IRC log of webrtc on 2011-05-19

Timestamps are in UTC.

16:35:47 [RRSAgent]
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logging to http://www.w3.org/2011/05/19-webrtc-irc
16:35:55 [francois]
RRSAgent, make logs public
16:36:37 [francois]
Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-webrtc/2011May/0006.html
16:36:51 [francois]
Meeting: Web Real-Time Communications Teleconference
16:37:00 [francois]
Chair: Harald
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16:56:13 [voxeo_jose]
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16:56:28 [hta]
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16:56:40 [hta]
hello everyone. Will be right with you.
16:57:15 [stefanh]
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16:58:57 [Zakim]
Team_(webrtc)17:00Z has now started
16:58:59 [Zakim]
+??P19
16:59:04 [Zakim]
+[Mozilla]
16:59:06 [Zakim]
-[Mozilla]
16:59:06 [Zakim]
+[Mozilla]
16:59:23 [Zakim]
+[Mozilla.a]
16:59:35 [Zakim]
+??P20
16:59:39 [francois]
zakim, ??P19 is me
16:59:40 [Zakim]
+francois; got it
16:59:56 [nstratford]
zakim, ??P20 is me
16:59:56 [Zakim]
+nstratford; got it
17:00:00 [francois]
scribe: francois
17:00:04 [francois]
zakim, code?
17:00:04 [Zakim]
the conference code is 26631 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 tel:+33.4.26.46.79.03 tel:+44.203.318.0479), francois
17:00:09 [Zakim]
+ +1.650.241.aaaa
17:00:12 [Zakim]
+ +46.7.03.60.aabb
17:00:14 [francois]
zakim, who is on the phone?
17:00:17 [Zakim]
On the phone I see [Mozilla], francois, [Mozilla.a], nstratford, +1.650.241.aaaa, +46.7.03.60.aabb
17:00:19 [Zakim]
+StefanH
17:00:23 [Zakim]
+ +1.603.756.aacc
17:00:26 [hta]
zakim, aaaa is hta
17:00:28 [Zakim]
+hta; got it
17:00:30 [Zakim]
+[Voxeo]
17:00:36 [Zakim]
+ +1.703.471.aadd
17:00:42 [Zakim]
+ +358.408.20aaee
17:01:01 [Zakim]
+Caroline
17:01:07 [Zakim]
+ +7.299.57.aaff
17:01:11 [Zakim]
+Dan_Druta
17:01:20 [Zakim]
-Caroline
17:01:25 [Zakim]
+Dan_Burnett
17:01:37 [hta]
zakim, who is on the phone?
17:01:37 [Zakim]
On the phone I see [Mozilla], francois, [Mozilla.a], nstratford, hta, +46.7.03.60.aabb, StefanH, +1.603.756.aacc, [Voxeo], +1.703.471.aadd, +358.408.20aaee, +7.299.57.aaff,
17:01:40 [Zakim]
... Dan_Druta, Dan_Burnett
17:01:50 [Zakim]
+Caroline
17:01:56 [DanD]
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17:02:04 [Zakim]
-[Mozilla.a]
17:02:22 [burn_]
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17:02:32 [burn_]
zakim, I am Dan_Burnett
17:02:32 [Zakim]
ok, burn_, I now associate you with Dan_Burnett
17:02:36 [danyork]
Dan York from Voxeo on the phone.
17:03:36 [DanD]
I am Dan Druta from AT&T
17:03:53 [Zakim]
-hta
17:04:07 [voxeo_jose]
zakim, +1.407.418.1800 is me
17:04:07 [Zakim]
sorry, voxeo_jose, I do not recognize a party named '+1.407.418.1800'
17:04:15 [Zakim]
+ +1.206.256.aagg
17:04:22 [Zakim]
+hta
17:05:00 [anant]
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17:05:04 [burn_]
zakim, who's noisy?
17:05:05 [blizzard]
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17:05:07 [salvatore]
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17:05:15 [Zakim]
burn_, listening for 11 seconds I heard sound from the following: hta (17%)
17:06:15 [danyork]
A number of people joined #webrtc over on Freenode... I provided the URL to get over here.
17:06:24 [blizzard]
(also on freenode since that has a port I can get to with an irc client)
17:06:25 [derf]
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17:06:35 [francois]
hta: there are some people who are on IRC and some who are not. Let's go for a quick round of introductions.
