15:50:32 RRSAgent has joined #html-a11y
15:50:32 logging to http://www.w3.org/2010/02/25-html-a11y-irc
15:50:34 RRSAgent, make logs world
15:50:34 Zakim has joined #html-a11y
15:50:36 Zakim, this will be 2119
15:50:36 ok, trackbot; I see WAI_PFWG(HTML TF)11:00AM scheduled to start in 10 minutes
15:50:37 Meeting: HTML Accessibility Task Force Teleconference
15:50:37 Date: 25 February 2010
15:50:47 chair: Mike_Smith
15:50:52 agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-a11y/2010Feb/0522.html
15:50:53 Morning Michael
15:51:55 regrets: Laura_Carlson, Ben_Caldwell, Geoff_Freed, Markku_Hakkinen, Joshue_O'Connor, Kelly_Ford
15:54:32 Stevef has joined #html-a11y
15:54:42 agenda+ Actions Review
15:54:43 agenda+ discuss survey results for canvas change proposal: http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/44061/20100225_canvas/results
15:54:45 agenda+ discuss results for summary-details change proposal: http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/44061/20100225_summary/results
15:54:46 agenda+ discuss MultitrackAPI proposal: http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/Media_MultitrackAPI
15:54:48 agenda+ discuss TextAssociations proposal: http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/Media_TextAssociations
15:54:49 agenda+ Resolved & Rejected Bugs Review http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-a11y/2010Feb/0497.html
15:54:51 agenda+ New Business
15:54:52 agenda+ next meetings, confirm date/time, choose scribe
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15:56:50 WAI_PFWG(HTML TF)11:00AM has now started
15:56:57 +??P6
15:57:04 +John_Foliot
15:57:06 -John_Foliot
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15:57:25 zakim, ??P6 is Stevef
15:57:25 +Stevef; got it
15:57:29 +Gregory_Rosmaita
15:57:35 +John_Foliot
15:57:40 +Eric_Carlson
15:58:53 +Michael_Cooper
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15:59:16 Zakim, call Mike
15:59:17 ok, MikeSmith; the call is being made
15:59:18 +Mike
15:59:39 Zakim, Mike is me
15:59:41 +MikeSmith; got it
15:59:47 RRSAgent, make minutes
15:59:47 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/02/25-html-a11y-minutes.html MikeSmith
15:59:59 +Rich
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16:00:25 GJR joins in steveF's plus 1 to rich's most recent post
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16:00:50 +Marco_Ranon
16:01:00 Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose MikeSmith
16:01:10 + +1.514.312.aaaa
16:01:58 <---- 515.312
16:02:00 zakim, +1.514 is Denis_Boudreau
16:02:00 +Denis_Boudreau; got it
16:02:04 +Matt
16:02:09 hi hi :)
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16:02:13 Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose Rich
16:03:18 scribe: Gregory_Rosmaita
16:03:22 scribenick: oedipus
16:03:31 TOPIC: Introductory Stuff
16:03:41 MS: will have scribe rotation list ready for next week
16:04:02 MS: put agendum item on media accessibility -- move to front of agenda and address briefly
16:04:10 +Cynthia_Shelly
16:04:12 MS: want to give summary and next steps
16:04:28 agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-a11y/2010Feb/0522.html
16:04:32 +kliehm
16:05:13 agenda+ discuss MultitrackAPI proposal: http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/Media_MultitrackAPI
16:05:13 agenda+ discuss TextAssociations proposal: http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/Media_TextAssociations
16:05:13 agenda+ discuss MultitrackAPI proposal: http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/Media_MultitrackAPI
16:05:13 agenda+ discuss TextAssociations proposal: http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/Media_TextAssociations
16:05:13 agenda+ discuss MultitrackAPI proposal: http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/Media_MultitrackAPI
16:05:14 agenda+ discuss TextAssociations proposal: http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/Media_TextAssociations
16:05:17 MS: experiencing IRC problems - please stand by
16:05:18 agenda+ discuss MultitrackAPI proposal: http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/Media_MultitrackAPI
16:05:20 agenda+ discuss TextAssociations proposal: http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/Media_TextAssociations
16:05:22 agenda+ discuss MultitrackAPI proposal: http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/Media_MultitrackAPI
16:05:24 agenda+ discuss TextAssociations proposal: http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/Media_TextAssociations
16:05:26 agenda+ discuss MultitrackAPI proposal: http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/Media_MultitrackAPI
16:05:44 zakim, take item 19
16:05:44 I don't understand 'take item 19', MikeSmith
16:05:46 zakim, agendum 19
16:05:46 I don't understand 'agendum 19', oedipus
16:05:56 zakim, take agendum 19
16:05:58 I don't understand 'take agendum 19', oedipus
16:06:13 TOPIC: MultitrackAPI Proposal
16:06:44 MS: draft is up-to-date; ready for us to take to TF as a whole for a survey; only hold up is survey not yet put together, will be soon
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16:07:07 http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/Media_MultitrackAPI
16:07:09 MS: plan: discuss MultitrackAPI Proposal next week; have survey out at beginning of week then discuss on call next week
16:07:25 MS: if have comments or something new to say about draft proposal, please take to list
16:07:46 TOPIC: TextAssociations proposal
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16:08:13 MS: please read proposal -- if anything new to say that hasn't been said, please post comments to list A.S.A.P.
