IRC log of svg on 2010-02-11

Timestamps are in UTC.

20:01:11 [RRSAgent]
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logging to http://www.w3.org/2010/02/11-svg-irc
20:01:13 [trackbot]
RRSAgent, make logs public
20:01:13 [Zakim]
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20:01:15 [trackbot]
Zakim, this will be GA_SVGWG
20:01:15 [Zakim]
ok, trackbot; I see GA_SVGWG()3:00PM scheduled to start now
20:01:16 [trackbot]
Meeting: SVG Working Group Teleconference
20:01:16 [trackbot]
Date: 11 February 2010
20:01:38 [Zakim]
GA_SVGWG()3:00PM has now started
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+[IPcaller]
20:03:03 [Zakim]
+??P2
20:03:14 [ed]
Zakim, [IP is me
20:03:14 [Zakim]
+ed; got it
20:03:45 [ChrisL]
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20:03:46 [anthony]
Zakim, ??P2 is me
20:03:46 [Zakim]
+anthony; got it
20:04:08 [Zakim]
+Shepazu
20:05:58 [ChrisL]
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/w3c-ac-members/2010JanMar/0025.html
20:06:49 [Zakim]
+ChrisL
20:11:16 [ed]
Zakim, pick a victim
20:11:16 [Zakim]
Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose Shepazu
20:11:51 [ed]
scribe: ed
20:12:14 [ed]
topic: webfonts
20:12:38 [ChrisL]
http://www.w3.org/2009/08/WebFonts/activity-proposal (member onlt)
20:13:01 [ed]
CL: explains what happened, for the process document
20:13:20 [ed]
...looking at implementation, there are cmdline tools for woff
20:13:28 [ed]
...and he coded into firefox
20:13:41 [ed]
...firefox 3.6 shipped with woff support
20:14:27 [ed]
...requested fontforge to add woff support
20:14:40 [ed]
...it's already in their cvs, and works
20:14:54 [ed]
...there are some python tools for validation
20:15:11 [ed]
...and it can write @fontface rules for you
20:15:17 [ed]
...apple hasn't stated a position
20:15:57 [ed]
...opera has said they will support it
20:16:43 [ed]
...microsoft was saying they wanted CWT instead
20:16:52 [ed]
...used to be called EOT-light
20:17:07 [ed]
...someone had trademark on that
20:18:01 [jwatt]
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20:18:51 [Zakim]
+[IPcaller]
20:19:16 [jwatt]
Zakim: +[I is me
20:19:30 [jwatt]
Zakim: [IP is me
20:19:40 [jwatt]
Zakim: [IPCaller] is me
20:19:47 [jwatt]
Zakim: IPCaller is me
20:20:12 [jwatt]
Zakim, IPCaller is me
20:20:12 [Zakim]
+jwatt; got it
20:20:38 [ed]
CL: we've got two deliverables, the woff spec, and a conformance spec
20:21:09 [ed]
...you must support css, same origin restriction, will depend on css3 fonts spec
20:21:20 [ed]
...you need a font and a stylesheet to make it work
20:21:40 [ed]
...the font group will produce tests
20:21:51 [ed]
...tell your ac reps to vote on this
20:22:05 [ed]
...svg 1.1 and 1.2T mandates svg font format
20:22:12 [ed]
...i'd like svg 2 to mandate woff
20:22:29 [ed]
...but should it require svgfonts?
20:22:40 [ed]
DS: i'm torn
20:23:45 [ed]
...thanks to CL for pulling WOFF together
20:24:33 [ed]
...i'm torn about svgfonts personally
20:24:48 [ed]
...making it a must means that it's harder to have ppl hit the svg target
20:24:59 [ed]
...i'd like to say svg 2.0 is 100% implemented soon
20:25:14 [ed]
CL: i'd like to see it as a should
20:25:49 [ed]
DS: svg 1.1 has svgfonts as a must
20:26:09 [ed]
...all companies that contributed ipr
20:26:23 [ed]
CL: we can have different conformance classes
20:26:42 [ed]
...a maximally conforming profile that MUST support svgfonts
20:28:32 [ed]
ED: see no real benefit of doing full svg 1.1 fonts, but 1.2T svg fonts are useful
20:29:16 [ed]
DS: maybe we could go one step beyond svgt12 font support, but one step down from svg 1.1 full
20:29:39 [ed]
...we could say must support svg 2.0 fonts, and you may support e.g full video fonts
20:30:53 [ed]
CL: we could do alot of tests for svg 1.1 full fonts, and put the spec text in the first draft, then possibly drop parts if they're not implemented
20:32:18 [ChrisL]
zakim, who is here
20:32:18 [Zakim]
ChrisL, you need to end that query with '?'
