19:29:49 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #svg
19:29:49 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2011/02/16-svg-irc
19:29:51 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public
19:29:53 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be GA_SVGWG
19:29:53 <Zakim> ok, trackbot; I see GA_SVGWG(SVG1)2:30PM scheduled to start in 1 minute
19:29:54 <trackbot> Meeting: SVG Working Group Teleconference
19:29:54 <trackbot> Date: 16 February 2011
19:30:50 <Zakim> GA_SVGWG(SVG1)2:30PM has now started
19:30:55 <Zakim> +Doug_Schepers
19:30:57 <Zakim> +??P2
19:31:10 <anthony_work> Zakim, ??P2 is me
19:31:10 <Zakim> +anthony_work; got it
19:31:32 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
19:31:42 <ed> Zakim, [IP is me
19:31:42 <Zakim> +ed; got it
19:32:43 <Zakim> +??P7
19:32:45 <heycam> Zakim, ??P7 is me
19:32:45 <Zakim> +heycam; got it
19:32:55 <tbah> tbah has joined #svg
19:33:57 <Zakim> + +39.537.7.aaaa
19:35:10 <heycam> Chair: Cameron
19:35:16 <heycam> Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-svg-wg/2011JanMar/0142.html
19:37:09 <Zakim> Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose Doug_Schepers
19:37:15 <anthony> Scribe: anthony
19:37:22 <anthony> ScribeNick: anthony
19:37:31 <anthony> Topic: Face-to-face
19:37:49 <anthony> CM: Today's telcon will probably the last before the face-to-face
19:37:56 <anthony> ... people may be travelling next week
19:37:58 <heycam> http://www.w3.org/Graphics/SVG/WG/wiki/F2F/Auckland_2011/Agenda
19:38:05 <anthony> ... so we will cancel next weeks
19:38:18 <anthony> ... wanted to check if people had noticed anything missing from the agenda
19:38:21 <ChrisL> ChrisL has joined #svg
19:38:35 <anthony> DS: Did you get confirmation from Dean that he can come?
19:38:42 <anthony> CM: I got confirmation that he can't come
19:38:49 <anthony> ... he's stuck in the USA
19:38:52 <anthony> ... for another week
19:39:11 <Zakim> +ChrisL
19:39:12 <anthony> ... Dean said he was thinking about some APIs for some Animation
19:39:18 <anthony> ... and he may send it through
19:39:24 <anthony> ED: About the Animations
19:39:40 <anthony> ... if there are questions and topics, I can forward those to people in Opera
19:39:54 <anthony> CM: I plan to start hashing out some Animation stuff on the Wiki
19:40:08 <anthony> DS: Brian will be there right?
19:40:19 <anthony> CM: Yes, he'll stick some stuff up on that page
19:40:39 <anthony> ... he's going to be focusing on fixing SMIL stuff in SVG rather than harmonisation
19:40:53 <ChrisL> rrsagent, here
19:40:53 <RRSAgent> See http://www.w3.org/2011/02/16-svg-irc#T19-40-53
19:41:19 <anthony> DS: Not going to be there on Monday until noon
19:41:55 <anthony> CM: Fujisawa-san is going to be there Monday - Wednesday
19:42:07 <anthony> ... and Alex Danilo will be there Wednesday - Friday
19:42:30 <anthony> ... If you have time to stick stuff up on the Wiki please do so by Monday
19:42:41 <Zakim> -heycam
19:43:02 <anthony> CL: I think it's really good that the chairs are doing this work prior to the meeting
19:43:07 <Zakim> +??P7
19:43:09 <heycam> Zakim, ??P7 is me
19:43:09 <Zakim> +heycam; got it
19:43:32 <anthony> ED: I think it will help to get the agenda sorted out before the meeting starts
19:43:48 <tbah> zakim, +39.537.7.aaaa is me
19:43:48 <Zakim> +tbah; got it
19:43:48 <anthony> CM: I think we will discuss that over the next few days
19:44:09 <anthony> ... if there is anything that we've missed, stick it up and let us know
19:45:40 <anthony> Topic: Status update on SVG 1.1 2nd Edition
19:45:48 <adrianba> adrianba has joined #svg
19:45:58 <anthony> CM: For my part I haven't been able to find any time
19:46:05 <anthony> ... to fix Batik up for any test failures
19:46:11 <anthony> ... I started looking at one
19:46:34 <anthony> ... there are 19 tests that are marked as less than two passes
19:46:51 <anthony> ... a few telcons ago we assigned actions to people asked them to look at their implementations
19:47:01 <Zakim> +[Microsoft]
19:47:02 <anthony> ... not sure if that is all we needed to do
19:47:11 <adrianba> zakim, [Microsoft] is me
19:47:11 <Zakim> +adrianba; got it
19:47:14 <anthony> ED: I haven't had time to look at the actions I took for that
19:47:32 <anthony> ... I do know we have a couple of those failing tests in internal builds
19:48:10 <anthony> CM: I can't really guarantee that I'll have stuff fixed before the face-to-face
19:48:26 <anthony> DS: My take on this less than two passes is it isn't supported well
19:48:36 <anthony> ... and we shouldn't include it
19:48:46 <anthony> CM: Do we remove the feature then?
