13:24:04 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #bpwg
13:24:04 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2010/09/28-bpwg-irc
13:24:06 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public
13:24:06 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #bpwg
13:24:08 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be BPWG
13:24:08 <Zakim> ok, trackbot; I see MWI_BPWG()9:30AM scheduled to start in 6 minutes
13:24:09 <trackbot> Meeting: Mobile Web Best Practices Working Group Teleconference
13:24:09 <trackbot> Date: 28 September 2010
13:26:31 <francois> Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-bpwg/2010Sep/0010.html
13:26:37 <francois> Chair: jo
13:27:07 <francois> Regrets: yeliz, kai, miguel
13:27:21 <adam> adam has joined #bpwg
13:27:22 <twhume> Zakim, what is the code?
13:27:22 <Zakim> the conference code is 2794 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 tel:+33.4.26.46.79.03 tel:+44.203.318.0479), twhume
13:27:49 <Zakim> MWI_BPWG()9:30AM has now started
13:27:56 <Zakim> +adam
13:29:54 <Zakim> +DKA
13:30:12 <DKA> DKA has joined #bpwg
13:30:14 <Zakim> +francois
13:30:15 <Zakim> + +44.203.141.aaaa
13:30:21 <EdC> EdC has joined #bpwg
13:30:21 <jo> zakim, aaaa is me
13:30:22 <Zakim> +jo; got it
13:30:50 <francois> zakim, mute me
13:30:50 <Zakim> francois should now be muted
13:31:57 <jo> twhume, you want to try again?
13:32:28 <jo> i am in on UK
13:32:45 <DKA> zakim, what is the code?
13:32:45 <Zakim> the conference code is 2794 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 tel:+33.4.26.46.79.03 tel:+44.203.318.0479), DKA
13:32:49 <Zakim> + +31.97.2.aabb
13:33:26 <francois> ack me
13:33:53 <Zakim> + +44.127.381.aacc
13:34:02 <twhume> Zakim, aacc is me
13:34:02 <Zakim> +twhume; got it
13:34:24 <francois> zakim, mute me
13:34:24 <Zakim> francois should now be muted
13:34:29 <DKA> Scribe: Dan
13:34:31 <DKA> ScribeNick: DKA
13:34:37 <DKA> Topic: BP2
13:34:47 <DKA> Jo: Francois? A run-down?
13:34:54 <francois> ack me
13:35:03 <francois> -> http://www.w3.org/2010/07/mwabp-implementation-report MWABP implementation report
13:35:51 <EdC> The matrix of implementation reports looks good. 
13:36:07 <DKA> Francois: We are good. There are 3 best practices for which we don't have 2 proper implementation reports but I think it's OK. We have evidence of implementation in the world of "fingerprinting" - links in discussion in the mailing list.
13:36:26 <DKA> PROPOSED RESOLUTION: We are good to go on fingerprinting.
13:36:42 <EdC> Why are entries in the column Uxebu marked "yes" instead of "pass" ?
13:36:52 <DKA> PROPOSED RESOLUTION: We are good to go on fingerprinting - i.e. point 14 of the implementation report ya know.
13:37:00 <jo> +1
13:37:01 <DKA> +1
13:37:03 <adam> +1
13:37:07 <twhume> +1
13:37:10 <francois> +1
13:37:16 <EdC> 0
13:37:18 <DKA> RESOLUTION: We are good to go on fingerprinting - i.e. point 14 of the implementation report.
13:37:25 <DKA> [no objections]
13:37:26 <francois> [EdC, there's indeed a slight problem in the table layout, I'll fix that]
13:38:37 <DKA> Francois: Moving to number 21. We have 2 implementation reports for that. I just note that the last implementation report said that they don't think it's that useful on mobile devices. I don't think we should worry about it.
13:39:00 <DKA> Francois: Unless there are any objections don't think we need a resolution.
13:39:03 <DKA> Jo: OK.
13:39:14 <DKA> Francois: Number 22- use fragment ID...
13:39:49 <DKA> Francois: We have multiple implementation reports but they all come from the same companies. Pity we don't have evidence from more than 1 company but it does exist in the wild...
