09:03:09 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #mediafrag
09:03:09 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2010/10/20-mediafrag-irc
09:03:11 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public
09:03:11 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #mediafrag
09:03:13 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be IA_MFWG
09:03:13 <Zakim> ok, trackbot; I see IA_MFWG()5:00AM scheduled to start 3 minutes ago
09:03:14 <trackbot> Meeting: Media Fragments Working Group Teleconference
09:03:14 <trackbot> Date: 20 October 2010
09:04:20 <Zakim> IA_MFWG()5:00AM has now started
09:04:28 <Zakim> + +33.9.52.30.aaaa
09:04:30 <raphael> Chair: Raphael
09:04:37 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/10/20-mediafrag-minutes.html raphael
09:04:53 <raphael> zakim, aaaa is raphael
09:04:54 <Zakim> +raphael; got it
09:05:00 <Zakim> +??P5
09:05:01 <raphael> Regrets: Erik, Jack
09:05:12 <jackjansen> jackjansen has joined #mediafrag
09:05:23 <raphael> zakim, +P5 is foolip
09:05:23 <Zakim> sorry, raphael, I do not recognize a party named '+P5'
09:05:29 <raphael> zakim, +??P5 is foolip
09:05:29 <Zakim> sorry, raphael, I do not recognize a party named '+??P5'
09:05:32 <raphael> zakim, P5 is foolip
09:05:32 <Zakim> sorry, raphael, I do not recognize a party named 'P5'
09:05:37 <raphael> zakim, ??P5 is foolip
09:05:37 <Zakim> +foolip; got it
09:06:03 <raphael> Present: Philip, raphael, davy, jack (irc), silvia, Yves
09:06:15 <raphael> Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-media-fragment/2010Oct/0013.html
09:06:19 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/10/20-mediafrag-minutes.html raphael
09:06:28 <Zakim> + +61.2.801.2.aabb
09:06:28 <Zakim> +Davy
09:06:39 <silvia> Zakim, aabb is me
09:06:39 <Zakim> +silvia; got it
09:08:50 <silvia> zakim, mute me
09:08:50 <Zakim> silvia should now be muted
09:09:20 <raphael> Scribe: raphael
09:09:24 <raphael> Scribenick: raphael
09:09:29 <raphael> topic: 1. Admin
09:09:40 <raphael> PROPOSED to accept the minutes of the 06 October 2010 telecon
09:09:46 <raphael> http://www.w3.org/2010/10/06-mediafrag-minutes.html
09:09:48 <foolip> +1
09:09:50 <davy> +1
09:09:55 <raphael> minutes are accepted
09:10:34 <raphael> ACTION-185?
09:10:34 <trackbot> ACTION-185 -- Yves Lafon to book zakim for the 2 days meeting of the group on Mon 1st and Tue 2nd Nov -- due 2010-09-29 -- OPEN
09:10:34 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/tracker/actions/185
09:11:03 <silvia> zakim, unmute me
09:11:03 <Zakim> silvia should no longer be muted
09:11:55 <foolip> November 1 and 2, any time between 0800 and 1800 in UTC+2
09:12:12 <raphael> Raphael: for Silvia and Philip, could you write down time slot where we can phone you
09:12:15 <silvia> Monday is better for me than Tuesday - it's both in the afternoon/evening for me, I think
09:12:33 <foolip> in other words, any time is fine, since I'm in the same timezone as TPAC
09:12:56 <raphael> zakim, who is make noise
09:12:56 <Zakim> I don't understand 'who is make noise', raphael
09:13:01 <raphael> zakim, who is make noise?
09:13:01 <Zakim> I don't understand your question, raphael.
09:13:07 <raphael> zakim, who is making noise?
09:13:10 <silvia> if you start early, I can join in the mornings
09:13:21 <Zakim> raphael, listening for 11 seconds I heard sound from the following: raphael (76%), foolip (76%)
09:13:32 <raphael> zakim, mute foolip
09:13:32 <Zakim> foolip should now be muted
09:14:06 <raphael> Topic: 2. MEDIA FRAGMENT EXTENSION
09:14:22 <raphael> ACTION-189?
09:14:22 <trackbot> ACTION-189 -- Raphaël Troncy to put the top-level production rules back into the document (in section 4.3.5 or 4.1) -- due 2010-10-06 -- OPEN
09:14:22 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/tracker/actions/189
09:14:59 <silvia> ok
09:15:22 <foolip> can't say anything until I see the actual suggestion for the spec
09:16:37 <raphael> Raphael: I will implement the ACTION-189 in the spec and ask all the group if we can close this issue
09:16:43 <raphael> Topic: 3. Implementation experiment
09:16:58 <foolip> Zakim, unmute me
09:16:58 <Zakim> foolip should no longer be muted
09:17:19 <raphael> Raphael: problem with pixels, are we talking about physical pixels or css pixels?
