15:57:39 RRSAgent has joined #html-wg
15:57:39 logging to http://www.w3.org/2010/10/28-html-wg-irc
15:57:39 morning, folks
15:57:41 RRSAgent, make logs public
15:57:41 Zakim has joined #html-wg
15:57:43 Zakim, this will be html_wg
15:57:43 ok, trackbot, I see HTML_WG()12:00PM already started
15:57:44 Meeting: HTML Weekly Teleconference
15:57:44 Date: 28 October 2010
15:57:55 Mark has joined #html-wg
15:57:58 Zakim, who's on the phone?
15:57:58 On the phone I see Julian, dsinger (muted)
15:57:59 +John_Foliot
15:58:20 zakim, who is here?
15:58:20 On the phone I see Julian, dsinger (muted), John_Foliot
15:58:21 On IRC I see Mark, Zakim, RRSAgent, dsinger_, rubys, paulc, JF, kennyluck, MikeSmith, aroben, Julian, plh, gavin__, Martijnc, mjs, arronei, shepazu, krijnh, karl, hober, inimino,
15:58:23 Dzung_Tran has joined #html-wg
15:58:25 ... gsnedders, jgraham, anne, CIA-1, Shunsuke, heycam, webr3, Hixie, webben, Dashiva, sideshow, gavin, ed_work, Philip, pimpbot, jmb, Jedi, Yudai, drry, hsivonen, jwm, trackbot
15:58:43 +Radhika_Roy
15:58:47 janina has joined #html-wg
15:58:55 +[Microsoft]
15:58:59 zakim, call janina
15:58:59 ok, janina; the call is being made
15:59:00 +Janina
15:59:06 -Janina
15:59:09 Zakim, call Mike-goog
15:59:09 ok, MikeSmith; the call is being made
15:59:11 +Mike
15:59:17 zakim, [Microsoft] has paulc
15:59:17 +paulc; got it
15:59:43 agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-wg-announce/2010OctDec/0005.html
15:59:45 Title: {agenda} HTML WG Telecon 2010-10-28: status of actions, calls, issues, heartbeat drafts, TPAC, Task Force reports from Paul Cotton on 2010-10-28 (public-html-wg-announce@w3.org from October to December 2010) (at lists.w3.org)
15:59:45 Good morning!
15:59:45 zakim, drop janina
15:59:45 sorry, janina, I do not see a party named 'janina'
15:59:51 zakim, call janina
15:59:51 ok, janina; the call is being made
15:59:53 +Janina
16:00:05 I'm dialing
16:00:08 stan_manoski has joined #html-wg
16:01:15 krisk has joined #html-wg
16:01:15 zakim, who is here?
16:01:15 On the phone I see Julian, dsinger (muted), John_Foliot, Radhika_Roy, [Microsoft], Janina, Mike
16:01:17 [Microsoft] has paulc
16:01:18 On IRC I see krisk, stan_manoski, janina, Dzung_Tran, Mark, Zakim, RRSAgent, dsinger_, rubys, paulc, JF, kennyluck, MikeSmith, aroben, Julian, plh, gavin__, Martijnc, mjs, arronei,
16:01:22 ... shepazu, krijnh, karl, hober, inimino, gsnedders, jgraham, anne, CIA-1, Shunsuke, heycam, webr3, Hixie, webben, Dashiva, sideshow, gavin, ed_work, Philip, pimpbot, jmb, Jedi,
16:01:25 ... Yudai, drry, hsivonen, jwm, trackbot
16:01:51 +mjs
16:01:52 + +1.732.859.aaaa
16:01:53 adrianba has joined #html-wg
16:01:57 +Plh
16:02:21 +Cynthia_Shelly
16:02:31 +[Microsoft.a]
16:02:44 -mjs
16:02:49 zakim, [Microsoft.a] has adrianba, krisk
16:02:49 +adrianba, krisk; got it
16:03:08 +mjs
16:03:08 Laura has joined #html-wg
16:04:00 agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-wg-announce/2010OctDec/0005.html
16:04:00 +Laura_Carlson
16:04:01 Title: {agenda} HTML WG Telecon 2010-10-28: status of actions, calls, issues, heartbeat drafts, TPAC, Task Force reports from Paul Cotton on 2010-10-28 (public-html-wg-announce@w3.org from October to December 2010) (at lists.w3.org)
16:04:26 +[Microsoft.aa]
16:04:41 eliot has joined #html-wg
16:04:58 Lachy has joined #html-wg
16:05:07 Chair: Maciej Stachowiak
16:05:10 ScribeNick: adrianba
16:05:16 Scribe: Adrian Bateman
16:05:31 +[Microsoft.aaa]
16:05:34 zakim, microsoft.aaa is me
16:05:34 +eliot; got it
16:05:44 TOPIC: ACTION items due by Thursday, October 28
16:06:02 ACTION-187?