13:40:11 <DKA> Jo: It is extemely widely used - so not worried.
13:40:22 <DKA> Adam: It's worth noting that it's wildly used on desktop as well.
13:40:48 <DKA> PROPOSED RESOLUTION: We agree that Nunber 22- use fragment ID is OK to go even though all the formal implementation reports are from one company...
13:40:57 <adam> +1
13:41:00 <EdC> +1
13:41:03 <francois> +1
13:41:08 <jo> +1
13:41:08 <DKA> +1
13:41:08 <twhume> +1
13:41:21 <DKA> RESOLUTION: We agree that Nunber 22- use fragment ID is OK to go even though all the formal implementation reports are from one company
13:41:54 <DKA> Francois: Last one is 26 - consider ... - 3 partial implementations from 3 different companies. So I think we are good to go.
13:42:23 <DKA> Francois: It's a "consider" best practice so difficult to define where line should be drawn.
13:42:54 <EdC> And it proposes several methods, so partial might have been interpreted as "we use only one of all these".
13:43:03 <DKA> PROPOSED RESOLUTION: We are agreed that nunber 26 - consider .. is OK even considering we only have 3 partial implementations...
13:43:07 <EdC> +1
13:43:10 <adam> +1
13:43:17 <twhume> +1
13:43:20 <jo> +1
13:43:22 <francois> +1
13:43:30 <DKA> RESOLUTION: We are agreed that nunber 26 - consider .. is OK even considering we only have 3 partial implementations...
13:43:53 <DKA> Jo: Now we go to the transition request...
13:45:03 <DKA> Francois: before that I'd like to mention replies to the last call comments. We received the response from PFWG - they sent a positive response.  One of the responses was not send to the public mailing list - it has not arrived there yet - I will chase him for this.
13:45:16 <DKA> Jo: We have a record from you (here) that this response has been received.
13:45:32 <DKA> Francois: yes, we are not waiting for any further reply - I will prepare disposition of comments.
13:46:04 <DKA> ACTION: Daoust to prepare distribution of comments for BP2.
13:46:04 <trackbot> Created ACTION-1072 - Prepare distribution of comments for BP2. [on François Daoust - due 2010-10-05].
13:46:22 <jo> PROPOSED RESOLUTION: The BPWG requests transition of Mobile Web Applications Best Practices (aka BP2) to Proposed Recommendation. There is no need for the document to go through Candidate Recommendation again.
13:46:51 <francois> +1
13:46:51 <DKA> +1
13:46:53 <twhume> +1
13:46:54 <jo> +1
13:46:54 <adam> +1
13:47:04 <DKA> Jo: Any objections?
13:47:06 <EdC> +
13:47:07 <EdC> +1
13:47:08 <DKA> [none heard]
13:47:11 <DKA> RESOLUTION: The BPWG requests transition of Mobile Web Applications Best Practices (aka BP2) to Proposed Recommendation. There is no need for the document to go through Candidate Recommendation again.
13:47:17 <DKA> woo hoo!
13:48:01 <DKA> Francois: This means we need to request transition - it will take some time... Then Dan, Jo and I will have to attend a transition call with "the Director".
13:48:35 <SeanP> SeanP has joined #bpwg
13:48:42 <DKA> Jo: Transition call within 2 weeks...
13:48:57 <DKA> Francois: Hopefully. Then 4 weeks minimum in PR.
13:49:19 <Zakim> +SeanP
13:49:38 <DKA> Thanks Adam!
13:49:58 <DKA> Topic: [lovely] CT Guidelines
13:50:28 <DKA> Jo: Any last minute news from anybody on an implementation report that is forthcoming?
13:50:41 <DKA> Jo: If not, we don't have sufficient implementation evidence.
13:50:45 <DKA> Francois: That's correct.
13:51:00 <DKA> Jo: Anybody on this call here have anything to say about this?
13:51:13 <DKA> Adam: Aaron said he was going to...
13:51:33 <SeanP> q+
13:51:33 <DKA> Jo: He kindly provided a report but it did not support a sufficient number of the points of conformance.
13:51:39 <DKA> ack seanp
13:52:21 <DKA> Sean: Bad news [from Nokia]: we're not going to provide a report.
