00:07:19 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #dap
00:07:19 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2011/03/15-dap-irc
00:07:21 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs world
00:07:21 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #dap
00:07:23 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be DAP
00:07:23 <Zakim> ok, trackbot, I see UW_DAP(DAPWGF2F)7:00PM already started
00:07:24 <trackbot> Meeting: Device APIs and Policy Working Group Teleconference
00:07:24 <trackbot> Date: 14 March 2011
00:07:44 <fjh> Agenda: http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/wiki/F2F_Agenda_15,_16,_18_March_2011,_Seoul
00:09:33 <Zakim> - +1.408.216.aaaa
00:09:34 <Zakim> UW_DAP(DAPWGF2F)7:00PM has ended
00:09:34 <Zakim> Attendees were +1.408.216.aaaa
00:09:49 <fjh> Chair: Robin_Berjon, Frederick_Hirsch
00:10:03 <Zakim> UW_DAP(DAPWGF2F)7:00PM has now started
00:10:10 <Zakim> + +1.408.216.aaaa
00:10:19 <dom> RRSAgent, this meeting will span midnight
00:10:19 <RRSAgent> I'm logging. I don't understand 'this meeting will span midnight', dom.  Try /msg RRSAgent help
00:10:25 <Suresh> zakim, aaaa is Suresh
00:10:25 <Zakim> +Suresh; got it
00:11:26 <dom> RRSAgent, this meeting spans midnight
00:13:33 <dom> Zakim, code?
00:13:33 <Zakim> the conference code is 3279 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 tel:+33.4.26.46.79.03 tel:+44.203.318.0479), dom
00:13:45 <Kangchan> Kangchan has joined #dap
00:13:51 <Zakim> +??P1
00:14:41 <Suresh> I don't hear you!
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00:20:24 <marengo> Scribe: Marco Marengo
00:20:28 <marengo> scribenick: marengo 
00:21:00 <Kangchan> Kangchan has joined #dap
00:21:17 <Kangchan> Present+ Kangchan_Lee
00:21:33 <Zakim> +??P2
00:21:37 <Zakim> -??P2
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00:22:24 <Zakim> +??P2
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00:23:10 <fjh> zakim, who is here?
00:23:10 <Zakim> On the phone I see Suresh, ??P1, ??P2
00:23:11 <Zakim> On IRC I see fjh, Kangchan, Chen_Bo, shan, Zakim, RRSAgent, marengo, Suresh, homata, richt, wmaslowski, ilkka, lgombos, ingmar, dom, trackbot
00:23:37 <dom> Present+ Dominique_Hazael-Massieux
00:23:57 <Kangchan> Kangchan has joined #dap
00:24:17 <fjh> fjh has joined #dap
00:24:25 <fjh> zakim, who is here?
00:24:25 <Zakim> On the phone I see Suresh, ??P1, ??P2
00:24:26 <Zakim> On IRC I see fjh, Kangchan, Chen_Bo, shan, Zakim, RRSAgent, marengo, Suresh, homata, richt, wmaslowski, ilkka, lgombos, ingmar, dom, trackbot
00:24:39 <fjh> rrsagent, generate minutes
00:24:39 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/03/15-dap-minutes.html fjh
00:24:49 <dhk> dhk has joined #DAP
00:25:01 <marengo> fjh: we'll start with introductions
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00:28:13 <Chen_Bo> Present+ Bo Chen
00:28:28 <dom> Zakim, who's on the phone?
00:28:28 <Zakim> On the phone I see Suresh, ??P1, ??P2
00:28:35 <dom> Zakim, ??P2 is DAP_WG
00:28:35 <Zakim> +DAP_WG; got it
00:28:54 <Liao> Present+Jun Liao
00:29:03 <shan> Present+ Soonbo Han
00:29:17 <wuj> Present+ Jing Wu
00:29:19 <soonho> soonho has joined #dap
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00:29:42 <Liang> Liang has joined #dap
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00:29:51 <soonho> Present+ Soonho_Lee
00:29:51 <BJKim> BJKim has joined #dap
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00:30:02 <donghyun_kang> Present+ DongHyun Kang
00:30:28 <ktaklee> ktaklee has joined #dap
00:30:46 <ktaklee> Present+ Kyung-Tak_Lee
00:30:52 <sungok> sungok has joined #dap
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00:32:02 <marengo> Topic: Introductions, Minutes Approval, Agenda Review, Logistics
00:32:19 <Suresh> Note: the line is poor (echo, noise) , and i'll try to use chat as much as possible
00:32:43 <Kangchan> Kangchan has joined #dap
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00:33:44 <Gyubong> Present+ Gyubong_Oh
00:34:01 <fjh> fjh has joined #dap
00:35:05 <fjh> fjh has joined #dap
00:35:05 <marengo> fjh: reviews the agenda for this meeting
00:36:00 <Kangchan> Kangchan has joined #dap
00:36:42 <Zakim> + +1.781.534.aabb
00:37:01 <lgombos> Present+ Laszlo_Gombos
00:37:03 <Kangchan> Kangchan has joined #dap
00:37:26 <lgombos> dom: lgombos joined
00:37:50 <marengo> RESOLUTION: minutes from last meeting (March 9) are approved
00:37:54 <Liang> Present+ Yan_Liang
00:37:57 <marengo> Topic: DAP Charter review
00:38:10 <fjh> fjh has joined #dap
00:38:44 <dom> RESOLUTION: Happy birthday Robin
00:39:08 <dom> http://www.w3.org/2011/Talks/dhm-dap-recharter/
00:39:17 <fjh> fjh has joined #dap
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00:39:24 <fjh> rrsagent, generate mintues
00:39:24 <RRSAgent> I'm logging. I don't understand 'generate mintues', fjh.  Try /msg RRSAgent help
00:39:29 <fjh> rrsagent, generate minutes
00:39:29 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/03/15-dap-minutes.html fjh
00:39:55 <lgombos> fjh:line is quite bad, would be good to get the mic closer
00:40:34 <marengo> dom: presents a set of slides about the rechartering process
00:40:49 <marengo> .. draft sent to the ML on Feb 2
00:41:10 <Kangchan> Kangchan has joined #dap
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00:42:04 <fjh> Present+ Suresh_Chitturi
00:42:10 <fjh> zakim, who is here?
00:42:10 <Zakim> On the phone I see Suresh, ??P1, DAP_WG, +1.781.534.aabb
00:42:11 <Zakim> On IRC I see soonho, fjh, Kangchan, BJ, Gyubong, sungok, darobin, Liang, Liao, donghyun_kang, wuj, Chen_Bo, shan, Zakim, RRSAgent, marengo, Suresh, homata, richt, wmaslowski,
00:42:13 <soonho> Present+ Soonho_Lee
00:42:14 <Zakim> ... ilkka, lgombos, ingmar, dom, trackbot
00:42:23 <marengo> .. the final draft must be ready for early May
00:42:44 <Liao> Present+ Jun_Liao
00:43:04 <marengo> .. will highlight the main changes
00:43:19 <marengo> .. 1) removal of policy framework
00:43:19 <fjh> fjh has joined #dap
00:43:27 <fjh> current charter -> http://www.w3.org/2009/05/DeviceAPICharter
00:43:33 <marengo> .. 2) tightening of the scope of the APIs
00:43:43 <marengo> .. 3) clarification on security model
00:44:13 <ktaklee> ktaklee has joined #dap
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00:44:52 <dom> http://www.w3.org/2007/10/htmldiff?doc1=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2F2009%2F05%2FDeviceAPICharter&doc2=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2F2010%2F11%2FDeviceAPICharter.html
00:45:19 <fjh> fjh has joined #dap
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00:46:48 <marengo> .. policy framework: there's been a lot of misunderstanding about this topic, there's been rough consensus on removing it (concerns about it have been expressed by DT, AT&T)
00:47:09 <fjh> zakim, who is here?