16:06:02 ACTION-187 -- Maciej Stachowiak to inform the group that no comments on issue-9 requirements means they will be accepted -- due 2010-10-28 -- OPEN
16:06:02 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/actions/187
16:06:03 Title: ACTION-187: Inform the group that no comments on issue-9 requirements means they will be accepted - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
16:06:14 mjs: that is done - sent that notice
16:06:25 Norm has joined #html-wg
16:06:28 ...caused some discussion on the mailing list including some pushback
16:06:41 ...encourage anyone else with comments to read and review the requirements
16:06:53 TOPIC: New Issues This Week
16:07:01 close ACTION-187
16:07:01 ACTION-187 Inform the group that no comments on issue-9 requirements means they will be accepted closed
16:07:18 mjs: chairs entered some of the tracker backlog into the tracker since the last telcon so there are quite a few
16:07:19 zakim, aaaa is me
16:07:19 +stan_manoski; got it
16:07:23 ISSUE-132?
16:07:23 ISSUE-132 -- Drop the color input type -- raised
16:07:23 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/132
16:07:24 Title: ISSUE-132: Drop the color input type - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
16:07:40 mjs: suggests removing the input type=color control
16:08:36 ISSUE-133?
16:09:04 mjs: request to add some functionality - an attribute for a modal dialog
16:09:19 ISSUE-134?
16:09:21 ISSUE-133 -- Add a modal attribute to html5 to indicate a modal segment of the DOM (modal dialog) -- raised
16:09:21 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/133
16:09:21 ISSUE-134 -- Provide tablist and tab states for menu and command elements respectively -- raised
16:09:21 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/134
16:09:33 Title: ISSUE-133: Add a modal attribute to html5 to indicate a modal segment of the DOM (modal dialog) - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
16:09:51 ISSUE-135?
16:09:51 ISSUE-135 -- put back direct link to the W3C version of the canvas 2d context spec -- raised
16:09:51 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/135
16:09:52 Title: ISSUE-135: put back direct link to the W3C version of the canvas 2d context spec - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
16:10:08 mjs: suggests adding link back to the w3c canvas spec
16:10:14 ISSUE-136?
16:10:14 ISSUE-136 -- would the element be better handled in CSS? -- raised
16:10:14 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/136
16:10:16 Title: ISSUE-136: would the element be better handled in CSS? - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
16:10:22 mjs: suggests removing the small element
16:10:47 ISSUE-137?
16:10:47 ISSUE-137 -- Since Javascript does not support mode specifiers inside the regular expression, there is no simple way of matching a single word case-insensitively besides turning into [Ww][Oo][Rr][Dd] -- raised
16:10:47 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/137
16:10:49 Title: ISSUE-137: Since Javascript does not support mode specifiers inside the regular expression, there is no simple way of matching a single word case-insensitively besides turning into [Ww][Oo][Rr][Dd] - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
16:11:38 ISSUE-138?
16:11:38 ISSUE-138 -- "mutate action" for issueing a GET request is misleading -- raised
16:11:38 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/138
16:11:39 Title: ISSUE-138: "mutate action" for issueing a GET request is misleading - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
16:11:57 mjs: this is about form submission algorithm in the spec
16:12:15 ...and the particular way it describes some things is confusing - suggested changes to fix that
16:12:19 ISSUE-139?
16:12:19 ISSUE-139 -- HTML5 spec mentions Microdata in Acknowledgements -- raised
16:12:19 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/139
16:12:39 mjs: suggests moving the acknowledgements for microdata from the html5 spec to the microdata spec
16:12:43 ISSUE-140?
