SPARQL Working Group Teleconference

Minutes of 15 November 2011

Agenda
http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/wiki/Agenda-2011-11-08 (essentially the same points, we'll run through status/progress made and PostLastCall page)
Seen
Andy Seaborne, Axel Polleres, Birte Glimm, Chimezie Ogbuji, Gregory Williams, Lee Feigenbaum, Matthew Perry, Olivier Corby, Paul Gearon, Sandro Hawke, Steve Harris
Regrets
Birte Glimm
Chair
Axel Polleres
Scribe
Axel Polleres, Sandro Hawke
IRC Log
Original and Editable Wiki Version
Resolutions
  1. Approve minutes at http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/meeting/2011-11-08 link
  2. remove the AT RISK note for COPY, ADD, MOVE in Update (7 pro, 2 abstentions, no objections) link
Topics
14:51:24 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2011/11/15-sparql-irc

RRSAgent IRC Bot: logging to http://www.w3.org/2011/11/15-sparql-irc

14:51:26 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs world

Trackbot IRC Bot: RRSAgent, make logs world

14:51:28 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be 77277

Trackbot IRC Bot: Zakim, this will be 77277

14:51:28 <Zakim> ok, trackbot; I see SW_(SPARQL)10:00AM scheduled to start in 9 minutes

Zakim IRC Bot: ok, trackbot; I see SW_(SPARQL)10:00AM scheduled to start in 9 minutes

14:51:29 <trackbot> Meeting: SPARQL Working Group Teleconference
14:51:29 <trackbot> Date: 15 November 2011
14:52:09 <AndyS> Query doc isn't finished yet -- see PosLastCall page.

Andy Seaborne: Query doc isn't finished yet -- see PosLastCall page.

14:52:19 <AndyS>  wiki:PostLastCall

Andy Seaborne: wiki:PostLastCall

14:52:24 <AxelPolleres_> agenda: http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/wiki/Agenda-2011-11-08 (essentially the same points, we'll run through status/progress made and PostLastCall page)
14:52:31 <AxelPolleres_> chair: AxelPolleres
14:52:59 <AxelPolleres_> http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/wiki/PostLastCall

Axel Polleres: http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/wiki/PostLastCall

14:53:38 <kasei> ok, thanks AndyS

Gregory Williams: ok, thanks AndyS

14:55:24 <AxelPolleres_> regrets:BirteGlimm
14:58:35 <AxelPolleres_> As regards "future work", lee has started a new page: http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/wiki/Future_Work_Items

Axel Polleres: As regards "future work", lee has started a new page: http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/wiki/Future_Work_Items

14:59:53 <AxelPolleres_> Open issue from last time: assign reviewers for protocol

Axel Polleres: Open issue from last time: assign reviewers for protocol

15:00:21 <kasei> Zakim, I hate you.

Gregory Williams: Zakim, I hate you.

15:00:21 <Zakim> I don't understand 'I hate you', kasei

Zakim IRC Bot: I don't understand 'I hate you', kasei

15:00:24 <Zakim> SW_(SPARQL)10:00AM has now started

Zakim IRC Bot: SW_(SPARQL)10:00AM has now started

15:00:31 <Zakim> +kasei

Zakim IRC Bot: +kasei

15:00:43 <Zakim> + +1.603.897.aaaa

Zakim IRC Bot: + +1.603.897.aaaa

15:00:45 <kasei> wow. that seems to have worked. need to curse Zakim more often.

Gregory Williams: wow. that seems to have worked. need to curse Zakim more often.

15:00:56 <MattPerry> zakim, aaaa is me

Matthew Perry: zakim, aaaa is me

15:00:56 <Zakim> +MattPerry; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +MattPerry; got it

15:01:03 <Zakim> + +49.897.aabb

Zakim IRC Bot: + +49.897.aabb

15:01:19 <AxelPolleres_> Zakim, aabb is probably me

Axel Polleres: Zakim, aabb is probably me

15:01:23 <Zakim> +[Sophia]

Zakim IRC Bot: +[Sophia]

15:01:25 <Zakim> +AxelPolleres; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +AxelPolleres; got it

15:02:02 <AxelPolleres_> Zakim, who is on the phone?

Axel Polleres: Zakim, who is on the phone?

15:02:04 <LeeF> Zakim, I hate you.

Lee Feigenbaum: Zakim, I hate you.