00:47:09 <Zakim> On the phone I see Suresh, ??P1, DAP_WG, +1.781.534.aabb
00:47:10 <Zakim> On IRC I see fjh, ktaklee, soonho, Gyubong, sungok, darobin, Liang, Liao, donghyun_kang, wuj, Chen_Bo, shan, Zakim, RRSAgent, marengo, Suresh, homata, richt, wmaslowski, ilkka,
00:47:12 <Zakim> ... lgombos, ingmar, dom, trackbot
00:47:17 <wonsuk> wonsuk has joined #dap
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00:49:26 <fjh_> fjh_ has joined #dap
00:49:33 <fjh_> zakim, who is here?
00:49:33 <Zakim> On the phone I see Suresh, ??P1, DAP_WG, +1.781.534.aabb
00:49:34 <Zakim> On IRC I see fjh_, Kangchan, BJ, fjh, Gyubong, darobin, Liang, Liao, donghyun_kang, wuj, Chen_Bo, shan, Zakim, RRSAgent, marengo, Suresh, homata, richt, wmaslowski, ilkka, lgombos,
00:49:36 <Zakim> ... ingmar, dom, trackbot
00:50:11 <marengo> fjh: we still need to address security and privacy
00:50:31 <fjh> rrsagent, generate minutes
00:50:31 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/03/15-dap-minutes.html fjh
00:51:09 <fjh> s/fjh:line is quite bad, would be good to get the mic closer//
00:51:11 <marengo> dom: there's a draft of permission identifiers for APIs (eg. accessing geolocation, address book) as well-known strings
00:51:29 <Suresh> The question is can we separate the policy framework from the APIs? - to me/us the APIs can be usable both within browser and widgets and policy framework is a separate layer that can be implemented along side the APIs
00:52:00 <marengo> .. do we intend to continue working on it? if so it should be stated in the charter
00:52:00 <soonho> soonho has joined #dap
00:52:06 <Suresh> i would not tie the policy framework exclusively to widgets
00:52:08 <shan> Present- Han
00:52:27 <marengo> .. my personal inclination would be to include this in the charter
00:52:38 <lgombos> dom: +1 to include it in the charter
00:53:12 <marengo> .. that would probably address the privacy and security issues
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00:53:54 <marengo> dom: security model. a few companies complained that it was too closely linked to "browser-model"
00:56:08 <Suresh> q+
00:56:26 <fjh> fjh has joined #dap
00:56:49 <fjh> zakim, who is here?
00:56:49 <Zakim> On the phone I see Suresh, ??P1, DAP_WG, +1.781.534.aabb
00:56:50 <Zakim> On IRC I see fjh, BJ_Kim, soonho, darobin, Liang, Liao, donghyun_kang, wuj, Chen_Bo, shan, Zakim, RRSAgent, marengo, Suresh, homata, richt, wmaslowski, ilkka, lgombos, ingmar, dom,
00:56:52 <minkyo> minkyo has joined #dap
00:56:52 <Zakim> ... trackbot
00:56:55 <fjh> rrsagent, generate minutes
00:56:55 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/03/15-dap-minutes.html fjh
00:57:07 <Kangchan> Kangchan has joined #dap
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00:57:48 <fjh> proposed charter   http://www.w3.org/2010/11/DeviceAPICharter.html
00:57:58 <fjh> rrsagent, generate minutes
00:57:58 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/03/15-dap-minutes.html fjh
00:58:42 <darobin> q?
01:00:33 <marengo> bryan: are we coming out with specific criteria about what facilitates open web environment security?
01:02:31 <fjh> fjh has joined #dap
01:03:28 <marengo> .. our criteria for what's in or out is a bit too foggy (untechnical)
01:03:43 <Kangchan> Kangchan has joined #dap
01:04:35 <marengo> dom: it's not a matter of taste, it's a matter of consensus.
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01:05:05 <Gyubong> Present+ Gyubong_Oh
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01:06:29 <marengo> darobin: it's not easy to define a set of criteria, fuzzyness does not help building consensus. 
01:06:55 <marengo> .. there's room for a note about the security model
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01:08:45 <BJ_Kim> Present+ BJ_Kim
01:08:48 <marengo> fjh: we should discuss it during the F2F (tomorrow or on friday)
01:09:07 <Kangchan> Kangchan has joined #dap
01:10:21 <marengo> dom: concern about messaging apis is about usefulness (to grant access to your mailbox to an external website)
01:10:28 <wonsuk> wonsuk has joined #dap
01:10:29 <fjh> fjh has joined #dap
01:10:37 <fjh> q?
01:10:38 <fjh> q?
01:10:46 <fjh> ack suresh
01:10:57 <Gyubong> Gyubong has joined #dap
01:10:59 <fjh> rrsagent, generate mintes
01:10:59 <RRSAgent> I'm logging. I don't understand 'generate mintes', fjh.  Try /msg RRSAgent help
01:11:03 <fjh> rrsagent, generate minutes
01:11:03 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/03/15-dap-minutes.html fjh
01:11:14 <Suresh> It is no different from accessing your contacts or calendar?
01:11:18 <Gyubong> Present+ Gyubong_Oh
01:11:36 <wonsuk> Present+ Wonsuk_Lee
01:11:58 <Kangchan> Kangchan has joined #dap
01:12:03 <soonho> Present+ Soonho_Lee
01:12:19 <soonho> Present+ Soonho_Lee
01:13:11 <fjh> fjh has joined #dap
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01:15:08 <Suresh> i was comments on the succes criteria
01:15:28 <ktaklee> Present+ Kyung-Tak_Lee
01:15:36 <fjh> fjh has joined #dap
01:15:46 <fjh> q?
01:15:47 <Suresh> we expect the APIs to be implemented on the browser and widgets
01:17:22 <fjh> s/suresh, you need to type. we get 1/2 sentence then silence etc//
01:17:36 <marengo> darobin: example of good design. contacts.find() in the open web prompts the user. in widgets it should return the results immediately
01:17:55 <Suresh> The current wording seems to say that only browser implementation would be used to judge the usefulness of the API
01:18:04 <dom> "APIs that cannot be demonstrated to be implementable securely within the default browser context will not be released."
01:18:43 <wonsuk> wonsuk has joined #dap
01:19:41 <Suresh> @robin: if we expect a prompt in the browser we should expect the same or simialr behavior in widgets as well?
01:20:54 <marengo> dom: privacy. it has been fixed in the new charter. proposal for best practises (how to use the apis in a privacy-sensitive way)
01:23:27 <darobin> q?
01:24:41 <dom> -> http://www.w3.org/2011/track-privacy/ Privacy workshop, April 28-29
01:25:09 <fjh> fjh has joined #dap
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01:26:36 <marengo> darobin: we could bring the new charter as input to the privacy workshop (end of april) and get feedback on it
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01:28:18 <Gyubong> Present+ Gyubong_Oh
01:29:07 <BJ> BJ has joined #dap
01:30:29 <RRSAgent> I'm logging.  Sorry, nothing found for 'ping'
01:30:49 <Gyubong> Gyubong has joined #dap
01:31:02 <darobin> ACTION: Dom to figure out what are the secrets and evil plans from Thomas on privacy follow-up
01:31:02 <trackbot> Created ACTION-349 - Figure out what are the secrets and evil plans from Thomas on privacy follow-up [on Dominique Hazaël-Massieux - due 2011-03-22].