16:12:43 ISSUE-140 -- clarify the applicability of the term "conforming document" in cases where "applicable specifications" had been used to augment or change the base HTML5 specification -- raised
16:12:43 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/140
16:12:44 Title: ISSUE-140: clarify the applicability of the term "conforming document" in cases where "applicable specifications" had been used to augment or change the base HTML5 specification - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
16:13:09 mjs: this is about having the term conforming document defined with the relationship to applicable specs
16:13:20 ...currently caught up with tracker requests
16:13:39 ...we've gone through most of the bugs for last call already
16:13:53 ...encourage people to review the issues to see if they want to write a change proposal
16:13:57 ...questions or comments?
16:14:07 TOPIC: Items Closing this Week
16:14:18 ISSUE-121?
16:14:18 ISSUE-121 -- Do not ignore HTTP caching rules -- raised
16:14:18 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/121
16:14:20 Title: ISSUE-121: Do not ignore HTTP caching rules - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
16:14:37 mjs: http-caching - change proposal due oct 30, saturday
16:14:51 ...should volunteer by then or it will be closed without prejudice
16:15:03 TOPIC: New Calls this week
16:15:08 ISSUE-122?
16:15:08 ISSUE-122 -- alt text and description for Lady of Shalott example -- open
16:15:08 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/122
16:15:09 Title: ISSUE-122: alt text and description for Lady of Shalott example - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
16:15:29 mjs: already have a call for proposal - only have null proposal but not a proposal for the original issue
16:15:46 ...chairs reviewed and decided it made more sense to apply the reasoning of this issue to all the wg publications
16:16:05 ...that means that we're asking again for proposals given the expanded scope
16:16:23 ...and asking for the original proposal to be updated to include proposals for all drafts
16:16:35 TOPIC: Heart beat publications
16:16:55 mjs: our heartbeat publications did get published
16:17:08 ...we had another round of all 8 of our drafts published once again
16:17:16 ...good to keep that heartbeat going
16:17:37 q+
16:18:24 paulc: we made a change at the last moment to take comment form off the html5 document and we discovered that microdata and canvas also had the form
16:18:33 ...and so those have been removed for now too
16:18:38 ack paulc
16:18:43 ...chairs did take that feedback from the working group
16:18:56 TOPIC: TPAC next week
16:19:17 mjs: next week is w3c technical plenary and advisory commitee meeting
16:19:28 ...html wg will have a f2f on thursday/friday
16:19:37 ...no telcon that week but will try to keep irc going
16:19:54 ...so people will be able to participate by irc
16:20:11 ...tp day will have interesting sessions including demo and panel discussion about html
16:20:33 TOPIC: Media requirements update
16:20:35 +q
16:20:42 mjs: link in the agenda to the mail i sent out
16:20:55 ...there have been comments on the mailing list
16:21:04 http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/Media_Accessibility_Checklist
16:21:05 Title: Media Accessibility Checklist - HTML accessibility task force Wiki (at www.w3.org)
16:21:17 john: regarding the requirements, if people could look at the checklist as a primary list
16:21:31 ...one of the things we've tried to do is to map these requirements against WCAG and UAAG
16:21:38 ...and using must, should, may criteria
16:21:54 ...if people could look at that and take that into account to try to understand how we got to where we are
16:22:13 janina: i'm glad the discussion is happening - it was making me nervous that there wasn't any
16:22:36 q+
16:22:41 cyns: glad to hear the questions about priority have been addressed - they will be important to make sure we have progress in html5
16:22:45 ack JF
16:23:08 janina: we will do our best to participate in the discussion as well - haven't weighed in yet on the recent mails
16:23:13 q?
