IRC log of lld on 2011-08-18

Timestamps are in UTC.

13:54:32 [RRSAgent]
RRSAgent has joined #lld
13:54:32 [RRSAgent]
logging to http://www.w3.org/2011/08/18-lld-irc
13:54:36 [tbaker]
rrsagent, bookmark
13:54:36 [RRSAgent]
See http://www.w3.org/2011/08/18-lld-irc#T13-54-36
13:54:44 [tbaker]
zakim, this will be lld
13:54:44 [Zakim]
ok, tbaker; I see INC_LLDXG()10:00AM scheduled to start in 6 minutes
13:54:51 [tbaker]
Meeting: LLD XG
13:54:54 [tbaker]
Chair: Tom
13:55:08 [tbaker]
rrsagent, please make record public
13:56:26 [Zakim]
INC_LLDXG()10:00AM has now started
13:56:33 [Zakim]
+??P4
13:56:52 [tbaker]
Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xg-lld/2011Aug/0065.html
13:57:07 [tbaker]
Previous: http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2011/08/11-lld-minutes.html
13:57:24 [marcia]
marcia has joined #lld
13:57:57 [tbaker]
Regrets: Gordon, Jodi, Lars, Kai, Uldis
13:58:00 [michaelp]
michaelp has joined #lld
13:58:11 [Zakim]
+??P10
13:58:13 [tbaker]
zakim, ??P4 is me
13:58:13 [Zakim]
+tbaker; got it
13:58:14 [Zakim]
+jeff_
13:58:20 [antoine]
zakim, ??P10 is me
13:58:20 [Zakim]
+antoine; got it
13:58:40 [tbaker]
zakim, jeff is really michaelp
13:58:40 [Zakim]
+michaelp; got it
13:58:57 [michaelp]
yes
13:59:35 [Zakim]
+ +1.330.672.aaaa
13:59:45 [antoine]
zakim, aaaa is marcia
13:59:45 [Zakim]
+marcia; got it
14:00:35 [pmurray]
pmurray has joined #lld
14:00:38 [Zakim]
+??P28
14:00:56 [tbaker]
zakim, ??P28 is kcoyle
14:00:57 [Zakim]
+kcoyle; got it
14:01:10 [antoine]
zakim, ??P28 is kcoyle
14:01:10 [Zakim]
I already had ??P28 as kcoyle, antoine
14:01:44 [Zakim]
+ +1.678.235.aabb
14:01:51 [pmurray]
zakim, aabb is me
14:01:51 [Zakim]
+pmurray; got it
14:02:00 [pmurray]
zakim, mute me
14:02:04 [Zakim]
pmurray should now be muted
14:02:34 [antoine]
rrsagent, please draft minutes
14:02:34 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/08/18-lld-minutes.html antoine
14:03:29 [antoine]
regrets+ Jeff
14:04:34 [Emma]
Emma has joined #LLD
14:04:35 [michaelp]
yes sure
14:06:02 [tbaker]
scribe: michaelp
14:06:07 [tbaker]
scribenick: michaelp
14:06:15 [michaelp]
Topic: Admin
14:06:28 [michaelp]
Tom: No objection to the minites?
14:06:36 [michaelp]
... Minutes accepted
14:07:03 [michaelp]
... Future telecons
14:07:17 [antoine]
rrsagent, please draft minutes
14:07:17 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/08/18-lld-minutes.html antoine
14:07:20 [michaelp]
... We can continue to use the telecon slot for coordinating the editing.
14:07:29 [michaelp]
Topic: Public Comments
14:08:04 [michaelp]
Tom: We had an action to keep track of comments
14:08:10 [michaelp]
ACTION: Emma to keep track of comments through AUG. 11 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2011/08/04-lld-minutes.html#action03]
14:08:10 [michaelp]
--DONE
14:08:22 [michaelp]
ACTION: Jodi to make an alternative transclusion [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2011/08/04-lld-minutes.html#action04]
14:08:22 [michaelp]
--DONE -- see http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/DraftReportWithTransclusion
14:09:54 [michaelp]
Tom: At some point, we have to stop taking major comments into consideration.
14:10:09 [michaelp]
... I think we need to close the action to watch for substantial comments.
14:10:35 [michaelp]
... However, we need somebody who is willing to watch the mailing list and blog.
