13:50:43 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #lld
13:50:43 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2010/08/19-lld-irc
13:50:51 <TomB> rrsagent, bookmark
13:50:51 <RRSAgent> See http://www.w3.org/2010/08/19-lld-irc#T13-50-51
13:50:58 <TomB> zakim, this will be lld
13:50:58 <Zakim> ok, TomB; I see INC_LLDXG()10:00AM scheduled to start in 10 minutes
13:51:55 <TomB> Meeting: LLD XG
13:52:03 <TomB> Chair: Tom
13:52:09 <michaelp> michaelp has joined #lld
13:52:12 <TomB> Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xg-lld/2010Aug/0073.html
13:52:22 <TomB> Previous: http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/07/29-lld-minutes.html
13:52:48 <TomB> Regrets: Tod, Andreas, Alexander, Kim, Ray, Oreste, Guenther
13:53:01 <TomB> rrsagent, please make record public
13:55:59 <Zakim> INC_LLDXG()10:00AM has now started
13:56:06 <Zakim> +??P1
13:56:15 <TomB> zakim, ??p1 is me
13:56:15 <Zakim> +TomB; got it
13:56:22 <TomB> zakim, who is on the call?
13:56:22 <Zakim> On the phone I see TomB
13:56:57 <antoine> antoine has joined #lld
13:57:14 <GordonD> GordonD has joined #lld
13:57:23 <Zakim> + +33.1.53.79.aaaa
13:57:41 <TomB> zakim, aaaa is emma
13:57:41 <Zakim> +emma; got it
13:57:42 <emma> zakim, aaaa is me
13:57:42 <Zakim> sorry, emma, I do not recognize a party named 'aaaa'
13:57:57 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
13:58:04 <antoine> zakim, IPCaller is me
13:58:04 <Zakim> +antoine; got it
13:58:08 <TomB> zakim, IPcaller is antoine
13:58:08 <Zakim> sorry, TomB, I do not recognize a party named 'IPcaller'
13:58:58 <marcia> marcia has joined #LLD
13:59:30 <Zakim> +[VrijeUni]
13:59:47 <TomB> zakim, VrijeUni is MarkVanAssem
13:59:47 <Zakim> +MarkVanAssem; got it
13:59:51 <Zakim> + +1.330.672.aabb
13:59:55 <bvatant> bvatant has joined #lld
13:59:57 <monica> monica has joined #lld
14:00:00 <Zakim> +??P10
14:00:12 <antoine> zakim, aabb is marcia
14:00:12 <Zakim> +marcia; got it
14:00:24 <antoine> zakim, ??P10 is GordonD
14:00:24 <Zakim> +GordonD; got it
14:00:36 <kcoyle> kcoyle has joined #lld
14:01:14 <Zakim> + +44.194.346.aacc
14:01:17 <Zakim> +[LC]
14:01:20 <antoine> zakim, aacc is monica
14:01:20 <Zakim> +monica; got it
14:01:24 <Zakim> + +33.9.71.48.aadd
14:01:28 <antoine> zakim, LC is edsu
14:01:31 <Zakim> +edsu; got it
14:01:31 <rsinger> rsinger has joined #lld
14:01:39 <antoine> zakim, aadd is bvatant
14:01:39 <Zakim> +bvatant; got it
14:02:02 <Zakim> +??P17
14:02:02 <whalb> whalb has joined #lld
14:02:10 <monica> \me zakim mute me
14:02:14 <antoine> zakim, ??P17 is kcoyle
14:02:14 <Zakim> +kcoyle; got it
14:02:17 <bvatant> zakim please mute me
14:02:46 <MarkVanAssem> zakim, mute me
14:02:46 <Zakim> MarkVanAssem should now be muted
14:03:00 <Zakim> +whalb
14:03:04 <Zakim> + +1.423.463.aaee
14:03:13 <antoine> zakim, aaee is rsinger
14:03:13 <Zakim> +rsinger; got it
14:03:31 <bvatant> zakim, mute me
14:03:31 <Zakim> bvatant should now be muted
14:06:06 <edsu> i always fumble around w/ scribing :)
14:06:16 <rsinger> antoine: ok, next planned mtg, then ;)
14:06:20 <Zakim> + +1.607.222.aaff
14:06:53 <antoine> zakim, aaff is john
14:06:54 <Zakim> +john; got it
14:07:53 <TomB> scribe: rsinger
14:07:55 <rsinger> OK!
