IRC log of rif on 2010-08-24

Timestamps are in UTC.

14:43:39 [RRSAgent]
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14:43:39 [RRSAgent]
logging to http://www.w3.org/2010/08/24-rif-irc
14:43:42 [Zakim]
Zakim has joined #rif
14:43:46 [sandro]
zakim, this will be rif
14:43:46 [Zakim]
ok, sandro; I see SW_RIF()11:00AM scheduled to start in 17 minutes
14:52:26 [Doug]
Doug has joined #rif
14:52:53 [Zakim]
SW_RIF()11:00AM has now started
14:53:00 [Zakim]
+ +1.512.342.aaaa
14:53:32 [Doug]
zakim, 512 is me
14:53:32 [Zakim]
sorry, Doug, I do not recognize a party named '512'
14:53:41 [Doug]
zakim, aaaa is me
14:53:41 [Zakim]
+Doug; got it
14:57:54 [ChrisW]
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14:59:27 [Harold]
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14:59:32 [ChrisW]
Meeting: RIF Telecon 24 Aug 2010
14:59:37 [ChrisW]
Chair: Chris Welty
14:59:42 [ChrisW]
Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rif-wg/2010Aug/0015.html
15:00:17 [ChrisW]
rrsagent, make minutes
15:00:17 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/08/24-rif-minutes.html ChrisW
15:00:25 [ChrisW]
zakim, list agenda
15:00:25 [Zakim]
I see nothing on the agenda
15:00:31 [ChrisW]
agenda+ Admin
15:00:33 [StellaMitchell]
StellaMitchell has joined #RIF
15:00:35 [AdrianP]
AdrianP has joined #rif
15:00:44 [ChrisW]
agenda+ Liason
15:00:49 [ChrisW]
agenda+ Actions
15:01:08 [ChrisW]
agenda+ RIF in RDF
15:01:16 [ChrisW]
agenda+ Sparql
15:01:22 [ChrisW]
agenda+ RIF XML
15:01:27 [ChrisW]
agenda+ RIF Primer
15:01:32 [ChrisW]
agenda+ Test Cases
15:01:36 [ChrisW]
agenda+ AOB
15:01:47 [ChrisW]
rrsagent, make logs public
15:01:53 [DaveReynolds]
DaveReynolds has joined #rif
15:01:57 [Zakim]
+[IBM]
15:02:00 [mdean]
mdean has joined #rif
15:02:13 [ChrisW]
zakim, ibm is temporarily me
15:02:13 [Zakim]
+ChrisW; got it
15:02:30 [leora]
leora has joined #rif
15:02:37 [Zakim]
+Mike_Dean
15:02:38 [Zakim]
+??P40
15:02:55 [ChrisW]
zakim, who is on the phone?
15:02:55 [Zakim]
+??P31
15:02:56 [Zakim]
On the phone I see Doug, ChrisW, Mike_Dean, ??P40, ??P31
15:03:10 [Zakim]
+??P42
15:03:13 [Zakim]
+LeoraMorgenstern
15:03:18 [AdrianP]
Zakim, who is on the phone?
15:03:18 [Zakim]
On the phone I see Doug, ChrisW, Mike_Dean, DaveReynolds, ??P31, ??P42, LeoraMorgenstern
15:03:32 [Zakim]
+AxelPolleres
15:03:40 [StellaMitchell]
zakim, ?p42 is me
15:03:40 [Zakim]
sorry, StellaMitchell, I do not recognize a party named '?p42'
15:03:42 [Zakim]
+Sandro
15:03:54 [Zakim]
+ +49.715.22.aabb
15:03:55 [AdrianP]
Zakim, ??P31 is me
15:03:55 [Zakim]
+AdrianP; got it
15:04:02 [StellaMitchell]
zakim, ??p42 is me
15:04:02 [Zakim]
+StellaMitchell; got it
15:04:05 [AxelPolleres]
I have some question for AOB on the rif:imports issue.
15:04:12 [ChrisW]
Scribe: Adrian Paschke
15:04:12 [AxelPolleres]
from SPARQL
15:04:18 [ChrisW]
scribenick: AdrianP
15:04:29 [ChrisW]
zakim, who is on the phone?
15:04:30 [Zakim]
On the phone I see Doug, ChrisW, Mike_Dean, DaveReynolds, AdrianP, StellaMitchell, LeoraMorgenstern, AxelPolleres, Sandro, +49.715.22.aabb
15:04:35 [ChrisW]
zakim, who is talking?