15:02:05 <Zakim> On the phone I see kasei, MattPerry, AxelPolleres, [Sophia]

Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see kasei, MattPerry, AxelPolleres, [Sophia]

15:02:09 <Zakim> I don't understand 'I hate you', LeeF

Zakim IRC Bot: I don't understand 'I hate you', LeeF

15:02:13 <Zakim> + +1.617.553.aacc

Zakim IRC Bot: + +1.617.553.aacc

15:02:15 <LeeF> sweet, works like a charm

Lee Feigenbaum: sweet, works like a charm

15:02:17 <Zakim> +??P12

Zakim IRC Bot: +??P12

15:02:18 <LeeF> zakim, aacc is me

Lee Feigenbaum: zakim, aacc is me

15:02:19 <Zakim> +LeeF; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +LeeF; got it

15:02:22 <AndyS> zakim, ??P12 is me

Andy Seaborne: zakim, ??P12 is me

15:02:22 <Zakim> +AndyS; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +AndyS; got it

15:02:23 <kasei> there's no agenda online?

Gregory Williams: there's no agenda online?

15:02:45 <kasei> ah, ok.

Gregory Williams: ah, ok.

15:03:14 <Zakim> +pgearon

Zakim IRC Bot: +pgearon

15:03:15 <AxelPolleres_> Zakim, who is on the phone?

Axel Polleres: Zakim, who is on the phone?

15:03:15 <Zakim> On the phone I see kasei, MattPerry, AxelPolleres, [Sophia], LeeF, AndyS, pgearon

Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see kasei, MattPerry, AxelPolleres, [Sophia], LeeF, AndyS, pgearon

15:05:06 <AxelPolleres_> Zakim, who is on the phone?

Axel Polleres: Zakim, who is on the phone?

15:05:06 <Zakim> On the phone I see kasei, MattPerry, AxelPolleres, [Sophia], LeeF, AndyS, pgearon

Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see kasei, MattPerry, AxelPolleres, [Sophia], LeeF, AndyS, pgearon

15:05:12 <Zakim> + +1.216.368.aadd

Zakim IRC Bot: + +1.216.368.aadd

15:05:35 <chimezie> Zakim, +1.216.368.aadd is me

Chimezie Ogbuji: Zakim, +1.216.368.aadd is me

15:05:35 <Zakim> +chimezie; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +chimezie; got it

15:05:50 <chimezie> Zakim, mute me

Chimezie Ogbuji: Zakim, mute me

15:05:50 <Zakim> chimezie should now be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: chimezie should now be muted

15:06:25 <Zakim> +Sandro

Zakim IRC Bot: +Sandro

15:06:45 <AxelPolleres_> sandro, can you scribe?

Axel Polleres: sandro, can you scribe?

15:06:54 <Zakim> -Sandro

Zakim IRC Bot: -Sandro

15:07:07 <AxelPolleres_> scribe: AxelPolleres

(Scribe set to Axel Polleres)

15:07:14 <AxelPolleres_> topic: admin

1. admin

15:07:18 <Zakim> +sandro

Zakim IRC Bot: +sandro

15:07:32 <AxelPolleres_> scribe: sandro

(Scribe set to Sandro Hawke)

15:07:44 <chimezie> I'm getting caught up with my ACTION items outstanding (unable to last week)

Chimezie Ogbuji: I'm getting caught up with my ACTION items outstanding (unable to last week)

15:08:06 <sandro> axel: Agenda is reviewing status of documents, checking on reviews; see where we are toward the next publication round.

Axel Polleres: Agenda is reviewing status of documents, checking on reviews; see where we are toward the next publication round.

15:08:24 <AxelPolleres_> PROPOSED: Approve minutes at http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/meeting/2011-11-08

PROPOSED: Approve minutes at http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/meeting/2011-11-08

15:08:56 <AxelPolleres_> RESOLVED: Approve minutes at http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/meeting/2011-11-08

RESOLVED: Approve minutes at http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/meeting/2011-11-08

15:09:47 <sandro> axel: (looking for next scribe)

Axel Polleres: (looking for next scribe)

15:10:13 <chimezie> sure

Chimezie Ogbuji: sure

15:10:23 <AxelPolleres_> scribe for next week: chime

Axel Polleres: scribe for next week: chime

15:10:44 <sandro> topic: liaison with RDF WG

2. liaison with RDF WG

15:10:50 <sandro> axel: some email;   comment Andy?

Axel Polleres: some email; comment Andy?

15:11:20 <sandro> andy: No current decisions by RDF WG affecting us.    Just working through consequences of decisions earlier on, eg datatype changes

Andy Seaborne: No current decisions by RDF WG affecting us. Just working through consequences of decisions earlier on, eg datatype changes

15:11:25 <AxelPolleres_> discussion on effects of http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2011OctDec/0149.html

Axel Polleres: discussion on effects of http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2011OctDec/0149.html

15:11:33 <sandro> andy: There will be something about RDF Graphs, but not yet.

