IRC log of html-a11y on 2010-02-04

Timestamps are in UTC.

15:58:42 [RRSAgent]
RRSAgent has joined #html-a11y
15:58:42 [RRSAgent]
logging to http://www.w3.org/2010/02/04-html-a11y-irc
15:58:44 [trackbot]
RRSAgent, make logs world
15:58:44 [Zakim]
Zakim has joined #html-a11y
15:58:46 [trackbot]
Zakim, this will be 2119
15:58:46 [Zakim]
ok, trackbot; I see WAI_PFWG(HTML TF)11:00AM scheduled to start in 2 minutes
15:58:47 [trackbot]
Meeting: HTML Accessibility Task Force Teleconference
15:58:47 [trackbot]
Date: 04 February 2010
15:59:07 [MichaelC]
zakim, call cooper-mit
15:59:07 [Zakim]
ok, MichaelC; the call is being made
15:59:58 [kliehm]
kliehm has joined #html-a11y
16:00:14 [MichaelC]
zakim, this is 2119
16:00:19 [Zakim]
ok, MichaelC; that matches WAI_PFWG(HTML TF)11:00AM
16:00:23 [Zakim]
+[IPcaller]
16:00:24 [MichaelC]
zakim, who's on the phone?
16:00:26 [kliehm]
trackbot, start conference
16:00:28 [trackbot]
RRSAgent, make logs world
16:00:29 [Zakim]
On the phone I see Gregory_Rosmaita, [Microsoft], Cooper, ??P8, Rich, kliehm, [IPcaller]
16:00:30 [trackbot]
Zakim, this will be 2119
16:00:31 [trackbot]
Meeting: HTML Accessibility Task Force Teleconference
16:00:31 [trackbot]
Date: 04 February 2010
16:00:37 [Zakim]
ok, trackbot; I see WAI_PFWG(HTML TF)11:00AM scheduled to start now
16:00:39 [MikeSmithX]
MikeSmithX has joined #html-a11y
16:00:44 [Stevef]
zakim, IPcaller is Stevef
16:00:50 [MichaelC]
zakim, Microsoft is Bruce_Lawson
16:00:53 [Zakim]
sorry, Stevef, I do not recognize a party named 'IPcaller'
16:00:56 [Ben]
Ben has joined #html-a11y
16:00:56 [dboudreau]
dboudreau has joined #html-a11y
16:00:59 [Zakim]
sorry, MichaelC, I do not recognize a party named 'Microsoft'
16:01:09 [dboudreau]
mornin' everyone
16:01:10 [MichaelC]
zakim, ??P8 is Eric_Carlson
16:01:17 [Stevef]
zakim, [IPcaller] is Stevef
16:01:19 [Zakim]
I already had ??P8 as ??P8, MichaelC
16:01:23 [Zakim]
sorry, Stevef, I do not recognize a party named '[IPcaller]'
16:02:09 [davidb]
davidb has joined #html-a11y
16:02:10 [Zakim]
+ +0154558aabb
16:02:13 [MichaelC]
zakim, Microsoft has Kelly_Ford
16:02:13 [Zakim]
+Kelly_Ford; got it
16:02:27 [MichaelC]
zakim, ??P8 is Bruce_Lawson
16:02:27 [Zakim]
+Bruce_Lawson; got it
16:02:29 [Zakim]
+??P24
16:02:33 [Zakim]
+ +1.514.312.aacc
16:02:33 [MichaelC]
zakim, IPcaller is Steve_Faulkner
16:02:33 [Zakim]
+Steve_Faulkner; got it
16:02:39 [Ben]
zakim, ??P24 is Ben_Caldwell
16:02:39 [Zakim]
+Ben_Caldwell; got it
16:02:50 [dboudreau]
i'm on the call too now
16:02:59 [MichaelC]
zakim, +1.408 is Eric_Carlson
16:03:01 [Zakim]
+Eric_Carlson; got it
16:03:05 [dboudreau]
correct
16:03:11 [MichaelC]
zakim, +1.514 is Denis_Boudreau
16:03:11 [Zakim]
+Denis_Boudreau; got it
16:03:30 [MichaelC]
zakim, +01 is Sean_Hayes
16:03:30 [Zakim]
+Sean_Hayes; got it
16:04:19 [Zakim]
+[IPcaller]
16:04:23 [Zakim]
+[Microsoft.a]
16:04:29 [Zakim]
+Cynthia_Shelly
16:05:01 [wendy]
wendy has joined #html-a11y
16:05:23 [MichaelC]