19:48:57 <anthony> CL: One option is to say it is not defined
19:49:16 <anthony> ... there is also a class of things that we are saying are defined but we don't test
19:49:26 <anthony> ... in CSS is that is
19:50:12 <anthony> DS: There are a lot of things that are good in the spec that are not implemented
19:50:21 <anthony> ... and we can resolve some of these things in SVG 2
19:50:31 <anthony> ... so we could change 'must' to 'should'
19:51:31 <anthony> ... but it's a lot of trouble
19:51:56 <anthony> ... I think it would take a lot of work to do
19:52:06 <anthony> ... we can do that in the frame of SVG 2
19:52:33 <anthony> ... even though I don't like the idea of features untested
19:52:57 <anthony> CM: I feel like we've gone that set of tests to determine if we can get passes on them
19:53:04 <anthony> ... but we haven't decided if we would drop them
19:53:23 <anthony> ... I get the feeling that it's going to be pretty hard to get those done as fix ups
19:53:43 <anthony> ... If we want to get things done by the face-to-face not sure if we will have time
19:54:04 <anthony> ... Should we leave deciding what to do with the test to the face-to-face?
19:54:36 <anthony> CL: If it's something that we can fix in SVG 2 then we can leave it until then
19:54:51 <anthony> ... then if it is something fundamental to the specification
19:54:58 <anthony> ... then we should push implementations to fix it
19:55:21 <anthony> CM: That's what worries me the most
19:55:42 <anthony> ... is features not being implemented
19:55:49 <anthony> ... that are important
19:56:11 <anthony> ... it could be one of those case that it is a bit tricky and provides marginal value
19:56:33 <anthony> DS: I think we should keep in mind that once we complete SVG 1.1 2nd edition
19:56:42 <anthony> ... doesn't mean that we will make a 3rd edition
19:57:02 <anthony> ... so if we think there is the slightest ambiguity about a test
19:57:21 <anthony> ... we should mark it for SVG 1.1 3rd edition or SVG 
19:57:27 <anthony> ... w
19:57:37 <anthony> s/w/2/
19:58:04 <anthony> ED: We could mark the parts of tests that are not passing
19:58:10 <anthony> ... I had a couple of actions to do that
19:58:20 <anthony> ... but it doesn't cover all of the tests remaining
19:58:48 <anthony> DS: Historically going through tests during the face-to-face
19:58:53 <anthony> ... is time consuming
19:58:59 <anthony> ... and we have a pretty full agenda
19:59:15 <anthony> ... we should try to talk about this over email
19:59:26 <anthony> CL: I think we should have a Wiki page with the tests
19:59:39 <anthony> ... and have reasons for dropping certain tests
19:59:46 <anthony> CM: I will create a page after the call
19:59:51 <anthony> ... and put my initial opinions up
19:59:57 <anthony> ... and we'll see what comes out of that
20:00:22 <shepazu> s/doesn't mean that we will make a 3rd edition/doesn't mean that we won't make a 3rd edition/
20:00:46 <anthony> ACTION: Cameron to Create a Wiki page listing the current tests that have less that 2 passes in SVG 1.1 2nd edition
20:00:46 <trackbot> Created ACTION-2960 - Create a Wiki page listing the current tests that have less that 2 passes in SVG 1.1 2nd edition [on Cameron McCormack - due 2011-02-23].
20:02:45 <tbah> http://tavmjong.free.fr/SVG/BUTTON_TEST/button_test.xhtml
20:02:55 <anthony> Topic: SVG in HTML
20:04:08 <anthony> TB: I tried to test 'seemless' attribute
20:04:58 <ed> s/seemless/seamless/ 
20:05:00 <heycam> Zakim, who is noisy?
20:05:02 <anthony> ... I verified that the SMIL works inside an image
20:05:12 <Zakim> heycam, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: anthony_work (9%), tbah (94%)
20:05:46 <heycam> Zakim, who is noisy?
