See also: IRC log
<trackbot> Date: 29 October 2010
Yolanda: asking about the sections of the final report: size, wirk done, etc
James: maybe copy paste first, and then refine it
<pgroth> Scribe: dgarijo
James: any volunteers for helping in Business Contract Scenario?
<pgroth> james, just ping me if you need anything
James: It's all there, just have to write it down.
Yolanda: focus on the gap
... Should the vocabulary mappings be part of the roadmap or the soa?
<ssahoo2> Some parts of the mapping can be referenced in the "State of the Art"?
Yolanda: It's worth mention it in the soa at least.
<ssahoo2> I can work with you on that James
I can offer my help too.
James: What should be there? and who should write it?
... 2-3 pages long
... 4 parts: When/what reccomendations become real, when are the technological requirements, and the when we think that use cases become feasible.
Paulo: Read all the use cases and done some classification according to the use cases and domain
Yolanda: the focus should be the scenarios, not the use cases
<pgroth> I like the domain idea
Paulo: Still need to figure out,
make draft and send it to the group for feedback?
... We need a justification about why these use cases.
Yolanda: they were based on the groupings we made of provenance
Paulo: are the prov domensions
described before the scenarios
Yolanda: We described the
dimension as we described the requirements
... having the dimensions first is hard to describe
Paulo: Who is going to describe the dimensions?
Yolanda: maybe the dimensions should be in the requirements section
Paulo: how deep does the dimension need to be in the use cases?
Yolanda: No need to name
... the dimension will be on the user requirements
Paulo: 3 pages
<jcheney> can we put size estimates in wiki?
Paul: Really like the idea of
using domain motivation.
... You don't need to motivate why you have the scenario
... happy to put the dimensions on the requirements section
Yolanda: November 12 is our target
<ssahoo2> Daniel: Discussing the bibliography work
Paul: Nice to have both
Yolanda: we will keep both.
Bibbase frozen and Mendeley to add new entries
... move to architecture in Provenance
... Olaf, Luc, Paul and Yolanda working there.
... Luc 's presentation.
Luc: interesting to know what
kind of feedback can we obtain from w3c
... 5 prov situations/ use cases for provenance
Yolanda: presentation which
introduces all the group has done
... separated the slides about web architecture issues
Luc: Has a brainstorm to start
with some ideas
... our goal was to get feedback from w3c also.
... looked at the http response pattern.
... some slides about prov in ws
... Communication pattern. Some prov info included in the answer
... different of passing prov information: by values and by reference
... A bit of overhead because some prov can be big
... the server has to keep the provenance for dynamic resources-> problematic
... ways to insert provenance: http header
... multipart messages. Content and provenance in 2 separate parts.
... RDF-a in html documents
... in pdf, support for metadata that can be used too
... Metrics of possibilities: inserting in the message, the content downloaded, by value, by reference.
... Provenance negotiation between client and server for identifying which representation should be returned.
... Provenance services out there: Times/Third parties
... Different versions of provenance and accounts is interesting too
... Leverage to use SPARQL instead of creating a new lenguage for wuerying
... Important to reuse what is there
... General comment: People very impressed with the presentation
... The ideas were very compatible with what they were thinking
Yolanda: We have clarified the idea of provenance
Luc: First question they had:
they felt that not necessary to have a prov field but a
... Functionality which will be provenance specific?
... Another point raised: Provenance may have provenance
... Little discussion about passing it by value
... question about long term prov services.
<ssahoo2> I think provenance of provenance issue can be decided by the requirements of the application
Luc: What if the domain is moved. How do we find our prov?
<pgroth> yeah agree satya
<pgroth> it grounds out somewhere
The DC Metadata Task group is working about provenance metadata also
<pgroth> that's what we said on the call. and tim seemed to agree
Luc: Metadata framework to make prov available
<ssahoo2> sounds like an interesting discussion, I would have been interested in attending this call with W3C!
Yolanda: Some people would prefer
... we should try to maybe think about designing or coming up with a vocabulary rather an ontology
Luc: Many of us believe that provenance is more than a vocabulary
<ssahoo2> I agree with Luc - vocabulary or ontology has its own cost vs. benefits and both should be available to provenance users
Paulo: These work is the kind of
work done with PML group
... Very happy to see all the presentations. Value or reference-> preferable by refrence beacuse is more lightweith
... Distributed provenance
Luc: It is one of the questions
Yolanda: In slide 2 there are 5 situations, and situation 3 may be useful for this.
Paulo: Key to know who is using the data
<jcheney> i just got cut off...
Paulo: one of the major attractions for many people to use provenance
<pgroth> what was your question james?
<jcheney> i'm back.
<jcheney> just wanted to address the version issue:
ah, yes please!
<Luc> This presentation is not about OPM!
Paulo: Presentation helps to
align pml and opm
... We do it at the server level, not at the http level
Yolanda: continue this
conversation next Friday
... wiki page to continue the discussion too
... extend the wikipage adding the minutes and bring up some ideas
James: The versioning issue. There is a group called Memento
<jcheney> memento (http://www.mementoweb.org/) is already starting to address versioning
yolanda, should i do anything to save all?
trackbot, end telcon
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