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14:57:02 happy venerable bede's day (catholic observance) http://www.hicom.net/~oedipus/obfuscation.html#may27
14:57:14 happy belated venerable bede's day (anglican observance) http://www.hicom.net/~oedipus/obfuscation.html#may25
14:58:09 venerable bede is credited with conceiving the footnote
14:58:59 zakim, call janina
14:59:03 Zakim has joined #html-a11y
14:59:12 trackbot, start meeting
14:59:14 RRSAgent, make logs world
14:59:16 Zakim, this will be 2119
14:59:16 ok, trackbot; I see WAI_PFWG(HTML TF)11:00AM scheduled to start in 1 minute
14:59:16 zakim, this will be html-a11y
14:59:17 Meeting: HTML Accessibility Task Force Teleconference
14:59:17 Date: 27 May 2010
14:59:18 I do not see a conference matching that name scheduled within the next hour, janina
14:59:24 zakim, call janina
14:59:24 ok, janina; the call is being made
14:59:28 zakim, code?
14:59:28 the conference code is 2119 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 tel:+33.4.89.06.34.99 tel:+44.117.370.6152), jeanne
14:59:36 JF has joined #html-a11y
14:59:51 zakim, drop janina
14:59:51 sorry, janina, I don't know what conference this is
14:59:57 zakim, call janina
14:59:57 ok, janina; the call is being made
15:00:22 zakim, this is 2119
15:00:24 zakim, drop janina
15:00:28 zakim, this is 2119
15:00:31 zakim, this is 2119
15:00:33 ok, MichaelC; that matches WAI_PFWG(HTML TF)11:00AM
15:00:33 zakim, this is 2119
15:00:37 zakim, call janina
15:00:39 zakim, who's on the phone?
15:00:41 Janina.a is being disconnected
15:00:46 zakim, who's on the phone?
15:00:51 -Janina.a
15:00:53 MichaelC, this was already WAI_PFWG(HTML TF)11:00AM
15:00:55 ok, MichaelC; that matches WAI_PFWG(HTML TF)11:00AM
15:00:57 MichaelC, this was already WAI_PFWG(HTML TF)11:00AM
15:01:01 ok, MichaelC; that matches WAI_PFWG(HTML TF)11:00AM
15:01:03 MichaelC, this was already WAI_PFWG(HTML TF)11:00AM
15:01:05 ok, MichaelC; that matches WAI_PFWG(HTML TF)11:00AM
15:01:11 ok, janina; the call is being made
15:01:15 +Janina
15:01:19 On the phone I see Eric_Carlson, Janina (muted), Gregory_Rosmaita, kliehm, Michael_Cooper
15:01:27 On the phone I see Eric_Carlson, Janina (muted), Gregory_Rosmaita, kliehm, Michael_Cooper
15:01:29 +John_Foliot
15:01:49 +Jeanne
15:01:55 http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/index.php?title=Scribe_List
15:02:07 -Jeanne
15:02:08 Meeting: HTML-A11Y telecon
15:02:08 Chair: Janina_Sajka
15:02:08 agenda: this
15:02:08 agenda+ Identify Scribe http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/index.php?title=Scribe_List
15:02:08 agenda+ Actions Review http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/track/actions/open
15:02:09 agenda+ Canvas, Media, & ARIA Subteam Updates
15:02:11 agenda+ Resolved & Rejected Bugs Review http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-a11y/2010May/0170.html agenda+ New
15:02:14 +Business
15:02:16 agenda+ next meetings, confirm date/time, choose scribe
15:02:18 agenda+ be done
15:02:20
15:02:21 Zakim, call Mike
15:02:28 zakim, who is on the phone?
15:02:43 -Janina
15:02:45 +Jeanne
15:03:01 +Janina_Sajka
15:03:21 ok, MikeSmith; the call is being made
15:03:25 +Mike
15:03:33 On the phone I see Eric_Carlson, Gregory_Rosmaita, kliehm (muted), Michael_Cooper, John_Foliot, Jeanne, Janina_Sajka, Mike (muted)
15:03:38 Marco_Ranon has joined #html-a11y
15:04:38 +Ben
15:05:08 Ben has joined #html-a11y
15:05:30 Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose Ben
15:05:54 http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/index.php?title=Scribe_List
15:07:17 + +0207388aaaa
15:07:30 zakim, aaaa is Marco_Ranon
15:07:30 +Marco_Ranon; got it
15:07:47 +Cynthia_Shelly
15:08:28 richardschwerdtfe has joined #html-a11y
15:09:03 cyns has joined #html-a11y
15:09:23 Zakim, Mike is me
15:09:25 +MikeSmith; got it
15:09:32 Zakim, mute me
15:09:32 MikeSmith should now be muted
15:09:53 http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/track/actions/open
15:09:54 action items review
15:09:54 Sorry, couldn't find user - items
15:10:10 Action 28 on Gregory on future of datamining
15:10:10 Sorry, couldn't find user - 28
15:10:24 GR: don't know publication status of alt techniques
15:10:32 JS: listed to publish with next round
15:10:56 GR: wanted that draft to go out an dbe commented on before adding appendix,so we don't have discussion on mulitple fronts
15:11:03 MC: push out 2 weeks
15:11:07 GR: ok
15:11:08 action-28 due 10 June
15:11:08 ACTION-28 - prepare text for SteveF's guidance document about future of data-mining using RDFPic methodology outlined in post to list due date now 10 June
15:11:30 action-44 due 10 June
15:11:31 ACTION-44 - monitor status of @alt in HTML5 spec; when SteveF's Alt Guidance is published, ensure that what is in SteveF's note supersedes or corrects HTML5 verbiage; propose changes to HTML5 based on SteveF's alt doc due date now 10 June
15:11:32 i/action items review/TOPIC: action items review/
15:11:35 Action 44: Cynthia to ensure that what's in Steve Notes superscedes spec verbiage
15:11:35 Sorry, couldn't find user - 44
15:11:44 MC: waiting on same event?
