19:51:49 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #ssn
19:51:49 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2010/08/11-ssn-irc
19:51:58 <laurent_lefort_cs> rrsagent, bookmark
19:51:58 <RRSAgent> See http://www.w3.org/2010/08/11-ssn-irc#T19-51-58
19:52:06 <laurent_lefort_cs> zakim, this will be inc_ssn 
19:52:06 <Zakim> ok, laurent_lefort_cs; I see INC_SSN()4:00PM scheduled to start in 8 minutes
19:52:16 <laurent_lefort_cs> Meeting:   SSN XG
19:52:36 <laurent_lefort_cs> Chair:     Laurent
19:53:17 <laurent_lefort_cs> Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xg-ssn/2010Aug/0004.html
19:53:30 <Zakim> INC_SSN()4:00PM has now started
19:53:37 <Zakim> + +1.937.775.aaaa
19:54:43 <laurent_lefort_cs> Previous:  2010-08-03 http://www.w3.org/2010/08/03-ssn-minutes.html
19:55:13 <Payam> Payam has joined #SSN
19:55:28 <Andriy> Andriy has joined #ssn
19:57:38 <laurent_lefort_cs> Regrets: Simon, Kevin, Raśl, Sumita, Cory, Luis, David
19:59:09 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
19:59:27 <Payam> zakim, IPcaller is me
19:59:27 <Zakim> +Payam; got it
20:00:04 <Zakim> +??P2
20:00:26 <Arthur> Arthur has joined #ssn
20:01:05 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
20:01:34 <Arthur> zakim, IPcaller is me
20:01:34 <Zakim> +Arthur; got it
20:01:40 <Zakim> +??P5
20:01:42 <Andriy> Zakim, P2 is me
20:01:42 <Zakim> sorry, Andriy, I do not recognize a party named 'P2'
20:01:59 <laurent_lefort_cs> zakim, ??P5 is me
20:01:59 <Zakim> +laurent_lefort_cs; got it
20:02:14 <Andriy> Zakim, ??P2 is me
20:02:15 <Zakim> +Andriy; got it
20:04:27 <laurent_lefort_cs> scribenick: Payam
20:04:35 <Pramod> Pramod has joined #SSN
20:05:06 <kerry> kerry has joined #ssn
20:05:15 <krzysztof_j> krzysztof_j has joined #ssn
20:05:21 <laurent_lefort_cs> Topic: Examples and How To
20:05:21 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
20:05:32 <krzysztof_j> zakim, [IPcaller] is me
20:05:32 <Zakim> +krzysztof_j; got it
20:05:34 <laurent_lefort_cs> Andriy email last night with questions http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xg-ssn/2010Aug/0005.html
20:06:15 <michael_> michael_ has joined #ssn
20:07:26 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
20:07:51 <michael_> zakim, [IPcaller] is me
20:07:51 <Zakim> +michael_; got it
20:09:13 <Zakim> +kerry
20:10:23 <krzysztof_j> yes, i can  give a very short summary
20:11:04 <Payam> krzysztof to give a summary on DOLCHE work
20:11:49 <kerry> scribenick: payam
20:11:53 <Payam> we are discussing Andriy questions
20:12:59 <Payam> Andriy's example is a smart environment in a kitchen and he tries to use SSNX ontology for an accelerometer sensor
20:13:21 <krzysztof_j> +q
20:13:24 <Payam> questions are: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xg-ssn/2010Aug/0005.html
20:15:04 <Payam> answer to question 1: Michael - there should be role defined for qualities in the ontology
20:16:47 <Payam> Laurent, realtionship between O&M and features we follow Simon's work on relating features to O&M
20:16:54 <Payam> +q
20:17:33 <Payam> Michael, there is no link from sensor to features
20:17:52 <Payam> Andriy, how O&M is connected to sensors?
20:18:27 <laurent_lefort_cs> Laurent: check the nice doco at http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/ssn/wiki/SSN
20:19:07 <Payam> Michael, in the original ontology there is link from O&M to sensor and in some versions there is a link from O&M to process - but seems there is an error there in some versions.
