21:56:56 RRSAgent has joined #html-a11y
21:56:56 logging to http://www.w3.org/2010/06/16-html-a11y-irc
21:57:06 zakim, this will be html-a11y
21:57:06 I do not see a conference matching that name scheduled within the next hour, janina
21:57:53 zakim, this will be WAI_PFWG(A11Y)
21:57:53 ok, janina, I see WAI_PFWG(A11Y)6:00PM already started
21:58:04 zakim, call janina
21:58:04 ok, janina; the call is being made
21:58:06 +Janina
21:58:21 zakim, who is on the phone?
21:58:21 On the phone I see Eric_Carlson, Janina
22:02:59 +Judy
22:05:55 Judy has joined #html-a11y
22:05:59 zakim, call Mike
22:05:59 ok, MikeSmith; the call is being made
22:06:01 +Mike
22:06:15 silvia, do you plan to join?
22:06:52 I have a busy schedule today, sorry
22:07:06 if you need me, just type my name and I can join though
22:11:48 4http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/44061/20080526_media-requirements/results
22:12:08 +silvia
22:15:20 http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/Media_Accessibility_Requirements
22:16:48 ---------------------------
22:16:50 scribe: MikeSmith
22:16:51 +[Microsoft]
22:16:57 starting to review document at http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/44061/20080526_media-requirements/results#xq19
22:17:09 Sean Hayes has joined
22:17:24 John Foliot is out today, Janina is chairing
22:17:28 chair: Janina
22:18:10 Sean has joined #html-a11y
22:18:30 RRSAgent, make minutes
22:18:30 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/06/16-html-a11y-minutes.html MikeSmith
22:18:42 RRSAgent, make logs public
22:19:27 meeting: HTML a11y media subgroup
22:20:07 Present: Janina, Judy, Silvia, Sean, MikeSmith
22:20:20 Present+ Eric
22:20:31 Zakim, who's on the phone?
22:20:31 On the phone I see Eric_Carlson, Janina, Judy, Mike, silvia, [Microsoft]
22:20:58 [reviewing requirements together]
22:23:08 janina: we did not make an representations that we would reply to people's comments
22:23:20 janina: so no action necessarily needed here
22:23:45 silvia: I suggest putting a reply to this question in the minutes
22:24:09 [discussion is about comment regarding inclusion of markup for speech synthesis]
22:24:52 answer to question about whether such formats exist: Yes
22:26:36 Sean: Timed Text can also be used for speech markup...
22:26:53 [going on to next comment from Philip J]
22:27:45 the comment: "Is copyright information and usage rights really relevant to users of this technology? It seems like a general requirements unrelated to accessibility which should be suggested for /, if at all."
22:28:10 silvia: it's good to have it in the requirements, but it should be solved more generally
22:28:20 ... e.g., as is being done in the Media Annotations WG
22:28:51 Judy: so remove it? keep it but tie it to other work?
22:29:02 ... is there a suggestion?
22:30:18 Eric: I would suggest it be listed as a general requirement any time we pull in resources that are not the [master media resource]
22:32:31 http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/Media_Accessibility_Requirements#Production_practice_and_resulting_requirements
22:33:15 Eric: I think we should remove it from this section
22:33:31 ...because we are otherwise implying that it's not important in other sections as well
22:33:44 [we have agreement to remove it from this section]
22:33:57 [Silvia is making changes to the source live]
22:34:09 RRSAgent, make minutes
22:34:09 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/06/16-html-a11y-minutes.html MikeSmith
22:35:49 janina: resolution on TAD-3 is "if you can support it, you should"
22:36:02 Philip's comment about that was, "Sounds like a quality of implementation issue for UAs, not something all UAs will be able to do on all platforms"
22:36:26 [no objections to making that change]
22:36:34 RRSAgent, make minutes
22:36:34 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/06/16-html-a11y-minutes.html MikeSmith
22:37:06 janina: this is a UA issue, not a user issue
22:37:29 Eric: this is one of those that there is no way to support on all platforms
22:37:51 silvia: we should document what we expect the default/minimum to be
22:38:10 Eric: it won't be a very good user experience if a UA is not able to handle it
22:38:21 ... because the descriptions will be out of synx
22:38:30 s/synx/sync/
22:38:51 janina: I can't see this being used in, say, a Hollywood movie
22:39:19 ... it seems like something that's limited to the case of using in an [instructional context only]
22:39:49 janina: this is new ground here.. brand new... have not had this ability in the past
22:40:51 [we are btw discussing TAD-4]
22:42:07 Eric: amount that a UA keeps buffered is not infinite
22:46:10 [changes made to requirements doc]
22:46:31 moving on to comment from Eric: "If we want people to be able to create interoperable pages, this requirement must specify a TAD file format.
22:46:31 "
22:46:46 plus:
22:46:47 (TAD-1), (TAD-2), (TAD-4), and (TAD-5) Aren't these all requirements for the TAD file format?
22:46:47 (TAD-3) This won't be possible on all platforms, for example devices that only allow one mode of audio output.