zakim, Microsoft.a is Paul_Cotton
16:05:24 [Zakim]
+Paul_Cotton; got it
16:05:32 [paulc]
tx
16:05:39 [MichaelC]
zakim, IPCaller is Wendy_Chisholm
16:05:39 [Zakim]
+Wendy_Chisholm; got it
16:05:44 [Sean]
Sean has joined #html-a11y
16:06:02 [Zakim]
+??P33
16:06:07 [MikeSmithX]
Zakim, call Mike
16:06:07 [Zakim]
ok, MikeSmithX; the call is being made
16:06:09 [Zakim]
+Mike
16:06:14 [MichaelC]
zakim, ??P33 is Jon_Gunderson
16:06:14 [Zakim]
+Jon_Gunderson; got it
16:06:15 [jongunderson]
jongunderson has joined #html-a11y
16:06:24 [MichaelC]
regrets+ Janina_Sajka
16:06:49 [mhakkinen]
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16:07:33 [oedipus]
scribe: Gregory_Rosmaita
16:07:37 [oedipus]
scribenick: oedipus
16:07:46 [MichaelC]
regrets+ Aurélien Levy
16:07:55 [Laura]
Laura has joined #html-a11y
16:07:56 [oedipus]
TOPIC: Meeting Planning/Agenda Review
16:07:57 [MichaelC]
regrets+ Joshue_O'Connor
16:08:18 [MichaelC]
regrets+ Laura_Carlson
16:08:21 [oedipus]
MS: media issues part of cooper's list from a few weeks ago are high priority so want to talk about them on the call today
16:08:24 [MichaelC]
regrets+ Silvia_Pfeiffer
16:08:32 [oedipus]
MS: quick couple of minutes for task force sub-group reports
16:08:44 [oedipus]
TOPIC: Task Force Sub-Group Updates
16:08:49 [oedipus]
MS: anyone with update on media?
16:09:01 [Zakim]
-Steve_Faulkner
16:09:42 [paulc]
Can the person typing (scribe) go on mute?
16:09:46 [oedipus]
EC: philip from opera and sylvia and i have been discusssing exposing track level attributes media elemeents so possible for scripts to query media files, discover if has CC or descriptive audio, [breaking up]
16:10:16 [Zakim]
+ +1.609.482.aadd
16:10:19 [oedipus]
EC: wiki page with summary of thoughts to this point
16:10:22 [MichaelC]
zakim, mute Paul
16:10:22 [Zakim]
Paul_Cotton should now be muted
16:10:31 [oedipus]
EC: welcome feedback from anyone about discussion or contents of wiki page
16:10:34 [MichaelC]
zakim, mute Gregory
16:10:34 [Zakim]
Gregory_Rosmaita should now be muted
16:10:37 [oedipus]
EC: should have more of a report next week
16:10:58 [oedipus]
MS: substantial progress, good
16:11:03 [oedipus]
MS: Canvas Sub-Group?
16:11:36 [MichaelC]
zakim, +1.609 is Markku_Hakkinen
16:11:36 [Zakim]
+Markku_Hakkinen; got it
16:11:44 [oedipus]
JRG: monday, Canvas sub-group went through examples of use of shadow DOM - Frank Oliver of MS had a checkbox example, i had an accessible version of a chart
16:12:22 [eric_carlson]
Media TextAssociations wiki page: http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/Media_TextAssociations
16:12:24 [oedipus]
JRG: FO's checkbox example works functionally with safari and FF; have to be code changes so shadow DOM code needs to be inside CANVAS element - doesn't work at this point; good proof of concept
16:12:28 [oedipus]
MS: next steps
16:12:48 [oedipus]
JRG: writing specification related to work, suggested code changes to get to work
16:12:54 [oedipus]
MS: ownership for spec text?
