17:43:03 RRSAgent has joined #gallery 17:43:03 logging to http://www.w3.org/2010/10/01-gallery-irc 17:43:31 ===== snapshot: 3 bits: wiki overview; sample half-dozen; css zen garden ====== 17:43:42 -Elizabeth 17:43:59 zakim, next item 17:43:59 agendum 3. "Prep for Challenge.gov posting (content; admin host; w3c; accessibility; length; other)" taken up [from Judy] 17:44:14 +Cynthia_Shelly 17:47:26 Judy: was there a need for legal review? I think it was for prizes, but we will not be prize oriented. There was a review by W3C management for W3C sponsorship and there was enthusiasm 17:47:52 Jamal: There is greater review if there is prize money. There is also review if there is a panel of judges. 17:48:19 ... they don't want it to appear that any company we regulate is getting favor by helping us with this project. 17:49:53 Judy: there has been concern about accessibility of the site itself. We haven't sent them a formal "these are our concerns". 17:50:07 Jamal: That has been on my to-do list. 17:52:01 Judy: We can have an informal meeting next week and bring it up at the Unconference to get a list. 17:52:56 John: Or give them the worst problem, and encourage them to fix it, then tell them the next problem. 17:55:51 Judy: What if we set a 3 month time limit initially and if it was going smoothly, we can extend it. What do people think of a short start up with a permanent gallery. 17:56:18 Jamal: I like it. It motivates people to do it now rather than postpone it if they have a long deadline. 17:57:53 zakim, close this item 17:57:53 agendum 3 closed 17:57:53 zakim, next item 17:57:54 I see 7 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is 17:57:57 4. Updates on approach for reviewing submissions (criteria; skills; people; training; tracking; turn-around) [from Judy] 17:57:59 agendum 4. "Updates on approach for reviewing submissions (criteria; skills; people; training; tracking; turn-around)" taken up [from Judy] 17:58:04 zakim, take up next item 17:58:04 agendum 4 was just opened, jeanne 17:58:06 As long as we combine a short-term challenge program with a longer-term (or permenant) hosting and searching mechanism, short is fine. Short is probably better for motivating people. 18:00:24 Jan: We met for 20 minutes. We would need different categores, because the need for evaluating a static HTML template would be very different from the time to evaluate a complex widget. 18:02:42 ... for large submissions from an organization, then we would spot check 5-10% and put all the submissions up. If there were complaints, the entire submission would be taken down. If we got submissions from high school classes, we could have responses ready to thank them and send to them with suggestions. Keep separate the challenge from direct submissions from more trusted groups. 18:03:46 Cyn: Some of the things we (microsoft) would want to submit, are in Sharepoint and already have WCAG conformance statements. 18:04:18 Jan: This is exactly what we meant - where we would do some spot-checking. We need to discuss what would be a reasonable sample. 18:05:08 Judy: Next Saturday, could Jeanne or Jamal some session on evaluating these kinds of things. 18:05:22 John: Do a group on testing and then go into this? 18:07:11 Jamal: It is hard to describe in the abstract. If there were samples to show, that would help. 18:07:20 Judy: there will be samples by then. 18:08:09 John: Last year, there was a group doing coding, it may be possible to get some involvment. 18:09:36 Judy: We could also reach out to Loretta Guarino-Reed, for her experience with the WCAG rollout. 18:10:43 ... for example, if there is disagreement between people as to what is accessible, we don't want to make it very public. Be sensitive to the fact that this could be someone's product. 18:10:57 ... we had to document very clear conformance examples. 18:11:27 Jan: We aren't saying it is accessible, but we can pick and choose what goes in the gallery without saying whether or not it is accessible. 18:11:47 [note to judy: note expectations in gallery text, wrt conformance support & whether something gets posted] 18:12:12 zakim, next item 18:12:12 agendum 5. "Further discussion on security and persistence of linked off-site resources" taken up [from Judy] 18:13:14 Jan will be traveling the next week. Judy will try to capture in the wiki what Jan and Jeanne discussed. The following week, we will firm that up. 18:14:13 Jeanne should meet with Loretta and Michael to do a simpler version of the testing. Judy will send an email to Loretta and Michael to help with priorities. 18:15:34 Topic: Hosting and off-site hosting. How do we make sure that the material is not changed? 18:15:58 Jan: There could be a disclaimer that it was checked on a certain date, and a link to report a problem. 18:17:12 Judy: We need to have some kind of submission agreeemnt that you will try to keep the submission persistent and accessible. 18:17:35 Jamal: I don't think it would be a problem with a 90 day challenge. 18:17:47 Judy: I am also thinking of longer term gallery. 