20:20:14 <krzysztof_j> sorry, i have only an usb surf stick
20:20:29 <krzysztof_j> i will write it down
20:22:13 <michael_> +q
20:22:32 <laurent_lefort_cs> ack krzysztof_j
20:22:38 <laurent_lefort_cs> ack Payam
20:22:44 <laurent_lefort_cs> ack michael_
20:22:49 <krzysztof_j> for the ontology pattern/dolce alignment the feature of interest is linked using the role hasProperty to an observableProperty and therefore to the observation
20:23:05 <Payam> Payam, how this link between O&M data, feature and sensor description is maintained?
20:23:31 <Payam> Michael, there should be a link from sensor to features of quality that it measures
20:24:30 <Payam> Michael, there is a mistake in the current ontology and the link will be fixed
20:24:43 <Andriy> +q
20:24:53 <laurent_lefort_cs> Laurent: need to add a property measures <= missing link (move the link from the process) o feature-of-interest
20:25:09 <Payam> There will be a link from sensor to qualities that it measures
20:25:20 <Pramod> +q
20:25:24 <michael_> more like measures <= missing o observed-quality
20:25:34 <michael_> +q
20:25:53 <laurent_lefort_cs> Ack Andriy 
20:26:15 <Payam> Andriy, if the sensor is deployed and there is no measurement data, then how this feature can be accessed (if there is no O&M data)?
20:26:53 <Payam> +q
20:27:43 <Payam> Andriy, what is a feature?
20:28:07 <Payam> Laurent, it can be an abstract entity, a geographical entity, ...
20:28:29 <kerry> zakim, who's making noise?
20:28:32 <laurent_lefort_cs> Example: a sensor measuring the vertical acceleration of a knife
20:28:40 <Zakim> kerry, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: michael_ (69%)
20:29:16 <michael_> sorry, typing noise
20:29:26 <kerry> +q
20:29:30 <michael_> having measures <= missing o observed-quality doesn't mean that there is an indirection, it just means that anything that has been observed is something that the sensor can observe
20:30:02 <Payam> Kerry, feature is an object that you take measure
20:31:38 <kerry> ack kerry
20:31:43 <kerry> +q
20:32:57 <Payam> Michael, qulities are qualities of features; qualities that a sensor measures can be defined. Another way is linking a deployment to a sensor (we havn't discussed the latter)
20:33:47 <laurent_lefort_cs> ack Pramod
20:33:55 <laurent_lefort_cs> ack michael_
20:35:15 <laurent_lefort_cs> Action: Michael to add the missing link (and the role composition axioms manually)
20:35:15 <trackbot> Created ACTION-40 - Add the missing link (and the role composition axioms manually) [on Michael Compton - due 2010-08-18].
20:35:27 <laurent_lefort_cs> s/qulities/qualities/
20:35:34 <michael_> measures >= missing o observed-quality
20:36:06 <laurent_lefort_cs> s/measures <=/measures >=/
20:36:13 <Payam> Michael, there will be a link from sensor to qulities, and there will be a link from qualities to O&M
20:36:40 <Payam> it's clear to me now
20:37:00 <laurent_lefort_cs> ack Kerry
20:37:09 <Payam> ack Payam
20:37:17 <michael_> +q
20:37:49 <laurent_lefort_cs> s/qulities/qualities/
20:38:03 <laurent_lefort_cs> ack michael_
20:38:23 <Payam> Kerry, favouring deployment approach - features that sensor measures in deployment
20:38:48 <laurent_lefort_cs> Action: Michael to investigate or add link to feature at deployment 
20:38:48 <trackbot> Created ACTION-41 - Investigate or add link to feature at deployment  [on Michael Compton - due 2010-08-18].
20:39:16 <Payam> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xg-ssn/2010Aug/0005.html
20:39:35 <Payam> we now discuss question 3- 
20:40:12 <michael_> +q
20:40:27 <laurent_lefort_cs> ack michael_
20:40:27 <Payam> units of measurment - is there any recommended or it's totally up to user to select one
20:41:08 <Payam> Laurent, there is a UOM ontology from a group called ... QMOS?
