10 <nimbupani> szilles: i think it would be useful to put the issue under flow from that we need to clarify the interaction between the fow from and the contents property. 
16:43:18 <nimbupani> vhardy: i was proposing to say smthing in the draft
16:43:36 <dsinger> dsinger has joined #css
16:43:49 <nimbupani> vhardy: we iterate on the draft and have a new ED proposed for the next F2F, and we can have an issue on the review of the new WD.
16:43:57 <Zakim> +[Apple]
16:44:05 <Zakim> -dsinger
16:44:07 <nimbupani> alexmog: lets keep it an issue.
16:44:19 <nimbupani> TabAtkins: how do I create an issue >_>
16:44:49 <nimbupani> vhardy: following the resolution about breaks to be container specific or region specific as decided on Seattle, I aligned it with multicol.
16:45:07 <nimbupani> vhardy: issues i raised on seattle meeting are not region specific they affect multicol pagination as one thing
16:45:27 <nimbupani> vhardy: how do breaks work in nested regions, multicol and when u start combining different kinds of break. it spans regions multicol and pagination
16:45:47 <nimbupani> vhardy: i dont think this is the right place to handle in the regions spec. what do we do about it? do we have a separate spec for breaks?
16:46:21 <nimbupani> alexmog: sorry I forgot how to add an issue >_>
16:46:31 <nimbupani> RESOLVED: use flow-from property to enable regions
16:47:41 <nimbupani> alexmog: my biggest concern with region break was that while behavior of page-break is undefined we would be creating a separate syntax for smthing that means something exactly same as page break or has same effect in same media
16:47:49 <nimbupani> plinss: we redefined breaking property in multicol
16:47:55 <nimbupani> vhardy: we already resolved to have a region break
16:48:12 <nimbupani> florian: when we want diff kind of break for diff kind of thing and we need to think about carefully. 
16:48:28 <nimbupani> fantasai: we need a css3 pagination module?
16:48:33 <nimbupani> vhardy: maybe. 
16:48:43 <nimbupani> alexmog: yeah that would be great to have one. we can ask for volunteers to write it.
16:48:51 <nimbupani> fantasai: there is some interaction with paged meda spec. 
16:49:24 <nimbupani> fantasai: we might want to sync paged media spec to css 2.1 and push that out and ahve css3 pagination and then add whatever we need to add
16:49:39 <nimbupani> fantasai: the multicol spec defines aliases it was kinda expecting paged media to do that definition
16:49:46 <nimbupani> fantasai: maybe we can pull that into a separate module
16:49:55 <nimbupani> vhardy: sgtm
16:50:08 <nimbupani> plinss: who is going to work on the pagination module
16:50:16 <nimbupani> fantasai: i probably should do that
16:50:27 <nimbupani> fantasai: i hope its okay if you dont start until sept or oct
16:50:37 <nimbupani> fantasai: will be working more on pagination stuff this fall in either case.
16:50:54 <nimbupani> alexmog: MS and Adobe are most motivated people so maybe we and you should talk about it and figure out who should write the spec
16:50:56 <nimbupani> vhardy: yeah
16:51:19 <nimbupani> fantasai: i can rip out various pieces we need and create a framework
16:51:52 <nimbupani> whats the resolution?
16:53:12 <nimbupani> RESOLVED: CSS Regions has a region break like multicol and start on css3 pagination module and adobe and ms would sort out the editorship of that spec
16:53:26 <vhardy> http://dev.w3.org/csswg/css3-regions/#region-flow-break-properties-break-before-break-after-break-inside
16:53:38 <nimbupani> TOPIC: Conformance markup within the spec
16:53:44 <nimbupani> TabAtkins: can we talk about print backgrounds
16:53:53 <nimbupani> fantasai: can we talk about css 2. test suites
16:53:56 <nimbupani> plinss: whats the issue?
16:54:15 <nimbupani> fantasai: apparently ?? filed a bunch of issues but has not received a response about getting them fixed
16:54:29 <plinss> s/??/Gerard Talbot/
16:54:29 <nimbupani> fantasai: is ms planning to maintain those tests or find a new owner
16:54:44 <nimbupani> arronei: i can make changes whenever we feel its right
16:54:52 <nimbupani> plinss: no reason not to make updates. 
16:54:57 <nimbupani> arronei: i can start working on it then
16:55:20 <nimbupani> plinss: TabAtkins is saying if we can get a resolution in printing bg last week
16:55:28 <nimbupani> TabAtkins: wiki page did not facilitate new discussion
16:55:47 <nimbupani> TabAtkins: 1. do nothing 2. add a hint that lets author provide extra info so UA can make a better choice
16:56:18 <nimbupani> florian: 1 and then come up with a UI that lets user switch based.
16:56:29 <nimbupani> TabAtkins: are u asking me to come up with a new browser UI for all browsers
16:56:58 <nimbupani> florian: seems like browsers have not made effort on print yet. Option1  is not silly and use ?? as heuristics it is not that silly
16:57:28 <nimbupani> plinss: there is no way we can get reasonable heuristics. there are print scenarios that do not have a direct user interaction
16:57:40 <nimbupani> ??? I like whats in 3
16:57:56 <Zakim> -arno
16:57:58 <nimbupani> alexmog: using !important
16:58:06 <bradk> bradk has joined #css
16:58:12 <nimbupani> TabAtkins: !important is already doing wrong things and it is not just bgs. 
16:58:42 <nimbupani> alexmog: printing bgs is unique situation where browser refuses to display smthing that was specified. it is a special feature
16:58:47 <vhardy> vhardy: need to drop out.
