Chatlog 2011-03-24

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13:50:09 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #rdfa
13:50:09 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2011/03/24-rdfa-irc
13:50:11 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs world
13:50:11 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #rdfa
13:50:13 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be 7332
13:50:13 <Zakim> ok, trackbot; I see SW_RDFa()10:00AM scheduled to start in 10 minutes
13:50:14 <trackbot> Meeting: RDFa Working Group Teleconference
13:50:14 <trackbot> Date: 24 March 2011
13:50:57 <manu1> Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdfa-wg/2011Mar/0089.html
13:51:12 <manu1> Chair: Manu
13:55:08 <Benjamin> Benjamin has joined #rdfa
14:02:17 <Zakim> SW_RDFa()10:00AM has now started
14:02:18 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
14:02:23 <manu1> zakim, i am IPcaller
14:02:23 <Zakim> ok, manu1, I now associate you with [IPcaller]
14:02:40 <Zakim> +??P22
14:02:41 <Zakim> -??P22
14:02:41 <Zakim> +??P22
14:02:49 <webr3> Zakim, I am ??P22
14:02:49 <Zakim> +webr3; got it
14:02:51 <Zakim> +??P24
14:02:57 <ivan> zakim, ??P24 is me
14:02:58 <Zakim> +ivan; got it
14:04:25 <Zakim> +ivan.a
14:05:05 <manu1> zakim, ivan.a is benjamin
14:05:05 <Zakim> +benjamin; got it
14:05:26 <Benjamin> scribenick: benjamin
14:05:37 <manu1> Present: Ivan, Nathan, Benjamin, Manu, MarkB
14:05:39 <manu1> Regrets: Steven, ShaneM, Knud
14:06:04 <manu1> zakim, who is on the call?
14:06:04 <Zakim> On the phone I see [IPcaller], webr3, ivan, benjamin
14:07:08 <Benjamin> Topic: Remaining 1st Last Call Issues
14:07:55 <manu1> http://www.w3.org/2010/02/rdfa/track/products/8
14:07:58 <Benjamin> Manu: We have a number of official responses that we're waiting on for the comment submitter to respond. We have asked them to respond at least once, in some cases we've asked them to respond several times, we have publicly announced several times when we were going into 2nd Last Call. I think it's safe to close these issues as we've taken them into account, agreed to make changes based on most of the comments, and implemented those changes in the RDFa Core 1.1 and XHTML+RDFa 1.1 documents.
14:12:34 <manu1> PROPOSAL: Close the following issues, official response was sent, multiple reminders to respond were sent to each comment submitter: ISSUE-46, ISSUE-66, ISSUE-67, ISSUE-69, ISSUE-70, ISSUE-72, ISSUE-73, ISSUE-74, ISSUE-76, ISSUE-78, ISSUE-79, ISSUE-80, ISSUE-81, ISSUE-82, ISSUE-84.
14:12:48 <manu1> +1
14:12:50 <Benjamin> Benjamin: +1
14:12:52 <ivan> +1
14:12:53 <webr3> +1
14:12:55 <manu1> RESOLVED: Close the following issues, official response was sent, multiple reminders to respond were sent to each comment submitter: ISSUE-46, ISSUE-66, ISSUE-67, ISSUE-69, ISSUE-70, ISSUE-72, ISSUE-73, ISSUE-74, ISSUE-76, ISSUE-78, ISSUE-79, ISSUE-80, ISSUE-81, ISSUE-82, ISSUE-84.
14:13:31 <Benjamin> manu: next issue is described on mailing list
14:13:38 <manu1> Subtopic: XML+RDFa spec bug
14:13:40 <manu1> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdfa-wg/2011Mar/0100.html
14:17:21 <manu1> http://www.w3.org/2010/02/rdfa/sources/rdfa-core/#evaluation-context
14:18:31 <manu1> Step 13: the parent subject is set to the value of new subject, if non-null, or the value of the parent subject of the current evaluation context;
14:19:32 <webr3> step 6: "otherwise, if parent object is present, new subject is set to the value of parent object. Additionally, if @property is not present then the skip element flag is set to 'true';"
14:21:39 <manu1> Manu: Woops, I misread the specification - there is no issue with 2-level nesting and subjects being set.
14:21:39 <manu1> Ivan: The tests are correct and the spec is consistent.
14:21:52 <markbirbeck> markbirbeck has joined #rdfa
14:22:44 <Benjamin> rrsagent, make minutes
14:22:44 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/03/24-rdfa-minutes.html Benjamin
14:23:29 <manu1> Ivan: Separate concern - do we want to set the new subject to the document for XML+RDFa?
14:23:40 <manu1> Ivan: Concerned about adding this at such a late stage.
14:25:38 <manu1> PROPOSAL: XML+RDFa does not assume an about="" on the root element. If authors want to generate a triple, they must explicitly set the subject.
14:25:47 <webr3> +1
14:25:48 <ivan> +1
14:25:49 <manu1> +1
14:25:52 <Benjamin> Benjamin: +1
14:25:57 <manu1> RESOLVED: XML+RDFa does not assume an about="" on the root element. If authors want to generate a triple, they must explicitly set the subject.
14:26:27 <manu1> Topic: IRI vs URI Reference
14:26:27 <manu1> Ivan: Do we want to resolve the issues that Mischa raised?
14:29:02 <Benjamin> manu: I think they're editorial. The reason we use URI references instead of IRIs is because we are more concerned about the value space (which URI References discuss) than we are about the lexical space (which IRIs discuss). We wanted to talk about URIs as a sequences of characters that RDFa Processors generate.