16:08:16 +??P27
16:08:34 MS: will be putting together a survey for TextAssociationsAPI for beginning of next week so can discuss at next week's call
16:08:45 zakim, ??P27 is Jon_Gunderson
16:08:45 +Jon_Gunderson; got it
16:08:52 MS: any questions or comments?
16:09:38 JF: has been fair amount of discussion on which type of timestamp format; a lot of back-and-forth, but no decision; boils down to SRT, SMIL tags, etc. - no resolution yet -- anyone with substantive thoghts or comments please post
16:09:42 MS: thanks JF
16:09:54 +Gerald-E
16:10:05 MS: talked with sylvia today; asked slyvia for some text for basis for survey on issue of format
16:10:34 MS: will be reflected in surveys -- probably need discussion; format issue clearly needds resolution
16:11:06 MS: for those who haven't weighed in on format discussion, review thread if possible to ensure that if you do post something it is something new and substantive
16:11:24 MS: comments that lead to action items are encouraged
16:11:37 TOPIC: Actions Review
16:12:19 s/TOPIC: Actions Review/TOPIC: survey results for canvas change proposal: http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/44061/20100225_canvas/results
16:12:26 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/02/25-html-a11y-minutes.html oedipus
16:12:58 MS: approach suggest with documented results, look for points-of-agreement
16:13:17 MS: question on canvas simpler than summary versus details survey
16:13:22 MS: want to find points of consensus
16:13:27 q?
16:13:36 q?
16:13:42 q+
16:13:48 q+
16:15:03 RS: agreement in principle: need ability to: 1) have solution where a11y test tool can test when runs into CANVAS; 2) make use of HTML components as much as possible (reduces burden on author); 3) need to be able to associate a representation of what is in canvas in terms of structural info; need to be explicit as to what UA does when encounters an a11y implementation for CANVAS
16:15:12 RS: AT (assistive tech) also key
16:15:54 RS: SteveF asked about area/imagemaps -- in HTML5 removed all document structural info that one could use in HTML4
16:16:05 RS: imagemap approach would require change in HTML5
16:16:29 RS: advantages to using subtree -- already used for fallback content, how do we do binding to convey semantics and structural info
16:16:44 Zakim, mute me
16:16:44 MikeSmith should now be muted
16:17:15 Zakim, unmute me
16:17:15 MikeSmith should no longer be muted
16:17:16 RS: first question for TF: 1) use what is in adom proposal (what is in subtree is what author designated as a11y implementation); or 2) imagemap / use of AREA - would involve changing HTML5 changes to HTML5
16:17:19 q?
16:17:23 ack rich
16:17:46 q+
16:17:55 SF: regards to areas of agreement -- what does that exactly mean
16:19:00 SF: reply to RichS: imagemaps don't supplant use of subtree in complicated situations, but in simple situations where someone wants some hotspots on a CANVAS, seems lilke ideal solution; pluls for dev because easy to do and provides community a way to add text alternatives and labesl to hotspots, plus keyboard nav/focus built-in
16:19:02 ack Stevef
16:19:37 SF: if follow imagemap will help; problem with subtree issue is dichotomy between "fallback" -- is CANVAS available or not available; need means of differentiation
16:19:39 q?
16:19:59 MS: points of agreement -- lot more agreement in survey responses than in most surveys
16:20:24 MS: easy for people to note points of disagreement -- looking for points of agreement
16:20:52 [The imagemap proposal actually comes from Lachlan Hunt (at least that's who showed me the light)]
16:20:58 MS: sounds as if there need to be some refinements made to proposal based on feeddback from survey results -- is that accurate, Rich?
16:21:34 RS: 2 changes in my mind are easy to make: 1) address DSinger's comment on what UA must do if adom is set (include in subtree map for API); if false, don't do it; made that change
16:21:50 RS: added part about support of a11y API suggested by Sylvia
16:22:07 RS: agree with SF, imagemap can be good solution for some cases, however, it has changed in HTML5
16:22:25 RS: Maciej assumed canvas children always exposed to AT
16:22:48 RS: includes not exposing for currently existing canvas elements -- how to control currently existing canvas implementations
16:22:51 Therefore I will propose adopting this proposal with one of the following changes:
16:22:51 A) Allow