14:10:53 [michaelp]
... This person should announce that we are transitioning to finalizing the report.
14:11:12 [kcoyle]
q+
14:11:14 [antoine]
+1 for closing the action
14:11:24 [tbaker]
ack kcoyle
14:11:52 [michaelp]
Karen: Any comments that appear on the list become discussions on the list. No special reply needed.
14:12:11 [Zakim]
-antoine
14:12:14 [michaelp]
Tom: Should we post note to the list that comment period has ended?
14:12:30 [michaelp]
Karen: Yes.
14:12:54 [marcia]
*+
14:13:07 [Zakim]
+??P10
14:13:13 [marcia]
Agree Karen
14:13:13 [antoine]
zakim, ??P10 is me
14:13:13 [Zakim]
+antoine; got it
14:13:53 [michaelp]
ACTION Tom to post an announcement to the list that comment period has ended
14:14:02 [tbaker]
s/ACTION/ACTION:/
14:14:03 [michaelp]
ACTION: Editors of each section should watch for substantial comments to their section [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2011/06/30-lld-minutes.html#action06]
14:14:03 [michaelp]
--DONE
14:14:15 [Zakim]
+[LC]
14:14:15 [michaelp]
ACTION: Tom to post an announcement to the list that comment period has ended
14:14:16 [edsu]
zakim, LC is edsu
14:14:16 [Zakim]
+edsu; got it
14:14:40 [michaelp]
Topic: Deliverables
14:15:11 [kcoyle]
yes to title -
14:15:25 [michaelp]
Tom: We don't have a title for the report yet, but I would propose "Library Linked Data Incubator Group Final Report: W3C Incubator Group Report xx September 2011"
14:15:38 [antoine]
+1 to title: not exciting but explicit...
14:15:50 [Emma]
+1
14:16:10 [michaelp]
... We have to write acknowledgements first.
14:18:15 [michaelp]
... We should have brief discussions who to include from inside and outside the working group.
14:18:31 [kcoyle]
I think the chairs should do it
14:18:32 [antoine]
me is volunteering
14:18:41 [michaelp]
... Who is willing to take on an action to draft acknowledgements?
14:18:49 [edsu]
+1 for chairs
14:19:01 [michaelp]
ACTION: Tom and Antoine to draft acknowledgements.
14:19:11 [antoine]
it would look like http://www.w3.org/TR/skos-primer/#secack, probably
14:19:18 [kcoyle]
listing editors seems pretty neutral
14:19:19 [rsinger]
rsinger has joined #lld
14:19:30 [antoine]
together with a quite complete listing of editors and contributors from XG
14:19:36 [marcia]
maybe include also whoever were invited to our telecons
14:19:41 [kcoyle]
antoine, yes
14:20:19 [antoine]
@marcia: maybe we could ack people related to JISC who came and gave us some light
14:20:28 [edsu]
is the draft available yet? sorry if it has been announced and i just missed it
14:20:33 [antoine]
s/JISC/JISC and UKOLN
14:20:41 [michaelp]
... Main part of the report: Executive summary. We have to find a date next week to look at the sumamry together.
14:21:04 [antoine]
@edsu: the latest version is still at http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/DraftReportWithTransclusion
14:21:09 [edsu]
antoine: thnx
14:21:15 [michaelp]
Karen: The group should feel free to edit before the call.
14:22:06 [michaelp]
Tom: I volunteered to write an introductory paragraph. Still to be done.
14:22:36 [Zakim]
+rsinger
14:22:51 [rsinger]
better late than never, i guess
14:23:03 [rsinger]
ugh
14:23:28 [edsu]
lol :)
14:23:35 [antoine]
q+
14:23:38 [michaelp]
... We received comment on "Current situtation" we have to take into account
14:23:40 [tbaker]
ack antoine
14:24:42 [antoine]
http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/DraftReportWithTransclusion#Data_availability
14:25:28 [michaelp]
Antoine: Just wanted to check that general size and tone of new edits is fitting to the other parts in this section.
14:25:53 [Emma]
I sent comments this morning re: current situation, but I also offered to make the changes if the comments make sense to you guys.
14:26:18 [michaelp]
Ross: Benefits section. Something was completely lost that was in the comments.
14:26:43 [michaelp]
... It is the stew that matters not the individual components for linked data. All has to come together.
14:26:57 [michaelp]
... This is not reflected in the section.