16:13:02 [oedipus]
JRG: don't recall
16:13:12 [oedipus]
GJR: i believe RichS was going to write up spec text
16:13:20 [frankolivier]
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16:13:52 [oedipus]
minutes from CANVAS call: http://www.w3.org/2010/02/01-html-a11y-minutes.html
16:13:59 [oedipus]
TOPIC: Outstanding Action Item Review
16:14:14 [oedipus]
MC: Actions that are due or overdue - all
16:14:20 [oedipus]
MC: Action 2 on Cyns
16:14:28 [oedipus]
CS: haven't gotten to it; due date?
16:14:38 [oedipus]
MS: originally 24 december 2009, then 28 january 2010
16:14:41 [MikeSmithX]
action-2?
16:14:41 [trackbot]
ACTION-2 -- Cynthia Shelly to deliver draft of change proposal for ARIA additions to HTML 5 by 2009-12-24 -- due 2010-01-28 -- OPEN
16:14:41 [trackbot]
http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/track/actions/2
16:14:48 [oedipus]
CS: haven't been able to sync up with steve
16:14:54 [oedipus]
CS: can i have 2 more weeks?
16:15:06 [oedipus]
MC: relates to meta-grouping of projects will discuss later in call
16:15:07 [MichaelC]
action-2 due 18 Feb
16:15:07 [trackbot]
ACTION-2 Deliver draft of change proposal for ARIA additions to HTML 5 by 2009-12-24 due date now 18 Feb
16:15:10 [oedipus]
CS: big project
16:15:19 [oedipus]
MS: reset to 18 February 2010
16:15:30 [oedipus]
MC: action 6 on Rich - CANVAS related issue
16:15:43 [oedipus]
MC: skip canvas ones - will be reviewed in canvas call
16:15:45 [oedipus]
GJR: yes
16:16:01 [oedipus]
MC: action 8 on Cyns - follow up with IE team about parent/child relationships
16:16:07 [oedipus]
CS: need an additional week
16:16:07 [MichaelC]
action-8 due 11 Feb
16:16:07 [trackbot]
ACTION-8 Follow up with IE team about whether implementers are willing to use parent/child/nesting relationships could be used in mappings logic due date now 11 Feb
16:16:24 [oedipus]
MC: action 11 on Wendy - timeline for summary verbiage about what AT needs to communicate
16:18:05 [Zakim]
-Mike
16:18:23 [oedipus]
WC: joshue and gregory and i met and discussed a lot of topics; deatils element over @summary - good reasons for that usage; cell API investigated that Cyns proposed; good to have them - at minimum need collections for colum and row groupings; have some text we 3 agree with -- will send to list today; questions originally going to answer was "what is derivable from table markup" what isn't what needs to be; scaled back to what we expect to get from DOM an
16:18:47 [MikeSmithX]
zakim, call Mike
16:18:47 [Zakim]
ok, MikeSmithX; the call is being made
16:18:49 [Zakim]
+Mike
16:18:54 [oedipus]
MS: think action closeable; falls under "summary" category
16:19:04 [oedipus]
WC: 2 main keywords were Cell API and summary
16:19:29 [oedipus]
CS: moving away from derivable from structure towards details, what is thinking - different dirction than from HTML WG
16:19:31 [MichaelC]
s/MS/MC
16:20:17 [oedipus]
WC: 1 statement that GJR made was that CAPTION is to @alt as @summary is to LONGDESC; info that can be derived from tables with cell api - wahat is derivable needs to be in DOM so all apps can interact with it
16:21:28 [oedipus]
WC: if have rowspan and colspan info easily derivable, would help create query consistency -- middle road between 2 opinions; want to keep ascpet of authors to provide explanaion or details - deatils will be rich so can handle multi-lingual; not just for blind or screen reader users; may help those with cognative disabilities and non-native speakers to get better idea
16:21:52 [oedipus]
CS: my reading of details is has visible button or link that opens details; suggested using summary when deatails button not acceptable
16:22:17 [oedipus]
WC: propose that @summary be mapped to DETAILS for backwards compatibility; details would replace @summary
16:22:28 [oedipus]
CS: how handle situation where not having anything available ok
16:22:34 [oedipus]