15:11:50 CS: yes, push out 2 weeks
15:12:12 MC: action 20 on Charles on history of col element
15:12:25 CS: wendy waiting on this for summary and table algorithm work
15:12:31 JS: think that is right
15:12:32 CS: Wendy waiting on this.
15:12:47 MC: reasign to wendy to have her follow up with charles
15:12:52 +Rich
15:13:24 MC: deadline?
15:13:32 CS: a week - will talk to her today
15:13:43 JS: can you update her on summary so far?
15:13:46 CS: yes
15:14:11 JS: revised restore as was in HTML 4.01 at chairs' suggestion to take pressure off of time constraints so can engineer better
15:14:19 CS: not end of world if old stuff is there
15:14:32 JS: resolved following chair's suggestion, forwarded that
15:14:59 remaining actions are part of sub-groups
15:15:13 JS: next topic sub team reports, first canvas
15:15:29 RS: feedback from Apple late last week. They want to add features to API.
15:15:30 i/next topic sub/TOPIC: Canvas, Media, & ARIA Subteam Updates
15:15:40 RS: some group doesnt' agree with for a couple reasons:
15:15:45 RS: 1) feature creep
15:15:53 RS: 2) concerns about magnification
15:16:10 RS: also had some feautres we liked. Sent new draft with new features.
15:16:13 http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-a11y/2010May/0172.html
15:16:33 RS: didn't expect new requiremetns this late. it slowed things down, but we have to reach consensus
15:16:43 http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-canvas-api/2010AprJun/att-0015/2dcontext10-Apr-11.html
15:16:51 RS: assuming Apple is happy with changes, shouldn't take too long to finish. If they want more, it will take longer.
15:17:04 RS: haven't heard from Charles.
15:17:38 JS: sent note to Charles. Want image map proposals, but if the other proposals are ready, we won't wait. Days not weeks to get proposal in.
15:17:45 JS: we hope he'll get it done
15:18:37 RS: Apple was waiting until James got back from vacation. I wish I'd known that. Challenge we're having now is that james can't attend Monday calls. Hope we can resolve via email
15:18:41 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/05/27-html-a11y-minutes.html oedipus
15:19:03 JS: so, we can't come up with a new deadline now? Don't know exactly what needs to be done again?
15:19:22 JS: decided to wait and include Apple feedback
15:19:31 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/05/27-html-a11y-minutes.html oedipus
15:19:35 RS: apple created canvas, so we really wanted their feedback
15:20:49 JS: communications breakdown
15:20:58 JS: but moving forared now
15:21:08 JS: doesn't think canvas will hold up last call
15:21:17 JS: moving to media
15:21:20 http://www.w3.org/2010/05/26-html-a11y-minutes.html
15:21:32 http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/Media_MultitrackAPI
15:21:34 +??P6
15:21:47 http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/Media_Accessibility_Requirements
15:21:49 JF: a couple weeks back we did a major regroup. had been workign from assumptions, and need to create list of requirements
15:22:19 JF: requirements list is now fairly complete. tried really hard to tighted it and cover everything
15:22:50 JF: broken out by types of disabilities. there are some terms that need clean up, and Judy will be doing this
15:22:55 Stevef has joined #html-a11y
15:23:01 JF: types of technologies and system requirements covered
15:24:07 JF: major thing yesterday, hoping that by EOD or early tomorrow there will be straw poll survey to get feedback on requirements. don't need to be media expert, just understand accessibility. do we have everything, did we miss anything, is it clear?
15:24:27 JF: once doc is finished, we'll do gap analysis against media work done so far
15:24:37 JF: those are waiting for this doc.
15:25:03 JF: other groups have expressed interest in this doc. We're getting our horse in front of the cart now.
15:25:09 JF: please do the survey
15:25:12 zakim, ??P6 is possibly Steve_Faulkner
15:25:12 +Steve_Faulkner?; got it
15:25:41 zakim, Steve_Faulkner is Stevef
15:25:41 +Stevef; got it
15:25:44 JS: we really want a wide review. hypertext coordination group discussing week from friday
15:25:55 JS: htmlwg also very interested
15:26:14 JS: please do the survey. we're very close to finished, need a sanity check.
