16:00:25 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #html-a11y
16:00:25 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2011/03/03-html-a11y-irc
16:00:27 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs world
16:00:29 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be 2119
16:00:29 <Zakim> ok, trackbot; I see WAI_PFWG(HTML TF)11:00AM scheduled to start now
16:00:30 <trackbot> Meeting: HTML Accessibility Task Force Teleconference
16:00:30 <trackbot> Date: 03 March 2011
16:00:42 <MikeSmith> Zakim, who's on the phone?
16:00:42 <Zakim> WAI_PFWG(HTML TF)11:00AM has not yet started, MikeSmith
16:00:43 <Zakim> On IRC I see RRSAgent, JF, eric_carlson, MikeSmith, Marco_Ranon, kliehm, Judy, Zakim, MichaelC, trackbot, [tm]
16:00:51 <paulc> paulc has joined #html-a11y
16:01:46 <oedipus> oedipus has joined #html-a11y
16:01:57 <MikeSmith> Zakim, who's on the phone?
16:01:58 <MichaelC> zakim, this is 2119
16:02:05 <MikeSmith> Zakim, who's on the phone?
16:02:10 <MikeSmith> hmm
16:02:12 <paulc> zakim, [Microsoft] has paulc
16:02:13 <Zakim> WAI_PFWG(HTML TF)11:00AM has not yet started, MikeSmith
16:02:14 <Zakim> ok, MichaelC; that matches WAI_PFWG(HTML TF)11:00AM
16:02:17 <Zakim> +[Microsoft]
16:02:19 <Zakim> On the phone I see Eric, ??P20, John_Foliot, kliehm, [Microsoft]
16:02:26 <Zakim> On IRC I see oedipus, paulc, RRSAgent, JF, eric_carlson, MikeSmith, Marco_Ranon, kliehm, Judy, Zakim, MichaelC, trackbot, [tm]
16:02:31 <MichaelC> zakim, ??P20 is Mike_Smith
16:02:31 <paulc> zakim, [Microsoft] has paulc
16:02:32 <Zakim> +Michael_Cooper
16:02:34 <kliehm> zakim, mute me
16:02:34 <Zakim> +paulc; got it
16:02:38 <Zakim> +Gregory_Rosmaita
16:02:43 <MikeSmith> Zakim, ??P20 is me
16:02:46 <Zakim> +Mike_Smith; got it
16:02:48 <Zakim> paulc was already listed in [Microsoft], paulc
16:02:51 <paulc> paulc on manual mute
16:02:52 <Zakim> kliehm should now be muted
16:02:59 <Zakim> I already had ??P20 as Mike_Smith, MikeSmith
16:03:08 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
16:03:21 <MichaelC> zakim, IPcaller is Marco_Ranon
16:03:22 <Zakim> +Marco_Ranon; got it
16:03:41 <Marco_Ranon> zakim, mute me
16:03:46 <Zakim> Marco_Ranon should now be muted
16:04:34 <Marco_Ranon> zakim, unmute me
16:04:34 <Zakim> Marco_Ranon should no longer be muted
16:04:46 <Marco_Ranon> zakim, mute me
16:04:46 <Zakim> Marco_Ranon should now be muted
16:05:17 <oedipus> scribe: Marco_Ranon
16:05:21 <MikeSmith> agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-a11y/2011Mar/0026.html
16:05:26 <oedipus> scribenick: Marco_Ranon
16:06:47 <Zakim> +Cynthia_Shelly
16:07:00 <richardschwerdtfe> richardschwerdtfe has joined #html-a11y
16:07:02 <oedipus> http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/44061/201103_ftf/
16:07:05 <oedipus> http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/44061/201103_ftf/results
16:07:16 <MichaelC> agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-a11y/2011Mar/0026.html
16:07:19 <kliehm> agenda?
16:07:32 <Marco_Ranon> MS: survey for f2f meeting survey
16:07:58 <Marco_Ranon> MS: enough people for the f2f
16:08:20 <Marco_Ranon> CS: 11 March deadline for registration. Room booked.