Andy Seaborne: There will be something about RDF Graphs, but not yet.

15:11:40 <sandro> axel: You did some changes based on datatype decision?

Axel Polleres: You did some changes based on datatype decision?

15:12:36 <sandro> andy: Because all literals will have datatypes, the DATATYPE( ) fn in sparql is affected.  It didn't cover lits with lang tags.     plain lits without lang tags were already returned as xs:string.   Now it returns rdf:LangString for lang tagged strings.

Andy Seaborne: Because all literals will have datatypes, the DATATYPE( ) fn in sparql is affected. It didn't cover lits with lang tags. plain lits without lang tags were already returned as xs:string. Now it returns rdf:LangString for lang tagged strings.

15:13:17 <sandro> axel: So we're blending in some RDF 1.1 features there.   Shall we discuss this as a group, since we already decided to stick to RDF 1.0, with only commentary about RDF 1.1.

Axel Polleres: So we're blending in some RDF 1.1 features there. Shall we discuss this as a group, since we already decided to stick to RDF 1.0, with only commentary about RDF 1.1.

15:13:28 <sandro> axel: any opinions?

Axel Polleres: any opinions?

15:13:35 <sandro> (silence)

(silence)

15:13:52 <sandro> +1 I'm fine with proceeding like this.

+1 I'm fine with proceeding like this.

15:14:11 <kasei> i'm hesitant to change it at this point.

Gregory Williams: i'm hesitant to change it at this point.

15:14:23 <sandro> axel: So, we'll try to keep as close as we can to RDF 1.1 without disrupting the test suite.

Axel Polleres: So, we'll try to keep as close as we can to RDF 1.1 without disrupting the test suite.

15:14:47 <pgearon> Olivier had a question about loading RDF data where data from 1.1 may define multiple graphs, but Update 1.1 currently specifies a particular graph

Paul Gearon: Olivier had a question about loading RDF data where data from 1.1 may define multiple graphs, but Update 1.1 currently specifies a particular graph

15:15:03 <sandro> kasei: I'm wary of making changes that potentially change the results of SPARQL 1.1 queries, on something that's not a spec (REC) yet.

Gregory Williams: I'm wary of making changes that potentially change the results of SPARQL 1.1 queries, on something that's not a spec (REC) yet.

15:15:25 <sandro> axel: this dt is in RDF 1.1?

Axel Polleres: this dt is in RDF 1.1?

15:15:28 <sandro> sandro: yes

Sandro Hawke: yes

15:15:34 <sandro> axel: so we have to wait for it?

Axel Polleres: so we have to wait for it?

15:15:52 <AxelPolleres_> I am a bit worried processwise

Axel Polleres: I am a bit worried processwise

15:15:57 <LeeF> We wouldn't need to wait because we're not leaning on RDF, we're just defining things ourselves

Lee Feigenbaum: We wouldn't need to wait because we're not leaning on RDF, we're just defining things ourselves

15:16:09 <LeeF> at least, that's how i understood what Andy did

Lee Feigenbaum: at least, that's how i understood what Andy did

15:16:15 <AndyS> +1 to LeeF

Andy Seaborne: +1 to LeeF

15:16:25 <sandro> sandro: we can just define what we need ourselves

Sandro Hawke: we can just define what we need ourselves

15:16:33 <sandro> sandro: it's half a sentence.....

Sandro Hawke: it's half a sentence.....

15:16:47 <sandro> axel: Does any of this affect D-Entailment and the fixed datatype map, Birte?

Axel Polleres: Does any of this affect D-Entailment and the fixed datatype map, Birte?

15:16:50 <kasei> won't this change results of in-the-wild 1.0 queries?

Gregory Williams: won't this change results of in-the-wild 1.0 queries?

15:17:11 <sandro> axel: I'll ask Birte in email

Axel Polleres: I'll ask Birte in email

15:17:39 <sandro> kasei: won't this change results of in-the-wild 1.0 queries?

Gregory Williams: won't this change results of in-the-wild 1.0 queries?

15:18:09 <sandro> andy: Yes, all the RDF 1.1 changes have that potential.  Particularly with datatypes, which is one of our extension points.

Andy Seaborne: Yes, all the RDF 1.1 changes have that potential. Particularly with datatypes, which is one of our extension points.

15:18:13 <LeeF> Was it an error in SPARQL 1.0 or an empty sting?

Lee Feigenbaum: Was it an error in SPARQL 1.0 or an empty string?

15:18:19 <LeeF> s/sting/string
15:18:36 <sandro> andy: THe change to simple literals, having xs:string is also like this.