14:26:58 [antoine]
ross++ it is bad if we entirely lost the "stone stew" message
14:27:36 [marcia]
+1 for Ross' observation
14:27:37 [edsu]
maybe we just need a stone soup of some happy people eating stone soup :)
14:27:37 [michaelp]
ACTION: Ross to propose sentence about sum being more than the parts
14:27:56 [edsu]
s/need a stone soupe/graphic/
14:28:09 [edsu]
s/need a stone soup/graphic/
14:28:16 [kcoyle]
just appendices is fine
14:28:35 [michaelp]
Tom: Technical Appendix. How do we want to set this apart in the final version?
14:28:37 [antoine]
+1
14:28:37 [rsinger]
edsu: or a very long footnote explaining how the stone does not refer explicitly to MARC, unless that's how you want to read it, etc.
14:28:44 [rsinger]
edsu: VERY long footnote
14:28:49 [michaelp]
... How do we mark this as "technical"?
14:28:52 [antoine]
Just "appendix"
14:28:59 [marcia]
'Part II"?
14:29:11 [rsinger]
+1 to "just appendix"
14:29:12 [michaelp]
Michael: +1 to just call it "Appendix"
14:29:16 [Emma]
+1 for appendix
14:29:16 [pmurray]
+1 Agreed.
14:29:34 [antoine]
will do
14:29:48 [michaelp]
Tom: Ok, decided.
14:30:30 [marcia]
I think we answered all comments and suggestions, including from blog.
14:30:37 [michaelp]
Antoine: We still have some outstanding comments for vocabs and datasets.
14:30:37 [antoine]
almost :-)
14:31:02 [michaelp]
Tom: Deliverable B: Use Cases
14:31:13 [antoine]
q+
14:31:21 [tbaker]
ack antoine
14:31:36 [michaelp]
... Antoine: I would not object to Daniel being the sole editor.
14:31:52 [kcoyle]
q+
14:31:54 [michaelp]
... But all contributors to the cluster should be listed.
14:32:09 [michaelp]
... A lot of work went into these pages.
14:33:18 [michaelp]
Tom: Maybe Antoine and I could make a proposal how to handle the naming of contributors for the use cases?
14:33:42 [michaelp]
Antoine: Overlap with general contributors will be quite large.
14:34:23 [michaelp]
Tom: We can also ask Daniel and Jodi.
14:35:01 [antoine]
I think so
14:35:02 [michaelp]
... Deliverable C: Title and editors OK?
14:35:14 [kcoyle]
q-
14:35:20 [marcia]
Set = Sets
14:35:20 [michaelp]
... No objections. Default will stand.
14:35:30 [marcia]
title missing a 's'
14:36:09 [marcia]
Deliverable C "W3C Library Linked Data Incubator Group: Datasets, Value Vocabularies, and Metadata Element Set" -- "Sets"
14:36:50 [michaelp]
Topic: Actions related to deliverables
14:37:32 [michaelp]
ACTION: Karen, Tom, Michael, and Gordon to write the executive summary [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2011/07/21-lld-minutes.html#action05]
14:37:37 [michaelp]
--continued
14:38:07 [michaelp]
ACTION: Karen and Emma to write a sentence adding cultural and memory institutions together in some way [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2011/07/07-lld-minutes.html#action03]
14:38:12 [michaelp]
--CONTINUED
14:38:21 [michaelp]
ACTION: Editors of Benefits to meet and work on the comments. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2011/08/04-lld-minutes.html#action07]
14:38:23 [michaelp]
--DONE
14:38:33 [michaelp]
ACTION: Karen will track items from former "issues" and "recommendations" that belong to benefits [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2011/08/04-lld-minutes.html#action08]
14:38:36 [michaelp]
--DONE
14:39:11 [michaelp]
ACTION: Jeff to integrate more refined view of non-resolvable URIs and linking. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2011/07/21-lld-minutes.html#action08]
14:39:14 [michaelp]
--DONE
14:39:34 [tbaker]
http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/index.php?title=Draft_Relevant_Technologies&diff=5746&oldid=5294 - Jeff on URIs
14:39:49 [michaelp]
ACTION: Karen will convene issues and recommendations group to identify things that need to be discussed with larger group for July 21 meeting [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2011/07/07-lld-minutes.html#action04]
14:39:51 [michaelp]
--DONE
14:41:48 [michaelp]
ACTION: Karen and Antoine to relate Library Data Resources and Library Standards and Linked data [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2011/06/16-lld-minutes.html#action12]
14:41:50 [michaelp]
--DONE
14:42:55 [michaelp]
ACTION: Emma to review Use Cases and make comments [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2011/07/07-lld-minutes.html#action07]
14:43:01 [michaelp]
--CONTINUED
14:43:13 [michaelp]
Topic: Finalization of report
14:43:34 [michaelp]
Tom: We have remaining writing tasks as discussed above.