20:41:22 <laurent_lefort_cs> Laurent : OASIS wg QUOMOS Quantity of Unit of Meausrement Ontology Standard
20:42:02 <laurent_lefort_cs> NASA ontology: QUDT
20:42:23 <laurent_lefort_cs> OMG SysML-QUDV 
20:42:46 <Payam> Jano also sent one earlier today
20:43:24 <Payam> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xg-ssn/2010Aug/0007.html
20:44:37 <Payam> Laurent will send a UOM ontology to the group later
20:45:31 <Payam> sorry, my mistake it judge based on name :)
20:45:33 <michael_> +q
20:46:04 <krzysztof_j> ack!
20:46:18 <laurent_lefort_cs> ack michael_
20:46:38 <laurent_lefort_cs> +q
20:47:02 <laurent_lefort_cs> ack laurent
20:47:54 <Payam> Laurent, if we want to connect our work to others; we should leave some aspects to be linked to other existing data
20:48:35 <michael_> +q
20:48:51 <Payam> question 4- how to express quality attributes and quality values
20:49:35 <Payam> e.g. what is max, and min. vlaues for frequancy...
20:49:56 <laurent_lefort_cs> Laurent: see example http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/ssn/wiki/Modelling_of_Accuracy,_etc
20:50:09 <laurent_lefort_cs> s/vlaues/values/
20:50:32 <Payam> question is: how to express ranges for values
20:50:41 <laurent_lefort_cs> ack michael_m
20:50:49 <laurent_lefort_cs> ack michael_
20:51:14 <laurent_lefort_cs> Andriy asking about point 5
20:52:25 <Payam> +q
20:52:35 <krzysztof_j> why not use proxy class
20:53:58 <laurent_lefort_cs> Ack payam
20:54:07 <michael_> proxy?
20:54:31 <Payam> we don't have detailed attributes; so we can't really define rules at this stage
20:55:26 <Payam> Jano, we can use proxy classes... let users define equivalent classes
20:55:53 <Payam> we discuss point 6 later
20:56:32 <krzysztof_j> keep in mind that domain and range are very dangerous
20:57:05 <Payam> point 6- domain/range restrictions of properties 
20:57:09 <laurent_lefort_cs> Action: Michael to remove remaining range and domain
20:57:09 <trackbot> Created ACTION-42 - Remove remaining range and domain [on Michael Compton - due 2010-08-18].
20:57:15 <michael_> ok
20:57:38 <Payam> I will try
20:57:40 <kerry> +q
20:57:45 <Payam> how many weeks we have left?
20:58:23 <laurent_lefort_cs> 3 weeks
20:58:35 <Payam> Jano, DOLCHE work update
20:58:39 <laurent_lefort_cs> Topic: DOLCE Alignment 
20:59:01 <michael_> agree
20:59:21 <kerry> +q
20:59:42 <laurent_lefort_cs> s/DOLCHE/DOLCE/
21:00:11 <krzysztof_j> andriy: to point 6 are you arguing for or against domain/range for the roles?
21:00:24 <Payam> I will try to use SSN ontology and link it to linked-data; we use DBpedia SPARQL end-points so most of resources will be from DBpedia
21:00:36 <laurent_lefort_cs> Laurent: LODE http://linkedevents.org/ontology/
21:00:49 <laurent_lefort_cs> Topic: AOB
21:01:30 <krzysztof_j> would be great!
21:01:43 <Andriy> +q
21:01:50 <laurent_lefort_cs> ack kerry
21:01:55 <kerry> ack kerry
21:01:56 <laurent_lefort_cs> ack Andriy
21:02:19 <krzysztof_j> +q
21:03:09 <kerry> there was also a preference to avoid prporty explosion
21:03:31 <laurent_lefort_cs> ack krzysztof_j
21:04:55 <Payam> Kerry, invited group members to particiapte and join the SSN workshop co -organised with Int. Semantic Web conference in Shanghai- 
21:05:44 <kerry> +kerry
21:06:42 <michael_> not me
21:07:00 <krzysztof_j> we cannot edit the wikie?