Andy Seaborne: THe change to simple literals, having xs:string is also like this.

15:18:39 <AndyS> error

Andy Seaborne: error

15:19:13 <sandro> axel: two observable changes.    plain literals with and without language tags.

Axel Polleres: two observable changes. plain literals with and without language tags.

15:19:15 <LeeF> I'm comfortable making a change that goes from error --> proper semantics -- I think that's consistent with SPARQL's extension mechanism in general

Lee Feigenbaum: I'm comfortable making a change that goes from error --> proper semantics -- I think that's consistent with SPARQL's extension mechanism in general

15:19:43 <Olivier_> The problem is that rdf:LangString is not a definitive decision in a final REC, so it may change ?

Olivier Corby: The problem is that rdf:LangString is not a definitive decision in a final REC, so it may change ?

15:19:45 <chimezie> I would concur to those who understand this better than me

Chimezie Ogbuji: I would defer to those who understand this better than me

15:19:52 <AndyS> zakim, who is on the phone?

Andy Seaborne: zakim, who is on the phone?

15:19:52 <Zakim> On the phone I see kasei, MattPerry, AxelPolleres, [Sophia], LeeF, AndyS, pgearon, chimezie (muted), sandro

Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see kasei, MattPerry, AxelPolleres, [Sophia], LeeF, AndyS, pgearon, chimezie (muted), sandro

15:20:02 <chimezie> s/concur/defer
15:20:02 <pgearon> +q

Paul Gearon: +q

15:20:05 <LeeF> Olivier_, I do share that concern... it's a little risky

Lee Feigenbaum: Olivier_, I do share that concern... it's a little risky

15:20:51 <sandro> lee: there is some risk of RDF WG changing its mind

Lee Feigenbaum: there is some risk of RDF WG changing its mind

15:21:05 <sandro> andy: either way we're a bit stuck.

Andy Seaborne: either way we're a bit stuck.

15:21:12 <sandro> andy: it's a no win situation

Andy Seaborne: it's a no win situation

15:21:38 <AxelPolleres_> Can we ask the RDF WG at least to make some formal resolution for the URI, or is that alrady there?

Axel Polleres: Can we ask the RDF WG at least to make some formal resolution for the URI, or is that alrady there?

15:21:43 <sandro> lee: We could just put a note in about what we expect.

Lee Feigenbaum: We could just put a note in about what we expect.

15:21:52 <kasei> if we were divergent from the eventual rdf1.1 spec, though, implementors could still do extensions to align.

Gregory Williams: if we were divergent from the eventual rdf1.1 spec, though, implementors could still do extensions to align.

15:22:34 <sandro> axel: we seem fine with xs:string...

Axel Polleres: we seem fine with xs:string...

15:22:37 <sandro> andy: that's not a change

Andy Seaborne: that's not a change

15:22:50 <sandro> andy: It was already in SPARQL 1.9

Andy Seaborne: It was already in SPARQL 1.0

15:22:58 <sandro> s/1.9/1.0/
15:23:14 <AxelPolleres_> Alternative 1: return an error

Axel Polleres: Alternative 1: return an error

15:23:36 <LeeF> DATATYPE("foo"@en)

Lee Feigenbaum: DATATYPE("foo"@en)

15:23:38 <AxelPolleres_> Alternative 2: return rdf:LangString

Axel Polleres: Alternative 2: return rdf:LangString

15:23:47 <sandro> 2

2

15:23:48 <LeeF> 2

Lee Feigenbaum: 2

15:24:05 <LeeF> 2 (with note is good)

Lee Feigenbaum: 2 (with note is good)

15:24:23 <sandro> andy: Don't hide it.   Put a note in the spec about the change.

Andy Seaborne: Don't hide it. Put a note in the spec about the change.

15:24:27 <LeeF> Don't think somewhere else would be "hiding", but still happy to just include it

Lee Feigenbaum: Don't think somewhere else would be "hiding", but still happy to just include it

15:24:27 <AndyS> Alternative 3: as alt 2 with a note about the change

Andy Seaborne: Alternative 3: as alt 2 with a note about the change

15:24:43 <sandro> axel: We could use "AT RISK" so we can drop it during CR.

Axel Polleres: We could use "AT RISK" so we can drop it during CR.

15:24:54 <AxelPolleres_> 2 (mark explicitly at risk)

Axel Polleres: 2 (mark explicitly at risk)

15:24:58 <MattPerry> 1

Matthew Perry: 1

15:24:58 <chimezie> which alternative is at risk?

Chimezie Ogbuji: which alternative is at risk?

