IRC log of ws-ra on 2010-02-16

Timestamps are in UTC.

20:25:22 [RRSAgent]
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logging to
20:25:24 [trackbot]
RRSAgent, make logs public
20:25:24 [Zakim]
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20:25:26 [trackbot]
Zakim, this will be WSRA
20:25:26 [Zakim]
ok, trackbot; I see WS_WSRA()3:30PM scheduled to start in 5 minutes
20:25:27 [trackbot]
Meeting: Web Services Resource Access Working Group Teleconference
20:25:27 [trackbot]
Date: 16 February 2010
20:26:06 [Dug]
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WS_WSRA()3:30PM has now started
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+ +984999aaaa
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trackbot, start telecon
20:28:55 [trackbot]
RRSAgent, make logs public
20:28:57 [trackbot]
Zakim, this will be WSRA
20:28:57 [Zakim]
ok, trackbot, I see WS_WSRA()3:30PM already started
20:28:58 [trackbot]
Meeting: Web Services Resource Access Working Group Teleconference
20:28:58 [trackbot]
Date: 16 February 2010
20:29:07 [Bob]
chair: Bob Freund
20:29:41 [Zakim]
+ +39.331.574.aabb
20:29:43 [li]
li has joined #ws-ra
20:29:56 [asoldano]
Zakim, aabb is asoldano
20:29:56 [Zakim]
+asoldano; got it
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20:30:29 [Zakim]
+ +1.908.696.aacc
20:30:52 [li]
zakim, aacc is li
20:30:52 [Zakim]
+li; got it
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+ +1.408.642.aadd
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+ +1.703.860.aaee
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20:32:05 [Bob]
zakim, aadd is Gilbert
20:32:05 [Zakim]
+Gilbert; got it
20:32:32 [Zakim]
20:32:36 [Zakim]
20:32:50 [Zakim]
20:32:59 [Zakim]
20:33:42 [Zakim]
20:33:56 [DaveS]
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20:34:49 [Bob]
zakim pick a victim
20:34:58 [Bob]
zakim, pick a victim
20:34:58 [Zakim]
Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose ??P22
20:35:22 [gpilz]
SCRIBE: gpilz
20:35:28 [asir]
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20:35:40 [gpilz]
TOPIC: agenda bashing
20:36:02 [Bob]
20:36:31 [gpilz]
RESOLUTION: agenda approved
20:37:05 [Dug]
8306 is a good one too
20:37:40 [gpilz]
TOPIC: new issues
20:38:02 [gpilz]
RESOLUTION: 9032 accepted as new issue
20:38:56 [gpilz]
Bob: any probs with dealing with 8306?
20:39:23 [gpilz]
Ram: I would prefer that issues that came after the moratorium be discussed after last call
20:39:35 [gpilz]
Bob: let's tackle MOAP and 9032
20:40:03 [gpilz]
TOPIC: approval of minutes from Feb 9th, 2010
20:40:08 [gpilz]
RESOLUTION: minutes approved
20:40:27 [gpilz]
TOPIC: issue 9032
20:40:43 [Dug]
20:42:50 [gpilz]
gil: describes proposal
20:43:04 [gpilz]
bob: any probs with this proposal?
20:43:15 [Dug]
s/will/MUST/ in transfer too
20:43:15 [gpilz]
doug: there is a similar sentence in WS-T
20:43:21 [gpilz]
... can we change this as well?
20:43:40 [gpilz]
ram: is that change in the chat room ???
20:43:58 [Dug]
Transfer: When this operation is used to replace the entire XML representation, any OPTIONAL values (elements or attributes) not specified in the Put request message will be set to a resource-specific default value.
20:44:06 [gpilz]
asir: can you pull in the exact text from WS-T that you propose to change?