17:07:04 [blizzard]
welcome to the first teleconference
17:07:28 [burn_]
zakim, who's here?
17:07:28 [Zakim]
On the phone I see [Mozilla], francois, nstratford, +46.7.03.60.aabb, StefanH, +1.603.756.aacc, [Voxeo], +1.703.471.aadd, +358.408.20aaee, +7.299.57.aaff, Dan_Druta, Dan_Burnett,
17:07:30 [blizzard]
still working out the bugs
17:07:31 [Zakim]
... Caroline, +1.206.256.aagg, hta
17:07:33 [Zakim]
On IRC I see derf, salvatore, blizzard, anant, burn_, DanD, nstratford, stefanh, hta, voxeo_jose, danyork, RRSAgent, Zakim, francois
17:09:21 [burn_]
info on using zakim: http://www.w3.org/2002/01/UsingZakim
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17:10:40 [francois]
Present: Harald, Stefan, francois, DanBurnett, ChrisBlizzard, DanDruta, Cullen, NeilStratford, DanYork
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17:11:50 [dromasca]
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17:12:04 [bitshaq]
hi just joining the irc room. been on the call.
17:12:15 [francois]
Present+ Goran, Jose, ChristopheEyrignoux.
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17:12:43 [francois]
Present+ Steve?
17:13:09 [cullenfluffyjenni]
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17:13:34 [francois]
[hta reviewing the agenda]
17:14:02 [francois]
hta: Decision we need to make at this call is basically when next calls will be and whether we want to meet F2F.
17:14:15 [blizzard]
hta: none here
17:14:20 [francois]
... According to W3C rules, F2F meetings need to be announced pretty much in advance.
17:14:24 [francois]
... Comments on the agenda?
17:14:28 [francois]
[none heard]
17:14:29 [gape]
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17:14:50 [francois]
Topic: Round table introductions
17:15:02 [anant]
1 per organization?
17:15:03 [francois]
hta: With so many people, that would take a long time.
17:15:09 [dyork]
1 per company
17:15:50 [francois]
hta: 1 per company. From Google, what I hope is to define APIs that would allow to make audio/video conference calls within Web browsers.
17:16:40 [francois]
cullen: 100% in line with what's already been said.
17:17:07 [francois]
DanBurnett: I'd like to have Jose to explain Voxeo's position
17:17:50 [francois]
Jose: We've coming in from the API perspective as well. We don't represent a browser vendor but we've been trying to define this API for some time, so we're really excited to see this work going on.
17:18:43 [francois]
ChristopheEyrignoux: For France Telecom / Orange. I'd like this API to enable interconnection with SIP-RTC.
17:19:02 [francois]
... Signaling should allow for format negotiation.
17:19:23 [Zakim]
- +1.603.756.aacc
17:19:48 [Zakim]
+ +1.603.756.aahh
17:20:01 [francois]
DanDruta: for AT&T, we're actively involved in other works that would like to take advantage of these capabilities on a standard basis.
17:20:23 [dyork]
hta: That was me rejoining... I lost audio and had to drop off and rejoin
17:20:28 [francois]
Goran: From Ericsson, we want this to be interoperable and secure.
17:20:51 [francois]
Present+ DanRomascanu
17:21:05 [francois]
DanRomascanu: from Avaya.
17:21:23 [stefanh]
francois, add "datagram" to Ericsson expectations
17:21:50 [dromasca]
solution to be browser independent and accomodate various classes of devices via negociation capabilities
17:22:46 [francois]
hta: I guess we all see the need for interoperable APIs, that's the key word here. How much of the datagram format needs to be exposed is still unclear.
17:22:50 [bitshaq_]
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17:23:01 [francois]
... I think that might be enough for our expectation for now.
17:23:08 [francois]
Topic: Web RTC WG Overview
17:23:20 [francois]
hta: Looking at the charter, it's all about API functions.
17:23:29 [francois]
-> http://www.w3.org/2011/04/webrtc-charter.html Web RTC WG charter
17:23:49 [francois]
hta: we expect collaboration with the IETF RTCWEB group, Cullen is one of the chairs.
17:24:07 [francois]
cullen: yes, I recognize many people here, so think things will go smooth.
17:24:40 [francois]
hta: people expressed that they did not want W3C to define which codecs are mandatory.