14:07:59 <TomB> scribenick: rsinger
14:08:05 <edsu> rsinger++ 
14:08:19 <antoine> Topic: Admin
14:08:24 <rsinger> Topic: Admin
14:08:25 <rsinger> er
14:08:56 <rsinger> Propse to accept minutes?
14:09:21 <rsinger> resolved
14:09:36 <antoine> RESOLVED: To accept minutes of previous telecon: http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/07/29-lld-minutes.html
14:09:53 <rsinger> RESOLVED: accept meeting minutes of previous telecon: http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/07/29-lld-minutes.html
14:10:43 <rsinger> TOPIC: F2F Meetings
14:11:06 <rsinger> Meeting in Pittsburgh around DC2010
14:11:19 <marcia> marcia has joined #LLD
14:11:32 <rsinger> Looking for next actions in the LLD space
14:11:47 <rsinger> What has/has not worked in the DCMI Abstract Model
14:11:54 <rsinger> How to move forward constructively
14:12:12 <rsinger> Sat/Sun, have a meeting room @ DC2010
14:12:21 <rsinger> no registration fee
14:12:30 <rsinger> antoine: sure
14:12:52 <rsinger> ... wireless costs $350/day
14:13:03 <rsinger> :)
14:13:44 <rsinger> ... $10-15/person to provide wireless for the day
14:13:48 <kcoyle> ++ pass the hat
14:13:55 <edsu> +1 
14:13:57 <GordonD> +1
14:14:05 <rsinger> -- TomB will send proposal to the list
14:14:19 <marcia> +1
14:14:31 <rsinger> ... will convene by noon(?) on Sunday so people can catch flights
14:14:35 <Zakim> + +1.614.764.aagg
14:14:57 <kcoyle> q+
14:15:01 <rsinger> ... discussion continues re: F2F at SWIB in Cologne
14:15:08 <rsinger> TOPIC: Use cases
14:16:47 <rsinger>   TomB, any comments on selections of links and the way they're characterized? 
14:17:03 <antoine> s/TomB,/TomB:
14:17:16 <rsinger> ... update schedule
14:18:28 <edsu> :-)
14:18:55 <edsu> oh, kai isn't here ...
14:19:12 <rsinger> TomB: who wants to take the lead on the use cases?
14:19:23 <rsinger> kcoyle: What do we need to do?
14:19:44 <jneubert> jneubert has joined #lld
14:20:19 <rsinger> kcoyle: it would be great to know what goes in each part of the use case / many things being left blank
14:20:47 <rsinger> kcoyle: there are very large use cases, like how we deal with legacy data, are those appropriate as use cases?
14:21:14 <michaelp> q+ to suggest discussing use cases one by one on future telecon
14:21:16 <antoine> q+ on Joachim's case
14:21:28 <rsinger> emma: we need to test use case template within the group
14:21:43 <rsinger> that is emma, right?
14:21:53 <rsinger> thanks
14:22:24 <Zakim> + +49.40.aahh
14:22:31 <marma> marma has joined #lld
14:22:45 <antoine> zakim, aahh is jneubert
14:22:45 <Zakim> +jneubert; got it
14:23:24 <rsinger> kcoyle: on the use case notes page, we can put an FAQ?