21:07:09 <krzysztof_j> y
21:07:10 <Payam> once XG is closed, we can't edit wiki
21:07:19 <krzysztof_j> uh!
21:07:28 <krzysztof_j> bye bye
21:07:35 <Zakim> -krzysztof_j
21:07:38 <kerry> bye!
21:07:39 <Zakim> - +1.937.775.aaaa
21:07:39 <michael_> bye
21:07:40 <Zakim> -Payam
21:07:40 <Arthur> bye
21:07:44 <laurent_lefort_cs> s/particiapte/participate/
21:07:44 <Zakim> -kerry
21:07:45 <Payam> bye
21:07:47 <Zakim> -Arthur
21:07:49 <Zakim> -michael_
21:07:54 <laurent_lefort_cs> s/wikie/wiki/
21:11:04 <Zakim> -Andriy
21:11:23 <laurent_lefort_cs> zakim, list attendees
21:11:23 <Zakim> As of this point the attendees have been +1.937.775.aaaa, Payam, Arthur, laurent_lefort_cs, Andriy, krzysztof_j, michael_, kerry
21:12:23 <Zakim> -laurent_lefort_cs
21:12:24 <Zakim> INC_SSN()4:00PM has ended
21:12:26 <Zakim> Attendees were +1.937.775.aaaa, Payam, Arthur, laurent_lefort_cs, Andriy, krzysztof_j, michael_, kerry
21:18:31 <laurent_lefort_cs> rrsagent, make log public
21:18:41 <laurent_lefort_cs> rrsagent, please draft minutes
21:18:41 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/08/11-ssn-minutes.html laurent_lefort_cs
21:18:59 <laurent_lefort_cs> rrsagent, make log public
21:19:30 <laurent_lefort_cs> s/Raśl/Raul/
21:20:10 <laurent_lefort_cs> s/SSNX/SSN/
21:20:37 <laurent_lefort_cs> s/realtionship/relationship/
21:22:18 <laurent_lefort_cs> s/property measures <=/property measures =>/
21:23:30 <laurent_lefort_cs> s/measurment/measurement/
21:25:19 <laurent_lefort_cs> s/Quantity of Unit of Meausrement/Quantities and Units of Measure/
21:25:56 <laurent_lefort_cs> s/QMOS?/http://www.oasis-open.org/committees/tc_home.php?wg_abbrev=quomos/
21:27:14 <laurent_lefort_cs> s/QUDT/QUDT qudt.org/
21:27:24 <laurent_lefort_cs> rrsagent, please draft minutes
21:27:24 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/08/11-ssn-minutes.html laurent_lefort_cs
21:28:24 <laurent_lefort_cs> s/frequancy/frequency/
21:30:33 <laurent_lefort_cs> s/prporty/property/
21:31:07 <laurent_lefort_cs> rrsagent, please draft minutes
21:31:07 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/08/11-ssn-minutes.html laurent_lefort_cs
21:32:14 <laurent_lefort_cs> More units of measurement references here: http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/ssn/wiki/Agriculture_Meteorology_Sensor_Network#Generic_units_and_quantities
21:32:34 <laurent_lefort_cs> rrsagent, please draft minutes
21:32:34 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/08/11-ssn-minutes.html laurent_lefort_cs
21:33:05 <laurent_lefort_cs> rrsagent, please generate minutes
21:33:05 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/08/11-ssn-minutes.html laurent_lefort_cs
22:02:55 <laurent_lefort_cs> zakim, bye
22:02:55 <Zakim> Zakim has left #ssn
22:03:09 <laurent_lefort_cs> rrsagent, bye
22:03:09 <RRSAgent> I see 3 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2010/08/11-ssn-actions.rdf :
22:03:09 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Michael to add the missing link (and the role composition axioms manually) [1]
22:03:09 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/08/11-ssn-irc#T20-35-15
22:03:09 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Michael to investigate or add link to feature at deployment  [2]
22:03:09 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/08/11-ssn-irc#T20-38-48
22:03:09 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Michael to remove remaining range and domain [3]
22:03:09 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/08/11-ssn-irc#T20-57-09