W3C

- DRAFT -

LLD XG

07 Oct 2010

Agenda

See also: IRC log

Attendees

Present
+33.1.53.79.aaaa, emma, TomB, jeff_, antoine, Jonathan_Rees, rsinger, marcia, matolat, kcoyle, rayd, +1.404.892.aabb, pmurray, digikim, Oreste, MarkA, michaelp
Regrets
Anette, Gordon, Jodi, Felix, Lars, Alex, Kai, Monica, Martin, Andras, Jon, Kevin, Oreste
Chair
Emmanuelle
Scribe
rayd, Ray

Contents


<oreste> regrets, called in another meeting, I will leave a few minutes after the telecon start

<emma> Previous: 2010-09-30 http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/09/30-lld-minutes.html

<emma> aaaa is me

<jeff_> zakim jeff is me

<bvatant> will follow only IRC today

<bvatant> conflicting agendas again

<bvatant> apologies

<matolat> zakim jeff_.a is matolat

<emma> ?

<MarkA> logged on using new nick, but old one persists

<digikim> Zakim P1 is me

<rsinger> jump in the pool, ray!

<pmurray> I'm also quite new to W3C processes and procedures -- this is my first working group.

<MarkA> cant get on phone now, VU phone central's not patching me through, try later...

<emma> Scribe: rayd

<emma> Scribe: Ray

<emma> scribenick: rayd

topic admin

admin

emma: accept minutes?

<antoine> RESOLVED: To accept minutes of previous telecon: http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/09/30-lld-minutes.html

emma: minutes accepted

summary of telecon

face to face meeting

<emma>

emma: meeting friday oct 22 joint meeting with dc arch there is a draft agenda will post link

tomB: summary of tc with dc arch moving forward or not with dcmi model, alot has changed since model has been put forward
... looking at ways to deprecate model and adopt rdf abstract model, finalize by oct 15
... for meeting on 22 there will be many who sho up becaus they are at the dc mtg in addition to 16 already signed up, good presentations planned
... be able to compare and contrast the 2 different approaches, marcia and gordon will present; long discussion about requirement s for app profiles - one way or several

<Zakim> antoine, you wanted to comment on action

antoine: is everyone happy with proposed agenda?

tomB: program is solid now, not much time for more, focus on preparing agenda as proposed.

<antoine> ACTION: Any proposed changes to agenda for joint meeting with DC Architecture Forum (http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/wiki/JointMeeting2010), please email TomB [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/09/30-lld-minutes.html#action01] [DONE]

sat/sun part of meeting

<emma> http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/F2F_Pittsburgh

emma: lot of change on agenda, everyone look at it.
... if you haven't registered and you plan to come, add your name.
... everyone attending should present a use case.
... sunday, sessions on use cases and topics.
... topic: use cases

Use cases

<Abartov> so, seeing as I have only recently added my use case, should I add it to the F2F agenda in case I make it there?

<antoine> yes!

<kcoyle> yes, reminder

<pmurray> reminder++

<marcia> yes, some organization has been preparing, e.g., FAO

<Abartov>

<antoine> my yes was to abartov :-)

emma: send reminder to lists about use cases?

<marcia> +1

<kcoyle> yes, same as first time

<emma> ack

<Zakim> pmurray, you wanted to discuss library-oriented lists

<antoine>

<oreste> sorry, leaving for the other meeting

pmurray: should we add more library-oriented lists, e.g. code-for-lib?

<antoine> code4lib is on the list...

<antoine> ACTION: first use case call senders to send a reminder to the lists they added on http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/Dissemination_Lists [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/10/07-lld-minutes.html#action02]

<emma> http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/UseCaseNotes

emma: use case notes page, review it to see if there are use cases missing
... ... e.g. citations.

kcoyle: during discussion at face to face are we going to try to fill in gaps?

<antoine> +1 for just identifying the gaps at the F2F first

<TomB> +1 for identifying gaps - we can work on filling them during the rest of our charter

emma: good question, not sure there will be time. will have time after face to face to fill in gaps.

<MarkA> don't see the SURF UC (contributed at dutchsemweb-l) in the list?

