IRC log of html-a11y on 2011-05-12

Timestamps are in UTC.

14:59:11 [RRSAgent]

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14:59:11 [RRSAgent]

logging to http://www.w3.org/2011/05/12-html-a11y-irc

14:59:13 [trackbot]

RRSAgent, make logs world

14:59:13 [Zakim]

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14:59:15 [trackbot]

Zakim, this will be 2119

14:59:15 [Zakim]

ok, trackbot; I see WAI_PFWG(HTML TF)11:00AM scheduled to start in 1 minute

14:59:16 [trackbot]

Meeting: HTML Accessibility Task Force Teleconference

14:59:16 [trackbot]

Date: 12 May 2011

14:59:34 [paulc]

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14:59:50 [MichaelC]

zakim, this is 2119

14:59:50 [Zakim]

MichaelC, I see WAI_PFWG(HTML TF)11:00AM in the schedule but not yet started. Perhaps you mean "this will be 2119".

15:00:11 [JF]

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15:00:40 [Zakim]

WAI_PFWG(HTML TF)11:00AM has now started

15:00:47 [Zakim]

+Michael_Cooper

15:01:02 [Zakim]

+??P24

15:01:23 [Zakim]

+JF

15:01:30 [Stevef]

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15:01:54 [MichaelC]

zakim, ??P24 is Janina_Sajka

15:01:54 [Zakim]

+Janina_Sajka; got it

15:02:09 [Zakim]

+??P4

15:02:28 [MichaelC]

zakim, ??P4 is Steve_Faulkner

15:02:28 [Zakim]

+Steve_Faulkner; got it

15:02:32 [janina]

Meeting: HTML-A11Y telecon

15:02:32 [janina]

Chair: Janina_Sajka

15:02:32 [janina]

agenda: this

15:02:32 [janina]

agenda+ Identify Scribe

15:02:32 [janina]

http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/index.php?title=Scribe_List

15:02:33 [janina]

agenda+ Subteam Reports: Media; Canvas; Bug Triage

15:02:35 [janina]

agenda+ Text Subteam Issues http://www.w3.org/2011/05/09-text-minutes.html

15:02:37 [janina]

agenda+ Role Presentation http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-a11y/2011May/0271.html

15:02:39 [janina]

agenda+ Title http://www.w3.org/html/wg/wiki/ChangeProposals/notitle

15:02:41 [janina]

http://www.w3.org/html/wg/wiki/ChangeProposals/EnTitle

15:02:43 [janina]

agenda+ Fig-Caption http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-a11y/2011May/0210.html

15:02:46 [janina]

agenda+ Longdesc http://www.w3.org/html/wg/wiki/ChangeProposals/InstateLongdesc

15:02:49 [janina]

agenda+ Actions Review http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/track/actions/open

15:02:51 [janina]

agenda+ Other Business

15:02:53 [janina]

agenda+ Identify Scribe for 19 May http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/index.php?title=Scribe_List

15:02:55 [janina]

agenda+ be done

15:02:57 [LeifHSilli]

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15:03:00 [Zakim]

+Judy

15:03:16 [judy]

judy has joined #html-a11y

15:03:42 [janina]

zakim, who's here?

15:03:42 [Zakim]

On the phone I see Michael_Cooper, Janina_Sajka, JF, Steve_Faulkner, Judy

15:03:45 [Zakim]

On IRC I see judy, LeifHSilli, Stevef, JF, paulc, Zakim, RRSAgent, janina, MichaelC, MikeSmith, davidb, [tm], trackbot

15:04:15 [Zakim]

+??P5

15:04:20 [MikeSmith]

Zakim, ??P5

15:04:20 [Zakim]

I don't understand '??P5', MikeSmith

15:04:26 [MikeSmith]

Zakim, ??P5 is me

15:04:26 [Zakim]

+MikeSmith; got it

15:04:28 [judy]

zakim, who's here?