14:23:36 <rsinger> antoine: we can use the discussion section of the use case template page
14:23:42 <emma> +1
14:23:48 <rsinger> antoine: this was kai's suggestion
14:24:02 <rsinger> kcoyle: we should note this somewhere
14:24:29 <TomB> Karen and Antoine propose to use http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/Talk:Use_Case_Template
14:24:39 <rsinger> kcoyle: i will add a note to the use case template to use the discussion section
14:24:46 <GordonD> next week's telecon islast chance to discuss use cases before end august deadline, so +1 to use wiki between now and then - assuming we stick to deadline
14:25:03 <rsinger> +1
14:25:06 <antoine> kcoyle ++
14:25:07 <Zakim> -jneubert
14:25:09 <bvatant> +1
14:25:22 <GordonD> +1 for karen's suggestion
14:25:28 <marcia> +1
14:25:39 <Zakim> +??P34
14:25:58 <antoine> zakim, ??P34 is jneubert
14:25:59 <Zakim> +jneubert; got it
14:26:03 <kcoyle> Emma -- didn't understand your last comment
14:26:15 <rsinger> emma: can you repeat?
14:26:29 <antoine> -> -> http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/Use_Case_Publishing_20th_Century_Press_Archives
14:26:41 <antoine> ->jneubert's use case
14:26:50 <rsinger> emma: jneubert has added two sections to template
14:26:50 <monica> emma: joachim has added some sections to his template
14:27:57 <antoine> +1 for including prototype in "related work" but explaining it in the template
14:28:14 <antoine> s/Related Work/Existing Work
14:28:17 <rsinger> jneubert: it is not only about technology but applications or prototypes in template
14:28:29 <rsinger> jneubert: in the Existing Work section
14:28:43 <TomB> q?
14:29:12 <TomB> ack kcoyle
14:29:21 <TomB> ack michaelp
14:29:21 <Zakim> michaelp, you wanted to suggest discussing use cases one by one on future telecon
14:30:03 <rsinger> michaelp: go through the use cases one by one in a telecon so we can all contribute to filling the blanks to give input to the use case creators
14:30:26 <TomB> +1 michaelp's suggestion
14:30:28 <rsinger> ... the target audience really depends on the use case, in jneubert's case it is really an application, in other cases, it's really a task
14:30:35 <kai> kai has joined #lld
14:30:45 <emma> +1 to comment the use cases 1 by 1
14:30:45 <TomB> ack antoine
14:30:51 <Zakim> antoine, you wanted to comment on Joachim's case
14:31:13 <rsinger> antoine: use next teleconf to discuss the use cases
14:31:23 <TomB> q?
14:31:23 <rsinger> ... wanted to mention jneubert's use case
14:31:38 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
14:31:50 <TomB> zakim, IPcaller is Kai
14:31:50 <Zakim> +Kai; got it
14:31:59 <Zakim> -jneubert
14:32:53 <TomB> q+
14:33:02 <TomB> ack TomB
14:34:01 <TomB> q?
14:34:33 <rsinger> TomB: the schedule
14:35:04 <rsinger> ... we are still at the gathering and development of scenarios
14:35:17 <GordonD> it would be useful for me to extend schedule
14:35:22 <rsinger> ... should we revise expectations?
14:35:32 <kcoyle> yes
14:35:32 <GordonD> +1
14:35:35 <monica> +1
14:35:40 <bvatant> +1
14:35:57 <kcoyle> Sep 15?
14:36:19 <michaelp> +1
14:36:24 <rsinger> ... continue the action  Everyone to create use cases on the "use case note" page http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/UseCaseNotes 
14:36:25 <antoine> q+
14:36:30 <Zakim> +jneubert
14:36:40 <kai> +q
14:36:51 <TomB> ack antoine
14:37:22 <rsinger> antoine: kcoyle asks if the deadline can be extended until sep. 15th
14:37:44 <TomB> +1 for extending deadline
14:37:47 <rsinger> ... there can be contribution after the next teleconf
14:37:59 <kcoyle> ok, i agree
14:38:05 <bvatant> ok for this
14:38:05 <TomB> ack kai
14:38:20 <GordonD> thanx for clarification from antoine
14:38:39 <rsinger> kai: Are there more ideas for extensions to the template?