<marcia> +1 for identifying gaps. Members who contributed UCs may be able to fill in more

<antoine> I plan to send them a mail later asking them to try to fill the form

<antoine> it was an interesting case in fact

actions

<antoine> ACTION: emma, kcoyle, GordonD, Marcia, bvatant to structure the discussion of use cases in light of the topic list [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/09/23-lld-minutes.html#action01] [CONTINUES]

<antoine> ACTION: Karen to export spreadsheet, and Asaf to convert to wiki table [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/09/30-lld-minutes.html#action02] [DONE]

<antoine>

<antoine> ACTION: Use-case owner(s) to check table and matches [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/09/30-lld-minutes.html#action03] [CONTINUES]

<antoine> ACTION: Topic owners to check table and think about supplying additional use-cases [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/09/30-lld-minutes.html#action04] [CONTINUES]

<antoine> ACTION: Alexander to create wiki page for identifying requirements [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/09/30-lld-minutes.html#action06] [DONE]

<antoine>

<antoine>

kcoyle: occurs that we didn't ask people what gaps they see

emma: problems and limitations sections

kcoyle: do we have good enough gap analysis

<digikim> (off topic: MarkVanAssem: SeCo won 1 hour ago the first prize in a open data competition in Finland: http://www.slideshare.net/apps4finland/apps4finland-2010-voittajat -- check slide 15; sorry partially in Finnish)

emma: we should go back to the use case owner when gaps are identified.

<Abartov> +1

<digikim> :)

emma: would be good if people attending would act as advocate for one or more use cases

<Abartov> +1

<kcoyle> yes

<antoine> +1 (but I'm not here next week :-)

emma: ... not a use case you have contributed, a different use case

<pmurray> Did you say people /not/ advocate for a use case they have submitted?

<TomB> +1 - "shepherds" lead discussion of that use case...

<antoine> @pmurray: yes

<MarkA> digikim: congrats!!

<antoine> digikim++

<MarkA> +1 shepherds

<pmurray> Agreed.

<Abartov> We could try to identify UCs whose owners won't be at the F2F, and see if we can match volunteers to work with the owner and prepare to advocate the UC at the F2F.

<antoine> good idea, asaf

<TomB> Where should "shepherds" sign their names -- directly in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/F2F_Pittsburgh#Use_case_discussion_9:00-10:30_.2B_11:00-12:30 ?

<matolat> how much time per case? Or will it be by interest?

<antoine> ACTION: participants to volunteer as use case 'shepherds' by signing their names in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/F2F_Pittsburgh#Use_case_discussion_9:00-10:30_.2B_11:00-12:30 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/10/07-lld-minutes.html#action08]

<MarkA> shepherd = champion, proponent

I don't think either "shepherd" or "advocate" is quite the right term, I think "presenter" is.

<emma> the shepherd should have read the UC carefully and is prepared to lead discussion. It's not about producing an analysis but to lead discussion. Everyone should read 1 or 2 UC, in order to spread the work

<TomB> discussion leader?

<rsinger> they are also moderator

<digikim> (as an outcome of this wg, we should recommend to create a new wg on the topic of "shepherd" vs "advocate" vs "presenter")

<rsinger> "sucker"

<TomB> let's call them something in French :-)

<MarkA> "le suckeeeer"

<TomB> animateur...

use topics

Topics

<marcia> http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/Topics

kcoyle: do we want to do anymore work elaborating on topics before f2f or leave it as is?

<marcia> I think some editing may be needed

emma: ok to leave table as starting point.

<TomB> +1 for short names, "handles" - better than numbers...

kcoyle: can add short name for reference.

<marcia> +1 for short names

<TomB> Karen, see http://www.w3.org/TR/skos-ucr/#Requirements for examples of short names

<antoine> ACTION: karen to add short names to the topics page [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/10/07-lld-minutes.html#action09]

<antoine> ACTION: Everyone to elaborate on topics in the wiki [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/07/08-lld-minutes.html#action08]

<antoine> --

<antoine> DONE

<antoine> --DONE

wiki pages for capturing relevant links and ideas

<rsinger> er

<michaelp> A few data sets are on the Linked Data cloud.