15:04:28 [Zakim]

On the phone I see Michael_Cooper, Janina_Sajka, JF, Steve_Faulkner, Judy, MikeSmith

15:04:31 [Zakim]

On IRC I see judy, LeifHSilli, Stevef, JF, paulc, Zakim, RRSAgent, janina, MichaelC, MikeSmith, davidb, [tm], trackbot

15:04:44 [mranon]

mranon has joined #html-a11y

15:05:45 [Zakim]

+[Microsoft]

15:06:04 [paulc]

zakim, [Microsoft] has paulc

15:06:04 [Zakim]

+paulc; got it

15:06:41 [janina]

zakim, pick a victim

15:06:41 [Zakim]

Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose Judy

15:06:48 [janina]

zakim, pick a victim

15:06:48 [Zakim]

Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose paulc

15:06:58 [janina]

zakim, pick a victim

15:06:58 [Zakim]

Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose JF

15:07:07 [Zakim]

+??P7

15:07:21 [MichaelC]

zakim, ??P7 is Marco_Ranon

15:07:21 [Zakim]

+Marco_Ranon; got it

15:07:26 [mranon]

zackim, P7 is me

15:07:28 [MichaelC]

zakim, mute marco

15:07:28 [Zakim]

Marco_Ranon should now be muted

15:07:39 [MichaelC]

scribe: MichaelC

15:07:41 [MikeSmith]

Zakim, mute me

15:07:41 [Zakim]

MikeSmith should now be muted

15:08:07 [MichaelC]

chair: Janina_Sajka

15:08:10 [MichaelC]

zakim, close item 1

15:08:14 [MichaelC]

zakim, next item

15:08:17 [Zakim]

agendum 1, Identify Scribe, closed

15:08:18 [Zakim]

I see 10 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is

15:08:20 [Zakim]

2. Subteam Reports: Media; Canvas; Bug Triage [from janina]

15:08:22 [Zakim]

+Cynthia_Shelly

15:08:23 [MichaelC]

jf: multitrack mostly wrapped up

15:08:24 [Zakim]

agendum 2. "Subteam Reports: Media; Canvas; Bug Triage" taken up [from janina]

15:08:40 [MichaelC]

== media ==

15:08:52 [MichaelC]

discussion ongoing about text alternatives for video element

15:09:14 [MichaelC]

js: request for stable URI for <missed>

15:09:30 [MichaelC]

also need to work on navigational concerns

15:09:34 [MichaelC]

== canvas ==

15:09:39 [MichaelC]

<nobody present>

15:09:44 [MichaelC]

== bug triage ==

15:10:31 [MichaelC]

mr: bug triage processed pending tf decision bugs this week

15:10:39 [MichaelC]

gave a few the a11ytf keyword, not many

15:10:47 [MichaelC]

gave rationales for each

15:10:49 [MichaelC]

no major highlights

15:10:59 [MichaelC]

zakim, mute marco

15:10:59 [Zakim]

Marco_Ranon should now be muted

15:11:21 [MichaelC]

== ARIA mapping ==

15:11:35 [MichaelC]

cs: first discussion about HTML API map document just before this call

15:11:39 [MichaelC]

lots of work to do

15:11:43 [MichaelC]

have identified starter points

15:11:52 [MichaelC]

js: that meets just before this call?

15:11:55 [MichaelC]

cs: yes, for now

15:11:59 [MichaelC]

js: need help?

15:12:02 [MichaelC]

cs: yes

15:12:09 [judy]

zakim, who's here?

15:12:09 [Zakim]

On the phone I see Michael_Cooper, Janina_Sajka, JF, Steve_Faulkner, Judy, MikeSmith (muted), [Microsoft], Marco_Ranon (muted), Cynthia_Shelly

15:12:11 [Zakim]

[Microsoft] has paulc

15:12:12 [Zakim]

On IRC I see mranon, judy, LeifHSilli, Stevef, JF, paulc, Zakim, RRSAgent, janina, MichaelC, MikeSmith, davidb, [tm], trackbot

15:12:14 [MichaelC]

splitting time between HTML API map, and ARIA API map

15:12:42 [MichaelC]

js: good, looking to publish HTML implementation guide in June

15:13:11 [MichaelC]

zakim, next item

15:13:11 [Zakim]

agendum 3. "Text Subteam Issues http://www.w3.org/2011/05/09-text-minutes.html" taken up [from janina]

15:13:13 [judy]

Text Alternatives Sub-Team -- recent meeting: http://www.w3.org/2011/05/09-text-minutes.html

15:13:37 [MichaelC]

jb: 7-8 issues on the table

15:14:01 [MichaelC]

<lists too fast to scribe>

15:14:25 [MichaelC]

jf: re meta name = generator

15:14:29 [JF]

http://www.w3.org/html/wg/wiki/ChangeProposal/meta_name=generator_does_not_make_missing_alt_conforming

15:14:38 [MichaelC]

leif has done a lot of work

15:14:44 [MichaelC]

creating a change proposal in wiki

15:14:50 [MichaelC]

still work to do

15:14:58 [Stevef]

rich will try to join later

15:15:13 [MichaelC]

jb: expect work in near future?