GJR: would be availalbe via the DOM
16:22:59 [oedipus]
MS: discuss on mailing list after WC posts; know this is something JS has a lot of interest in -- might be best to wait for her in discussion
16:23:05 [oedipus]
CS: please put on agenda for next week
16:23:23 [MichaelC]
close action-11
16:23:24 [trackbot]
ACTION-11 - report on timeline for summary verbiage about what AT needs to communicate and report back to HTML5 A11y TF closed
16:23:45 [oedipus]
MC: remaining actions are CANVAS sub-groupo
16:23:56 [oedipus]
TOPIC: status on face-to-face meeting plan
16:24:31 [oedipus]
MS: face2face times and place -- seems consensus leaning towards europe in april 2010
16:24:50 [oedipus]
MC: question is hosting - 1 specific host candidate have specific dates, but can also solicit other hosts
16:25:06 [oedipus]
MC: in england could do 6-7 april or 26-29
16:25:16 [oedipus]
CS: latter dates confict with WWWConf
16:25:31 [oedipus]
MC: london or birminghton
16:25:37 [oedipus]
CS: MS has facility in reading
16:25:53 [oedipus]
MS: finalize date first then work with hosts?
16:26:00 [MichaelC]
s/birminghton/birmingham
16:26:32 [oedipus]
MS: april window of opportunity; anyone with strong opinions on early or late april speak up
16:26:46 [oedipus]
CS: what about doing WWW - in Raleigh, North Carolina in april
16:27:05 [oedipus]
MS: wonder if Janina can make it
16:27:19 [oedipus]
CS: w4a (web4all) going to convene then in Raleigh
16:27:46 [oedipus]
MS: strongest possiblity having in europe, most likely england, at beginning or end of month - if conflicts start of month might be best
16:28:06 [oedipus]
MC: earlier is better to sync with HTML WG timeline; bang out issues at f2f would make HTML WG chairs very happy
16:28:14 [oedipus]
MS: good reason to pin to early April 2010
16:28:37 [oedipus]
MS: get offer for hosting at beginning of april in U.K. - already have one for 6-7 april via RNIB
16:28:47 [oedipus]
MC: need to call for objections to date and location
16:28:57 [oedipus]
MS: do on list - no objections voiced during call
16:29:07 [oedipus]
MS: need to give those on list opportunity to provide feedback
16:29:26 [SCain]
SCain has joined #html-a11y
16:29:29 [oedipus]
RESOLVED: HTML A11y Task Force will meet in Europe at beginning of April
16:29:46 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/02/04-html-a11y-minutes.html oedipus
16:29:57 [oedipus]
MS: can talk with sally about hosting at end of call
16:30:09 [oedipus]
TOPIC: Media Issues
16:30:12 [MikeSmithX]
http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/buglist.cgi?product=HTML+WG&keywords=media
16:30:14 [oedipus]
MS: half-hour left
16:30:31 [oedipus]
MS: previous URI has media and a11y keywords
16:30:57 [Zakim]
+ +0190561aaee
16:31:03 [oedipus]
MS: neeed to determine which ones are highest priority; ones that are higher are 5758
16:31:08 [MikeSmithX]
5758insufficient accessibility fallback for <audio> or <video>
16:31:17 [MikeSmithX]
8187Section 4.8.7 on video makes no reference to audio description
16:31:20 [oedipus]
MS: second with high priority 8187
16:31:29 [oedipus]
MS: discuss those 2 today
16:31:35 [SCain]
zakim, +01905 is SCain
16:31:35 [Zakim]
+SCain; got it
16:31:35 [oedipus]
MS: some feedback on list about this
16:31:39 [MikeSmithX]
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-a11y/2010Feb/0035.html
16:31:52 [oedipus]
MS: sylvia can't be on call due to time differences, but sent very good response
16:32:13 [oedipus]
MS: sylvia said that 5758 is an open issue for discussion in media sub-group
16:32:46 [oedipus]
MS: sylvia had comments on 5758 -- 1 comment that applies to all we do is getting someone to take ownership of writing a concrete proposal
16:32:54 [oedipus]
MS: sylvia also mentioned implementations
16:33:14 [oedipus]
MS: as far as 8187, sylvia said that she considers this unresolved -- MCooper do you concur?