20:44:15 [gpilz]
doug: (above)
20:44:47 [gpilz]
RESOLUTION: 9032 resolved with proposal plus additional, corresponding change to WS-Transfer
20:45:02 [gpilz]
20:45:17 [gpilz]
bob: where are we on the mother of all proposals
20:45:28 [gpilz]
doug: some of us had a phone call on Fri of last week
20:45:38 [gpilz]
... I sent out a slightly modified proposal for further review
20:45:48 [gpilz]
... but I haven't heard back yet; Asir?
20:45:57 [gpilz]
Asir: we are reviewing the latest proposal
20:46:06 [gpilz]
bob: are we more right than wrong at this point?
20:46:18 [gpilz]
asir: I would suggest we discuss MOAP next week
20:46:29 [gpilz]
... maybe we will be in a position to discuss it then
20:46:41 [gpilz]
bob: in that case, there is relatively little new business
20:46:43 [Dug]
20:46:51 [gpilz]
... unless people would like to tackle another issue . . .
20:47:00 [gpilz]
doug: 8306?
20:47:16 [gpilz]
bob: people objected to discussing issues that had previously been laid over to Last Call
20:47:33 [gpilz]
doug: this issue wasn't opened up after the moratorium
20:47:49 [gpilz]
... we deferred it based on the idea that we didn't have time to discuss it
20:47:53 [gpilz]
... we have time now
20:48:05 [gpilz]
bob: the WG decided to defer that issue until Last Call
20:48:32 [gpilz]
... the WG needs to decide to take it back
20:48:37 [gpilz]
doug: I propose we do so
20:48:46 [Dug]
20:48:54 [gpilz]
ram: is there a proposal?
20:48:56 [gpilz]
bob: yes
20:49:03 [gpilz]
ram: I haven't had a chance to look at it yet
20:49:12 [gpilz]
... can I look at it and discuss it next week?
20:49:36 [asir]
20:49:41 [gpilz]
TOPIC: schedule
20:49:41 [Dug]
20:50:11 [gpilz]
bob: right now, we're coming up to a mid-march moratorium on publishing (something to do with the AC meeting)
20:50:22 [gpilz]
... the minimum Last Call interval is 3 weeks post publication
20:50:32 [gpilz]
... practically 3.5 to 4 weeks
20:50:56 [gpilz]
... in order for us to maintain our schedule of having a F2F at the end of Last Call
20:51:12 [gpilz]
... we need to vote/approve Last call by March 2nd
20:51:30 [gpilz]
... if people agree to this, we can keep the scheduled F2F
20:51:38 [Bob]
ack asir
20:51:48 [gpilz]
Asir: there are a couple more Frag issues to deal with as well
20:52:04 [gpilz]
bob: there is no requirement (by process) that all specs be advanced simultaneously
20:52:43 [gpilz]
asir: I'm not sure that 3 weeks is sufficient for other WGs to review
20:52:56 [gpilz]
... I also recall at the F2F that we should allow 6 weeks
20:53:10 [gpilz]
bob: I was hoping for 6 weeks because you get more feedback
20:53:19 [gpilz]
asir: we think 6 weeks is reasonable
20:53:32 [gpilz]
bob: should we leave the next F2F to be open schedule?
20:53:32 [gpilz]
20:54:14 [asir]
we agree
20:54:27 [gpilz]
gil: i'm reluctant to have a F2F where there is nothing to talk about
20:54:43 [gpilz]
bob: we have 2 frag issues, MOAP, and RFC 2119 on WS-Evd
20:55:11 [asir]
If the WG could close on MOAP, then the WG could advance T, E, En and MEX
20:55:19 [Dug]
do have interop/test stuff to talk about?