16:08:42 <Marco_Ranon> GJR: need access for remote users
16:08:49 <Marco_Ranon> MS: we can use skype
16:09:01 <oedipus> skype is fine
16:09:43 <oedipus> i/MS: survey for f2f/TOPIC: Face2Face Planning/Schedule/
16:09:50 <Zakim> +Rich
16:09:50 <Marco_Ranon> MS: do we have two rooms for breakout group?
16:09:58 <Marco_Ranon> CS: one big room
16:10:34 <Marco_Ranon> MS: logistics lined up. 
16:11:45 <Marco_Ranon> RS: summary: ARIA will be included in HTML5
16:12:05 <Marco_Ranon> ... minor issues but acceptable
16:12:12 <oedipus> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2011Mar/0027.html
16:12:31 <MikeSmith> -> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2011Mar/0067.html response from Steve Faulkner to Hixie's request for specific list of changes requested
16:12:49 <Marco_Ranon> ... authors might not use html5 control so for accessibility is important that aria is used
16:12:54 <MikeSmith> -> http://www.html5accessibility.com/tests/aria-changes.html detailed list of changes from Steve Faulkner
16:14:12 <Marco_Ranon> MS: positive resolution for tis issue, no strong objections
16:14:32 <oedipus> i/RS: summary: ARIA will/TOPIC: ARIA in HTML Decision & Follow-Up/
16:14:35 <Marco_Ranon> TOPIC: issue 30 (longdesc)
16:15:32 <Marco_Ranon> PC: the proposal put together by mostly Laura Carlson have been considred by the chairs and the issue reopen for LC
16:15:49 <Marco_Ranon> PC: we'll open a call for counter proposals
16:15:54 <JF> +q
16:15:54 <Marco_Ranon> .. any questions?
16:15:54 <MikeSmith> q?
16:15:59 <oedipus> ack jud
16:16:11 <oedipus> ack JF
16:16:44 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/03/03-html-a11y-minutes.html oedipus
16:17:12 <Marco_Ranon> JF: when is the issue going to be considred? when is the next step?
16:17:20 <Marco_Ranon> PC: it's a LC issue
16:17:23 <oedipus> chair: MikeSmith
16:17:52 <Marco_Ranon> ... no dates that apply to pre-LC apply tho this issue
16:19:05 <Marco_Ranon> ... this also applies to all other LC issues: the chairs are not asking the WG to do work on this until it's time for LC
16:19:15 <Marco_Ranon> ... approx May
16:19:46 <oedipus> q+
16:20:00 <oedipus> q?
16:20:26 <Marco_Ranon> ... but it might be appropriate for a11y people to talk discuss the issue with other people to try to reach consensus (option to be perhaps discussed off-line)
16:21:02 <JF> +q
16:21:35 <oedipus> it's called reality
16:21:38 <Marco_Ranon> GJR: we've done that already but we want to make clear the need for the mechanism
16:21:51 <Marco_Ranon> PC: we should discuss this option off-line
16:22:00 <oedipus> we have reached the same dead end by travelling many routes
16:22:19 <Marco_Ranon> MS: facilitators will talk about it
16:22:20 <oedipus> those who objected didn't on factual/need grounds, but on faulty statistics
16:22:43 <oedipus> ack oe
16:22:47 <oedipus> ack JF
16:23:03 <Marco_Ranon> JF: i think we need to have this conversations
16:23:13 <oedipus> i've been discussing longdesc with IDPF/EPUB and they NEED longdesc and native describedby by March for their deadline
16:23:37 <Marco_Ranon> TOPIC: bug 11893 (lexical processing rules for ARIA) question from Hixie
16:23:48 <Marco_Ranon> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-a11y/2011Feb/0224.html
16:24:17 <MikeSmith> "What's the spec I should use as the reference for these rules?"