15:15:28 [MichaelC]

jf: yes, but more to do in wiki

15:15:33 [MichaelC]

jb: role=presentation

15:15:41 [MichaelC]

being dealt with by bugs

15:15:50 [MikeSmith]

RRSAgent, make minutes

15:15:50 [RRSAgent]

I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/05/12-html-a11y-minutes.html MikeSmith

15:16:11 [MichaelC]

cs: talked with Rich, think ok to allow null alt as equivalent to role=presentation

15:16:28 [MichaelC]

concern about case in which there is non-null alt plus role=presentation

15:16:52 [MichaelC]

author doesn't know what they're doing in this case

15:16:54 [MichaelC]

talked with david singer

15:17:06 [JF]

+q

15:17:24 [MichaelC]

since this doesn't truly break anything, think it's a validation warning / accessibility evaluation issue

15:17:32 [MichaelC]

not a validator error

15:17:51 [MichaelC]

jb: need to check support for this?

15:18:40 [MichaelC]

jb: over to Steve for title

15:18:56 [Zakim]

+Eric

15:19:00 [MichaelC]

Leif making a case

15:19:13 [MichaelC]

sf: he has made a change proposal, discussion going on

15:19:18 [MichaelC]

jb: ready for discussion within tf?

15:19:20 [MichaelC]

sf: yes

15:19:24 [MichaelC]

jb: figcaption

15:19:25 [eric_carlson]

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15:19:33 [MichaelC]

would like to take off urgent track

15:20:06 [MichaelC]

recognize not everyone wants to do that, but many do

15:20:13 [MichaelC]

cs: taking off urgent track is good

15:20:16 [MichaelC]

jb: longdesc

15:20:32 [MichaelC]

were looking for a stablized proposal from Laura

15:20:41 [MichaelC]

kept getting additional suggestions

15:20:51 [MichaelC]

want to do consensus check on proposal as it stands at the moment

15:20:55 [MichaelC]

jb: poster alt

15:21:18 [MichaelC]

jf: being discussed in media subteam

15:21:24 [MichaelC]

alternative text for paused video

15:21:28 [MichaelC]

same problem from different angle

15:21:50 [MichaelC]

active discussion, strong divide in opinion

15:22:16 [MichaelC]

there is [candidate?] formal objection to chair decision on poster alt

15:22:24 [MichaelC]

not pursuing further at moment

15:22:54 [MichaelC]

jb: table summary

15:23:03 [MichaelC]

gregory working on, but out this week

15:23:07 [MichaelC]

probably taking off urgent path

15:23:12 [MichaelC]

jb: location of alt guidance

15:23:22 [MichaelC]

clear disagreement with HTML WG decision

15:23:29 [MichaelC]

probably will address on non-urgent basis

15:23:46 [MichaelC]

jb: for today: 1) alt validation title 2) longdesc

15:23:48 [paulc]

q+

15:24:07 [MichaelC]

but first, bug support issue

15:24:32 [MichaelC]

cs: role=presentation we meant not to impact alt requirements

15:24:39 [MichaelC]

but after discussion we view as not a big deal

15:25:12 [MichaelC]

do we need to push more?

15:25:29 [MichaelC]

ack j

15:25:46 [MichaelC]

jf: if <img src=foo alt=important role=presentation> which wins?

15:25:51 [MichaelC]

cs: role=presentation wins

15:25:54 [MichaelC]

but it's author error

15:26:07 [MichaelC]

from a validation perspective it's allowed

15:26:16 [MichaelC]

might be a warning

15:26:27 [MichaelC]

note validator doesn't know if alt is important

15:26:49 [MichaelC]

changing requirements won't affect prevalence of this kind of error

15:27:16 [MichaelC]

topic under discussion was expanding things could be given name, not restricting alt

15:27:47 [MichaelC]

js: leif noted this could be used to hide ascii art

15:28:16 [MichaelC]

cs: not sure ascii art in alt would work...