13:52:44 <DKA> Jo: I don't see any option that we have. Are we allowed to leave this in CR?
13:53:14 <DKA> Francois: As soon as the group closes, any remaining work items need to be published as a working group note. Seems to be a good idea to [publish it as a note] now.
13:53:48 <DKA> Jo: It seems a great shame but unless anyone has any brilliant ideas - I suggest we go ahead an publish it as a working group note.
13:54:07 <jo> PROPOSED RESOLUTION: "Downgrade" CT Guidelines to a WG Note and request publication as such.
13:54:19 <DKA> +1 (reluctantly)
13:54:24 <francois> +1
13:54:27 <SeanP> +1
13:54:27 <adam> +1
13:54:37 <twhume> +1 with a meh
13:54:42 <EdC> +1 (sadly)
13:54:45 <jo> +1 (it's a bitter pill to swallow)
13:54:58 <EdC> how are group members (especiallly
13:54:58 <EdC> operators and transcoder vendors) will utilize the CTG,
13:54:58 <EdC> even if only as a WG note?
13:55:10 <DKA> RESOLUTION: "Downgrade" CT Guidelines to a WG Note and request publication as such.
13:56:11 <DKA> Jo: Whilst it would have more force as a recommendation, in practice getting the work out there in a published form is worth-while [whether it be Note or Recommendation].
13:56:44 <DKA> Jo: Francois, can you adjust the content of the document to turn it from a Rec into a Note. The main bits are in the preamble. We will take it offline.
13:56:57 <jo> ACTION: Jo to talk with Francois about what is needed to enact the above resolution on CT Guidelines
13:56:57 <trackbot> Created ACTION-1073 - Talk with Francois about what is needed to enact the above resolution on CT Guidelines [on Jo Rabin - due 2010-10-05].
13:57:17 <DKA> Jo: Anything else on CT guidelines?
13:57:21 <DKA> Topic: AOB?
13:58:00 <DKA> Jo: Charter extension - sounds like it's going to take at least 6 weeks for BP2 to reach rec. So we need to request an extension or make w3m aware that we need an extension.
13:58:27 <DKA> Francois: We need to wait for response on our request to transition to PR.
13:58:52 <francois> s/need to/should/
13:58:53 <DKA> Jo: ok - so later in october we will request an extension.
13:59:05 <DKA> Jo: We should close off outstanding issues and actions.
13:59:16 <DKA> Topic: Issues & Actions clean-up
13:59:30 <DKA> Jo: No open issues.
13:59:43 <DKA> Jo: Open Actions - we have 21...
13:59:46 <DKA> ACTION-1003?
13:59:47 <trackbot> ACTION-1003 -- Bruce Lawson to follow up within Opera as to what exactly the XSS test scripts supplied by chaals guard against -- due 2009-09-08 -- OPEN
13:59:47 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/1003
14:00:02 <DKA> close action-1003
14:00:02 <trackbot> ACTION-1003 Follow up within Opera as to what exactly the XSS test scripts supplied by chaals guard against closed
14:00:08 <DKA> action-1008
14:00:10 <DKA> action-1008?
14:00:10 <trackbot> ACTION-1008 -- Adam Connors to check if Google has tests they could contribute for CT guidelines -- due 2009-09-22 -- OPEN
14:00:10 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/1008
14:00:20 <DKA> close action-1008
14:00:20 <trackbot> ACTION-1008 Check if Google has tests they could contribute for CT guidelines closed
14:00:27 <DKA> action-1022?
14:00:27 <trackbot> ACTION-1022 -- Daniel Appelquist to ping internally in Vodafone to see if we have any ability to help with CT test suites. -- due 2009-10-27 -- OPEN
14:00:27 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/1022
14:00:31 <EdC> Do we close at least with an indication that they are closed without final resolution ?
14:00:38 <DKA> I never got any joy.
14:00:44 <DKA> close action-1022
14:00:44 <trackbot> ACTION-1022 Ping internally in Vodafone to see if we have any ability to help with CT test suites. closed
14:00:47 <DKA> action-1035?