01:31:03 <marengo> fjh: we should add a privacy best practices deliverable to the charter
01:31:04 <Gyubong> Present+ Gyubong_Oh
01:31:14 <fjh> fjh has joined #dap
01:33:52 <fjh> fjh has joined #dap
01:38:41 <fjh> fjh has joined #dap
01:39:40 <marengo> dom: existing APIs. a couple of APIs could be removed from the new charter: communication log & gallery
01:40:45 <fjh> fjh has joined #dap
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01:41:07 <fjh> agreed next steps for draft charter - add explicit deliverables for privacy best practices NOTE deliverable,  add security permissions  REC deliverable, add privacy REC deliverable with note that this might be taken over by another group, add privacy use cases and requirements NOTE deliverable
01:41:07 <fjh> \
01:41:08 <fjh> xx
01:41:18 <fjh_> fjh_ has joined #dap
01:41:31 <fjh> s/xx//
01:41:34 <fjh> rrsagent, generate minutes
01:41:34 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/03/15-dap-minutes.html fjh
01:42:26 <fjh> not clear whether a working group will come out of do not track workshop, and whether it is scoped broadly enough to address privacy relevant to DAP
01:42:52 <minkyo> minkyo has joined #dap
01:42:54 <fjh> Timing of this may be off for DAP rechartering, given that DAP rechartering draft needs to be finished in April and has to happen in May
01:44:54 <marengo> PROPOSED RESOLUTION: remove communication log from the new charter
01:45:14 <ktaklee_> ktaklee_ has joined #dap
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01:46:11 <fjh> member:zakim, who is here?
01:46:15 <fjh> zakim, who is here?
01:46:15 <Zakim> On the phone I see Suresh, ??P1, DAP_WG, +1.781.534.aabb
01:46:17 <Zakim> On IRC I see fjh, BJ, bryan_sullivan, sungok, wonsuk, ktaklee, Suresh, Kangchan, donghyun_kang, darobin, Liao, wuj, Chen_Bo, shan, Zakim, RRSAgent, marengo, homata, richt,
01:46:19 <Zakim> ... wmaslowski, ilkka, lgombos, ingmar, dom, trackbot
01:46:53 <bryan_sullivan> q+
01:47:00 <darobin> ack bryan_sullivan 
01:47:03 <fjh> fjh has joined #dap
01:47:17 <Zakim> - +1.781.534.aabb
01:47:26 <marengo> bryan_sullivan: wrt menus. does html5 provide a way to to this?
01:47:34 <Zakim> + +1.781.534.aacc
01:47:35 <marengo> darobin: there's hook that works for context menus
01:48:20 <lgombos> fjh: line went mute about 2 min ago - would it be possible to redial ? 
01:48:46 <fjh> s/fjh: line went mute about 2 min ago - would it be possible to redial ?//
01:49:07 <marengo> -> http://paulrouget.com/e/nativecontrols
01:50:00 <fjh> fjh has joined #dap
01:50:01 <dom> http://paulrouget.com/e/nativecontrols
01:50:11 <marengo> darobin: 1: exposing context menus 2: site specific menus
01:50:19 <Zakim> -Suresh
01:50:40 <marengo> .. 2 is styled in a way which makes clear it's not provided by the UA
01:51:15 <Zakim> +Suresh
01:51:59 <dom> split API for menus, vibrations, menus
01:52:12 <dom> clarify re menus that it is about "promoting HTML5 menu to the chrome"
01:53:14 <marengo> dom: there's some overlap with Web Notifications WG, but this is more specific
01:53:51 <marengo> *** 20m break ***
01:54:02 <bj> bj has joined #dap
01:54:03 <Zakim> -Suresh
01:54:10 <marengo> meeting will resume at 11.15
01:54:37 <fjh> fjh has joined #dap
01:56:24 <Gyubong> Gyubong has joined #dap
01:57:55 <dom> [we're breaking for 20 minutes]
01:59:53 <fjh> fjh has joined #dap
02:01:28 <fjh> rrsagent, generate mintues
02:01:28 <RRSAgent> I'm logging. I don't understand 'generate mintues', fjh.  Try /msg RRSAgent help
02:02:56 <dom> RRSAgent, draft minutes
02:02:56 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/03/15-dap-minutes.html dom
02:16:35 <marengo> marengo has joined #dap
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02:21:19 <fjh2> zakim, who is here?
02:21:19 <Zakim> On the phone I see ??P1, DAP_WG, +1.781.534.aacc
02:21:20 <Zakim> On IRC I see fjh2, bj, marengo, Gyubong, bryan_sullivan, sungok, wonsuk, Suresh, Kangchan, donghyun_kang, darobin, wuj, Chen_Bo, shan, Zakim, RRSAgent, homata, richt, wmaslowski,
02:21:21 <marengo> dom: reshaping of current APIs
02:21:22 <Zakim> ... ilkka, lgombos, ingmar, dom, trackbot
02:21:45 <shan> Present- Soonbo
02:21:51 <shan> Present+ Soonbo_Han
02:22:02 <marengo> .. moving app launcher to "intent-based" approach
02:22:18 <marengo> .. (inspired by Android OS Intent mechanism)
02:23:07 <marengo> .. Web Introducer and Web Intent try to reproduce this mechanism in the web environment
02:23:14 <dom> zakim, who's on the phone?
02:23:14 <Zakim> On the phone I see ??P1, DAP_WG, +1.781.534.aacc
02:23:31 <bj> bj has joined #dap
02:24:18 <bryan_sullivan> Comments made in the F2F meeting re rechartering, for the minutes are in email at thread: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2011Mar/0085.html
02:24:36 <minkyo> minkyo has joined #dap
02:25:09 <Zakim> - +1.781.534.aacc
02:25:24 <Zakim> + +1.781.534.aadd
02:25:31 <bryan_sullivan> q+
02:26:02 <darobin> ACTION: Robin to find a better wording for intents-based application launcher
02:26:02 <trackbot> Created ACTION-350 - Find a better wording for intents-based application launcher [on Robin Berjon - due 2011-03-22].
02:26:05 <darobin> q?
02:26:25 <darobin> ack bryan_sullivan 
02:26:52 <marengo> bryan_sullivan: how does this relate to 1) content handler registration and 2) web messaging
02:27:53 <marengo> dom: it will complement content handler registration with additional features. web messaging is more fine grained protocol for inter webapps communication. we're talking about 1-time event communication. they're related but the overlap is not huge
02:27:54 <Zakim> +Suresh
02:28:15 <marengo> http://webintents.appspot.com/
02:28:31 <soonho> soonho has joined #dap
02:28:56 <dom> -> http://webintents.appspot.com/ WebIntents
02:29:07 <Suresh> can you please join the bridge from F2F?
02:29:19 <Suresh> Suresh has joined #dap
02:29:40 <Suresh> We cannot hear you on the bridge...are you on?
02:30:06 <marengo> bryan_sullivan: isn't this more suitable for WebApps instead of DAP
02:30:24 <ktaklee> ktaklee has joined #dap
02:30:29 <dom> Zakim, who's on the phone?
02:30:29 <Zakim> On the phone I see ??P1, DAP_WG, +1.781.534.aadd, Suresh
02:30:43 <dom> -> http://web-send.org/introducer/ Web Introducer
02:31:28 <marengo> darobin: rechartering webApps is not an option, it's easier to keep it in DAP
02:31:49 <Zakim> +??P4
02:31:59 <dom> ack b
02:35:16 <marengo> bryan_sullivan: as a user, I want to be able to open a specific version of an external client (Eg. acrobat reader)
02:35:44 <marengo> darobin: what might be in scope is a way for a widget to register itself as an handler
02:36:17 <dom> -> http://webintents.appspot.com/ WebIntents
02:36:19 <dom> -> http://web-send.org/introducer/ Web Introducer
02:38:54 <marengo> darobin: the browser can support intents even if the os doesn't. for the basic things emulation is possible
02:40:05 <bryan_sullivan> My comment re Applaucher API and the WebIntents work: If this supports the use case of being able to choose a native handler for content types or URI schemes (given that the registration of native handlers is out of scope), e.g. open Acrobat for PDFs instead of the browser-default (which may be an internal PDF viewer), then we would support this as a replacement of the specific Applauncher API.