20:32:22 [ChrisL]
zakim, who is here?
20:32:22 [Zakim]
On the phone I see ed, anthony, Shepazu, ChrisL, jwatt
20:32:23 [Zakim]
On IRC I see jwatt, ChrisL, Zakim, RRSAgent, ed, anthony, shepazu, eseidelDesk, karl, trackbot, ed_work
20:33:00 [ed]
ED: JW how about those SVG fonts?
20:33:18 [ed]
JW: ask again after SMIL is implemented :)
20:33:47 [ed]
JW: plan sounds good to me
20:35:02 [ed]
DS: hope the market will move quicker to the open format
20:35:41 [ChrisL]
http://www.aip.org/stixfonts/
20:35:50 [ed]
CL: bunch of fonts for doing maths
20:36:04 [ed]
...you download those fonts, and then you can view mathml
20:36:29 [ed]
...having it as a webfont is good for viewing an occasional equation
20:36:40 [ed]
...given away freely
20:36:58 [ed]
...there are two converters to WOFF available
20:37:07 [ed]
...so it's easy for them to do so,
20:39:24 [ed]
...XSL is also looking at adding webfonts in XSL2.0
20:39:42 [ed]
...they'll probably want WOFF format support
20:39:51 [ed]
DS: do we have to do anything special for WOFF?
20:40:09 [ed]
CL: it's not going to be inline, like an svgfont, well...maybe as a datauri
20:40:18 [ed]
...would like to see it in batik
20:41:23 [ed]
JW: made a woff demo for ff3.6
20:41:28 [jwatt]
http://jwatt.org/svg-open/2009/demos/font-face/web-fonts-in-html-and-svg.xhtml
20:41:43 [ed]
...the last one in the dropdown is a woff font
20:48:01 [ed]
topic: markerPaint
20:48:04 [ed]
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-svg/2010Feb/0023.html
20:49:47 [ed]
ED: summary: want to inherit styling into the marker element
20:49:55 [ed]
CL: could be done with vector effects
20:50:12 [ed]
DS: we could have this as a canned effect
20:50:45 [ed]
CL: right, like we do with non-scaling-stroke
20:51:01 [ed]
...and as for canned filter effects
20:51:43 [ed]
DS: we should keep the usecase in mind when we design svg 2.0
20:52:29 [ed]
ED: i raised a few concerns about the proposal there
20:53:45 [ed]
topic: css scientific notation
20:53:59 [ed]
CL: majority was in agreement
20:54:12 [ed]
...pro the scientific notation
20:54:17 [ed]
...it's a change in grammar
20:55:16 [ed]
...it's a flex grammar, which does do scientific notation, but css is using a custom variant doing only numbers
20:55:30 [ed]
...css21 doesn't allow it
20:56:15 [ed]
...but the style attribute spec... [lost some bits here]
20:56:46 [ed]
...got an action to write a summary
20:57:03 [ed]
...and a request to have more svg ppl in the discussion
20:57:19 [ed]
...all implementers argued the same position
20:58:23 [ed]
...this is a first bit of svg/css harmonization
20:58:42 [ed]
...will keep you informed
20:58:53 [ed]
topic: FX taskforce
20:59:00 [shepazu]
http://www.w3.org/2010/fx/effects-task-force.html
20:59:38 [ed]
DS: anthony gave some feedback
20:59:51 [ed]
...don't know how I missed filters, thanks for pointing it out ED
21:01:10 [ed]
CL: encoding is bad, use utf8
21:02:02 [ed]
...otherwise looks good to me
21:07:07 [ed]
DS: suggest making the few changes, propose a first telcon next thursday to discuss the charter
21:07:35 [ed]
...and we should get sylvain galinau (sp?) involved
21:09:17 [ed]
topic: widgets
21:12:04 [ed]
DS: we're rechartering the webapps wg
21:12:51 [ed]
...what's interesting about widgets is that you can have svg only content if you want
21:13:00 [ed]
...have made that before, for opera
21:13:24 [ed]
