IRC log of mediafrag on 2010-09-22

Timestamps are in UTC.

09:04:25 [RRSAgent]
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logging to http://www.w3.org/2010/09/22-mediafrag-irc
09:04:27 [trackbot]
RRSAgent, make logs public
09:04:27 [Zakim]
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09:04:29 [trackbot]
Zakim, this will be IA_MFWG
09:04:29 [Zakim]
ok, trackbot; I see IA_MFWG()5:00AM scheduled to start 4 minutes ago
09:04:30 [trackbot]
Meeting: Media Fragments Working Group Teleconference
09:04:30 [trackbot]
Date: 22 September 2010
09:04:49 [Zakim]
IA_MFWG()5:00AM has now started
09:04:52 [erik]
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09:04:57 [Zakim]
+??P0
09:05:33 [Zakim]
+ +33.4.93.00.aaaa
09:05:38 [raphael]
zakim, aaaa is raphael
09:05:38 [Zakim]
+raphael; got it
09:05:56 [raphael]
zakim, P0 is Philip
09:05:56 [Zakim]
sorry, raphael, I do not recognize a party named 'P0'
09:06:05 [raphael]
zakim, +??P0 is Philip
09:06:05 [Zakim]
sorry, raphael, I do not recognize a party named '+??P0'
09:06:12 [raphael]
zakim, +?P0 is Philip
09:06:12 [Zakim]
sorry, raphael, I do not recognize a party named '+?P0'
09:06:45 [Zakim]
+Yves
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09:08:14 [raphael]
Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-media-fragment/2010Sep/0051.html
09:08:30 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/09/22-mediafrag-minutes.html raphael
09:08:49 [raphael]
Chair: Raphael
09:08:59 [raphael]
Regrets: Davy, Jack, Silvia
09:09:08 [raphael]
Present: Raphael, Yves, Erik (irc), Philip
09:09:18 [RRSAgent]
I'm logging. I don't understand 'make minutes available', raphael. Try /msg RRSAgent help
09:09:45 [raphael]
Topic: 1. Admin
09:10:00 [raphael]
Accept the minutes from 15/09
09:10:05 [raphael]
http://www.w3.org/2010/09/15-mediafrag-minutes.html
09:10:08 [raphael]
+1 ?
09:10:21 [foolip]
+1
09:10:22 [erik]
+1
09:10:30 [raphael]
minutes accepted
09:10:36 [raphael]
Topic 2. TPAC
09:11:08 [raphael]
TPAC week from Nov 1st till Nov 5th in Lyon France
09:11:31 [Zakim]
+ +44.329.331.aabb
09:11:32 [raphael]
Yves, most likely only on Tuesday
09:12:27 [raphael]
Davy will attend the whole weeek
09:12:30 [raphael]
s/weeek/week
09:12:41 [raphael]
Raphael will attend from Mon till Thu or Fri
09:13:44 [raphael]
There are 40$ fees per day, and the fees increase after Oct 22nd
09:13:48 [raphael]
... so please register before
09:15:00 [raphael]
ACTION: Yves to book zakim for the 2 days meeting of the group on Mon 1st and Tue 2nd Nov
09:15:01 [trackbot]
Created ACTION-185 - Book zakim for the 2 days meeting of the group on Mon 1st and Tue 2nd Nov [on Yves Lafon - due 2010-09-29].
09:15:15 [raphael]
ACTION-183?
09:15:15 [trackbot]
ACTION-183 -- Raphaël Troncy to send reminders to all relevant groups -- due 2010-09-15 -- OPEN
09:15:15 [trackbot]
http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/tracker/actions/183
09:15:40 [raphael]
I have not yet done this for IETF, TAG
09:16:23 [erik]
q+
09:16:42 [raphael]
Topic: 3. MEDIA FRAGMENT EXTENSION:
09:16:51 [raphael]
zakim, ack Erik
09:16:51 [Zakim]
I see no one on the speaker queue
09:18:58 [raphael]
Erik: no more news from Michael/Conrad should we be concerned?
09:19:12 [raphael]
Raphael: I don't think so ... there are no critical actions from them we depend on
09:19:19 [raphael]
... if they can provide feedback, it's good
09:19:27 [raphael]
... we must progress without waiting
09:20:01 [raphael]
Philippe's proposal: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-media-fragment/2010Aug/0005.html
09:20:56 [raphael]
Philippe: this is just one part of the problem
09:21:12 [raphael]
... we could include this piece of ABNF in the doc
09:22:27 [raphael]
ACTIOn-173?
09:22:27 [trackbot]
ACTION-173 -- Yves Lafon to produce the code that will check the grammar of both the URI syntax and the Headers syntax -- due 2010-06-22 -- OPEN
09:22:27 [trackbot]
http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/tracker/actions/173
09:22:43 [raphael]
ISSUE-19?
09:22:43 [trackbot]
ISSUE-19 -- Parsing must be defined normatively in the MF spec itself -- open
09:22:43 [trackbot]
http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/tracker/issues/19
09:23:17 [raphael]
Yves: action is still pending
09:23:43 [raphael]
... what I would like to have is what goes in the javascript stack from the browsers when they meet a %encoded URL
09:24:11 [raphael]
... %encoded and html-encoded URL (with ampersand)
09:24:26 [raphael]
Erik: is this browser independent?