02:41:29 <marengo> dom: another big piece of work is SysInfo. two approaches: 1) focusing on specific sensors (eg. network, bt, NFC) 
02:41:59 <marengo> darobin: if someone supports BT and/or NFC, it would be useful to exactly state what will/should be implemented
02:42:34 <Kangchan> q+
02:42:47 <marengo> dom: call for use cases?
02:45:32 <Suresh> if we limit the scope to just discovery that might be ok, but beyond that it is not clear how specific we want to be with the scope
02:46:24 <fjh2> we should ask for use cases and requirements and not hearing any not include in draft charter, so that we can move forward (bluetooth, nfc)
02:46:34 <marengo> Kangchan: SysInfo vs device description
02:46:38 <fjh2> concerned about the potential broadness of the nfc topic
02:47:01 <Suresh> use of NFC is just becoming popular and until we have good penetration it might be premature to include it in the charter
02:47:01 <fjh2> rrsagent, generate minutes
02:47:01 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/03/15-dap-minutes.html fjh2
02:47:08 <bj> bj has joined #dap
02:47:31 <fjh2> s/broadness of the nfc topic/broadness of the nfc topic, both from IPR and work perspectives
02:47:36 <marengo> dom: device description is more server-side, sysInfo is client side. The overlap might be on the vocabulary used to describe properties. we're reconsidering using the vocabulary approach
02:50:24 <marengo> bryan_sullivan: device description only provides "static" info about the device model
02:51:06 <marengo> .. SysInfo delivers dynamic info
02:51:10 <marengo> eg. MNC-MCC
02:58:25 <marengo> dom: generic sensor API. do we want it and what should it look like?
02:58:38 <Gyubong> Present+ Gyubong_Oh
03:02:18 <wonsuk> wonsuk has joined #dap
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03:02:40 <marengo> dom: new APIs have been suggested: home media connectivity
03:02:46 <bj> bj has joined #dap
03:03:00 <marengo> http://www.w3.org/2010/11/web-and-tv/
03:04:04 <bryan_sullivan> Comments re SysInfo overlap with DDWG Core Vocabulary and DDR Simple API: the deployment model for device info supported by the DDR Simple API (a network service that provides access to network-stored device information) is valuable and was supported by AT&T. However there are several aspects that require the additional features that were in scope for SysInfo, e.g. (a) Instance-specific info (e.g. mobile phone Operator) vs device-generic info (e.g.
03:04:04 <bryan_sullivan> capabilities based upon evidence e.g. user-agent header); (b) Dynamic info (e.g. free memory) vs static info; (c) Device-local/offline info access vs online info access via a network-based API (DDR Simple API)
03:04:26 <marengo> darobin: DLNA spec is not freely available, and is a very wide spec
03:05:15 <marengo> .. BBC universal control protocol extracts from such protocols
03:05:25 <marengo> .. in terms of discovery: mDNS
03:06:10 <Suresh> It might be better to wait until the scope of the web and tv group settles down
03:06:10 <bj> bj has joined #dap
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03:08:00 <Suresh> I would prefer to stay away from specific items that we are not clear about...we need to deliver what we promise so keeping the scope limited will help us
03:09:44 <Kangchan> q?
03:09:47 <Kangchan> q-
03:09:55 <bj> bj has joined #dap
03:10:32 <marengo> dom: another proposal is "audio volume read"
03:10:47 <fjh2> q?
03:11:24 <fjh2> rrsagent, generate minutes
03:11:24 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/03/15-dap-minutes.html fjh2
03:12:46 <Suresh> can this be part of sys info?
03:13:06 <marengo> bryan_sullivan: could it be accessed via SysInfo
03:13:20 <marengo> darobin: it's a discrete API
03:14:27 <marengo> dom: <device> element
03:18:01 <bj_> bj_ has joined #dap
03:23:19 <marengo> .. success criteria for the group
03:23:51 <Gyubong> Gyubong has joined #dap
03:24:02 <Gyubong> Present+ Gyubong_Oh
03:24:29 <marengo> .. we need to include the widget environment and tv
03:25:54 <Suresh> How about "web runtime enviroment (e.g. Browser, widgets)"?
03:27:46 <darobin> [no, "web runtime environment" means "widgets" to most people]
03:28:36 <Suresh> one option would be to remobe this statment totally
03:28:48 <Suresh> s/remobe/remove
03:32:03 <Suresh> Just to be clear: i am trying to draw a distinction between the desktop and mobile, but drawing a distinction browser and a widget is the problem
03:33:40 <Suresh> We would like to see widgets and browser to use the APIs the same way and desgined in a similar way
03:34:51 <Suresh> the problem we noticed in the past discussion is that "browser model" has been used to as way to limit the API design and this is problematic
03:37:06 <darobin> [I don't think that removing this statement is a good solution, it's a very important goal]
03:37:06 <wonsuk> wonsuk has joined #dap
03:42:21 <marengo> *** lunch break (90m) ***
03:42:37 <Suresh> It seems there is a confusion or mis-understanding that widgets = web environmrnt+policy framework? we don't see it that way and thereofore the proposed rephrasing "APIs that can be demonstrated without the need of a specialized policy framework will be released
03:42:38 <marengo> *** meeting will resume at 14.15 ***
03:43:25 <dom> Reconvening at 14:15 local time
03:43:28 <Suresh> "APIs that can be demonstrated without the need of a specialized policy framework will be released
03:43:39 <Suresh> APIs that can be demonstrated without the need of a specialized policy framework will be released
03:43:44 <Suresh> oops
03:43:45 <Suresh> APIs that can be demonstrated without the need of a specialized policy framework will be released
03:43:57 <Zakim> - +1.781.534.aadd
03:44:36 <fjh2> rrsagent, generate minutes
03:44:36 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/03/15-dap-minutes.html fjh2
03:45:37 <Suresh> replacing the current statement with "APIs that can be demonstrated without the need of a specialized policy framework will be released" is a good alternative to indicate that the APIs will be demonstrated using the web runtime only and not with the assumption of an underlying policy framewrok which appeared to be the main concern from browser vendors
04:11:25 <Zakim> -Suresh
04:30:49 <homata> homata has joined #dap
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04:51:37 <darobin> darobin has joined #dap
04:52:14 <homata_> homata_ has joined #dap
04:52:18 <darobin> Present+ Sung-Ok, You
05:14:01 <Zakim> +Suresh
05:15:26 <BJ> BJ has joined #dap
05:18:30 <fjh> fjh has joined #dap
05:19:08 <Zakim> -Suresh
05:19:47 <Suresh> Suresh has joined #dap
05:21:02 <Zakim> +Suresh
05:24:23 <Suresh> Hi, are we resuming the session?
05:25:36 <Zakim> +??P3
05:29:44 <donghyun_kang> donghyun_kang has joined #DAP
05:30:45 <darobin> Dom shows a presentation about webinos
05:31:28 <darobin> slides will be sent to the list later
05:31:29 <wonsuk> wonsuk has joined #dap
05:34:34 <darobin> fjh: what's citizen-2-government?