16:24:21 <oedipus> the reference is in Steve's proposed text
16:24:35 <Marco_Ranon> MS: Hixie needs more info
16:24:48 <kliehm> http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=11893
16:24:49 <Marco_Ranon> RS: we are working on this. More info after the f2f
16:25:20 <Marco_Ranon> MS: will respond to Hixie today
16:25:55 <kliehm> zakim, kliehm is Martin_Kliehm
16:25:55 <Zakim> +Martin_Kliehm; got it
16:25:59 <Marco_Ranon> TOPIC: canvas subteam
16:26:19 <oedipus> http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/Canvas
16:26:21 <oedipus> http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/Canvas/Meetings
16:26:26 <oedipus> http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/Canvas/Meetings/Minutes
16:26:43 <Marco_Ranon> RS: worked on a counter proposal for issue-133.
16:26:58 <Marco_Ranon> PC: march 22 the deadline
16:27:16 <oedipus> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/131
16:27:25 <oedipus> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/wiki/ChangeProposals/CaretSelection
16:27:46 <paulc> ISSUE-131 Call for Counter Proposals closes Mar 22: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2011Feb/0374.html
16:27:47 <MikeSmith> http://dev.w3.org/html5/status/issue-status.html#ISSUE-131
16:27:48 <oedipus> call for alternate proposals for Canvas caret: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2011Feb/0374.html
16:27:56 <Marco_Ranon> MS: working on issue 131
16:28:20 <Marco_Ranon> s/MS: working on issue 131/RS: working on issue 131
16:28:50 <kliehm> rrsagent, make minutes
16:28:50 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/03/03-html-a11y-minutes.html kliehm
16:29:13 <Marco_Ranon> MS: March 22 is the deadline for all information needed for decisions prior LC
16:29:48 <Zakim> -Mike_Smith
16:30:09 <kliehm> s/RS: worked on a counter proposal for issue-133./RS: worked on a counter proposal for issue-131./
16:30:22 <kliehm> rrsagent, make minutes
16:30:22 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/03/03-html-a11y-minutes.html kliehm
16:31:11 <oedipus> RS: thanks to chairs for expediting the canvas decision
16:31:18 <oedipus> PC: thanks to those who worked on Canvas
16:31:48 <MikeSmith> Zakim, drop me
16:31:49 <Zakim> sorry, MikeSmith, I do not see a party named 'MikeSmith'
16:31:52 <Marco_Ranon> TOPIC: media subteam report
16:32:47 <Zakim> +??P20
16:32:59 <MikeSmith> Zakim, ??P20 is me
16:32:59 <Zakim> +MikeSmith; got it
16:32:59 <Marco_Ranon> JF: discussion on track. started with 8 solution, now need to discuss the progress at the f2f to meet the deadline
16:33:22 <oedipus> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/9
16:33:25 <Marco_Ranon> ... discussed issue-9 yesterday. chairs proposed to close the issue
16:33:50 <oedipus> call for consensus/counter proposal for HTML WG Issue-9 http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2011Feb/0410.html
16:33:53 <Marco_Ranon> ... there is concern that closing issue-9 might affect work in progress
16:34:05 <oedipus> http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/Media_Accessibility_Requirements
16:34:39 <Marco_Ranon> ... if issue-9 is closed we can still continue
16:35:20 <oedipus> if hixie could at least be in IRC for pinging purposes that would be a benefit
16:35:22 <Marco_Ranon> MS: Hixie might no be at the f2f, but we can ask him to join
16:36:31 <oedipus> HTML WG Issue-9 "video-accessibility" associated with HTML WG bugs 5758, 8187, 8657, 8658, 8659, 8736
16:36:46 <Marco_Ranon> JF: issue-9 was an old issue and we have other issues that relate to current work by the subteam
16:37:06 <oedipus> q+ migrate or review associated bugs?
16:37:18 <oedipus> q+ to ask if need to migrate or review issue-9 associated bugs?
16:37:20 <MikeSmith> q?