17:25:05 [francois]
... Discussion is still going on in IETF. Will that be smooth? ;)
17:26:26 [blizzard]
aaaand I need to vanish
17:26:26 [francois]
... There is one proposal definitely in scope for one of our API functions written by Ian Hickson.
17:26:27 [blizzard]
:(
17:26:30 [blizzard]
another thing at 1030
17:26:58 [francois]
... The WHATWG has the spec, in scope for our work. It helps a great deal to have only one spec to do one thing.
17:27:12 [francois]
... We need to work on relationship with WHATWG.
17:28:17 [francois]
DanBurnett: it is important to clarify the relation with WHATWG as it is a recurring topic at W3C.
17:28:40 [Zakim]
-francois
17:29:02 [richt]
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17:29:22 [Zakim]
+??P16
17:29:28 [francois]
zakim, ??P16 is me
17:29:28 [Zakim]
+francois; got it
17:29:29 [anant]
dan: use cases are going to drive everything. clearing up use-cases will make clear what groups to co-ordinate with
17:30:00 [francois]
Present+ AnantNayaranan
17:30:09 [richt]
Present+ Rich_Tibbett
17:30:22 [francois]
???: what are the groups with need to talk precisely for privacy and security aspects?
17:30:33 [hta]
francois, ??? was cullen
17:31:08 [francois]
stefan: Device APIs has done that up until now.
17:31:34 [francois]
Cullen: I don't understand how groups use to coordinate at W3C, which is why I raise the question.
17:31:59 [richt]
s/???:/Cullen:/
17:32:13 [francois]
goran: the list in the charter is a good starting point. I think one good starting point for the group would be to work on use cases.
17:32:28 [francois]
... to get a feeling of who we need to involve.
17:32:41 [francois]
hta: there was one use cases document that was presented by IETF.
17:33:00 [francois]
... Not sure where it makes sense to keep this work. Joint document?
17:33:21 [francois]
goran: Ericsson's willing to work on it in both forums.
17:33:23 [cullenfluffyjenni]
+1 on that viewpoint
17:34:02 [francois]
hta: Joint documents are generally shared. Keeping it as Internet Draft and asking both sides for review seems like the way to go.
17:34:34 [francois]
DanBurnett: the IETF is going to operate at the network layer. The W3C at the upper layer, it may be wise to split the document.
17:34:54 [francois]
goran: you're right, but first use cases would better appear in a common document.
17:35:06 [francois]
... I would suggest to start with a common one at least for 3 weeks.
17:35:18 [francois]
hta: yes, let's start with a common one.
17:35:51 [francois]
goran: I'd like to know examples of use cases at W3C.
17:36:40 [francois]
hta: that's where the mailing-list should come into action. Goran, could you point people to the latest draft?
17:36:57 [francois]
goran: yes, volunteers are welcome, by the way.
17:37:19 [francois]
hta: That also covers our topic on first next steps, and some of "who would be willing to contribute".
17:37:34 [francois]
... I need to leave very early. Can we jump to next meetings?
17:37:40 [francois]
Topic: Next meetings
17:38:07 [francois]
hta: A lot of us are going to Quebec end of July for IETF meeting and RTCWEB F2F.
17:38:27 [francois]
... I would suggest to hold a F2F for the W3C group as well.
17:39:03 [francois]
cullen: Do you want to have it in parallel with other meetings or at the beginning or the end of meetings?
17:39:17 [francois]
hta: I was thinking of Friday afternoon.
17:40:21 [dyork]
Ha! Indeed, by Friday people are ready to leave an IETF
17:40:35 [francois]
DanR: If we know now, I can ping the secretariat. My strong preference would be for Sunday.
17:41:00 [francois]
hta: we might not need too much time because the same discussions will happen at the RTCWEB meeting.
17:41:24 [Cary]
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17:41:25 [francois]
... I think we should announce as soon as we know we can hold it in Sunday
17:41:35 [Chris]
Chris has joined #Webrtc
17:42:03 [francois]
DanB: I would note that participants may not be exactly the same, and you should not assume that discussions and people will be exactly the same.
17:42:12 [francois]
... Don't shorten the time.
17:42:21 [francois]
??2: fully agree with that
17:42:44 [francois]
??3: what's normal here? 3 hours or 4 hours?
17:43:02 [francois]
DanB: It very much depends, based on experience, on where we're at.