05:34:44 <darobin> dom: e.g. reporting issues, like Open311
05:35:26 <fjh> http://open311.org/
05:35:41 <darobin> robin: are there any concrete APIs for discovery? long list
05:35:50 <darobin> dom: we're still in the planning stages, so nothing yet
05:36:16 <fjh> http://webinos.org/about-webinos
05:37:30 <fjh> dom notes first implementations may be on android and windows phone
05:38:33 <fjh> slide compares WAC and webinos
05:40:01 <darobin> dom: webinos will submit its APIs to W3C where applicable
05:40:18 <darobin> robin: wait until they're done or more iterative approach?
05:40:34 <ktaklee> ktaklee has joined #dap
05:40:37 <darobin> dom: would hope for more iterative, but we all know how hard it is to sync across organisations
05:41:20 <fjh> q+ to ask about level of detail of privacy work
05:41:29 <Gyubong> Gyubong has joined #dap
05:41:45 <Gyubong> Present+ Gyubong_Oh
05:42:14 <JonathanJ> JonathanJ has joined #DAP
05:42:43 <darobin> q?
05:43:12 <fjh> dom: webinos will also be open source project
05:44:05 <fjh> dom: priority round device discovery
05:45:17 <darobin> ack fjh 
05:45:17 <Zakim> fjh, you wanted to ask about level of detail of privacy work
05:45:24 <Chen_Bo> Chen_Bo has joined #dap
05:45:34 <darobin> fjh: what's the level of detail of work on privacy?
05:45:52 <darobin> dom: right now the focus has been more on requirements than on solutions
05:46:21 <darobin> dom: there are discussions about whether a BONDI-like policy framework or not
05:47:44 <darobin> dom: I'm hoping that webinos might be able to propose something for device discovery
05:47:50 <fjh> rrsagent, generate minutes
05:47:50 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/03/15-dap-minutes.html fjh
05:47:54 <darobin> dom: unless DAP is faster and it goes the other way
05:49:10 <fjh> dom: BONDI was part of webinos, but WAC is not a member
05:50:39 <fjh> s/Hi, are we resuming the session?/Topic: Webinos Introduction/
05:50:56 <fjh> s/*** lunch break (90m) ***//
05:51:08 <fjh> s/*** meeting will resume at 14.15 ***//
05:51:27 <fjh> s/*** 20m break ***//
05:51:41 <fjh> s/\\//
05:52:37 <fjh> Present+ Robin_Berjon, Frederick_Hirsch
05:53:16 <Suresh> Present+ Suresh_Chitturi
05:53:31 <darobin> q?
05:53:33 <fjh> Present+ Marco_Marengo
05:54:34 <JonathanJ> Present+JonathanJ
05:54:57 <ktaklee> Present+ Kyung-Tak_Lee
05:57:14 <Zakim> -Suresh
05:57:48 <dom> http://www.w3c.or.kr/DAP2011/
05:59:40 <dom> Topic: HTML Media Capture and Media Capture API
05:59:57 <dom> -> http://dev.w3.org/2009/dap/camera/ HTML Media Capture Editors draft
06:00:12 <dom> i/<dom> http/ScribeNick: dom/
06:00:38 <dom> Robin: simple additional parameter on <input type=file>, with additional API to get metadata
06:00:49 <fjh> Present+ JonathanJ
06:00:50 <dom> ... main question is about using media type parameter
06:00:51 <fjh> s/Present+JonathanJ//
06:00:58 <dom> ... not the cleanest approach
06:01:07 <dom> ... Android 3.0 has already shipped with this 
06:01:22 <dom> ACTION-317?
06:01:22 <trackbot> ACTION-317 -- Robin Berjon to ping Andrei about using @role instead of mime parameters -- due 2010-12-22 -- OPEN
06:01:22 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/actions/317
06:02:03 <dom> ISSUE-105?
06:02:03 <trackbot> ISSUE-105 -- Should the capture hint in HTML Media Capture be specified through a MIME parameter? -- open
06:02:03 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/105
06:02:19 <darobin> <input type='file' accept='image/*;capture=camera'/>
06:02:21 <darobin> <input type='file' accept='image/*' role='capture-camera'/>
06:02:39 <fjh> robin notes 2nd might be cleaer
06:02:52 <fjh> s/cleaer/cleaner/
06:03:02 <Liang> Liang has joined #dap
06:03:08 <fjh> robin notes this matches android
06:03:23 <fjh> ScribeNick: fjh
06:03:35 <fjh> Scribenick: dom
06:03:40 <fjh> scribenick: robin
06:03:47 <dom> scribenick: dom
06:03:53 <dom> Robin: pros and cons:
06:04:04 <dom> ... using media type parameter is a bit ugly, since it's not a valid parameter
06:04:31 <dom> ... someone could define capture=camera as a valid parameter for one of the covered media types
06:04:40 <dom> ... also requires to modify HTML5 allowed syntax
06:04:57 <dom> ... a separate attribute would be cleaner
06:05:17 <minkyo> minkyo has joined #dap
06:05:30 <dom> ... also attribute is stylable with CSS; harder to do with media type parameter
06:06:07 <dom> [robin notes that input[accept=~'capture=camera'] might do for CSS, but has its limitaitons
06:06:14 <darobin> CSS matching input[accept=~'capture=camera']
06:07:03 <dom> robin: with role attribute, you can do input[accept|='capture-camera'] would work with specific boundaries
06:07:06 <fjh> rssagent, generate minutes
06:07:14 <soonho> soonho has joined #dap
06:07:20 <dom> ... also, role attribute offers transition path
06:07:45 <soonho> Present+ Soonho_Lee
06:07:56 <fjh> zakim who is here?
06:08:24 <BJ> Present+ BJ_Kim
06:10:15 <JonathanJ> JonathanJ has joined #DAP
06:11:39 <dom> ACTION: Dom to draft HTML Media Capture with role attribute
06:11:39 <trackbot> Created ACTION-351 - Draft HTML Media Capture with role attribute [on Dominique Hazaël-Massieux - due 2011-03-22].
06:11:52 <dom> ACTION-318?
06:11:52 <trackbot> ACTION-318 -- Robin Berjon to ping WAI about using @role for capture -- due 2010-12-22 -- OPEN
06:11:52 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/actions/318
06:13:51 <Liao> Liao has joined #dap
06:13:57 <dom> -> http://dev.w3.org/2009/dap/camera/Overview-API.html Media Capture API
06:14:08 <Liao> Present+ Jun_Liao
06:14:11 <fjh> Topic: Media Capture API
06:17:01 <dom> -> http://public.wholesaleappcommunity.com/redmine/embedded/wac2pubrev/deviceapis/camera.html WAC Camera API
06:19:46 <dom> Robin: unclear if there is much traction for media capture API
06:19:57 <dom> ... sits between <device> and HTML Media Capture
06:20:24 <dom> Dom: the API could probably be built upon <device>, but would need double-checking (e.g. in terms of user experience)
06:20:45 <dom> Robin: I'll ask the mailing list to see what interest there is in continuing work on a snapshot-based approach
06:20:53 <dom> ... vs stream-based as <device> would provide
06:21:49 <fjh> rrsagent, generate minutes
06:21:49 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/03/15-dap-minutes.html fjh
06:22:11 <wonsuk> wonsuk has joined #dap
06:23:09 <dom> -> http://www.whatwg.org/specs/web-apps/current-work/multipage/index.html#auto-toc-9 WhatWG HTML and <device> element
06:24:08 <sungok> present+ sungok you 
06:24:17 <fjh> rrsagent, generate minutesd
06:24:17 <RRSAgent> I'm logging. I don't understand 'generate minutesd', fjh.  Try /msg RRSAgent help
06:24:22 <fjh> rrsagent, generate minutes
06:24:22 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/03/15-dap-minutes.html fjh
06:26:55 <Zakim> -??P3
06:37:20 <Zakim> +??P0
06:38:34 <marengo> marengo has joined #dap
06:40:38 <dom> Zakim, ??P0 is DAPWG
06:40:38 <Zakim> +DAPWG; got it
06:43:48 <fjh> Topic: RTC web
06:44:02 <fjh> \
06:44:08 <fjh> q?