14:29:43 <webr3> Nathan: What about relative URI-refs = ../
14:29:59 <Benjamin> the issue of mischa is: http://www.w3.org/2010/02/rdfa/track/issues/87
14:31:00 <webr3> "URI"
14:31:10 <webr3> IRI or URI (no reference)
14:33:15 <Benjamin> Ivan: We state clearly in the specification that we don't allow relative references to be generated by the processor.
14:33:17 <Benjamin> manu: We should wait for Shane to be on the call for resolving this.
14:34:03 <Zakim> -benjamin
14:35:29 <Zakim> +benjamin
14:37:48 <manu1> Ivan: This is editorial in my view
14:37:51 <manu1> Manu: I agree
14:37:51 <Benjamin> ivan: The change is editorial, we should leave it to Shane in my view
14:38:40 <webr3> I agree too, editorial
14:39:12 <Benjamin> benjamin: as far as i understood it, it seems to be editorial
14:40:10 <Benjamin> Topic: RDFa Core 1.1 and XHTML+RDFa 1.1 2nd Last Call
14:40:11 <Benjamin> manu: Any other open issues before the second last call?
14:41:08 <Benjamin> the group is not aware of any open issues
14:41:34 <manu1> These are the documents we're asserting should go to 2nd Last Call:
14:41:43 <manu1> http://www.w3.org/2010/02/rdfa/sources/rdfa-core/
14:41:49 <manu1> http://www.w3.org/2010/02/rdfa/sources/xhtml-rdfa/
14:43:47 <Benjamin> manu: Publication date will be march, 29
14:44:24 <manu1> PROPOSAL: RDFa Core 1.1 and XHTML+RDFa 1.1 should proceed into the 2nd Last Call with a publication date targeted at March 29th with a Last Call period of 3 weeks from the publication date.
14:44:45 <ivan> +1
14:44:46 <webr3> +1
14:44:46 <Benjamin> Benjamin: +1
14:44:48 <manu1> +1
14:45:08 <markbirbeck> +1
14:45:29 <manu1> Knud is a +1 (http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdfa-wg/2011Mar/0099.html)
14:45:49 <manu1> RESOLVED: RDFa Core 1.1 and XHTML+RDFa 1.1 should proceed into the 2nd Last Call with a publication date targeted at March 29th with a Last Call period of 3 weeks from the publication date.
14:47:19 <Benjamin> manu: We need to send out a 2nd LC notification as a W3C news item, right?
14:47:22 <Benjamin> ivan: yes
14:47:31 <manu1> Topic: RDFa API
14:48:24 <manu1> http://www.w3.org/2010/02/rdfa/sources/rdfa-api/
14:48:25 <manu1> Manu: The updates were discussed on the mailing list: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdfa-wg/2011Mar/0084.html
14:48:25 <manu1> Ivan: I like the changes, good direction - how do you get a list of all subjects or all types?
14:49:31 <webr3> document.getItemsByType(type)
14:50:01 <Benjamin> ivan: how do i know what types are availlable in the document
14:50:48 <ivan> Ivan: I think we need - document.getSubjects()
14:51:03 <Benjamin> ivan: you need a method like that to get all subjects available, otherwise you don't know what to query for...
14:51:18 <webr3> why does HTML not have that? document.getElementByID(id) how do I know the id's?
14:51:33 <webr3> how do you know which rel's, classes etc?
14:52:25 <Benjamin> ivan: For example I want to highlight the RDF triples in the document. But were do I start?
14:52:57 <webr3> use the RDF API??
14:50:48 <ivan> Ivan: No, using the RDF API is an advanced feature - we have simplified the RDFa API down to something that doesn't even need to mention triples - that is a good thing, let's not over-complicate it.
14:54:31 <webr3> document.data.getItemsByWhatever( s , p , o )
14:54:50 <webr3> (leave all null to get all objects) :)
14:55:44 <ivan> q+
14:56:33 <manu1> ack ivan
14:56:54 <Benjamin> q+
14:57:09 <webr3> it's just merging the functions .getItemBySubject(type) and .getItemsByProperty(property, optional value) together though? still cuts in two
14:59:41 <webr3> not the getElements... RDF API doesn't handle them, only RDFa API does
15:00:29 <manu1> http://www.w3.org/2010/02/rdfa/sources/rdfa-api/#document-data
15:01:58 <Benjamin> Manu: We may also rip .parse() out of there since we don't need it, we currently do this:
15:01:59 <manu1> var obj = document.data.parse("http://example.com");
15:02:08 <manu1> document.data.rdfa.parse("http://example.com");
15:02:25 <Benjamin> Manu: but we could do something like this to simplify things:
15:02:26 <manu1> var doc = CreateDocument(XMLHttpRequest("http://example.com"));
15:02:33 <manu1> doc.data.query(...);
15:02:57 <webr3> it's the "the keep can of worms closed" approach :)
15:05:44 <Zakim> -webr3
15:06:03 <Benjamin> rrsagent, make minutes
15:06:03 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/03/24-rdfa-minutes.html Benjamin
15:09:34 <Benjamin> rrsagent, make minutes
15:09:34 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/03/24-rdfa-minutes.html Benjamin
15:10:51 <Zakim> -benjamin
15:11:17 <ivan> http://www.w3.org/blog/admin.php?blog=13
15:12:16 <ivan> zakim, mute me
15:12:16 <Zakim> ivan should now be muted
15:12:18 <Zakim> -[IPcaller]
15:12:18 <Zakim> -ivan
15:12:18 <Zakim> SW_RDFa()10:00AM has ended
15:12:20 <Zakim> Attendees were [IPcaller], webr3, ivan, benjamin
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