20:55:21 [Bob]
ack gpi
20:56:21 [gpilz]
(all): continued discussion of F2F material
20:56:44 [gpilz]
bob: requirements for F2F in that time frame (last week of March) are weak w/out Last Call issues
20:56:52 [Dug]
20:56:53 [gpilz]
... though we will need a F2F on testing
20:57:03 [Bob]
ack dug
20:57:20 [gpilz]
doug: I know there a couple big issues that may or may not get resolved before the F2F
20:57:44 [gpilz]
... but it seems silly to ignore the issues that have been deferred until Last Call, just because we put this stake in the ground
20:57:53 [gpilz]
... several of these issues are relatively minor
20:58:09 [Tom_Rutt]
20:58:13 [gpilz]
bob: from a process point of view, its more important to tackle the substantive issues first
20:58:19 [Bob]
ack tom
20:58:22 [gpilz]
... willing to tackle the minor things
20:58:34 [asir]
20:58:38 [gpilz]
tom: if they are really simple things, its likely that reviewers will find them
20:58:42 [Katy]
20:58:48 [Bob]
ack asir
20:58:51 [gpilz]
... this wastes "Last Call review cycles"
20:59:11 [gpilz]
asir: if we just want to tell the world there is a bug in the spec, we can always just record an issue
20:59:12 [Bob]
ack katy
20:59:21 [gpilz]
karty: if we have time, we might as well be resolving issues
20:59:33 [gpilz]
bob: let's take a look at the issue list
20:59:52 [gpilz]
... MOAP has a wide-ranging impact and is substantive
20:59:56 [gpilz]
21:01:06 [Bob]
ack gp
21:01:58 [asir]
suggest that we use additional cycles to resolve 8185 and 8193
21:02:34 [asir]
21:03:00 [Bob]
ack asir
21:04:02 [Dug]
8886, 9031 are easy
21:04:11 [Dug]
8900 too
21:04:25 [asir]
disagree that 9031 is easy
21:04:41 [gpilz]
bob: people should look at new issues (8886, 8900, 9031)
21:05:35 [asir]
q+ to ask a clarification
21:06:14 [gpilz]
bob: I think we should cancel the March F2F
21:06:25 [gpilz]
asir: should we meet in the middle of April?
21:06:46 [gpilz]
bob: if we decide on a 6 week Last Call, we should plan a F2F for the end of that 6 week period
21:06:48 [gpilz]
21:07:03 [Bob]
ack asir
21:07:03 [Zakim]
asir, you wanted to ask a clarification
21:07:09 [Bob]
ack gp
21:07:24 [asir]
21:08:07 [Bob]
ack asir
21:08:21 [gpilz]
gil: 6 (or 7) seven weeks is enough time to plan any travel
21:08:38 [gpilz]
... propose we defer any decision about next F2F until after we approve Last Call
21:08:45 [gpilz]
asir: (agrees)
21:09:40 [gpilz]
(all): misc. discussion of next F2F
21:09:47 [gpilz]
asir: April 14-16th?
21:09:52 [gpilz]
bob: tentatively
21:10:09 [gpilz]
bob: April 13-15?
21:10:13 [gpilz]
... acceptable?
21:10:18 [gpilz]
(all): silence
21:10:23 [asir]
21:10:44 [gpilz]
RESOLTION: next F2F tentatively scheduled for April 13-15
21:10:48 [DaveS]
21:10:49 [gpilz]
meeting adjorned
21:10:50 [Zakim]
21:10:53 [asoldano]
21:10:53 [Zakim]
21:10:54 [Zakim]
21:10:54 [Zakim]
- +1.703.860.aaee
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21:10:57 [Zakim]
21:10:57 [Zakim]
21:11:00 [Zakim]
21:11:01 [Zakim]
21:11:03 [Zakim]
21:11:07 [Zakim]
21:11:15 [Bob]
rrsagent, generate minutes
21:11:15 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate Bob
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- +984999aaaa
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WS_WSRA()3:30PM has ended
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Attendees were Doug_Davis, +984999aaaa, Bob_Freund, +39.331.574.aabb, asoldano, +1.908.696.aacc, li, +1.408.642.aadd, +1.703.860.aaee, [Microsoft], Gilbert, Ashok_Malhotra,
21:12:38 [Zakim]
... Tom_Rutt, Yves
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