14:38:46 <TomB> q+
14:39:06 <rsinger> TomB: there was general approval of jneubert's additions
14:39:35 <rsinger> ... look at specific use cases/examples and use those examples to make decisions how to modify templates
14:39:46 <TomB> ack TomB
14:39:46 <jphipps> jphipps has joined #lld
14:39:54 <rsinger> kai: i like the new sections, we'll have a deeper look and discuss next time
14:40:01 <antoine> me re. joachim's new section, for one of them (prototype) could be in Existing work but explicitly documented in the template instruction for that section
14:40:19 <rsinger> TOPIC: LLC Topic List
14:40:31 <antoine> s/LLC/LLD
14:40:36 <rsinger> heh
14:40:40 <rsinger> s/LLC/LLC
14:41:06 <TomB> q?
14:41:13 <rsinger> kcoyle: the topic list hasn't been refined in a while.  do we want further refinement?  it is still very informal
14:41:15 <rsinger> BAH
14:41:22 <rsinger> s/LLC/LLD
14:42:12 <rsinger> TomB: will be put on the agenda in Pittsburgh
14:42:15 <antoine> +1
14:42:47 <rsinger> TOPIC: NISO Institutional Identifier (I2) working group
14:42:55 <rsinger> marcia: Already submitted
14:43:05 <marcia> http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/NISO-I2
14:43:07 <rsinger> ... recorded in wiki page
14:43:17 <antoine> ACTION: Marcia to send (informal) group's comment on I2 before the deadline for comments [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/07/29-lld-minutes.html#action05]
14:43:20 <antoine> --DONE
14:43:26 <rsinger> ... sent note to mailing list referring to: http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/NISO-I2
14:43:56 <rsinger> TomB: send it to our list as well, just for the public record
14:44:58 <rsinger> ACTION:  marcia to post I2 comments to LLD list
14:45:33 <rsinger> TOPIC: Library Data resources, and Library Terminology pages
14:45:57 <rsinger> kcoyle: there is room for other bullet points on the library data resources wiki page
14:46:20 <rsinger> ... this grew very quickly.  we have begun one of the possible tasks.
14:46:36 <rsinger> ... a vision of what the range is of library that we need to incorporate into our thinking of linked data
14:47:04 <rsinger> ... came out of work I was doing with OpenLibrary - libraries have their own language - so we use terms that librarians understand, but no one else
14:47:31 <rsinger> ... these aren't formal definitions, helps people understand what librarians mean
14:47:45 <rsinger> ... encourage people on the public list to contribute
14:48:09 <rsinger> ... started to gather together lists of vocabularies already in use for library linked data
14:48:46 <kcoyle> not me
14:48:47 <rsinger> ACTION: Gordon will prepare something on RDA, FRBR etc. for discussion in Sept. agenda [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/07/29-lld-minutes.html#action06]
14:48:55 <bvatant> yes!
14:49:00 <rsinger> TOPIC:  Reports from IFLA
14:49:01 <TomB> q?
14:49:13 <GordonD> q
14:49:33 <emma> q+
14:49:43 <rsinger> GordonD: IFLA was productive from the LLD perspective - started putting some info. out on the mailing list
14:49:57 <rsinger> ... on the FRBR stuff, hoping to be able to put something out within 2-3 weeks
14:50:16 <rsinger> ... also release an unbounded set of properties and see what happens with community uptake
14:50:40 <bvatant> http://www.slideshare.net/event/ifla-2010-world-library-and-information-congress-76th-ifla-general-conference-and-assembly
14:50:52 <rsinger> ... FRBR, as is, is deprecated in favor of a consolidated model combining FRBR and FRSAD
14:51:01 <TomB> q?