16:33:52 [eric_carlson]
+1 from me as well
16:33:53 [oedipus]
MC: don't feel qualified to concur or not concur, but willing to take as reservation; some bugs resolved as "fixed" if sylvia concurs, that is a plus 1 that i will accept
16:34:26 [oedipus]
MS: comments on other issues; under control and don't require attention of entire TF because no one objected to proposed resolution
16:34:53 [oedipus]
MC: sylvia seemed to bump 5758 up in priority; accept her ok for others
16:35:14 [oedipus]
MS: will tag these as a11y
16:35:21 [oedipus]
MC: remove others from a11y tf mailing list
16:35:34 [oedipus]
MS: getting baack to 5758 - seems to be highest priority
16:35:39 [MikeSmithX]
q?
16:35:42 [oedipus]
MS: comments on how to move forward on this expeditiously
16:35:48 [oedipus]
ack cy
16:36:06 [oedipus]
[silence]
16:36:24 [MikeSmithX]
ack Cyt
16:36:47 [oedipus]
MS: want to get something concrete out of this
16:37:06 [oedipus]
MS: eric, can you give some insight about progress on issue -- seems to be linked to what discussed earlier
16:37:09 [oedipus]
EC: which issue?
16:37:17 [oedipus]
MS: 5758 - fallback for video and audio
16:38:05 [oedipus]
EC: specifically the issue we've discussed; to address, first need to find further API on audio and video element so script has access to info about what kind of media is in media file, so can decide what to enable and what to disable for users' need; concentrating on this first because fundamental to solution
16:38:17 [oedipus]
MS: anything blocking progress other than limit of amount of time
16:38:44 [oedipus]
EC: time; sylvia mentioned we need to set up media telecons, we've been doing it all via email so far; at point where talking would move forward
16:38:54 [oedipus]
MS: anything anyone in TF or media group can do to expedite?
16:38:57 [oedipus]
EC: not yet
16:39:15 [oedipus]
MS: please follow up on list with this -- if can find time to talk by phone let chairs know
16:39:30 [MikeSmithX]
ack Sean
16:39:44 [oedipus]
SH: question: direction EC outlining is about working with content - means not a fallback in sense if i don't understand this content what do i do?
16:40:06 [oedipus]
SH: a11y info NOT a fallback, but part of the media; it is not fallback, am i missing something?
16:40:59 [oedipus]
EC: may be incorrectly titled issue; 1 of the issues is that media file can have alternate representations of its content - audio, audio and video, audio video sub-titles, alternate version s of audio file or video file; how to expose info in a media file so that scropt can configure file to display info according to user's needs
16:41:09 [oedipus]
SH: no objection to that, just pointing out that that is NOT a fallback
16:41:25 [oedipus]
EC: more work needs to be done, no doubt, but that is starting point we chose
16:41:28 [kliehm]
q+
16:41:39 [oedipus]
EC: either bug incorrectly titled, or need a new bug describing problem working on now
16:41:56 [oedipus]
SH: 2 bugs - what to do for fallback and what do about exposing various components
16:42:15 [oedipus]
MS: worth adding comment to bug issue or Sean can raise additional bug just to make clear
16:42:47 [oedipus]
MS: title is imprecise -- seems clear that scope of bug is part of, but not complete, solution; short term priority is work on that part of solution because momentum built
16:43:08 [oedipus]
MS: would be good for whole TF to meet in alternate time to accomodate those who can't attend current time
16:43:29 [oedipus]
MC: should investigate options, but may want to have media sub-group have own calls like CANVAS sub-group
16:44:00 [oedipus]
MS: greater wider task force needs to be filled in on what media issues are, what is being persued, what needs to be persued; talking with sylvia in real-time would be invaluable
16:44:33 [oedipus]
MS: never going to find time that works for everybody, but need to make effort to enable those working on media to talk
16:44:47 [oedipus]
MC: will follow up with MS and JS
16:45:00 [oedipus]
MS: week after next would like a detailed media update
16:45:10 [MikeSmithX]
ack kliehm
16:45:37 [oedipus]
MK: question regarding audio/video - alternative not fallback content -- implementing API for content, isn't it feasible as long as devs and implementors haven't agreed on video or subtitle format
16:46:33 [oedipus]
EC: video and audio independent of work we are doing; whether vendor supports 1 format or another, media files still have logical concept of track - streams of diff formats of media in a file (audio, video, captions, etc.) API would be higher level abstract way for media element to allow script to configure media contained in file
16:47:03 [oedipus]
EC: since captions data needs to be exposed via script, need to come up with recommendation on how that might work - we are addressing that directly
16:47:03 [MikeSmithX]
q?