15:04:39 [Harold]
zakim, +49.715.22.aabb is me
15:04:39 [Zakim]
+Harold; got it
15:04:46 [Zakim]
ChrisW, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: LeoraMorgenstern (39%), +49.715.22.aabb (17%), ChrisW (52%), StellaMitchell (4%)
15:04:59 [ChrisW]
zakim, next item
15:04:59 [Zakim]
agendum 1. "Admin" taken up [from ChrisW]
15:05:17 [Zakim]
+ +1.503.533.aacc
15:05:25 [ChrisW]
last meeting minutes: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rif-wg/2010Aug/0017.html
15:05:34 [ChrisW]
PROPOSED: Accept last meeting minutes
15:05:35 [AdrianP]
ChrisW: minutes approved
15:05:41 [ChrisW]
RESOLVED: Accept last meeting minutes
15:06:25 [Gary_Hallmark]
Gary_Hallmark has joined #rif
15:06:33 [ChrisW]
zakim, next item
15:06:33 [Zakim]
agendum 2. "Liason" taken up [from ChrisW]
15:08:01 [AdrianP]
Sandro: RDF Database working group addressing database queries
15:08:28 [AdrianP]
Sandro: how rules and queries creating constructive views interact
15:08:36 [ChrisW]
zakim, next item
15:08:36 [Zakim]
agendum 3. "Actions" taken up [from ChrisW]
15:08:42 [ChrisW]
zakim, aacc is Gary
15:08:42 [Zakim]
+Gary; got it
15:09:09 [Harold]
Michael and I discovered: RDB2RDF's "Direct Mapping in RIF"
15:09:31 [Harold]
http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/rdb2rdf/wiki/Direct_Mapping_in_RIF
15:09:53 [AdrianP]
Leora: action Send stella recommendations to improve UCR-4.7a test case continued
15:10:50 [AdrianP]
ChrisW: can the test case be renamed
15:11:07 [AdrianP]
ChrisW: with a meaningfull title
15:11:17 [AdrianP]
Stella: yes, can do
15:11:21 [ChrisW]
action: rename UCR 4.1.3, etc to meaningful names
15:11:21 [trackbot]
Sorry, couldn't find user - rename
15:13:34 [AdrianP]
ChrisW: issue was that these test cases have a lot of stuff in it - serving as an example but not as a test case
15:14:13 [AdrianP]
Doug: leave it and put a comment in the test case
15:15:14 [AdrianP]
Doug: comment in the ontology
15:15:32 [ChrisW]
action: stella to update TC 4.1.3 to indicate there is non-essential information unlike most test cases
15:15:32 [trackbot]
Created ACTION-1040 - Update TC 4.1.3 to indicate there is non-essential information unlike most test cases [on Stella Mitchell - due 2010-08-31].
15:15:37 [AdrianP]
http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wiki/UCR_4.1.3
15:16:06 [AdrianP]
action-1083 closed
15:16:06 [trackbot]
Sorry... closing ACTION-1083 failed, please let sysreq know about it
15:16:30 [AdrianP]
action 1038 closed
15:16:30 [trackbot]
Sorry, couldn't find user - 1038
15:16:43 [AdrianP]
action-1038 closed
15:16:43 [trackbot]
ACTION-1038 Move approved test cases to approved status closed
15:17:45 [ChrisW]
zakim, next item
15:17:45 [Zakim]
agendum 4. "RIF in RDF" taken up [from ChrisW]
15:18:03 [AdrianP]
http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wiki/RIF_In_RDF
15:18:33 [AdrianP]
Sandro: need to talk to Axel
15:19:19 [AdrianP]
Sandro: need to put in text about RIF Import from RDF
15:19:59 [AdrianP]
Sandro: RIF side it would be a note, on the SPARQL side it would be in the spec
15:20:12 [AxelPolleres]
what's the URI at the moment?
15:20:39 [AdrianP]
Axel: put the text from my mail about it into the text?
15:21:02 [AdrianP]
Sandro: probably yes - Sandro needs to be detailed
15:21:15 [AdrianP]
Axel: had some text in my last mail
15:22:02 [AdrianP]
Sandro: this should turn into a real section http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wiki/RIF_In_RDF#Importing_RIF_into_RDF
15:22:29 [AdrianP]
Axel: worried about inconsistencies
15:22:50 [AxelPolleres]
need to check possible inconsistencies... sigh.