06:44:10 <wonsuk> wonsuk has joined #dap
06:44:11 <darobin> -> http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-jennings-rtcweb-api-00 RTC draft
06:44:25 <dom> -> http://www.whatwg.org/specs/web-apps/current-work/multipage/dnd.html#video-conferencing-and-peer-to-peer-communication <device> element in Latest HTML WhatWG version
06:44:34 <fjh> fjh has joined #dap
06:44:52 <dom> Robin: around real time communications in the browser, two sides: IETF and W3C
06:45:23 <JonathanJ> JonathanJ has joined #DAP
06:45:35 <dom> ... rough agreement is that IETF does protocol, and W3C matching APIs
06:45:56 <dom> ... cross-organization coordination can be painful, but good working relationship between IETF and W3C
06:46:11 <dom> ... it's good that the split been agreed from the beginning
06:47:00 <JonathanJ> rrsagent, draft minutes
06:47:00 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/03/15-dap-minutes.html JonathanJ
06:47:54 <dom> ... IETF-side, goal is to re-use existing protocols as much as possible
06:48:24 <dom> ... IETF requirements has use cases, e.g. for direct p2p Facebook chat
06:48:43 <dom> ... one thing the be aware: the eternal video codec issue
06:48:44 <fjh> Present- Sung-Ok, You
06:48:51 <fjh> Present+ Sung-Ok_You
06:49:01 <dom> ... will hit the same issues as what happened with HTML5 and SVG video
06:49:43 <dom> ... group is hoping to find mandatory codec, although not sure how realistic that is
06:50:14 <dom> dom: requirement for direct interop more important here since doesn't involve servers, only users
06:50:26 <fjh> Present- Jun
06:50:47 <dom> robin: ietf document has also a rough proposal for the API
06:51:08 <fjh> Present- Bo, Chen
06:51:15 <fjh> Present+ Bo_Chen
06:51:19 <dom> ... based on a <session> element under a <video> element
06:51:42 <dom> ... similar to <device>, but more specific
06:51:48 <fjh> Present- Jing
06:52:10 <dom> ... Anybody planning to participate in Web RTC?
06:52:16 <dom> [no answer]
06:52:23 <dom> Frederick: Nokia will probably participate
06:52:35 <fjh> Present+ Jing_Win
06:52:39 <dom> Robin: end of AC review is this Friday
06:53:54 <fjh> Present+ Minkyo_Im
06:54:16 <dom> Kanghcan: goal is to re-use existing protocols as much as possible
06:54:34 <dom> ... might there be problems with protocols optimization?
06:54:50 <fjh> Present+ Manyoung_Cho
06:55:31 <fjh> Present+ Bryan_Sullivan
06:56:53 <fjh> Present+ DongHyun
06:57:14 <Kangchan> s/Kanghcan/Kangchan/
06:57:55 <fjh> Present+ DongHyun_Kang
06:58:05 <fjh> rrsagent, generate minutes
06:58:05 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/03/15-dap-minutes.html fjh
06:58:44 <fjh> Present- Kang
06:58:48 <darobin> ACTION: Robin to find out where <device> went
06:58:48 <trackbot> Created ACTION-352 - Find out where <device> went [on Robin Berjon - due 2011-03-22].
06:59:21 <fjh> Present- Liao, Wu, sungok, you
06:59:26 <dom> -> http://html5.org/tools/web-apps-tracker?from=5944&to=5945 <device> element removed from WhatWG HTML
06:59:38 <fjh> s/[no answer]//
06:59:59 <fjh> speech api
07:00:02 <darobin> -> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-archive/2011Mar/att-0001/microsoft-api-draft-final.html#capture_api_extensions HTML Speech API
07:00:20 <fjh> rrsagent, generate minutes
07:00:20 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/03/15-dap-minutes.html fjh
07:00:24 <dom> "Completely revamp how peer-to-peer networking works (and some minor typo fixes in other parts of the spec). This is only a second draft, and therefore this feature will likely evolve a lot over the coming months. Detailed responses to feedback on the topic will be sent out soon."
07:02:06 <fjh> zakim, who  is here?
07:02:06 <Zakim> On the phone I see ??P1, DAP_WG, ??P4, DAPWG
07:02:07 <Zakim> On IRC I see JonathanJ, fjh, wonsuk, marengo, Liao, soonho, minkyo, Chen_Bo, Gyubong, ktaklee, donghyun_kang, BJ, homata_, darobin, sungok, Kangchan, shan, Zakim, RRSAgent, richt,
07:02:09 <Zakim> ... wmaslowski, ilkka, lgombos, ingmar, dom, trackbot
07:02:29 <dom> Zakim, drop DAP_WG
07:02:29 <Zakim> DAP_WG is being disconnected
07:02:30 <Zakim> -DAP_WG
07:02:50 <dom> Zakim, drop ??P1
07:02:50 <Zakim> ??P1 is being disconnected
07:02:51 <dom> Zakim, drop ??P4
07:02:51 <Zakim> -??P1
07:02:51 <Zakim> ??P4 is being disconnected
07:02:53 <Zakim> -??P4
07:03:01 <Zakim> -DAPWG
07:03:02 <Zakim> UW_DAP(DAPWGF2F)7:00PM has ended
07:03:04 <Zakim> Attendees were +1.408.216.aaaa, Suresh, DAP_WG, +1.781.534.aabb, +1.781.534.aacc, +1.781.534.aadd, DAPWG
07:04:39 <shan> Present- DongHyun
07:07:00 <dom> Topic: Web Introducer
07:07:18 <dom> -> http://web-send.org/introducer/ Web Introducer proposal
07:09:34 <dom> ACTION: Dom to check with Claes re Web introducer contributors and bringing it to DAP
07:09:34 <trackbot> Created ACTION-353 - Check with Claes re Web introducer contributors and bringing it to DAP [on Dominique Hazaël-Massieux - due 2011-03-22].
07:11:57 <fjh> Web Introducer style needs to be changed to not be misleading about status
07:13:09 <dom> -> http://customer.web-send.org/ Web Introducer prototype
07:20:20 <dom> RRSAgent, draft minutes
07:20:20 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/03/15-dap-minutes.html dom
07:21:09 <dom> close ACTION-313
07:21:09 <trackbot> ACTION-313 Send feedback on media gallery use cases closed
07:21:35 <dom> ACTION-314?
07:21:35 <trackbot> ACTION-314 -- Anssi Kostiainen to react on media gallery use cases -- due 2010-12-15 -- OPEN
07:21:35 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/actions/314
07:24:55 <fjh> Topic: Issue Review
07:25:02 <fjh> ISSUE-2?
07:25:02 <trackbot> ISSUE-2 -- Error handling style -- open
07:25:02 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/2
07:28:17 <fjh> ISSUE-2: good javascript coding
07:28:17 <trackbot> ISSUE-2 Error handling style notes added
07:28:23 <fjh> ISSUE-2 closed
07:28:23 <trackbot> ISSUE-2 Error handling style closed
07:28:28 <fjh> ISSUE-18?
07:28:28 <trackbot> ISSUE-18 -- Determine security policy starting points for review and comparison -- open
07:28:28 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/18
07:28:52 <fjh> ISSUE-18: closed
07:28:52 <trackbot> ISSUE-18 Determine security policy starting points for review and comparison notes added
07:29:02 <fjh> ISSUE-21?