15:28:27 [MichaelC]

can see cases where having both alt and role makes sense

15:28:38 [MichaelC]

can't flag every case, if it makes sense sometimes

15:28:50 [MichaelC]

so would have to look for non-null string, which makes validation quite complex

15:28:56 [MichaelC]

therefore moves into warning territory

15:29:01 [MichaelC]

jf: agree sounds like warning

15:29:08 [MichaelC]

but important to capture the point

15:29:21 [MichaelC]

js: proposal to file bug

15:29:30 [MichaelC]

cs: having warning gives a hook

15:30:20 [MichaelC]

jb: sounds like this is execution of action for CS and RS to discuss

15:30:29 [MichaelC]

still needs to come back into text sub-team

15:30:36 [MichaelC]

not consensus there yet, needs further discussion

15:31:16 [MichaelC]

cs: worried about differing from WAI CG consensus document, because of perception of flip-flopping

15:31:25 [MichaelC]

jb: need further conversation on that

15:31:36 [MichaelC]

group yesterday considered new info

15:32:07 [MichaelC]

Monday seemed pretty strong consensus on a proposal except for Leif

15:32:20 [MichaelC]

jb: moving on to title

15:32:26 [MichaelC]

cs: ok with either there

15:32:29 [Zakim]

-Cynthia_Shelly

15:32:46 [judy]

zakim, who's here?

15:32:46 [Zakim]

On the phone I see Michael_Cooper, Janina_Sajka, JF, Steve_Faulkner, Judy, MikeSmith (muted), [Microsoft], Marco_Ranon (muted), Eric

15:32:48 [Zakim]

[Microsoft] has paulc

15:32:50 [Zakim]

On IRC I see eric_carlson, mranon, judy, LeifHSilli, Stevef, JF, paulc, Zakim, RRSAgent, janina, MichaelC, MikeSmith, davidb, [tm], trackbot

15:32:53 [Zakim]

+[IBM]

15:33:18 [MichaelC]

zakim, IBM has Rich_Schwerdtfeger

15:33:18 [Zakim]

+Rich_Schwerdtfeger; got it

15:33:21 [richardschwerdtfe]

richardschwerdtfe has joined #html-a11y

15:33:23 [LeifHSilli]

Just want to note the question I consider most important: Does e.g. @aria-labelledby=foo win over empty @alt=""? If empty @alt equals role=presentation, then empty @alt should win. However, ARIA says that aria-labelledby wins. See http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-a11y/2011May/0290

15:33:45 [MichaelC]

sf: Leif and I disagreed on what was meant by device independence

15:34:12 [MichaelC]

<something about input devices>

15:34:22 [MichaelC]

asked vendors, got inconclusive responses

15:34:46 [MichaelC]

looked at Webkit, when @title and not(@alt) it falls back to title

15:35:07 [MichaelC]

but title shouldn't be a repair mechanism, it should be a visible caption

15:35:17 [MichaelC]

or at least available to all, not to some people some times

15:35:18 [JF]

+1 to Steve

15:35:38 [MichaelC]

no requirement in HTML 5 that content be available in input device independent manner

15:35:42 [MichaelC]

filed a bug a year ago

15:35:47 [MichaelC]

was rejected

15:36:12 [MichaelC]

<re needing mouse to display title>

15:36:25 [MichaelC]

jb: questions?

15:36:50 [MichaelC]

objections to supporting proposal?

15:36:54 [janina]

+1

15:36:55 [mranon]

+1

15:37:18 [judy]

please indicate in IRC who is supporting Steve's title proposal

15:37:23 [janina]

+1

15:37:24 [mranon]

+1

15:37:30 [judy]

+1

15:37:31 [JF]

+1 to steves proposal

15:38:41 [MichaelC]

rs: what are problems viewed with Leif's proposal?

15:39:01 [MichaelC]

sf: about accessible name property in AAPIs

15:39:21 [paulc]

Where is Steve's proposal? Link please.

15:39:33 [janina]

Referenced in the agenda for today ...

15:39:36 [MichaelC]

main diff from my proposal is that title used as fallback to alt

15:39:47 [MichaelC]

rs: that's just webkit, right?