<marcia> +1 for a list

<rsinger> michaelp: right, but it's not comprehensive

<michaelp> Upper right hand corner.

rsinger: is there a list of all the lld that exists in the wild and if so it should go in this wiki

<kcoyle> there is the linked data cloud -- i t has some bib data

<marcia> sections on those already there and some are experimenting

<rsinger> michaelp: that appeared in my talk

<michaelp> +1 for a list, plus some basic facts: size, SPARQL endpoint, etc.

<jar> agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xg-lld/2010Oct/0016.html

<antoine> ACTION: ross to create a page with LLD data sets on the wiki [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/10/07-lld-minutes.html#action11]

<rsinger> i won't be at the f2f, anyway

upcoming topics

emma: Technology and best practices and Community building and outreach

emma ... we will discuss next week

<digikim> thanks

<rsinger> thanks!

<antoine> ACTION: Everyone to elaborate on topics in the wiki [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/07/08-lld-minutes.html#action08] [DONE]

Summary of Action Items

[NEW] ACTION: Everyone to elaborate on topics in the wiki [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/07/08-lld-minutes.html#action08]
[NEW] ACTION: first use case call senders to send a reminder to the lists they added on http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/Dissemination_Lists [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/10/07-lld-minutes.html#action02]
[NEW] ACTION: karen to add short names to the topics page [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/10/07-lld-minutes.html#action09]
[NEW] ACTION: participants to volunteer as use case 'shepherds' by signing their names in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/F2F_Pittsburgh#Use_case_discussion_9:00-10:30_.2B_11:00-12:30 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/10/07-lld-minutes.html#action08]
[NEW] ACTION: ross to create a page with LLD data sets on the wiki [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/10/07-lld-minutes.html#action11]
 
[PENDING] ACTION: emma, kcoyle, GordonD, Marcia, bvatant to structure the discussion of use cases in light of the topic list [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/09/23-lld-minutes.html#action01]
[PENDING] ACTION: Topic owners to check table and think about supplying additional use-cases [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/09/30-lld-minutes.html#action04]
[PENDING] ACTION: Use-case owner(s) to check table and matches [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/09/30-lld-minutes.html#action03]
 
[DONE] ACTION: Alexander to create wiki page for identifying requirements [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/09/30-lld-minutes.html#action06]
[DONE] ACTION: Any proposed changes to agenda for joint meeting with DC Architecture Forum (http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/wiki/JointMeeting2010), please email TomB [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/09/30-lld-minutes.html#action01]
[DONE] ACTION: Everyone to elaborate on topics in the wiki [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/07/08-lld-minutes.html#action08]
[DONE] ACTION: Karen to export spreadsheet, and Asaf to convert to wiki table [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/09/30-lld-minutes.html#action02]
 
[End of minutes]

Minutes formatted by David Booth's scribe.perl version 1.135 (CVS log)
$Date: 2010/10/07 15:03:37 $

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Scribes: rayd, Ray

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Default Present: +33.1.53.79.aaaa, emma, TomB, jeff_, antoine, Jonathan_Rees, rsinger, marcia, matolat, kcoyle, rayd, +1.404.892.aabb, pmurray, digikim, Oreste, MarkA, michaelp
Present: +33.1.53.79.aaaa emma TomB jeff_ antoine Jonathan_Rees rsinger marcia matolat kcoyle rayd +1.404.892.aabb pmurray digikim Oreste MarkA michaelp
Regrets: Anette Gordon Jodi Felix Lars Alex Kai Monica Martin Andras Jon Kevin Oreste
Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xg-lld/2010Oct/0016.html
Got date from IRC log name: 07 Oct 2010
Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2010/10/07-lld-minutes.html

WARNING: No person found for ACTION item: topic owners to check table and think about supplying additional use-cases [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/incubator/lld/minutes/2010/09/30-lld-minutes.html#action04]


WARNING: No person found for ACTION item: participants to volunteer as use case 'shepherds' by signing their names in http://www.w3.org/2005/incubator/lld/wiki/f2f_pittsburgh#use_case_discussion_9:00-10:30_.2b_11:00-12:30 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/10/07-lld-minutes.html#action08]

People with action items: bvatant call case emma everyone first gordond karen kcoyle marcia owner ross s senders use use-case

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