14:51:13 <Zakim> -jneubert
14:51:28 <rsinger> ... bibliographic description different than FRBR, more similar to RDA
14:51:42 <rsinger> ... specific rules about how elements should be displayed
14:51:53 <rsinger> ... will use a DC application profile for this
14:52:02 <rsinger> ... will feed back into DCMI and LLD
14:52:03 <Zakim> +jneubert
14:52:20 <rsinger> ... hope to make a crosslinking between FRBR and ISBD
14:53:08 <rsinger> ... much of the discussion taking place around linked data
14:53:36 <TomB> ack emma
14:53:58 <rsinger> emma: A lot of general interest on semweb at IFLA
14:54:19 <rsinger> ... important session on libraries and semweb, quite long for IFLA (4 hours?)
14:54:26 <rsinger> ... on a Sunday morning!
14:54:35 <TomB> q?
14:55:17 <rsinger> ... complementary to the technical work, special interest group within IFLA on the general interest, training, etc.
14:56:49 <rsinger> TOPIC: next telecon
14:56:57 <rsinger> TomB: next conference, next week
14:57:05 <rsinger> how do i do that?
14:57:29 <rsinger> i did that
14:58:03 <rsinger> --CONTINUES
14:58:09 <rsinger> hmm
14:58:24 <rsinger> ACTION: Gordon will prepare something on RDA, FRBR etc. for discussion in Sept. agenda [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/07/29-lld-minutes.html#action06]
14:58:30 <rsinger> --CONTINUES
14:58:37 <rsinger> well, that's in there twice, now
14:58:49 <rsinger> GordonD: so i expect that in duplicate
14:58:53 <Zakim> Zakim has left #lld
14:58:56 <Zakim> leaving.  As of this point the attendees were TomB, +33.1.53.79.aaaa, emma, antoine, MarkVanAssem, +1.330.672.aabb, marcia, GordonD, +44.194.346.aacc, monica, +33.9.71.48.aadd,
14:58:58 <Zakim> ... edsu, bvatant, kcoyle, +1.423.463.aaee, rsinger, Wolfgang, +1.607.222.aaff, jon, michaelp, +49.40.aahh, jneubert, Kai
14:59:09 <jneubert> bye
14:59:17 <TomB> rrsagent, please draft minutes
14:59:17 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/08/19-lld-minutes.html TomB
14:59:34 <MarkVanAssem> bye
15:00:06 <antoine> bye, Mark!
15:01:07 <antoine> ACTION: Everyone to create use cases on the "use case note" page http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/UseCaseNotes  . Not more than 2 persons per case. Deadline august 25. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/minutes/2010/07/29-lld-minutes.html#action04]
15:01:11 <antoine> --CONTINUES
15:02:55 <rsinger> ok, so i download, edit and send to the list?
15:03:51 <TomB> 	sees on the phone: TomB, emma, antoine, MarkVanAssem (muted), marcia, GordonD, monica (muted), edsu, bvatant (muted), kcoyle, Wolfgang, rsinger, jon, michaelp (muted), Kai,
15:04:18 <antoine> joachim
15:04:28 <antoine> s/joachim/jneubert
15:05:06 <rsinger> yes
15:05:22 <rsinger> no, but i can be
15:06:23 <TomB> zakim, who is on the call?
15:06:25 <rsinger> oh, ok
15:06:36 <rsinger> sounds good
15:07:03 <rsinger> alright
15:07:34 <rsinger> perfect
15:07:46 <antoine> rrsagent, please draft minutes
15:07:46 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/08/19-lld-minutes.html antoine
15:08:45 <rsinger> okie doke
15:08:49 <rsinger> will get this to you today
15:08:49 <emma> http://dublincore.org/architecturewiki/DcamInContext
15:09:04 <antoine> s/raoss/ross
15:09:13 <rsinger> thanks for being patient with me
15:09:50 <rsinger> aw, shucks
15:10:54 <TomB> thank you for scribing ross!
15:11:10 <rsinger> my pleasure - will be more efficient next time, i hope
15:13:56 <antoine> bye!
15:26:03 <michaelp> michaelp has left #lld