16:47:14 [oedipus]
MS: questions, comments?
16:47:42 [MikeSmithX]
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-a11y/2010Feb/0035.html
16:47:49 [oedipus]
MS: end of discussion of media for today -- any other media folks have comments, please post them to the list and reply to above post from sylvia
16:48:07 [MikeSmithX]
8659 Media events to indicate captions and audio descriptions
16:48:12 [oedipus]
MS: only other 1 being worked on actively is 8659 about events
16:48:41 [oedipus]
MS: not sure if anything to discuss; discussion on mailing list about timing model which is what this relates to
16:49:00 [oedipus]
EC: does it make sense to expose events floated on list, but don't recall a reply
16:49:51 [oedipus]
MS: 1 thing from Dave Singer is comment on bug - is this really right way to solve problem was question he raised
16:49:59 [oedipus]
MS: weren't any responses
16:50:17 [oedipus]
MS: will poke dave to have him re-ask question to solicit responses
16:50:41 [oedipus]
MS: nothing else in discussion; no direct reply to DSinger's message, rest of discussion didn't touch on DS' question so is still open
16:50:50 [oedipus]
MS: can ask DSinger to update us on it
16:51:30 [oedipus]
MS: resolve for today about set of issues: 2 we need to keep open as issues for a11y TF are 8659 and 5758
16:51:55 [oedipus]
MS: rest of issues, remain open in bugzilla -- anyone welcome to discuss or follow up on them;
16:52:38 [oedipus]
MS: next week, @summary discussion and review set of issues associated with @summary to find out which need to add to high priority list
16:52:54 [oedipus]
MS: Janina will be chairing next week - focus: forward progress on summary
16:52:57 [MichaelC]
Media related bugs taken up by the TF: http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/buglist.cgi?keywords_type=allwords&keywords=a11ytf+media
16:53:01 [oedipus]
MS: call next week at same time
16:53:13 [oedipus]
http://www.w3.org/wai/pf/html/wiki/Meetings
16:53:21 [oedipus]
TOPIC: New Issues & Announcements
16:53:36 [oedipus]
RS: when is HTML A11y TF meeting for f2f
16:54:03 [oedipus]
MS: talking about april 6/7 2010 in england; or another time close to beginning of apirl in U.K. probably london
16:54:53 [oedipus]
SC: at moment have space in conference facility in birmingham office -- london booked; 6/7 april are free; also opening week of 26th april
16:55:07 [oedipus]
MS: leaning towards beginning of month--aim for 6/7 april 2010
16:55:26 [oedipus]
MC: do we want to settle on that or investigate other hosting options around that date?
16:55:35 [Zakim]
-Markku_Hakkinen
16:55:43 [oedipus]
MS: cyns checking on MS hosting in reading, but would gladly ceede to RNIB
16:56:12 [oedipus]
MS: propose to TF april 6/7 in birmingham, u.k. hosted by RNIB
16:56:25 [oedipus]
RS: trying to schedule another trip around that time, so need to find out soon
16:56:34 [oedipus]
MC: can send call for objections email with plan
16:56:49 [oedipus]
MS: yes, please do -- earliest decision the best
16:56:55 [oedipus]
2 minute warning
16:57:20 [oedipus]
RS: heads up: looking at attributes for HTML that can be triggered via CSS Media Queries -- what is best way to do that?