16:37:29 <Marco_Ranon> JF: just a couple of outstanding bug
16:38:17 <Marco_Ranon> GJR: bug triage subteam sould check the bugs associated to issue-9
16:38:26 <oedipus> HTML WG Issue-9 associated with HTML WG bugs 5758, 8187, 8657, 8658, 8659, 8736
16:38:49 <kliehm> zakim, unmute me
16:38:49 <Zakim> sorry, kliehm, I do not know which phone connection belongs to you
16:38:54 <Marco_Ranon> TOPIC: bug triage
16:39:11 <Marco_Ranon> MC: we didn't meet. nothing to report
16:39:36 <oedipus> ACTION: kliehm - have bug triage subgroup review the bugs associated with HTML WG ISSUE-9 (bugs 5758, 8187, 8657, 8658, 8659, 8736)
16:39:36 <trackbot> Created ACTION-108 - - have bug triage subgroup review the bugs associated with HTML WG ISSUE-9 (bugs 5758, 8187, 8657, 8658, 8659, 8736) [on Martin Kliehm - due 2011-03-10].
16:39:42 <Marco_Ranon> TOPIC: aria mapping subteam report
16:39:44 <kliehm> we are at inbox 0 at the moment for the bug-triage sub-team.
16:40:03 <MikeSmith> kliehm, cool, thanks
16:40:03 <Marco_Ranon> RS: nothing to add to what said before about issue-129
16:40:20 <Marco_Ranon> TOPIC: f2f planning
16:40:42 <MikeSmith> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-a11y/2011Mar/0026.html
16:41:19 <Marco_Ranon> MS: proposed topics for f2f in the agenda of this meeting
16:41:39 <Marco_Ranon> ... we have critical mass
16:42:00 <Marco_Ranon> MS: RS, do we have people for canvas discussion?
16:42:17 <Marco_Ranon> RS: not sure if FrankO will be there
16:42:29 <kliehm> rrsagent, make minutes
16:42:29 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/03/03-html-a11y-minutes.html kliehm
16:42:56 <Marco_Ranon> MS: we might not have enough to do with canvas
16:43:09 <Zakim> +Michael_Cooper.a
16:43:16 <MichaelC_> MichaelC_ has joined #html-a11y
16:43:19 <Marco_Ranon> ... we should have canvas and media breakouts at the same time
16:45:05 <oedipus> caret in canvas: http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/131
16:45:25 <Marco_Ranon> MS: Counter proposal to a11y TF proposal for Issue 131. (if it comes up by March 22)
16:45:27 <oedipus> RichS change proposal for HTML WG Issue-131 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/wiki/ChangeProposals/CaretSelection
16:45:52 <Marco_Ranon> RS: Aria.next: are there things we need for html5? 
16:45:55 <oedipus> call for counter proposals on caret in canvas (deadline 22 March 2011) http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2011Feb/0374.html
16:46:22 <oedipus> i/RS: Aria.next/TOPIC: ARIA Next and HTML5
16:46:24 <Marco_Ranon> ... for example, do we want the equivalent of a longdesc in ARIA?
16:46:31 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/03/03-html-a11y-minutes.html oedipus
16:46:44 <JF> +q
16:46:45 <Zakim> -Michael_Cooper
16:47:27 <JF> ack JF
16:47:49 <MikeSmith> q?
16:48:01 <oedipus> q-
16:48:21 <oedipus> regrets: Laura_Carlson,Kenny_Johar,Silvia_Pfieffer
16:48:32 <oedipus> regrets+ Janina_Sajka
16:48:35 <Marco_Ranon> JF: there are still some accessibilty related open issues. we are supposed to hace change proposals by March 22
16:48:55 <Marco_Ranon> ... should we discuss those issues?
16:49:38 <oedipus> i/JF: there are still some accessiblity/TOPIC: Other Issues Which Need Immediate Attention/
16:50:04 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/03/03-html-a11y-minutes.html oedipus
16:50:13 <Marco_Ranon> MS: we are expecting chairs to make decisions on issue 31 and 32
16:50:48 <MikeSmith> q?