17:43:02 [dromasca]
that was Cullen
17:43:34 [cullenfluffyjenni]
Sorry, I will try and remember to say my name :-)
17:43:43 [francois]
... everything's not necessarily decided on mailing-lists at W3C. Crossing over lunch break is very nice.
17:44:19 [francois]
... It could perhaps help to improve mix networking between groups
17:44:25 [francois]
hta: ok, we have a proposal here.
17:44:46 [francois]
... Next question is how often should we make phone calls?
17:45:15 [francois]
... Groups vary in the number of phone calls they have.
17:46:00 [Zakim]
-nstratford
17:46:12 [francois]
DanB: We recently chartered the Audio incubator group, starting with a group who didn't want to have phone calls. Then we went on a call every 2 week basis, to discuss and resolve issues.
17:46:36 [francois]
... There is an advantage to having a group that meets often on the phone.
17:46:59 [francois]
hta: 3 weeks from now on 8 June, we have the RTCWeb interim meeting.
17:47:30 [francois]
... I think we need to talk before or after about where we are here.
17:47:58 [Zakim]
+??P19
17:48:01 [francois]
... In two weeks from now, but June 2nd is vacation day.
17:48:08 [francois]
... June 1st or June 6th.
17:48:50 [francois]
goran: I would suggest 7th (?)
17:48:50 [nstratford]
Zakim, ??P19 is me
17:48:50 [Zakim]
+nstratford; got it
17:49:13 [francois]
[consensus to create a Doodle around info date]
17:49:29 [francois]
??3: one question about conference bridge.
17:49:30 [francois]
q+
17:50:51 [francois]
ack me
17:51:19 [Zakim]
-hta
17:51:27 [francois]
francois: matter of estimating the maximum number of people for the reservation. I said 15, turns out it was not enough.
17:52:15 [francois]
stefan: I think we've been through the agenda, so unless there's anything left that people would like to discuss, we could close.
17:53:11 [francois]
... I note that there is a TPAC meeting in November in Santa Clara and think we should go there.
17:53:26 [francois]
DanB: deadline for registration is past, do you think we can find a meeting room?
17:53:28 [Zakim]
- +1.603.756.aahh
17:53:32 [Zakim]
- +358.408.20aaee
17:53:33 [Zakim]
- +46.7.03.60.aabb
17:53:34 [Zakim]
-Dan_Burnett
17:53:35 [Zakim]
- +1.703.471.aadd
17:53:36 [Zakim]
- +7.299.57.aaff
17:53:39 [Zakim]
-nstratford
17:53:40 [Zakim]
-[Mozilla]
17:53:40 [Zakim]
-StefanH
17:53:50 [francois]
francois: I will investigate. I think that's doable given that the group did not exist when the questionnaire was sent out.
17:53:53 [Zakim]
-francois
17:53:58 [Zakim]
-Caroline
17:54:02 [francois]
[call adjourned]
17:54:09 [Zakim]
-[Voxeo]
17:54:38 [Zakim]
- +1.206.256.aagg
17:54:58 [anant]
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17:55:51 [francois]
zakim, who is on the call?
17:55:51 [Zakim]
On the phone I see Dan_Druta
17:57:13 [francois]
i/cullen: 100%/[scribe had sound troubles and missed speaker]/
17:59:17 [francois]
s/interoperable and secure/interoperable, secure and to include datagrams/
17:59:29 [francois]
s/??3/Cullen/
17:59:44 [francois]
s/francois, ??? was cullen//
17:59:53 [Zakim]
-Dan_Druta
17:59:54 [Zakim]
Team_(webrtc)17:00Z has ended
17:59:56 [Zakim]
Attendees were [Mozilla], francois, nstratford, +1.650.241.aaaa, +46.7.03.60.aabb, StefanH, +1.603.756.aacc, hta, [Voxeo], +1.703.471.aadd, +358.408.20aaee, Caroline,
17:59:58 [Zakim]
... +7.299.57.aaff, Dan_Druta, Dan_Burnett, +1.206.256.aagg, +1.603.756.aahh
18:00:48 [francois]
RRSAgent, draft minutes
18:00:48 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/05/19-webrtc-minutes.html francois
18:17:47 [dyork]
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22:09:06 [francois]
RRSAgent, bye
22:09:06 [RRSAgent]
I see no action items