18:18:05 ====== [note on persistence & security: *was checked on* date + disclaimer + link to report + (?and possibly, an agreement if posted) 18:18:32 zakim, next item 18:18:32 agendum 6. "Candidate hosts for the stable longer-term gallery" taken up [from Judy] 18:21:22 Judy: What would the criteria be for a host for a longer term gallery? A federal agency, an international agency? 18:22:01 ??: I think it should be its own organization. Even if it was a .gov, it would not be under one agency. 18:22:20 Cyn: International - where all would be welcome 18:22:53 ==== criteria for longer-term host of gallery itself ==== 18:23:03 + international 18:23:16 + its own identity 18:23:22 + decent bandwidth 18:23:33 + backed by data-center quality 18:23:50 rrsagent, make minutes 18:23:50 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/10/01-gallery-minutes.html jeanne 18:23:58 rrsagent, make logs public 18:24:05 + persistent 18:24:35 + funding....??? 18:25:02 zakim, next item 18:25:02 agendum 7. "Confirming "prime the pump" submissions; circulate samples to list now; cross-review initial set?" taken up [from Judy] 18:25:29 zakim, who is here? 18:25:29 On the phone I see John_Croston, Judy, jeanne, Jamal, Jan, Cynthia_Shelly 18:25:31 On IRC I see RRSAgent, cyns, Jan, jeanne, Zakim, Judy 18:26:26 Judy: looking for a diverse collection (about 12 items) to start out the gallary 18:29:52 Cyn: had an interesting example that she saw in Vienna. She will send to Judy. 18:30:03 ==== candidates for "priming the pump" initial high-confidence submissions ==== 18:30:06 Microsoft, Adobe, Hi-Software, AEGIS, IDRC, IBM, Fluid, SS, IRS 18:32:06 MS/CS; Ad/AK; HS/D; AE/PK; IDRC/JR; IBM/ASW; FL/JR; SS/DK; IRS/JC 18:34:33 agenda? 18:35:14 topic: cross-reviewing the initial submissions 18:36:00 Judy: we are building a community behind this effort. I would like to get 6 people who would commit to reviewing someone else's submission. 18:37:31 ==== Willing to help look at the initial samples: Jamal, John after unconf; Cynthia; Jeanne; 18:37:50 Cyn: concern about the environment issue - having a system that would be able to install the widgets 18:37:52 jb -- check two other people not here today 18:38:25 We will have ARIA stuff from John and Jan. 18:38:49 zakim, next item 18:38:49 agendum 8. "Outreach goals at tomorrow's unconference (who; presentations; recruiting sites & evaluators)" taken up [from Judy] 18:39:14 s/at tomorrow's/at next week's/ 18:42:25 jeanne and John will talk about presenting at the Camp. Jeanne will talk about ATAG and mention the gallery. 18:43:52 Jeanne may talk about testing and mention the gallery. Jeanne will talk with John to see if there is something that Jeanne can contribute about testing 18:45:45 John, Jamal and Jeanne will talk about the Gallery with the larger audience, that will reach a broader group. 18:48:17 * upfront 5 minute bit 18:48:35 * atag2 presentation/jeanne/mentions challenge 18:49:03 * challenge/gallery presentation/jamal (depending) 18:49:42 recruiting goals -- planning; submissions; evaluation 18:49:49 agenda? 18:52:03 Judy: On evaluation of submissions - WCAG always had two people review each submission, sometimes people had very different responses. Sometimes it was the evaluator, who may not have the knowledge or experience to evaluate. 18:54:05 Jeanne: Often, when there were differences, the two evaluators and Loretta would exchange email or get on the phone and compare notes. Often it could be worked out where someone missed something or that we had to agree on interpretation. But every discrepancy was worked out. 18:54:42 zakim, close this item 18:54:42 agendum 8 closed 18:54:43 I see 2 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is 18:54:45 9. Update on potential launch scenarios and schedule [from Judy] 18:54:50 zakim, take up next 18:54:50 agendum 9. "Update on potential launch scenarios and schedule" taken up [from Judy] 18:55:13 Judy: @@ [brief overview of schedule] 18:56:01 launch the week of the 26 or the 18? 18:56:41 John: I am not available until the 11th, so that only gives me a week for a launch date of the 18. 18:56:51 Cyn: october is good for me. 18:57:20 Jeanne: 18th launch date would be difficult for me. 18:58:26 zakim, close this item 18:58:26 agendum 9 closed 18:58:27 I see 1 item remaining on the agenda: 18:58:28 10. Upcoming meetings schedule [from Judy] 18:58:33 zakim, take up next? 18:58:33 I don't understand your question, jeanne. 18:58:38 zakim, take up next 18:58:38 agendum 10. "Upcoming meetings schedule" taken up [from Judy] 18:58:54 Judy: Keep the same schedule for upcoming weeks. 18:59:07 John: I will be speaking at the time. 18:59:26 Jan: traveling 18:59:39 Jeanne and Cyn are good for next week. 19:00:12 -Jamal 19:00:13 -Cynthia_Shelly 19:00:14 -John_Croston 19:00:19 -Judy 19:00:24 -Jan 19:05:25 disconnecting the lone participant, jeanne, in WAI_(Gallery)1:30PM 19:05:28 WAI_(Gallery)1:30PM has ended 19:05:30 Attendees were +1.703.602.aaaa, Judy, jeanne, +1.202.418.aabb, Jamal, Jan, +1.202.418.aacc, Elizabeth, John_Croston, Cynthia_Shelly 19:19:52 zakim, bye 19:19:52 Zakim has left #gallery 19:19:58 rrsagent, make minutes 19:19:58 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/10/01-gallery-minutes.html jeanne 19:20:36 present+ John_Croston, Judy, jeanne, Jamal, Jan, Cynthia_Shelly, Elizabeth 19:20:43 chair: judy