16:58:55 <Zakim> - +2aabb
16:59:01 <Zakim> - +1.650.766.aadd
16:59:11 <nimbupani> alexmog: there is no other issue like that. we can create !print
16:59:15 <Zakim> + +1.650.766.aaee
16:59:33 <nimbupani> fantasai: we should ahve the principle that if someone has done the right thing, they should do one simple thing and it should just work
16:59:42 <nimbupani> fantasai: they should not reqrite stylesheet
17:00:16 <nimbupani> s/reqrite/rewrite
17:00:27 <nimbupani> fantasai: !important does not fit that bill
17:00:34 <nimbupani> alexmog: what is ur preferred answer TabAtkins
17:00:46 <nimbupani> florian: are we aligning with prop 7
17:00:49 <florian> http://wiki.csswg.org/ideas/print-backgrounds
17:01:03 <nimbupani> plinss: print media stylesheet is not sufficient
17:01:06 <florian> I was just asking elika's position, not everybody's
17:01:26 <nimbupani> TabAtkins: 2 to 6 are unusable
17:01:30 <nimbupani> TabAtkins: i am for option 7
17:01:46 <nimbupani> alexmog: is this for document or elements
17:01:48 <nimbupani> TabAtkins: either way
17:01:56 <nimbupani> TabAtkins: putting on doc is 7.1
17:02:03 <nimbupani> TabAtkins: individual pages is 7.2
17:02:09 <nimbupani> TabAtkins: any of them works.
17:02:13 <nimbupani> alexmog: it could be a meta tag
17:02:14 <Zakim> -[Microsoft]
17:02:34 <nimbupani> ??? print or anything like that sez we know better than you. the user needs to decide.
17:02:40 <nimbupani> s/????/arronei
17:03:26 <nimbupani> arronei: as vendors we decided not to print bgs by default. if we decide to print bgs by default, we need to engage the community and teach authors that they need to author good stylesheets for print
17:03:37 <nimbupani> TabAtkins: we will not be changing browsers to print bgs by default
17:03:56 <nimbupani> arronei: now you need to provide a notification that you will be printing insane amount of stuff on these pages.
17:04:27 <nimbupani> ??? we need people to write good stylesheet
17:04:40 <nimbupani> alexmog: if we add an option to print bg we will never need user override with that.
17:04:45 <dsinger> printed backgrounds sometimes make the print unreadable
17:05:02 <nimbupani> alexmog: browser it is okay to print what the author has done that. the lack of the property means this is the old page and use it the old way. 
17:05:17 <dsinger> making users miserable with the default is no way to educate site authors to make better stylesheets
17:05:28 <nimbupani> fantasai: an interesting heuristic to check would be if canvas has a bg that is not white then probably the page is not designed to print with ink
17:05:31 <Zakim> -[Microsoft.a]
17:06:00 <nimbupani> plinss: i dont think the simple heuristic is good enough. 
17:06:07 <oyvind> I'm sure plenty of pages have white/transparent html/body and put everything in some div
17:06:22 <nimbupani> TabAtkins: i have designed pages with no canvas bgs and elements that span the canvas having bg
17:06:31 <nimbupani> dsinger: bg by default would make usesrs miserable
17:06:42 <szilles> I support Alex's point: that adding a flag, probably on the document, that says honor the style, would allow migration to using suitable 'print' stylesheets
17:06:49 <nimbupani> TabAtkins: are we going to make a decision or are we going to continue be undefined
17:07:01 <nimbupani> TabAtkins: we are unable to make any decision on this whatsoever
17:07:11 <nimbupani> alexmog: we are closer to a decision
17:07:30 <nimbupani> TabAtkins: dont do it at all or do it with a property, there is no useful conversation out of this. I am not sure how to proceed. 
17:07:42 <nimbupani> TabAtkins: i am not seeing any progress towards a conclusion
17:07:59 <nimbupani> alexmog: u have proposal on the wiki
17:08:12 <nimbupani> alexmog: we can have things that are not in css but apply to whole doc
17:08:30 <nimbupani> TabAtkins: if we decide there is a mechanism for this, that would be sufficient for my needs.
17:08:47 <nimbupani> TabAtkins: can we assume 7 covers all variations on this idea?
17:09:05 <nimbupani> plinss: i propose we elect to do something
17:09:20 <nimbupani> plinss: i think we shold move forward anyway.
17:09:37 <nimbupani> plinss: tab should work on a concrete proposal get some implementation experience if folks hate it we can revisit
17:09:38 <szilles> +1 for Peter's proposal
17:09:43 <nimbupani> TabAtkins: cool for me
17:09:57 <nimbupani> RESOLVED: TabAtkins to create a proposal for print bgs
17:10:01 <Zakim> - +1.650.766.aaee
17:10:02 <Zakim> -fantasai
17:10:07 <Zakim> -[Apple]
17:10:08 <Zakim> -TabAtkins_
17:10:09 <Zakim> -arronei
17:10:10 <Zakim> -SteveZ
17:10:11 <Zakim> -plinss
17:10:11 <Zakim> -nimbu
17:10:11 <Zakim> -hober
17:10:13 <Zakim> -stearns
17:10:13 <Zakim> -florian
17:10:16 <Zakim> -alexmog
17:10:18 <Zakim> -??P15
17:10:19 <Zakim> Style_CSS FP()12:00PM has ended
17:10:22 <Zakim> Attendees were florian, plinss, nimbu, stearns, hober, +1.858.354.aaaa, dsinger, +2aabb, fantasai, JohnJansen, TabAtkins_, SteveZ, alexmog, +2aacc, arno, [Microsoft], arronei,
17:10:24 <Zakim> ... +1.650.766.aadd, +1.650.766.aaee
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