09:25:22 [foolip]
html entities: &
09:25:42 [foolip]
percent encoding: %64
09:25:45 [raphael]
Philippe: this never reaches javascript, this is handled by the HTML parser
09:26:50 [raphael]
... for percent encoding, yes, the js sees the un-decode strign
09:26:55 [raphael]
s/strign/string
09:27:14 [raphael]
Yves: could you send to the mailing list the tests you have made so we can test on another browser than Opera
09:27:21 [raphael]
Philippe: sure
09:27:50 [raphael]
ACTION: philippe to send his list of test cases to the mailing list for understanding how browsers handle %-encodded and html-encoded URL
09:27:50 [trackbot]
Sorry, couldn't find user - philippe
09:27:55 [foolip]
Philip
09:27:57 [raphael]
ACTION: philip to send his list of test cases to the mailing list for understanding how browsers handle %-encodded and html-encoded URL
09:27:57 [trackbot]
Created ACTION-186 - Send his list of test cases to the mailing list for understanding how browsers handle %-encodded and html-encoded URL [on Philip Jägenstedt - due 2010-09-29].
09:28:18 [raphael]
Erik: what's happened if browsers manage this inconsistently?
09:29:02 [raphael]
Raphael: the related problem deals with extensibility
09:29:12 [raphael]
... of the URI syntax
09:29:53 [raphael]
Philip: the whole thing is to have a break into name/value pairs
09:30:10 [raphael]
... and then be relaxed if you don't understand all name/value pairs
09:31:14 [raphael]
... I think we should have a syntax, that mandates what we should have as name/value
09:31:22 [raphael]
... parsers fail for typos
09:31:46 [raphael]
... but implementations should be more relaxed
09:33:21 [raphael]
Yves: what bothers me that the ABNF tells both what the syntax is and how to parse it
09:34:04 [raphael]
... the big issue is something that is not a media fragment can be recognized as a Media Fragment
09:34:34 [foolip]
"parsers fail for typos" isn't correct
09:34:46 [foolip]
a validator would, but not a parser in a browser
09:36:03 [raphael]
Yves: we could put an algorithm for the browser
09:37:29 [raphael]
Yves: we need to decide first what to do with extensibility
09:37:46 [raphael]
... then I don't see problem of having the algo closed to the ABNF definition
09:37:58 [raphael]
... so Annex D will move up towards the formal grammar
09:39:55 [raphael]
Erik: I will not make the parsing instructions normative, they are useful guidelines only
09:42:35 [raphael]
Philip: if we need to valid the whole URI before, then parsers will be broken with version 2
09:42:49 [raphael]
Yves: yes, but if the new thing means already something you're already into trouble
09:43:14 [silvia]
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ping?
09:44:48 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/09/22-mediafrag-minutes.html raphael
09:45:15 [raphael]
Yves: I agrre
09:45:23 [Yves]
s/agrre/agree/
09:45:25 [raphael]
s/agrre/agree with Philip
09:46:31 [raphael]
Raphael: could we just write a normative paragraph that states how the parser should behave ?
09:46:51 [raphael]
Erik: a lot of test cases would need to be redefined
09:48:05 [raphael]
Yves: I want to have everybody on the phone to agree what we want to do with extensibility
09:48:18 [Zakim]
+Silvia
09:48:28 [Zakim]
-Silvia
09:50:45 [Yves]
I would note that we can try to get agreement on the ML in the meantime
09:52:09 [raphael]
ACTION: Philip to start a new thread about extensibility of the Media Fragments in order to get consensus by next week
09:52:10 [trackbot]
Created ACTION-187 - Start a new thread about extensibility of the Media Fragments in order to get consensus by next week [on Philip Jägenstedt - due 2010-09-29].
09:52:35 [raphael]
Tpic: 4. UBLIC COMMENTS:
09:52:45 [raphael]
s/UBLIC COMMENTS:/PUBLIC COMMENT
09:52:48 [raphael]
ACTON-184?
09:52:54 [raphael]
ACTION-184?
09:52:54 [trackbot]
ACTION-184 -- Yves Lafon to email Chris the reply on when to send the range header -- due 2010-09-15 -- OPEN
09:52:54 [trackbot]
http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/tracker/actions/184
09:53:02 [raphael]
Yves: pending?
09:53:28 [raphael]
Topic: 5. AOB?
09:54:08 [erik]
have a nice day
09:54:10 [Zakim]
-raphael
09:54:12 [Zakim]
-Yves
09:54:14 [Zakim]
-Philip
09:54:15 [Zakim]
-Erik
09:54:17 [Zakim]
IA_MFWG()5:00AM has ended
09:54:17 [RRSAgent]
I'm logging. I don't understand 'draft minites', raphael. Try /msg RRSAgent help
09:54:18 [Zakim]
Attendees were +33.4.93.00.aaaa, raphael, Yves, Philip, +44.329.331.aabb, Erik, Silvia
09:54:20 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/09/22-mediafrag-minutes.html raphael
09:54:32 [raphael]
Silvia: will you attend TPAC in Lyon ?
09:54:35 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/09/22-mediafrag-minutes.html raphael
09:54:51 [silvia]
raphael: no and I think I have un-registered
09:56:21 [raphael]
ScribeOptions: -final -noEmbedDiagnostics
09:56:24 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/09/22-mediafrag-minutes.html raphael
09:57:10 [raphael]
s/Topic 2./Topic: 2.
09:57:12 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/09/22-mediafrag-minutes.html raphael
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