09:17:26 <raphael> Silvia: pixels in video are always a problem
09:18:29 <silvia> zakim, mute me
09:18:29 <Zakim> silvia should now be muted
09:18:37 <raphael> Raphael: I'm looking for a reference that we could use so that any developers understand what we are talking about
09:18:55 <raphael> Philip: this definition is provided by HTML5 and not CSS
09:19:05 <foolip> http://www.whatwg.org/specs/web-apps/current-work/multipage/video.html#concept-video-intrinsic-width
09:20:01 <Zakim> -silvia
09:20:20 <foolip> http://dev.w3.org/html5/spec/video.html#concept-video-intrinsic-width
09:21:19 <raphael> ACTION: troncy to update our spec to talk about video intrinsic width
09:21:20 <trackbot> Created ACTION-190 - Update our spec to talk about video intrinsic width [on Raphaël Troncy - due 2010-10-27].
09:24:23 <foolip> well, there's an issue we discussed at FOMS
09:25:30 <raphael> Davy: this issue is solved
09:25:32 <foolip> ah :)
09:25:42 <raphael> ... there is indeed too many byte ranges to send to the UA
09:26:10 <foolip> do you always redirect, or just when number of ranges > n ?
09:26:11 <raphael> ... therefore, we send a redirect pointing to a media fragment with the ?
09:26:34 <foolip> always seems simpler :)
09:26:37 <raphael> Davy: currently, always redirect
09:27:18 <raphael> Raphael: the UA issues a new request with the query parameter
09:27:31 <raphael> Davy: yes, and we had a Link header pointing to the master resource
09:31:25 <raphael> Philip: we could implement that but I really wonder if it is useful
09:31:46 <raphael> ... we will always need a specialized server
09:32:00 <raphael> ... so the query parameter migt be enough
09:32:15 <raphael> Davy: there are other scenarios where the # is useful
09:32:18 <raphael> ... we should have both
09:32:36 <raphael> ... even if in the retrieval behavior, the # will always be converted into the ?
09:32:49 <raphael> s/behavior/scenario
09:33:04 <raphael> Philip: what should we do with the name dimension
09:34:37 <raphael> Davy: in MP4, refer to the cue points; in Matroska, refer to the chapters names
09:34:51 <raphael> Philip: OK, yes the chapters are part of WebM
09:35:45 <silvia> and Ogg can have chapters through a srt chapter track in Ogg Kate
09:36:23 <raphael> Raphael: ok, so it seems important that we cover the name dimension even if it is limited to chapter names!
09:36:44 <raphael> Raphael: last issue from Philip, make the hour optional in specifying the time dimension
09:36:54 <raphael> ... currently, we need one or two digits
09:37:05 <raphael> ... but most clips have duration less than 1 hour
09:37:19 <raphael> ... but the grammar will be more complicated
09:37:37 <raphael> ... because we could then have just one digit for the minutes
09:37:48 <raphael> Philip: in WebSRT, the hours are optional
09:38:19 <raphael> Raphael: I suggest we discuss this at the F2F
09:39:51 <silvia> I would support that if you can find a grammar to describe it correctly - it's also more complicated to implement then, btw
09:40:23 <raphael> Look at the demos at http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/code/plugin/demos/
09:41:39 <raphael> Davy: yes, Ninsuna understands range request with SMPTE time codes
09:41:47 <raphael> ... and answers with smpte time codes
09:41:54 <raphael> ... though I need to check
09:42:19 <raphael> Yes Silvia, that's also our conclusion, re the gramme
09:42:24 <raphael> s/gramme/grammar
09:43:07 <raphael> ... the questio is who is willing to work out this more complex grammar? I suggest to hack this during the f2f but if you want to work on it before, please feel free
09:45:14 <silvia> do it with Yves - he is good at that stuff :)
09:46:01 <raphael> Topic: 4. AOB
09:46:15 <raphael> no other topic to discuss
09:46:19 <Zakim> -raphael
09:46:22 <raphael> meeting adjourned
09:46:22 <Zakim> -Davy
09:46:27 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/10/20-mediafrag-minutes.html raphael
09:46:28 <foolip> ok, about the syntax then
09:47:05 <foolip> it's be simplest to just say that all components are 1 or 2 digits
09:47:13 <foolip> ugly, but simpler, and simple is good :)
09:47:20 <raphael> :-)
09:47:41 <foolip> but let's discuss that further later
09:47:42 <raphael> we will see what the grammar should loook like, indeed, Yves might be able to sort that out elegantly
09:47:52 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/10/20-mediafrag-minutes.html raphael
09:48:47 <raphael> ScribeOptions: -final -noEmbedDiagnostics
09:48:49 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/10/20-mediafrag-minutes.html raphael
09:49:19 <davy> davy has left #mediafrag
09:49:32 <Zakim> -foolip
09:49:33 <Zakim> IA_MFWG()5:00AM has ended
09:49:35 <Zakim> Attendees were +33.9.52.30.aaaa, raphael, foolip, +61.2.801.2.aabb, Davy, silvia
09:51:17 <silvia> bye!
09:52:08 <raphael> raphael has left #mediafrag
09:54:59 <jackjansen> bye!
09:55:03 <jackjansen> jackjansen has left #mediafrag
11:51:25 <Zakim> Zakim has left #mediafrag