22:46:51 "
22:47:29 janina: I think, Eric, I agree with you
22:49:57 action: janina to add some introductory text to requirement docs clarifying that these are user requirements, not necessarily UA requirements
22:49:57 Created ACTION-50 - Add some introductory text to requirement docs clarifying that these are user requirements, not necessarily UA requirements [on Janina Sajka - due 2010-06-23].
22:52:15 RRSAgent, make minutes
22:52:15 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/06/16-html-a11y-minutes.html MikeSmith
22:53:18 zakim, mute me
22:53:18 silvia should now be muted
22:53:35 next comment was from Marco Ranon, about a typo, and that is now fixed
22:53:57 next comment is from Masatomo Kobayashi, "TAD-2 Could label the three specific requirements so that we could easily refer to each item?"
22:56:08 zakim, unmute me
22:56:08 silvia should no longer be muted
22:58:29 -Eric_Carlson
22:59:46 [not clear to scribe what the resolution was on Kobayashi-san's "(TAD-3) This won't be possible on all platforms, for example devices that only allow one mode of audio output." comment, so would like for somebody to please record that here if possible]
22:59:51 +Eric_Carlson
23:00:34 Koboyashi TAD-3 comment was already resolved through addressing Philip's comment
23:01:07 scribe: Sean
23:01:53 Zakim, drop Mike
23:01:53 Mike is being disconnected
23:01:54 -Mike
23:02:11 Rich is asking for API support
23:02:47 Judy: Should be 'support presentation of'
23:03:25 eric: we are documenting user requirements, not UA reqts
23:03:52 Judy: 'support for presentation of'
23:04:47 Do we want the additional specificity
23:05:03 s/support for presentation of/support presentation of/
23:05:05 Silvia: has made edit
23:07:43 judy: access to textual representation of description
23:08:10 in order that it can be presented to a screen reader
23:08:44 support for different options for the overflow case
23:08:54 -Eric_Carlson
23:09:43 silvia: addressing richards comment may have addresed this
23:09:44 +Eric_Carlson
23:10:57 No W3C recommendation on emotional markup
23:13:07 moving to clear audio
23:14:33 moving to extended audio description
23:15:23 davidb has joined #html-a11y
23:16:14 Eric: Big difference between a demo and shipping code
23:16:34 Janina: this is a new user requirement
23:16:47 if a major player wants to do it then fine
23:17:11 Eric: should this be listed as a requirement
23:17:32 Silvia: should soften must into "advanced functionality"
23:17:57 Judy : what does detailed user control mean
23:18:11 Silvia : what to do in the case of overflow
23:18:42 Judy: This requires too much domain knowledge
23:19:05 Judy: make conditional and reference TAD 2
23:19:16 s/2/4
23:20:40 comment is SMIL would be an enormous undertaking
23:21:06 Sean: could this be achieved with a simpler technology?
23:21:27 Silvia: These are technical comments, and we shouldnt go there in this doc
23:22:13 Eric: I'm concerned that if we come out with a doc saying these are the reqts, then its a conclusion all need to be supported by UA
23:22:24 Janina: This is an advanced feature
23:24:15 zakim, mute me
23:24:15 silvia should now be muted
23:24:30 How about: Note that this is an advanced feature and would only be expected by advanced systems.
23:24:34 zakim, unmute me
23:24:34 silvia should no longer be muted
23:24:45 Silvia: How about: Note that this is an advanced feature and would only be expected by advanced systems
23:25:27 zakim, mute me
23:25:27 silvia should now be muted
23:26:09 Judy: Capture a note to provide definition of EAD
23:27:29 Eric: the crux is the strictness of the synchronisation
23:27:43 without it wont provide a good user experience
23:28:31 Judy: response is?
23:28:53 Janina: Not convinced that loose synchronisation is acceptable
23:29:54 zakim, unmute me
23:29:54 silvia should no longer be muted
23:30:15 EAD 1 should be split into two provisions
23:32:02 Silvia : re-order to clarify that its the control that is key
23:32:48 Janina: Previous section is covering this area too
23:34:07 zakim, unmute me
23:34:07 silvia was not muted, silvia
23:34:11 zakim, mute me
23:34:11 silvia should now be muted
23:34:20 Janina : 3 out of 17 is not fast enough
23:34:46 there is too much to go throgh, suggesting a virtula f2f
23:35:06 Judy: suggest people to pair up and take on different sections
23:36:36 Eric: +1 to Judy
23:38:55 Janina: 3 teams Sean & silvia; Eric and John; Janina and Judy
23:40:25 Judy: Discovery is huge, rest is fairly even
23:40:55 Sean: load balance in email
23:41:17 zakim, unmute me
23:41:17 silvia should no longer be muted
23:42:14 Silivia: Will do the assignments
23:43:42 teams to cover their work by next tuesday
23:44:17 -Eric_Carlson
23:44:20 -[Microsoft]
23:44:21 -silvia
23:44:21 -Janina
23:44:23 -Judy
23:44:23 WAI_PFWG(A11Y)6:00PM has ended
23:44:24 Attendees were Eric_Carlson, Janina, Judy, Mike, silvia, [Microsoft]
23:44:41 rrsagent, make log public
23:44:50 rrsagent, make minutes
23:44:50 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/06/16-html-a11y-minutes.html janina