15:26:49 RS: all comments in survey? or put them elsewhere?
15:27:08 JF: you can do it in survey with inline comments, but mail is ok if that's easier for you.
15:27:25 JF: total of 17 discussion points. Do we have this right? agree yes/no, provide comments
15:27:35 JF: survey is easier, but any format will be accepted.
15:27:50 RS: Is this wiki public?
15:27:57 JF: survey is task-force restricted
15:28:16 RS: Jeff (???) is aware of the document
15:28:17 -> http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/Media_Accessibility_Requirements Media Accessibility Requirements (please review!)
15:29:01 JS: document is publicly viewable, but someone outside task force won't be able to fill in survey. have them send email.
15:29:08 JS: survey results and wiki are world-viewable; surveys and wiki content modification limited to TF members
15:29:34 RRSAgent, make minutes
15:29:34 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/05/27-html-a11y-minutes.html MikeSmith
15:29:52 JF: We are particularly looking for a deaf-blind user to give feedback
15:30:26 JS: thanks everyone who worked on this doc. Great contributions, and I think we'll be pleased with the results.
15:30:47 s/Jeff (???)/Geoff/
15:30:57 JS: there may be some terms that are used in accessibility that engineers won't understand. we're trying to find ways to define these better
15:31:26 JS: we hope this doc will live on beyond this task force
15:31:55 +1 to longer life of Media Accessibility Requirements document
15:32:12 SF: still working on mappings
15:32:30 SF: rich has started on his, Steve started on his, cynthia started on hers
15:32:35 plus 1 to longer life of Media Accessibility Requirements document
15:32:45 CS: aggressive target date, but think still ok
15:33:15 CS: draft but without signoff for target date
15:33:33 CS: already implemented (most of it) -- have to copy from existing documentation
15:33:58 RS: was to address hixie's table -- that doc isn't going into the HTML5 spec?
15:34:05 CS: don't think so, don't care
15:34:11 RS: would not do that
15:34:28 CS: second gargantuan -- not opposed to it being in spec, as long as in HTML5 document set
15:34:47 RS: not alot of UA devs have done A11y API mappings
15:35:02 CS: safari has mappings, IE has mappings, FF has mapping
15:35:08 RS: concern about "command"
15:35:23 CS: that has always been point of emphasis to document older stuff -- not controversial
15:35:44 SF: what are we intending to produce to modify or replace what is currently in spec in regards to conformance
15:35:55 CS: not sure if we decided on that -- been data collecting so far
15:36:50 RS: hixie's current beef is that there isn't a 1-to-1 mapping for ARIA and says that is problem, but is not, since we want native solutions over ARIA
15:37:01 JS: reminder -- just 4 weeks away
15:37:09 SF: who owns requirements document?
15:37:19 CS: rich
15:37:24 kliehm has joined #html-a11y
15:37:37 JS: 24 June still target date
15:37:53 RS: have plethora of controls being added -- are they adding more to HTML5 spec
15:38:01 CS: ones that are in there have been there a long time
15:38:21 RS: biggest concern is HTML5 still a moving target -- can't say we are done until spec text correct/analyzed
15:38:40 RS: may be implemented but are not yet supported
15:39:02 RS: pragmatic view: say something by 24 june, but we will probably log bug against it -- too big
15:39:21 CS: big mapping table with wraparound text and re-write of override verbiage in spec
15:39:30 CS: if spec changes, they will change
15:40:11 JS: a few points before next topic
15:40:21 s/override verbiage in spec/override verbiage in HTML5 spec will be delivered 24 june 2010
15:40:38 JS: Steve sent email asking if ARIA title change was ok. we'll do an editorial pass later
15:40:49 i/aggressive target date/scribenick: oedipus/
15:40:57 JS: ARIA title chagne do this wekk
15:41:05 SF: will do
15:41:11 JS: new topics coming soon
15:41:27 i/a few points before next topic/scribenick: cyns
15:41:30 http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-a11y/2010May/0179.html
15:41:40 JS: in April F2F asked Gez Lemon to look at drag and drop. He has posted
15:41:59 JS: asked him to join call to discuss. He proposed June 3
15:42:12 plus 1 to sooner rather than later
15:42:19 yeah
15:42:25 Zakim, unmute me
15:42:25 MikeSmith should no longer be muted
15:42:26 JS: 10th and 24th ok too. Would prefer to schedule sooner rather that later, next week
15:42:27 +1 for next week
15:42:32 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/05/27-html-a11y-minutes.html oedipus
15:42:37 +1 next week
15:43:08 JS: drag and drop scheduled for next thursday's meeting. Please read ahead of time and discuss on list
15:43:09 q+
15:43:24 q+
15:43:27 JS: 2nd topic, accesskeys. Gregory plans to bring it here in 2-3 weeks
15:43:30