...joined widgets telcon today, an interesting thing came out, talked about serverside widgets
21:13:41 [ed]
...you reference it using a object tag, it's just a packaged up materials
21:13:49 [ed]
...selfcontained
21:14:06 [ed]
...i've talked to several ppl that wanted to do this with svg's
21:14:15 [ed]
...emphasis is this what flash does
21:14:33 [ed]
...they want to package up everything, helps the workflow
21:14:45 [ed]
...another way svg can be referenced
21:15:17 [ed]
...it's yet another way svg can get used
21:16:35 [ed]
...asked for allowing the manifest to point to a css file, and have it apply to any other file
21:16:52 [shepazu]
[1] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-webapps/2010JanMar/0573.html
21:16:53 [shepazu]
[2] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-webapps/2010JanMar/0569.html
21:16:54 [ed]
...makes it possible to separate style and content (the link that ties them)
21:17:39 [ed]
CL: in XSL it's even worse than CSS
21:17:54 [ed]
...also means you can restyle someone elses content
21:19:35 [ed]
ED: sounds similar to the html5 seamless thing
21:19:43 [ed]
...on iframe elements
21:21:46 [ed]
topic: gradients
21:22:06 [ed]
ED: that new wording is going into SVG 1.1 second edition, right?
21:22:32 [ed]
AG: the changes are fairly small
21:23:04 [ed]
DS: yes, it's svg 1.1 stuff, clarification
21:23:11 [ed]
...does it apply to SVGT12?
21:23:13 [ed]
AG: yes
21:23:22 [ed]
DS: we should have an errata for 1.2T too then
21:24:33 [ed]
CL: the grammar for scientific notation in SVG 1.1 and 1.2T is wrong, all implementations ignore that and do the right thing
21:25:52 [ed]
ED: let's review the new wording once it's put in place in 1.1 second edition
21:27:41 [ed]
ACTION: add new wording for clarifying userspaceonuse gradients to SVG 1.1 second edition, and add a corresponding errata item for SVG Tiny 1.2
21:27:41 [trackbot]
Sorry, couldn't find user - add
21:27:48 [ed]
ACTION: AG to add new wording for clarifying userspaceonuse gradients to SVG 1.1 second edition, and add a corresponding errata item for SVG Tiny 1.2
21:27:49 [trackbot]
Created ACTION-2728 - Add new wording for clarifying userspaceonuse gradients to SVG 1.1 second edition, and add a corresponding errata item for SVG Tiny 1.2 [on Anthony Grasso - due 2010-02-18].
21:28:38 [ed]
ACTION: ed to email www-style to announce the FX taskforce telcon / charter discussion
21:28:38 [trackbot]
Created ACTION-2729 - Email www-style to announce the FX taskforce telcon / charter discussion [on Erik Dahlström - due 2010-02-18].
21:29:14 [ed]
ACTION: CL to fix the broken grammar for scientific notation in SVG 1.1 and 1.2T
21:29:14 [trackbot]
Created ACTION-2730 - Fix the broken grammar for scientific notation in SVG 1.1 and 1.2T [on Chris Lilley - due 2010-02-18].
21:31:55 [Zakim]
-ChrisL
21:31:58 [Zakim]
-ed
21:32:00 [Zakim]
-jwatt
21:32:08 [Zakim]
-Shepazu
21:32:16 [ed]
chair: ed
21:32:27 [ed]
rrsagent, make minutes
21:32:27 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/02/11-svg-minutes.html ed
21:33:13 [Zakim]
-anthony
21:33:15 [Zakim]
GA_SVGWG()3:00PM has ended
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Attendees were ed, anthony, Shepazu, ChrisL, jwatt
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22:42:14 [shepazu]
ed_work: got your name right, charter is ready to go: http://www.w3.org/2010/fx/effects-task-force.html
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