16:23:44 paulc: janina and other people interested, do we have someone on point to suggest on thursday morning that we have a discussion during the f2f
16:23:55 janina: i am in favour of doing that - thursday is the best day
16:24:16 ...unfortunately not many media people will be there but have indicated they can participate by telcon
16:24:23 ...the more notice the better
16:24:42 paulc: i answered the logistical set-up question for tpac and we didn't request telcon facilities
16:24:47 ...so it would have to be ad hoc
16:24:50 janina: okay
16:24:59 paulc: we didn't have that at tpac 2009
16:25:11 q+ to say that is normally works pretty well to just use Skype
16:25:18 ...we said we would keep the irc channel open but not planning for telcon to be available
16:25:23 +1 to skype
16:25:33 ...hard for people to hear on the phone in a large room
16:25:49 ...we can try to set-up something but someone needs to be on point to arrange that
16:26:13 ...if someone is going to use Skype or a personal laptop - might be worth anchoring when that session should happen if we consensus to hold it
16:26:34 ...if we could have some discussion about having this on the public list it would help
16:26:41 ...that's what i meant by on point
16:27:04 ...fyi, i did request a breakout room so we can do some topics simultaneously
16:27:19 ...it's very possible a lot of people will want to discuss this topic
16:27:44 janina: i think looking for a time might be a good thing to decide early but we might not be able to resolve the technology before we get there
16:27:56 ...since it is thur/fri we have time
16:28:03 ack paulc
16:28:17 cyns: might we worth mailing people who will be there to bring some hardware
16:28:35 janina: better to use a good device but we can try to do something
16:28:53 q?
16:28:58 I'm not sure we necessarily need a speaker phone.. I have had good results with just using normal speaker and mike from my PC
16:29:00 dsinger has joined #html-wg
16:29:19 +[Apple]
16:29:30 Mike?
16:29:32 MikeSmith: in my exp.....
16:29:35 can't hear you
16:29:39 -dsinger
16:29:42 zakim, [apple] has dsinger
16:29:42 +dsinger; got it
16:29:56 -Mike
16:30:24 ack next
16:30:25 MikeSmith, you wanted to say that is normally works pretty well to just use Skype
16:30:47 TOPIC: Task Force reports - Accessibility Task Force
16:31:06 janina: there isn't anything particular to report beyond what was discussed already for media
16:31:15 ...groups continue to work but nothing particular to report
16:31:38 TOPIC: Task Force reports - Testing Task Force
16:31:57 krisk: we met as planned last week - on 10/19
16:32:01 Notes -> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-testsuite/2010Oct/0024.html
16:32:02 Title: RE: HTML Testing Task Force Conf Call Agenda 10/19/2010 from Kris Krueger on 2010-10-28 (public-html-testsuite@w3.org from October 2010) (at lists.w3.org)
16:32:10 ...there's no meeting on 11/2 because of tpac
16:32:18 ...next meeting is 11/16 - schedule is on the wiki
16:32:25 ...group approved more tests
16:32:30 ...now have 212 approved tests
16:32:41 MikeSmith has joined #html-wg
16:32:41 ...we don't have any active bugs for approved tests at this time, good
16:32:57 ..other good stuff, microsoft updated test results for ie9 platform preview 6
16:33:11 ...google also sent in results to the list so their results are updated for chrome7
16:33:16 ...which is good to see
16:33:29 ...would be good to see other browser vendors update their tests too - they're getting kind of old
16:33:46 ...that's it - i'll be at tpac if anyone wants to talk about testing
16:33:53 -mjs
16:33:54 ...any questions?
16:34:03 sorry, I fell off the line, dialing again
16:34:09 http://test.w3.org/html/tests/reporting/report.htm
16:34:10 Title: HTML5 Conformance Test Results (at test.w3.org)
16:34:26 +mjs
16:34:43 paulc: krisk, are anticipating wanting to have a session during the f2f on testing?
16:34:48 krisk: yes, i'd like to
16:34:59 paulc: i'd encourage you to start a thread on the mailing list
16:35:06 ...you might suggest some items for discussion
16:35:10 laplink has joined #html-wg
16:35:22 ...i'd like to start collecting stuff over the next week so we aren't surprised by topics on thursday morning
16:35:32 that makes sense - I'll send something out to the list before next thursday
16:35:51 TOPIC: Chairs request to revert change to Editor's Draft
16:36:06 mjs: chairs have made request to revert changes to recent editor's draft
16:36:22 ...that included link to whatwg draft and grayed out all the text
16:36:24 q+
16:36:27 ...any questions or comments?
16:36:28 q+
16:36:38 q+
16:36:45