15:23:35 [AdrianP]
ChrisW: SWC deals with importing RDF into RIF
15:24:03 [AdrianP]
Sandro: just looking just as SWC, RIF imports RDF which might import again RIF
15:24:58 [AdrianP]
Axel: recursive import do not work if just defined in SWC
15:26:18 [AdrianP]
Sandro: systems which do SWC and systems which do SWC + this RIF in RDF import
15:27:35 [AdrianP]
Axel: Sandro and I will have a call about it;
15:28:20 [ChrisW]
action: Sandro to discuss with Axel the imports issue
15:28:20 [trackbot]
Created ACTION-1041 - Discuss with Axel the imports issue [on Sandro Hawke - due 2010-08-31].
15:28:41 [ChrisW]
zakim, next item
15:28:41 [Zakim]
agendum 5. "Sparql" taken up [from ChrisW]
15:29:44 [AdrianP]
Axel: my issue was the URI which needs to work for SPARQL. is not an issue if we define it in the RIF document
15:30:05 [ChrisW]
zakim, next item
15:30:05 [Zakim]
agendum 6. "RIF XML" taken up [from ChrisW]
15:30:31 [AdrianP]
http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wiki/RIF%2BXML_data-schema
15:30:31 [ChrisW]
zakim, close item 6
15:30:31 [Zakim]
agendum 6, RIF XML, closed
15:30:32 [Zakim]
I see 3 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
15:30:34 [Zakim]
7. RIF Primer [from ChrisW]
15:30:40 [AdrianP]
Garry: wait for Christian on this
15:30:40 [ChrisW]
zakim, next item
15:30:40 [Zakim]
agendum 7. "RIF Primer" taken up [from ChrisW]
15:30:59 [AdrianP]
http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wiki/Primer
15:32:14 [AdrianP]
Leora: some sections need fine tuning
15:32:27 [AdrianP]
ChrisW: added some more examples, e.g. http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wiki/Primer#Third_Example
15:33:12 [AdrianP]
Leora: compatibility, test suite
15:33:38 [AdrianP]
Leora: data types
15:33:54 [AdrianP]
ChrisW: deadline to finish Primer is end of this week
15:34:03 [AdrianP]
ChrisW: deadline for reviews next week
15:34:09 [ChrisW]
zakim, next item
15:34:09 [Zakim]
agendum 8. "Test Cases" taken up [from ChrisW]
15:34:44 [ChrisW]
actioN: sandro to ping EricP on Primer
15:34:44 [trackbot]
Created ACTION-1042 - Ping EricP on Primer [on Sandro Hawke - due 2010-08-31].
15:34:59 [AdrianP]
Harold: Eric Prud'hommeaux already reviewed it
15:35:13 [AxelPolleres]
I have one more AOB from SPARQL
15:35:23 [AxelPolleres]
(for the end is fine)
15:35:45 [AdrianP]
http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wiki/Test
15:35:59 [AdrianP]
Stella: what would be the deadline for it
15:36:40 [AdrianP]
Sandro: RIF in RDF could be ready for review in two weeks
15:37:14 [AdrianP]
ChrisW: version has been already been reviewed; not much changes needed
15:37:49 [AdrianP]
ChrisW: no editorial changes are fine for RIF test
15:38:59 [AdrianP]
Sandro: test reports from third parties could be useful
15:39:29 [DaveReynolds]
http://www.w3.org/TR/rif-test/#Test_Case_Repository
15:40:00 [AdrianP]
Leora: is there a pointer in the test document
15:40:08 [AdrianP]
Stella: it is in the introduction
15:40:44 [AdrianP]
ChrisW: 7 test cases have not been approved yet
15:41:13 [AdrianP]
http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wiki/Category:InDevelopment
15:41:33 [AdrianP]
http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wiki/Category:Proposed
15:42:13 [ChrisW]
http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wiki/Retract
15:43:33 [AdrianP]
Adrian: it retracts the complete frame ex:john[ex:status -> "normal" ex:test -> "some value"
15:44:18 [ChrisW]
PROPOSED: Approve test case http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wiki/Retract
15:44:23 [StellaMitchell]
+1
15:44:24 [ChrisW]
+1
15:44:27 [DaveReynolds]
+1
15:44:29 [Doug]
+1
15:44:31 [AdrianP]
+1
15:44:33 [mdean]
+1
15:44:35 [Harold]
+1
15:44:35 [leora]
+1
15:44:36 [ChrisW]
RESOLVED: Approve test case http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wiki/Retract
15:44:40 [Gary]
+1
15:44:52 [ChrisW]
action: stella move Retract TC to approved
15:44:52 [trackbot]
Created ACTION-1043 - Move Retract TC to approved [on Stella Mitchell - due 2010-08-31].