20:06:05 <Zakim> heycam, listening for 18 seconds I heard sound from the following: anthony_work (30%), heycam (29%), tbah (61%)
20:06:23 <anthony> .... I guess my conclusion from all this is that it is more tricky
20:06:27 <anthony> ... than I thought
20:06:30 <ChrisL> zakim, mute anthony
20:06:30 <Zakim> anthony_work should now be muted
20:07:22 <anthony> .... If you're trying to use more than one button
20:07:29 <anthony> ... it becomes more difficult
20:07:55 <anthony> ED: Could use framelement
20:08:05 <anthony> CM: Could use that to write your script in SVG
20:08:09 <ed> s/framelement/window.frameElement/
20:09:19 <anthony> ... One interesting thing you raised was the even propagation
20:09:31 <anthony> ... and I don't think it's defined anywhere specifically
20:09:46 <anthony> ... I'd be interested to see what happens in another document
20:09:52 <anthony> ... with iFrame
20:09:56 <anthony> TB: It doesn't
20:10:08 <anthony> ... in my page I put a dummy document and tried it
20:10:17 <anthony> ... for IE9 it works for both
20:10:44 <anthony> CM: That sounds like a general issues that needs to go into DOM events
20:11:32 <anthony> ... so I guess what might be good that comes out of these tests is concrete things that are unresolved
20:11:43 <anthony> ... apart from that one you had the marker one
20:12:14 <anthony> Zakim, unmute anthony
20:12:14 <Zakim> anthony_work should no longer be muted
20:12:30 <ChrisL> tpic: markers and color
20:12:34 <anthony> Topic: Marker and Colour
20:13:37 <anthony> CL: currentColor on a given taken element takes the color on a given element and uses it
20:13:56 <anthony> TB: What you're saying is over here I have a marker defined
20:13:59 <Zakim> -tbah
20:14:05 <anthony> ... and over here I have a path defined
20:14:12 <ChrisL> tav we lost you
20:14:27 <tbah> i'll be bach in a sec
20:14:42 <ChrisL> s/TB: What/CL: What/
20:14:47 <Zakim> +tbah
20:15:18 <anthony> TB: Suppose that your marker is defined there is nothing that gives you what the colour is
20:17:15 <anthony> DS: I think Tav one thing to do is make a proposal for specific mechanisms. Why don't you write up some
20:17:17 <anthony> ... spec text
20:17:22 <anthony> ... and we can reviewed that
20:17:39 <anthony> ... I think we all agree that we want the spec to do something useful for markers and colours
20:18:17 <anthony> ... If you find a away and is unlikely to conflict with current implementations then that would be useful
20:19:27 <anthony> ACTION: Tavmjong to Propose text to address issue with marker colours not matching colours of path
20:19:27 <trackbot> Created ACTION-2961 - Propose text to address issue with marker colours not matching colours of path [on Tavmjong Bah - due 2011-02-23].
20:19:31 <Zakim> -ChrisL
20:20:03 <anthony> TB: I liked the idea Patrick suggested in Paris
20:20:11 <Zakim> +ChrisL
20:20:44 <anthony> Topic: Review of Progress Events
20:21:24 <ed> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-svg-wg/2011JanMar/0146.html
20:22:40 <anthony> CL: There was a spec that SVG was doing that was about MAE
20:22:46 <anthony> ... is this a replacement spec?
20:22:57 <anthony> ED: I  think we defined progress events in Tiny 1.2 spec
20:23:04 <anthony> ... so it's not MAE
20:23:47 <ed> http://www.w3.org/TR/SVGTiny12/svgudom.html#events__ProgressEvent
20:24:25 <anthony> Adrian: Progress events spec is used in a number of different places
20:24:53 <anthony> ... it ensures that things a consistent no matter where it is used
20:28:05 <anthony> ED: Sent one minor comment about the spec
20:28:18 <anthony> ... just wondering if there is a set of those events that could be made normative
20:28:26 <anthony> DS: Does it say they are not normative?
20:28:31 <anthony> ED: Yes
20:28:53 <anthony> Adrian: I think it's to do with the naming
20:30:13 <anthony> DS: This is a spec that defines a model rather than a set of events
20:30:26 <anthony> Adrian: You shouldn't expect to see tests on this spec
20:30:35 <anthony> ... because this spec is used by others
20:30:51 <anthony> CL: For SVG 2 would we have to import these and change the names?
20:30:54 <anthony> Adrian: I think so
20:32:29 <anthony> CL: Would you be willing to collect the comments for this spec and send them on?
20:32:34 <anthony> ED: Ok
20:33:53 <anthony> CM: So everyone agrees that next week telcon is cancelled
20:34:09 <Zakim> -ChrisL
20:36:59 <Zakim> -ed
20:37:09 <Zakim> -anthony_work
20:37:15 <Zakim> -adrianba
20:37:18 <Zakim> -Doug_Schepers
20:37:19 <Zakim> -heycam
20:37:19 <Zakim> -tbah
20:37:20 <Zakim> GA_SVGWG(SVG1)2:30PM has ended
20:37:22 <Zakim> Attendees were Doug_Schepers, anthony_work, [IPcaller], ed, heycam, ChrisL, tbah, adrianba
20:39:27 <anthony> trackbot, end telcon
20:39:27 <trackbot> Zakim, list attendees
20:39:27 <Zakim> sorry, trackbot, I don't know what conference this is
20:39:28 <trackbot> RRSAgent, please draft minutes
20:39:28 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/02/16-svg-minutes.html trackbot
20:39:29 <trackbot> RRSAgent, bye
20:39:29 <RRSAgent> I see 2 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2011/02/16-svg-actions.rdf :
20:39:29 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Cameron to Create a Wiki page listing the current tests that have less that 2 passes in SVG 1.1 2nd edition [1]
20:39:29 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/02/16-svg-irc#T20-00-46
20:39:29 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Tavmjong to Propose text to address issue with marker colours not matching colours of path [2]
20:39:29 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/02/16-svg-irc#T20-19-27