15:40:22 [MichaelC]

q+

15:40:58 [paulc]

Title http://www.w3.org/html/wg/wiki/ChangeProposals/notitle

15:40:58 [MichaelC]

sf: don't want to promote that approach

15:41:45 [MichaelC]

q+ to say ARIA pretty explicitly allows title as last resort http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/aria/roles#namecalculation

15:42:20 [MichaelC]

rs: clarification?

15:42:32 [MichaelC]

sf: my proposal says title and alt should not be displayed in same way

15:42:45 [MichaelC]

rs: title used specifically for tooltip on mouseover

15:42:48 [MichaelC]

advisory text

15:42:53 [JF]

+q to this topic

15:43:04 [MichaelC]

ack me

15:43:04 [Zakim]

MichaelC, you wanted to say ARIA pretty explicitly allows title as last resort http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/aria/roles#namecalculation

15:43:09 [paulc]

q-

15:43:54 [MichaelC]

mc: ARIA allows title as last resort

15:44:04 [MichaelC]

sf: yes for accessible name

15:44:13 [MichaelC]

but shouldn't impact graphical rendering

15:44:32 [richardschwerdtfe]

q?

15:45:06 [MichaelC]

jf: there's an issue of conventional behaviors vs specified behaviors

15:45:19 [MichaelC]

lots of screen readers by default ignore title

15:45:29 [MichaelC]

because of redundancy with alt in legacy conetnt

15:45:34 [MichaelC]

s/conetnt/content/

15:45:57 [MichaelC]

because back in the day @alt wasn't rendered to tooltip so authors put in both places

15:46:34 [MichaelC]

jb: any change in support for Steve's proposal after this discussion?

15:46:56 [MichaelC]

rs: support

15:47:14 [MichaelC]

my understanding is Leif's is to have @title rendered when images turned off

15:47:17 [MichaelC]

that's not something I support

15:47:25 [MichaelC]

important to separate functionality of alt and tilte

15:47:31 [MichaelC]

s/tilte/title/

15:47:41 [MichaelC]

jb: proposing change?

15:47:53 [JF]

akc JF

15:48:09 [MichaelC]

rs: supporting Steve's

15:48:10 [JF]

ack JF

15:48:10 [Zakim]

JF, you wanted to this topic

15:48:33 [richardschwerdtfe]

I support Steve Faulkner's proposal

15:48:39 [richardschwerdtfe]

on title

15:48:59 [JF]

zakim, who's here?

15:48:59 [Zakim]

On the phone I see Michael_Cooper, Janina_Sajka, JF, Steve_Faulkner, Judy, MikeSmith (muted), [Microsoft], Marco_Ranon (muted), Eric, [IBM]

15:48:59 [MichaelC]

pc: note Leif not here

15:49:01 [Zakim]

[Microsoft] has paulc

15:49:03 [Zakim]

[IBM] has Rich_Schwerdtfeger

15:49:05 [Zakim]

On IRC I see richardschwerdtfe, eric_carlson, mranon, judy, LeifHSilli, Stevef, JF, paulc, Zakim, RRSAgent, janina, MichaelC, MikeSmith, davidb, [tm], trackbot

15:49:09 [MichaelC]

js: was on Monday, other discussions

15:49:16 [MikeSmith]

RRSAgent, make minutes

15:49:16 [RRSAgent]

I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/05/12-html-a11y-minutes.html MikeSmith

15:49:29 [MichaelC]

pc: proposal has a number of "new information"

15:49:39 [MichaelC]

is there a companion rationale to reopen decision?

15:49:41 [judy]

Leif, do you at this point object to Steve's proposal on title?

15:49:44 [MichaelC]

jb: embedded, think Sam's reviewed

15:49:51 [MichaelC]

sf: rationale is that there is new info

15:51:12 [MichaelC]

jb: pinging Leif, no response yet, but did discuss Monday that we'd look for consensus but not necessarily unanimity

15:51:27 [MichaelC]

at moment think we have that

15:51:43 [MichaelC]

suggest we declare TF consensus

15:52:02 [MichaelC]

js: think we have that now

15:52:14 [MichaelC]

were specific that the question would be called in this call

15:53:04 [paulc]

Title http://www.w3.org/html/wg/wiki/ChangeProposals/notitle

15:54:58 [MichaelC]

RESOLUTION: Task Force supports Steve's reopened request and change proposal at http://www.w3.org/html/wg/wiki/ChangeProposals/notitle and recommends that it be forwarded to the HTML WG