14:00:47 <trackbot> ACTION-1035 -- Daniel Appelquist to create a plan to raise awareness on mobileOK through some campaign -- due 2009-12-18 -- OPEN
14:00:47 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/1035
14:00:56 <DKA> ongoing
14:01:03 <DKA> yes
14:01:05 <DKA> leave it open
14:01:11 <DKA> action-1038?
14:01:11 <trackbot> ACTION-1038 -- François Daoust to look into mobile Web Applications within W3C that implement some of the Mobile Web Application Best Practices. -- due 2010-02-16 -- OPEN
14:01:11 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/1038
14:01:55 <DKA> Francois: I've had a look...
14:01:56 <DKA> close action-1038
14:01:56 <trackbot> ACTION-1038 Look into mobile Web Applications within W3C that implement some of the Mobile Web Application Best Practices. closed
14:02:01 <DKA> action-1039?
14:02:01 <trackbot> ACTION-1039 -- Tom Hume to look into mobile Web Application within Future Platforms and provide implementation report for MWABP -- due 2010-02-16 -- OPEN
14:02:01 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/1039
14:02:25 <DKA> Tom: Provided.
14:02:29 <DKA> Jo: done and closed.
14:02:35 <DKA> close action-1039
14:02:35 <trackbot> ACTION-1039 Look into mobile Web Application within Future Platforms and provide implementation report for MWABP closed
14:02:38 <DKA> Didn't do.
14:02:49 <DKA> close action-1040
14:02:49 <trackbot> ACTION-1040 Make a post about MWABP to entice people to provide feedback closed
14:02:53 <DKA> Did do but no response.
14:03:02 <EdC> Once more, when you close, is there an indication that the actions were actually dropped (no resolution) instead of closed with a resolution?
14:03:02 <DKA> action-1041?
14:03:02 <trackbot> ACTION-1041 -- Daniel Appelquist to contact facebook and Opera ref implementation reports for BP2 -- due 2010-03-09 -- OPEN
14:03:02 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/1041
14:03:07 <DKA> did but no response.
14:03:12 <DKA> close action-1041
14:03:12 <trackbot> ACTION-1041 Contact facebook and Opera ref implementation reports for BP2 closed
14:03:20 <DKA> action-1043?
14:03:20 <trackbot> ACTION-1043 -- Daniel Appelquist to see if on-deck apps and betavine could be a source of implementation reports -- due 2010-04-06 -- OPEN
14:03:20 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/1043
14:03:31 <DKA> Nothing forthcoming here.
14:03:35 <DKA> close action-1043
14:03:35 <trackbot> ACTION-1043 See if on-deck apps and betavine could be a source of implementation reports closed
14:03:41 <DKA> action-1050?
14:03:41 <trackbot> ACTION-1050 -- Jeffrey Sonstein to help find 2 implementations of 5 and 6 by 30 June. -- due 2010-06-29 -- OPEN
14:03:41 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/1050
14:03:51 <DKA> close action-1050
14:03:51 <trackbot> ACTION-1050 Help find 2 implementations of 5 and 6 by 30 June. closed
14:04:00 <DKA> action-1052
14:04:04 <DKA> close action-1052
14:04:04 <trackbot> ACTION-1052 Investigate CT implementation report closed
14:04:19 <DKA> close action-1053
14:04:19 <trackbot> ACTION-1053 Investigate CT implementation report closed
14:04:28 <DKA> action-1055?
14:04:28 <trackbot> ACTION-1055 -- François Daoust to see with Jérôme about CT implementation report -- due 2010-06-29 -- OPEN
14:04:28 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/1055
14:04:32 <DKA> close action-1055
14:04:32 <trackbot> ACTION-1055 See with Jérôme about CT implementation report closed
14:04:56 <DKA> action-1059?
14:04:56 <trackbot> ACTION-1059 -- Daniel Appelquist to ping Bytemobile about CT implementation report -- due 2010-06-29 -- OPEN
14:04:56 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/1059
14:05:03 <DKA> no response...
14:05:09 <DKA> close action-1059
14:05:09 <trackbot> ACTION-1059 Ping Bytemobile about CT implementation report closed
14:05:18 <DKA> action-1061?