16:51:34 <Marco_Ranon> JF: at the f2f we should have a bigger group to discuss open issues and not only breakout groups
16:51:38 <Marco_Ranon> MS: agreed
16:51:58 <Marco_Ranon> TOPIC: open action items
16:52:02 <oedipus> i/JF: there are still some accessibilty related open issues/TOPIC: Other Issues WHich Need Immediate Attention/
16:52:05 <MikeSmith> http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/track/actions/open
16:52:22 <oedipus> action-106?
16:52:22 <trackbot> ACTION-106 -- Gregory Rosmaita to - prepare keyboard access high-level issues discussion for F2F -- due 2011-03-03 -- OPEN
16:52:22 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/track/actions/106
16:52:34 <oedipus> action-105?
16:52:34 <trackbot> ACTION-105 -- Gregory Rosmaita to - review w3c bugzilla installation versus newest version 4, coordinate with those who volunteered, present options and needs -- due 2011-03-03 -- OPEN
16:52:34 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/track/actions/105
16:52:39 <Marco_Ranon> MS: action-106 on GJR
16:52:46 <Marco_Ranon> GJR: will do that
16:53:19 <Marco_Ranon> MS: action-105
16:53:43 <Marco_Ranon> GJR: looking into this
16:54:15 <MikeSmith> action-104: Rich says this one was done
16:54:15 <trackbot> ACTION-104 Post question to HTML working group on whether to limit HTML elements in non-visible content such as the Canvas fallback content notes added
16:54:20 <MikeSmith> close action-104
16:54:20 <trackbot> ACTION-104 Post question to HTML working group on whether to limit HTML elements in non-visible content such as the Canvas fallback content closed
16:54:31 <oedipus> GJR needs to reset due date for action-105 (review current installation now/round-robin improvement suggestions after F2F
16:54:57 <oedipus> http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/track/actions
16:55:14 <oedipus> GJR set some to "pending review"
16:55:37 <Marco_Ranon> MS: to all, please close actions assigned to you that you are not taking up now, but comment on the reasons
16:55:45 <Zakim> -Eric
16:55:46 <Zakim> -Martin_Kliehm
16:55:46 <Zakim> -Rich
16:55:48 <Zakim> -Michael_Cooper.a
16:55:50 <Zakim> -Cynthia_Shelly
16:55:55 <Zakim> -John_Foliot
16:55:57 <Zakim> -MikeSmith
16:56:06 <kliehm> rrsagent, make minutes
16:56:06 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/03/03-html-a11y-minutes.html kliehm
16:56:09 <Marco_Ranon> zackim, unmute me
16:56:12 <Marco_Ranon> zakim, unmute me
16:56:12 <Zakim> Marco_Ranon should no longer be muted
16:56:29 <Marco_Ranon> zakim, please part
16:56:29 <Zakim> leaving.  As of this point the attendees were Eric, John_Foliot, Michael_Cooper, paulc, Gregory_Rosmaita, Mike_Smith, Marco_Ranon, Cynthia_Shelly, Rich, Martin_Kliehm, MikeSmith
16:56:29 <Zakim> Zakim has left #html-a11y
16:56:43 <Marco_Ranon> rssagent, make minutes
16:56:56 <Marco_Ranon> rrsagent, make minutes
16:56:56 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/03/03-html-a11y-minutes.html Marco_Ranon
16:57:34 <MikeSmith> Marco_Ranon, thanks much for scribing
16:59:09 <kliehm> rrsagent, please part
16:59:09 <RRSAgent> I see 1 open action item saved in http://www.w3.org/2011/03/03-html-a11y-actions.rdf :
16:59:09 <RRSAgent> ACTION: kliehm - have bug triage subgroup review the bugs associated with HTML WG ISSUE-9 (bugs 5758, 8187, 8657, 8658, 8659, 8736) [1]
16:59:09 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/03/03-html-a11y-irc#T16-39-36