14:43:54 [michaelp]
... We need to declare the comment period closed.
14:44:38 [michaelp]
... Next week, we need to start moving thing over to HTML.
14:44:56 [michaelp]
... Go/No-go vote next week + final quality checks.
14:45:15 [kcoyle]
q+
14:45:36 [tbaker]
ack kcoyle
14:45:52 [michaelp]
... We have to trust the editors whether things are ready to be moved over to HTML
14:46:16 [michaelp]
Karen: Isn't this part of the editorial work anyway?
14:47:00 [michaelp]
Tom: It would be nice to have third parties look over it, but we don't seem to have enough resources.
14:47:09 [michaelp]
... So we will rely on the editors.
14:47:30 [kcoyle]
where does the html live? w3c site?
14:47:47 [michaelp]
... Moving wiki docs over to HTML: Ideally, we should have volunteers that have experience with this.
14:48:13 [tbaker]
How to migrate from wiki to HTML http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/ssn/wiki/Publishing_Incubator_Group_Documents
14:48:42 [pmurray]
Seems straightforward enough to do...
14:49:01 [kcoyle]
wouldn't it be easier to just take the wiki stuff as text?
14:49:12 [pmurray]
Put me down as helping with that.
14:49:21 [kcoyle]
it should be easy to code the text up
14:49:41 [pmurray]
zakim, unmute me
14:49:41 [Zakim]
pmurray should no longer be muted
14:50:17 [michaelp]
Karen: Given that our doc is mostly text, we could just grab text an then mark it up.
14:50:36 [michaelp]
Tom: We also have to run it through the publication checker.
14:50:47 [michaelp]
... To make sure it conform to W3C standards
14:51:34 [michaelp]
... Chairs will be involved. Karen and Peter also.
14:51:57 [michaelp]
ACTION: Chairs, Karen, Peter to migrate wiki content to HTML
14:54:12 [michaelp]
Tom: Response to the list on how LLD XG handled comments?
14:54:58 [michaelp]
Antoine: We cannot generally acknowledge comments individually.
14:55:47 [Emma]
Maybe say a word about comments handling in the methodology section of the report ?
14:56:08 [michaelp]
Tom: We can point to where we acknowledged the comments summarily and can respond that we took all into consideration.
14:56:31 [michaelp]
... We can add a sentence about comment handling in introductory remarks.
14:57:36 [michaelp]
Antoine: Should I send to draft mails for specific comments to my section?
14:58:03 [michaelp]
s/Should I send to /Should I still send /
14:59:23 [michaelp]
ACTION: Chairs to prepare press release with W3C
14:59:33 [michaelp]
Topic: Stanford Workshop
14:59:37 [michaelp]
Tom: Any comments?
14:59:42 [antoine]
I've not heard about activity there...
15:00:10 [michaelp]
Topic: Transition to Community Group
15:00:41 [antoine]
Anyone going to LOD-LAM-DC?
15:00:52 [michaelp]
Tom: We will have to close out the XG in order to be able to transition to community group, but we have not identified any leaders yet.
15:00:57 [Emma]
a lot of people asked me about it at IFLA
15:01:04 [kcoyle]
haven't heard about lod-lam-dc. got a link?
15:01:36 [marcia]
There is an email about LAM-DC
15:01:40 [michaelp]
... I follow up with Jon Voss about this.
15:01:51 [edsu]
jon voss' event in december http://lod-lam.net/summit/2011/08/17/lodlam-dc/
15:02:10 [michaelp]
... Thanks to all. Next week: final telecon!
15:02:18 [marcia]
thank you, Tom.
15:02:22 [michaelp]
... Meeting adjourned.
15:02:27 [antoine]
zakim, please list attendees
15:02:38 [Zakim]
-edsu
15:02:44 [Zakim]
-kcoyle
15:02:44 [pmurray]
pmurray has left #lld
15:02:47 [michaelp]
Sure, I think Im still muted
15:02:53 [Emma]
Bye all !