14:05:18 <trackbot> ACTION-1061 -- Daniel Appelquist to write the explanatory text for the "further considerations" section. -- due 2010-07-13 -- OPEN
14:05:18 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/1061
14:05:30 <DKA> close action-1061
14:05:30 <trackbot> ACTION-1061 Write the explanatory text for the "further considerations" section. closed
14:05:41 <DKA> action-1062?
14:05:41 <trackbot> ACTION-1062 -- Jo Rabin to formulate action plan with Francois and Dan -- due 2010-07-27 -- OPEN
14:05:41 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/1062
14:05:59 <DKA> close action-1062
14:05:59 <trackbot> ACTION-1062 Formulate action plan with Francois and Dan closed
14:06:04 <DKA> action-1066?
14:06:04 <trackbot> ACTION-1066 -- Adam Connors to enact LC-2415 -- due 2010-08-31 -- OPEN
14:06:04 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/1066
14:06:11 <DKA> Jo: Done.
14:06:17 <DKA> close action-1066
14:06:17 <trackbot> ACTION-1066 Enact LC-2415 closed
14:06:21 <DKA> action-1070?
14:06:21 <trackbot> ACTION-1070 -- Adam Connors to find prepare a short doc with references to remaining best practices -- due 2010-09-14 -- OPEN
14:06:21 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/1070
14:06:43 <DKA> francois; THis was done.
14:06:53 <DKA> close action-1070
14:06:53 <trackbot> ACTION-1070 Find prepare a short doc with references to remaining best practices closed
14:07:02 <DKA> action-1071?
14:07:02 <trackbot> ACTION-1071 -- Daniel Appelquist to send inspirational email to working group to get people to send implementation reports on CT -- due 2010-09-14 -- OPEN
14:07:02 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/1071
14:07:04 <francois> s/francois;/francois:/
14:07:11 <DKA> didn't feel inspirational.
14:07:14 <francois> s/THis/This/
14:07:17 <DKA> close action-1071
14:07:17 <trackbot> ACTION-1071 Send inspirational email to working group to get people to send implementation reports on CT closed
14:07:25 <DKA> ok
14:07:56 <DKA> Jo: 3 actions remain... and that is about it.
14:08:00 <francois> ACTION: daoust to send transition request to PR for MWABP
14:08:00 <trackbot> Created ACTION-1074 - Send transition request to PR for MWABP [on François Daoust - due 2010-10-05].
14:08:29 <DKA> jo: anything else?
14:09:04 <DKA> Jo: Little point in having a call next week (Oct 5 2010) and to resume following transition call.
14:09:09 <DKA> OK with me.
14:09:14 <EdC> Ok with me as well.
14:09:15 <DKA> thx!
14:09:21 <Zakim> -DKA
14:09:22 <Zakim> -jo
14:09:23 <Zakim> -francois
14:09:25 <Zakim> -adam
14:09:26 <Zakim> -twhume
14:09:28 <Zakim> -SeanP
14:09:28 <Zakim> - +31.97.2.aabb
14:09:28 <Zakim> MWI_BPWG()9:30AM has ended
14:09:30 <Zakim> Attendees were adam, DKA, francois, +44.203.141.aaaa, jo, +31.97.2.aabb, +44.127.381.aacc, twhume, SeanP
14:09:39 <francois> RRSAgent, draft minutes
14:09:39 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/09/28-bpwg-minutes.html francois
14:09:44 <jo> jo has left #bpwg
16:04:59 <Zakim> Zakim has left #bpwg
16:05:28 <francois> RRSAgent, bye
16:05:28 <RRSAgent> I see 3 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2010/09/28-bpwg-actions.rdf :
16:05:28 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Daoust to prepare distribution of comments for BP2. [1]
16:05:28 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/09/28-bpwg-irc#T13-46-04
16:05:28 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Jo to talk with Francois about what is needed to enact the above resolution on CT Guidelines [2]
16:05:28 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/09/28-bpwg-irc#T13-56-57
16:05:28 <RRSAgent> ACTION: daoust to send transition request to PR for MWABP [3]
16:05:28 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/09/28-bpwg-irc#T14-08-00