16:57:40 [oedipus]
MS: go directly to CSS WG mailing list (www-style) to give them heads up and request discussion
16:57:55 [oedipus]
MS: inform CSS WG on their mailing list
16:58:58 [oedipus]
RS: CANVAS sub-group agreed to create accessibleDOM binding for CANVAS; MS, Paciello Group, Mozilla, Apple working on it; Hixie says "fallback content sufficient" doesn't understand problem; how do we make progress -- doing implementations
16:59:53 [Zakim]
-kliehm
16:59:54 [oedipus]
MS: way to address getting wording into spec is write change proposal & bring to attention of chairs and WG -- first step; if hixie as editor is resolved not to make requested change to spec, then is up to chairs to put forward a survey or some other method of inquiry
17:00:09 [oedipus]
MS: first thing - concrete change proposal that addresses concern
17:00:42 [oedipus]
RS: i'm doing that, but i can't camp out on public-html and get carpet-bombed over tangental and philosophical issues; if put out for survey, going to have people voting out of ignorance
17:01:38 [oedipus]
MS: not voting per se; microdata split came down to chairs loooking at arguments and objectyions put forward and then making informed educated decision about strongest arguments and weakest objections; if comes down to standoff on this, chairs will review available info and make decision
17:01:45 [oedipus]
RS: will give CSS WG a heads up
17:01:54 [Zakim]
-Cynthia_Shelly
17:01:55 [oedipus]
MS: HTML WG call starting now - ADJOURN
17:02:00 [oedipus]
my "pleasure"
17:02:01 [Zakim]
-Rich
17:02:02 [Zakim]
-SCain
17:02:03 [Zakim]
-Sean_Hayes
17:02:04 [Zakim]
-Eric_Carlson
17:02:04 [Zakim]
-[Microsoft]
17:02:06 [Zakim]
-Ben_Caldwell
17:02:12 [Zakim]
-Gregory_Rosmaita
17:02:14 [Zakim]
-Bruce_Lawson
17:02:16 [Zakim]
-Cooper
17:02:19 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/02/04-html-a11y-minutes.html oedipus
17:02:20 [Zakim]
-Jon_Gunderson
17:02:22 [Zakim]
-Wendy_Chisholm
17:02:25 [MikeSmithX]
Zakim, drop Mike
17:02:28 [Zakim]
-Paul_Cotton
17:02:34 [Zakim]
Mike is being disconnected
17:02:36 [Zakim]
-Mike
17:02:57 [dboudreau]
cya guys
17:03:13 [Zakim]
-Denis_Boudreau
17:03:13 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/02/04-html-a11y-minutes.html oedipus
17:03:15 [Zakim]
WAI_PFWG(HTML TF)11:00AM has ended
17:03:17 [Zakim]
Attendees were Gregory_Rosmaita, Cooper, Rich, kliehm, +1.408.307.aaaa, +0154558aabb, Kelly_Ford, Bruce_Lawson, +1.514.312.aacc, Steve_Faulkner, Ben_Caldwell, Eric_Carlson,
17:03:20 [Zakim]
... Denis_Boudreau, Sean_Hayes, [Microsoft], Cynthia_Shelly, Paul_Cotton, Wendy_Chisholm, Mike, Jon_Gunderson, +1.609.482.aadd, Markku_Hakkinen, +0190561aaee, SCain
17:03:22 [oedipus]
zakim, please part
17:03:31 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/02/04-html-a11y-minutes.html oedipus
17:03:35 [Zakim]
Zakim has left #html-a11y
17:05:12 [oedipus]
chair: Mike_Smith
17:05:19 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/02/04-html-a11y-minutes.html oedipus
17:05:53 [jongunderson]
jongunderson has joined #html-a11y
17:06:34 [oedipus]
previous: http://www.w3.org/2010/01/28-html-a11y-minutes.html
17:06:37 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2010/02/04-html-a11y-minutes.html oedipus
17:08:16 [oedipus]
rrsagent, please part
17:08:16 [RRSAgent]
I see no action items