15:47:17 [ChrisW]
http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wiki/RDF_Combination_Invalid_Constant_1
15:48:16 [ChrisW]
action: stella to hide "import profile" in test cases listing
15:48:16 [trackbot]
Created ACTION-1044 - Hide "import profile" in test cases listing [on Stella Mitchell - due 2010-08-31].
15:48:28 [ChrisW]
zakim, next item
15:48:28 [Zakim]
agendum 9. "AOB" taken up [from ChrisW]
15:48:40 [Zakim]
-Harold
15:49:16 [AdrianP]
Axel: SPARQL Entailment should be reviewed by someone from Rif
15:49:24 [Zakim]
+Harold
15:49:27 [AdrianP]
Axel: review end of September
15:50:11 [AdrianP]
Axel: probably document ready by mid of September
15:50:24 [AdrianP]
ChrisW: think Mike already took an action to do it
15:51:25 [Harold]
What about progress on http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wiki/Implementations ?
15:51:30 [AdrianP]
Harold: table of implementations - any progress there?
15:51:58 [Harold]
Reminder to send implementation reports?
15:52:01 [AdrianP]
Sandro: some new projects
15:52:13 [sandro]
http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/wiki/Tools
15:52:52 [AdrianP]
Sandro: should add a category on RIF here
15:52:59 [sandro]
http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/wiki/Category:Tool
15:55:39 [sandro]
new category....? "RIF Tool" maybe?
15:55:56 [sandro]
"RIF Consumer" and "RIF Producer"
15:59:46 [DaveReynolds]
http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/wiki/Category:Work
15:59:55 [DaveReynolds]
http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/wiki/RIF
16:00:58 [sandro]
http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/wiki/RIF_Validator
16:05:40 [AdrianP]
Harold: would be great to have a documentation of the translator used for the test cases
16:06:16 [AdrianP]
Sandro: could ask the developers to add Wikipage to the SemWeb tools site
16:06:49 [AdrianP]
ChrisW: status of Silk?
16:07:01 [AdrianP]
Mike: not decided yet
16:07:12 [AdrianP]
Mike: portion of it might become open sources
16:08:59 [AdrianP]
Open Call for RIF Demos at Rule Challenge at RuleML-2010 http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rif-wg/2010Aug/0011.html
16:09:01 [ChrisW]
zakim, list attendees
16:09:01 [Zakim]
As of this point the attendees have been +1.512.342.aaaa, Doug, ChrisW, Mike_Dean, DaveReynolds, LeoraMorgenstern, AxelPolleres, Sandro, AdrianP, StellaMitchell, Harold,
16:09:04 [Zakim]
... +1.503.533.aacc, Gary
16:09:09 [Harold]
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rif-wg/2010Aug/0011.html
16:09:17 [Zakim]
-Gary
16:09:18 [Zakim]
-LeoraMorgenstern
16:09:18 [Zakim]
-Doug
16:09:18 [ChrisW]
rrsagent, make minutes
16:09:18 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/08/24-rif-minutes.html ChrisW
16:09:19 [Doug]
bye
16:09:20 [Zakim]
-Sandro
16:09:21 [Zakim]
-DaveReynolds
16:09:21 [Zakim]
-Mike_Dean
16:09:22 [Zakim]
-StellaMitchell
16:09:22 [Zakim]
-Harold
16:09:22 [DaveReynolds]
bye
16:09:27 [Zakim]
-AxelPolleres
16:09:54 [Zakim]
-ChrisW
16:09:55 [Zakim]
-AdrianP
16:09:56 [Zakim]
SW_RIF()11:00AM has ended
16:09:58 [Zakim]
Attendees were +1.512.342.aaaa, Doug, ChrisW, Mike_Dean, DaveReynolds, LeoraMorgenstern, AxelPolleres, Sandro, AdrianP, StellaMitchell, Harold, +1.503.533.aacc, Gary
16:39:52 [AxelPolleres]
AxelPolleres has left #rif