07:29:03 <trackbot> ISSUE-21 -- Is policy/access control on both features and device capabilities needed, do all submissions include both of these -- open
07:29:03 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/21
07:29:09 <dom> close ISSUE-18
07:29:09 <trackbot> ISSUE-18 Determine security policy starting points for review and comparison closed
07:29:14 <dom> close ISSUE-2
07:29:14 <trackbot> ISSUE-2 Error handling style closed
07:29:14 <fjh> ISSUE-21: closed
07:29:14 <trackbot> ISSUE-21 Is policy/access control on both features and device capabilities needed, do all submissions include both of these notes added
07:29:21 <dom> close ISSUE-21
07:29:21 <trackbot> ISSUE-21 Is policy/access control on both features and device capabilities needed, do all submissions include both of these closed
07:29:31 <fjh> ISSUE-23?
07:29:32 <trackbot> ISSUE-23 -- Should policy framework support notion of default policy? -- open
07:29:32 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/23
07:29:57 <fjh> ISSUE-23 closed
07:29:57 <trackbot> ISSUE-23 Should policy framework support notion of default policy? closed
07:30:02 <dom> close ISSUE-23
07:30:02 <trackbot> ISSUE-23 Should policy framework support notion of default policy? closed
07:30:16 <fjh> ISSUE-23?
07:30:16 <trackbot> ISSUE-23 -- Should policy framework support notion of default policy? -- closed
07:30:16 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/23
07:30:21 <fjh> ISSUE-25?
07:30:21 <trackbot> ISSUE-25 -- Cross-module dependency and impact on policy -- open
07:30:21 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/25
07:31:14 <fjh> ISSUE-33?
07:31:14 <trackbot> ISSUE-33 -- Persisting state of user decisions -- open
07:31:14 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/33
07:31:15 <fjh> ISSUE-25: cross api dependence and policy 
07:31:15 <trackbot> ISSUE-25 Cross-module dependency and impact on policy notes added
07:31:18 <fjh> close ISSUE-25
07:31:18 <trackbot> ISSUE-25 Cross-module dependency and impact on policy closed
07:33:15 <fjh> ISSUE-33: UI issue, added note to API draft
07:33:15 <trackbot> ISSUE-33 Persisting state of user decisions notes added
07:34:45 <dom> http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/wiki/ApiCheckList#Privacy_.26_Security_Considerations
07:34:47 <darobin> -> http://dev.w3.org/2009/dap/system-info/#privacy-considerations-for-implementors-of-the-system-info-api
07:35:00 <fjh> Note: see privacy note in  http://dev.w3.org/2009/dap/system-info/#privacy-considerations-for-implementors-of-the-system-info-api
07:35:05 <dom> ISSUE-33: added requirement of revokation capaibilites to API Checklist http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/wiki/ApiCheckList#Privacy_.26_Security_Considerations
07:35:06 <trackbot> ISSUE-33 Persisting state of user decisions notes added
07:35:21 <fjh> close ISSUE-33
07:35:21 <trackbot> ISSUE-33 Persisting state of user decisions closed
07:35:29 <fjh> ISSE-34?
07:35:33 <fjh> ISSUE-34?
07:35:33 <trackbot> ISSUE-34 -- Protecting data versus protecting apis -- open
07:35:33 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/34
07:35:41 <fjh> s/ISSE-34?//
07:36:32 <fjh> ISSUE-34: focus now is privacy by design, not policy framework
07:36:33 <trackbot> ISSUE-34 Protecting data versus protecting apis notes added
07:37:02 <BJ> BJ has joined #dap
07:37:34 <dom> ISSUE-34: WTF??
07:37:35 <trackbot> ISSUE-34 Protecting data versus protecting apis notes added
07:37:46 <dom> close ISSUE-34
07:37:46 <trackbot> ISSUE-34 Protecting data versus protecting apis closed
07:37:59 <fjh> ISSUE-35?
07:37:59 <trackbot> ISSUE-35 -- How to handle malformed policies, policy validity and intentional abuse of policy? How is policy deadlock handled? e.g. Only dial +39 numbers + Never dial +39 numbers -- open
07:37:59 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/35
07:38:00 <dom> close ISSUE-35
07:38:00 <trackbot> ISSUE-35 How to handle malformed policies, policy validity and intentional abuse of policy? How is policy deadlock handled? e.g. Only dial +39 numbers + Never dial +39 numbers closed
07:39:07 <fjh> ISSUE-58: fjh did this
07:39:08 <trackbot> ISSUE-58 Provide link to section of document producing text that includes section title and section number notes added
07:39:09 <dom> ACTION: Dom to look for a new place for hosting ReSpec Issues
07:39:09 <trackbot> Created ACTION-354 - Look for a new place for hosting ReSpec Issues [on Dominique Hazaël-Massieux - due 2011-03-22].
07:39:16 <fjh> close ISSUE-58
07:39:16 <trackbot> ISSUE-58 Provide link to section of document producing text that includes section title and section number closed
07:39:35 <darobin> close ISSUE-68
07:39:35 <trackbot> ISSUE-68 confusing indentation of WebIDL blocks in ReSpec closed
07:39:37 <fjh> ISSUE-78?
07:39:37 <trackbot> ISSUE-78 -- Capture has a minimisation problem with EXIF data (e.g. it could be Geotagged) -- open
07:39:37 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/78
07:39:57 <fjh> ACTION-251?
07:39:57 <trackbot> ACTION-251 -- John Morris to review privacy text related to ISSUE-78 for capture -- due 2010-10-20 -- OPEN
07:39:57 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/actions/251
07:40:05 <darobin> close ISSUE-75
07:40:05 <trackbot> ISSUE-75 ReSpec should support non-RecTrack override closed
07:40:10 <fjh> ISSUE-81?
07:40:10 <trackbot> ISSUE-81 -- How to represent dates? ES has Date but with no TZ information; using strings is less than ideal; do we have to create a Web Dates specification? -- open
07:40:10 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/81
07:40:43 <fjh> ACTION-297?
07:40:43 <trackbot> ACTION-297 -- Robin Berjon to draft up TZDate -- due 2010-11-11 -- OPEN
07:40:43 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/actions/297
07:40:55 <fjh> ISSUE-82?
07:40:55 <trackbot> ISSUE-82 -- Should Communication Logs be part of the messaging API or part of a telephony API? -- open
07:40:55 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/82
07:41:13 <dom> ISSUE-82: we're dropping work on commlog api in new charter
07:41:13 <trackbot> ISSUE-82 Should Communication Logs be part of the messaging API or part of a telephony API? notes added
07:41:17 <fjh> ISSUE-82: part  chartering discussionat this f2f
07:41:17 <trackbot> ISSUE-82 Should Communication Logs be part of the messaging API or part of a telephony API? notes added
07:41:23 <fjh> ISSUE-82 closed
07:41:23 <trackbot> ISSUE-82 Should Communication Logs be part of the messaging API or part of a telephony API? closed
07:41:33 <fjh> ISSUE-87?
07:41:33 <trackbot> ISSUE-87 -- Degree of ruleset transmission with API calls, how often, which -- open
07:41:33 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/87
07:42:00 <fjh> ruleset issues stay open
07:42:03 <fjh> ISSUE-90?
07:42:03 <trackbot> ISSUE-90 -- Create privacy best practices document for web site developer -- open
07:42:03 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/90
07:42:59 <dom> ACTION: Frederick to make first draft of privacy best practices
07:43:00 <trackbot> Created ACTION-355 - Make first draft of privacy best practices [on Frederick Hirsch - due 2011-03-22].