15:02:54 [Zakim]
-marcia
15:02:58 [Zakim]
As of this point the attendees have been tbaker, jeff_, antoine, michaelp, +1.330.672.aaaa, marcia, kcoyle, +1.678.235.aabb, pmurray, edsu, rsinger
15:03:01 [Zakim]
-pmurray
15:03:08 [antoine]
rrsagent, please draft minutes
15:03:08 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/08/18-lld-minutes.html antoine
15:03:17 [Zakim]
-rsinger
15:03:19 [edsu]
antoine: i'm planning on going to that event
15:03:31 [antoine]
edsu: cool!
15:03:37 [edsu]
antoine: i imagine kevin ford will go too, at least
15:03:45 [antoine]
but it's in september, not december as you said
15:05:47 [antoine]
zakim, bye
15:05:51 [antoine]
rrsagent, bye
15:05:51 [RRSAgent]
I see 16 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2011/08/18-lld-actions.rdf :
15:05:51 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: Emma to keep track of comments through AUG. 11 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2011/08/04-lld-minutes.html#action03] [1]
15:05:51 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/08/18-lld-irc#T14-08-10
15:05:51 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: Jodi to make an alternative transclusion [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2011/08/04-lld-minutes.html#action04] [2]
15:05:51 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/08/18-lld-irc#T14-08-22
15:05:51 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: Editors of each section should watch for substantial comments to their section [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2011/06/30-lld-minutes.html#action06] [3]
15:05:51 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/08/18-lld-irc#T14-14-03
15:05:51 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: Tom to post an announcement to the list that comment period has ended [4]
15:05:51 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/08/18-lld-irc#T14-14-15-1
15:05:51 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: Tom and Antoine to draft acknowledgements. [5]
15:05:51 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/08/18-lld-irc#T14-19-01
15:05:51 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: Ross to propose sentence about sum being more than the parts [6]
15:05:51 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/08/18-lld-irc#T14-27-37-1
15:05:51 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: Karen, Tom, Michael, and Gordon to write the executive summary [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2011/07/21-lld-minutes.html#action05] [7]
15:05:51 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/08/18-lld-irc#T14-37-32
15:05:51 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: Karen and Emma to write a sentence adding cultural and memory institutions together in some way [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2011/07/07-lld-minutes.html#action03] [8]
15:05:51 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/08/18-lld-irc#T14-38-07
15:05:51 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: Editors of Benefits to meet and work on the comments. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2011/08/04-lld-minutes.html#action07] [9]
15:05:51 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/08/18-lld-irc#T14-38-21
15:05:51 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: Karen will track items from former "issues" and "recommendations" that belong to benefits [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2011/08/04-lld-minutes.html#action08] [10]
15:05:51 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/08/18-lld-irc#T14-38-33
15:05:51 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: Jeff to integrate more refined view of non-resolvable URIs and linking. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2011/07/21-lld-minutes.html#action08] [11]
15:05:51 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/08/18-lld-irc#T14-39-11
15:05:51 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: Karen will convene issues and recommendations group to identify things that need to be discussed with larger group for July 21 meeting [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2011/07/07-lld-minutes.html#action04] [12]
15:05:51 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/08/18-lld-irc#T14-39-49
15:05:51 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: Karen and Antoine to relate Library Data Resources and Library Standards and Linked data [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2011/06/16-lld-minutes.html#action12] [13]
15:05:51 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/08/18-lld-irc#T14-41-48
15:05:51 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: Emma to review Use Cases and make comments [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2011/07/07-lld-minutes.html#action07] [14]
15:05:51 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/08/18-lld-irc#T14-42-55
15:05:51 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: Chairs, Karen, Peter to migrate wiki content to HTML [15]
15:05:51 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/08/18-lld-irc#T14-51-57
15:05:51 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: Chairs to prepare press release with W3C [16]
15:05:51 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/08/18-lld-irc#T14-59-23
15:07:22 [Zakim]
leaving. As of this point the attendees were tbaker, jeff_, antoine, michaelp, +1.330.672.aaaa, marcia, kcoyle, +1.678.235.aabb, pmurray, edsu, rsinger
15:07:25 [Zakim]
Zakim has left #lld