15:55:16 [MichaelC]

jb: moving back to longdesc

15:55:18 [MichaelC]

ack p

15:55:30 [MichaelC]

pc: trying to understand goal at the moment

15:55:38 [MichaelC]

current proposal being constantly updated

15:55:39 [paulc]

http://www.w3.org/html/wg/wiki/ChangeProposals/InstateLongdesc updated on may 12

15:55:44 [judy]

===== longdesc =====

15:55:47 [judy]

http://www.w3.org/html/wg/wiki/ChangeProposals/InstateLongdesc

15:56:03 [MichaelC]

change proposals not necessarily expected to be static

15:56:10 [MichaelC]

it's before the WG now

15:56:19 [paulc]

http://dev.w3.org/html5/status/issue-status.html#ISSUE-030

15:56:29 [MichaelC]

chairs track these things at above link

15:56:50 [MichaelC]

jb: we've requested Laura to stabilize this

15:57:07 [MichaelC]

she asked for consensus, got additional suggestions, so has continued to change

15:57:23 [MichaelC]

so put on agenda here to measure support from task force

15:58:09 [MichaelC]

who supports Laura's proposal as is right now?

15:58:26 [JF]

+q

15:58:39 [richardschwerdtfe]

q+

15:58:43 [MichaelC]

no responses, is the issue that it's still changing?

15:58:45 [MichaelC]

ack jf

15:59:00 [MichaelC]

jf: conditionally I support, but need to finish fine-tuning

15:59:08 [MichaelC]

want to see final version

15:59:11 [MichaelC]

ack r

15:59:26 [MichaelC]

same

15:59:48 [JF]

+1 to Rich's comments

15:59:51 [MichaelC]

think we're arriving at something that adds value to all users

16:00:32 [MichaelC]

jb: sounds like we can't call question on TF support until it stabilizes

16:00:47 [MichaelC]

to PC, what is process expectation?

16:01:11 [MichaelC]

pc: Sam & I will be at AC meeting next week, but both on travel so jetlag...

16:01:26 [MichaelC]

hope to respond within 3-4 days to reopen requests, but difficult next week

16:01:42 [MichaelC]

will enter our queue

16:01:57 [MichaelC]

jb: that's just regarding making decision whether or not to reopen?

16:01:59 [MichaelC]

pc: yes

16:02:07 [MichaelC]

though we have already started discussing this

16:02:31 [MichaelC]

and have meeting next Tuesday morning CEST

16:02:50 [JF]

bye all

16:03:11 [Zakim]

-[Microsoft]

16:03:29 [MikeSmith]

yep

16:03:30 [MikeSmith]

wi

16:03:36 [MikeSmith]

will be

16:03:57 [MichaelC]

topic: Next week

16:04:03 [MichaelC]

Mike to chair, Steve to scrivbe

16:04:03 [Zakim]

-[IBM]

16:04:09 [Zakim]

-Eric

16:04:09 [Zakim]

-Judy

16:04:09 [MichaelC]

s/scrivbe/scribe/

16:04:10 [Zakim]

-Steve_Faulkner

16:04:12 [Zakim]

-Janina_Sajka

16:04:15 [Zakim]

-Michael_Cooper

16:04:23 [Zakim]

-MikeSmith

16:04:29 [Zakim]

-JF

16:05:06 [MichaelC]

zakim, drop marco

16:05:09 [Zakim]

Marco_Ranon is being disconnected

16:05:12 [Zakim]

WAI_PFWG(HTML TF)11:00AM has ended

16:05:12 [Stevef]

Stevef has left #html-a11y

16:05:18 [Zakim]

Attendees were Michael_Cooper, JF, Janina_Sajka, Steve_Faulkner, Judy, MikeSmith, paulc, Marco_Ranon, Cynthia_Shelly, Eric, Rich_Schwerdtfeger

16:05:24 [MichaelC]

scribeOptions: -final

16:05:25 [MichaelC]

trackbot, end meeting

16:05:25 [trackbot]

Zakim, list attendees

16:05:26 [trackbot]

RRSAgent, please draft minutes

16:05:26 [RRSAgent]

I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/05/12-html-a11y-minutes.html trackbot

16:05:27 [trackbot]

RRSAgent, bye

16:05:27 [RRSAgent]

I see no action items