07:43:09 <fjh> ISSUE-90: need action, not issue
07:43:09 <trackbot> ISSUE-90 Create privacy best practices document for web site developer notes added
07:43:14 <fjh> ISSUE-90 closed
07:43:14 <trackbot> ISSUE-90 Create privacy best practices document for web site developer closed
07:43:16 <dom> ISSUE-90: not an issue, see ACTION-355
07:43:16 <trackbot> ISSUE-90 Create privacy best practices document for web site developer notes added
07:43:40 <dom> ISSUE-91?
07:43:40 <trackbot> ISSUE-91 -- Be clear to distinguish site (service) privacy policy versus included location provider policy etc -- open
07:43:40 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/91
07:43:55 <fjh> action: fjh to create initial editors draft for privacy best practices, ISSUE-90
07:43:55 <trackbot> Created ACTION-356 - Create initial editors draft for privacy best practices, ISSUE-90 [on Frederick Hirsch - due 2011-03-22].
07:44:09 <dom> close ACTION-356
07:44:09 <trackbot> ACTION-356 Create initial editors draft for privacy best practices, ISSUE-90 closed
07:44:19 <dom> ACTION-356: dup of ACTION-355
07:44:19 <trackbot> ACTION-356 Create initial editors draft for privacy best practices, ISSUE-90 notes added
07:44:20 <fjh> ISSUE-92?
07:44:20 <trackbot> ISSUE-92 -- Sysinfo, permissions for get vs monitor; -- open
07:44:20 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/92
07:44:35 <dom> ISSUE-91: might be relevant to Web introducer? otherwise probably not relevant to DAP
07:44:35 <trackbot> ISSUE-91 Be clear to distinguish site (service) privacy policy versus included location provider policy etc notes added
07:45:01 <fjh> ACTION-248?
07:45:01 <trackbot> ACTION-248 -- John Morris to provide a proposal relevant to ISSUE-92, sysinfo privacy prompts for operators get vs watch -- due 2010-08-11 -- CLOSED
07:45:01 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/actions/248
07:45:28 <fjh> ISSUE-91 closed
07:45:28 <trackbot> ISSUE-91 Be clear to distinguish site (service) privacy policy versus included location provider policy etc closed
07:45:36 <darobin> issue-94?
07:45:36 <trackbot> ISSUE-94 -- How do Powerbox and Policy interact and integrate -- open
07:45:36 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/94
07:45:39 <fjh> ISSUE-94?
07:45:39 <trackbot> ISSUE-94 -- How do Powerbox and Policy interact and integrate -- open
07:45:39 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/94
07:45:40 <bryan_sullivan> bryan_sullivan has joined #dap
07:45:47 <fjh> ISSUE-94 closed
07:45:48 <trackbot> ISSUE-94 How do Powerbox and Policy interact and integrate closed
07:46:05 <fjh> ISSUE-95?
07:46:05 <trackbot> ISSUE-95 -- Different regulatory environments and relationship to privacy and rulesets -- open
07:46:05 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/95
07:46:12 <dom> ISSUE-92: added note on get vs watch in API checklist http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/wiki/ApiCheckList#Privacy_.26_Security_Considerations
07:46:12 <trackbot> ISSUE-92 Sysinfo, permissions for get vs monitor; notes added
07:46:30 <fjh> ISSUE-96?
07:46:30 <trackbot> ISSUE-96 -- Some properties of sysinfo are static so monitor might not make sense -- open
07:46:30 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/96
07:47:00 <fjh> ISSUE-101?
07:47:00 <trackbot> ISSUE-101 -- Should we define a default audio (video?) codec for capture? if so, which? -- open
07:47:00 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/101
07:47:02 <dom> ISSUE-96: probably going to be moot if we reshape sysinfo; to be revisited
07:47:02 <trackbot> ISSUE-96 Some properties of sysinfo are static so monitor might not make sense notes added
07:47:41 <fjh> ISSUE-101: hopefully codec will be defined by rtw
07:47:41 <trackbot> ISSUE-101 Should we define a default audio (video?) codec for capture? if so, which? notes added
07:47:49 <fjh> ISSUE-104 closed
07:47:49 <trackbot> ISSUE-104 Find a better name for "trusted environments" closed
07:47:54 <dom> ISSUE-101: rtw = Web RTC
07:47:54 <trackbot> ISSUE-101 Should we define a default audio (video?) codec for capture? if so, which? notes added
07:48:00 <fjh> ISSUE-105?
07:48:00 <trackbot> ISSUE-105 -- Should the capture hint in HTML Media Capture be specified through a MIME parameter? -- open
07:48:00 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/105
07:48:35 <fjh> ACTION-317?
07:48:35 <trackbot> ACTION-317 -- Robin Berjon to ping Andrei about using @role instead of mime parameters -- due 2010-12-22 -- OPEN
07:48:35 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/actions/317
07:48:43 <fjh> ACTION-381?
07:48:43 <trackbot> ACTION-381 does not exist
07:48:46 <fjh> ACTION-351?
07:48:46 <trackbot> ACTION-351 -- Dominique Hazaël-Massieux to draft HTML Media Capture with role attribute -- due 2011-03-22 -- OPEN
07:48:46 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/actions/351
07:48:55 <fjh> ISSUE-106?
07:48:55 <trackbot> ISSUE-106 -- Does Contacts API having a timezone field make sense, should it be utfOffset or utcOffset and tz to better match vCard? -- open
07:48:55 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/106
07:49:16 <fjh> ISSUE-106: proposal from Rich
07:49:17 <trackbot> ISSUE-106 Does Contacts API having a timezone field make sense, should it be utfOffset or utcOffset and tz to better match vCard? notes added
07:49:44 <dom> ISSUE-106: Resolved as implemented in http://dev.w3.org/2009/dap/contacts/#widl-Contact-timezone 
07:49:44 <trackbot> ISSUE-106 Does Contacts API having a timezone field make sense, should it be utfOffset or utcOffset and tz to better match vCard? notes added
07:50:16 <fjh> close ISSUE-106
07:50:16 <trackbot> ISSUE-106 Does Contacts API having a timezone field make sense, should it be utfOffset or utcOffset and tz to better match vCard? closed
07:50:34 <fjh> ISSUE-107?
07:50:34 <trackbot> ISSUE-107 -- How to better integrate URIs schemes in Messaging API -- open
07:50:34 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/107
07:50:54 <fjh> ACTION-348?
07:50:54 <trackbot> ACTION-348 -- Dominique Hazaël-Massieux to send concrete proposal for navigator.sendMessage with URI scheme -- due 2011-03-16 -- PENDINGREVIEW
07:50:54 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/actions/348
07:51:10 <dom> ISSUE-107: new proposal on the table need review from Messaging API editors
07:51:10 <trackbot> ISSUE-107 How to better integrate URIs schemes in Messaging API notes added
07:51:18 <fjh> Now 14 issues open
07:51:32 <fjh> 6 Respec, leaving 8 open issues
07:51:55 <dom> ISSUE-106: resolution is that timezone attribute takes Timezone identifier, can take utf offset but not recommended
07:51:55 <trackbot> ISSUE-106 Does Contacts API having a timezone field make sense, should it be utfOffset or utcOffset and tz to better match vCard? notes added
07:51:56 <fjh> rrsagent, generate minutes?
07:51:56 <RRSAgent> I'm logging.  Sorry, nothing found for 'generate minutes'
07:52:05 <fjh> rrsagent, generate minutes
07:52:05 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/03/15-dap-minutes.html fjh
07:52:14 <wonsuk> wonsuk has left #dap
07:55:46 <fjh> Topic: Recess
07:55:51 <fjh> rssagent, generate minutes
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