15:25:17 <chimezie> 2

Chimezie Ogbuji: 2

15:25:19 <AndyS> 2 or 3

Andy Seaborne: 2 or 3

15:25:22 <Olivier_> 2

Olivier Corby: 2

15:25:27 <kasei> 0

Gregory Williams: 0

15:25:40 <sandro> sandro: Yeah, I think "AT RISK" can say datatype URI may change.

Sandro Hawke: Yeah, I think "AT RISK" can say datatype URI may change.

15:26:24 <sandro> MattPerry: This is a mild preference, toward letting implementors do the extension, but I wouldn't lie in the road over this, no.

Matthew Perry: This is a mild preference, toward letting implementors do the extension, but I wouldn't lie in the road over this, no.

15:26:31 <AxelPolleres_> direction seems to be to go for Alternative 2 with an AT RISK note.

Axel Polleres: direction seems to be to go for Alternative 2 with an AT RISK note.

15:26:41 <sandro> axel: sound like:  we'll go with alternative 2, with an AT RISK note.

Axel Polleres: sound like: we'll go with alternative 2, with an AT RISK note.

15:26:50 <Zakim> +??P2

Zakim IRC Bot: +??P2

15:27:24 <sandro> axel: Any more about Query document?    How close is it to review-ready.

Axel Polleres: Any more about Query document? How close is it to review-ready.

15:27:29 <AxelPolleres_> topic: query

3. query

15:27:32 <sandro> andy: I'm working through the list of work items.

Andy Seaborne: I'm working through the list of work items.

15:27:49 <sandro> steve: someone spotted an order consistency problem

Steve Harris: someone spotted an order consistency problem

15:28:04 <sandro> steve: mismatch between my head and [something].

Steve Harris: mismatch between my head and [something].

15:28:18 <sandro> axel: Reviewable by next telecon?

Axel Polleres: Reviewable by next telecon?

15:28:26 <sandro> steve: I'm aiming for it, but ... 50/50.

Steve Harris: I'm aiming for it, but ... 50/50.

15:28:36 <AndyS> Unlikely on my part.

Andy Seaborne: Unlikely on my part.

15:28:45 <AxelPolleres_> we aim at reviewable state by next Telco?

Axel Polleres: we aim at reviewable state by next Telco?

15:28:58 <bglimm> I plan to review the non-algebra sections tomorrow. Is that ok (sorry, only IRC)

Birte Glimm: I plan to review the non-algebra sections tomorrow. Is that ok (sorry, only IRC)

15:29:00 <sandro> axel: Birte will review in parallel, in order to have a chance to vote within 2 weeks.  Okay?

Axel Polleres: Birte will review in parallel, in order to have a chance to vote within 2 weeks. Okay?

15:29:26 <pgearon> q-

Paul Gearon: q-

15:29:26 <kasei> yes

Gregory Williams: yes

15:29:26 <AndyS> bglimm - doc not finished, hopefully local changes only but several to do.

Andy Seaborne: bglimm - doc not finished, hopefully local changes only but several to do.

15:29:40 <bglimm> ok, then I better wait

Birte Glimm: ok, then I better wait

15:29:47 <sandro> axel: Greg, can you start reviewing?

Axel Polleres: Greg, can you start reviewing?

15:29:52 <sandro> kasei: Whenever it's ready

Gregory Williams: Whenever it's ready

15:30:01 <bglimm> or you send a list naming the sections that are ready

Birte Glimm: or you send a list naming the sections that are ready

15:30:27 <swh> Zakim, who's on the phone?

Steve Harris: Zakim, who's on the phone?

15:30:27 <Zakim> On the phone I see kasei, MattPerry, AxelPolleres, [Sophia], LeeF, AndyS, pgearon, chimezie (muted), sandro, ??P2

Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see kasei, MattPerry, AxelPolleres, [Sophia], LeeF, AndyS, pgearon, chimezie (muted), sandro, ??P2

15:30:33 <swh> Zakim, ??P2 is me

Steve Harris: Zakim, ??P2 is me

15:30:33 <Zakim> +swh; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +swh; got it

15:30:53 <sandro> topic: Overview, Fed pubs

4. Overview, Fed pubs

15:31:01 <sandro> axel: Docs are ready.

Axel Polleres: Docs are ready.

15:31:55 <sandro> sandro: I think we can publish today.  I might need a little help.

Sandro Hawke: I think we can publish today. I might need a little help.

15:32:20 <sandro> sandro: I'll do my best.

Sandro Hawke: I'll do my best.

15:32:36 <sandro> axel: announcing them?

Axel Polleres: announcing them?

15:33:28 <sandro> axel: wait for it on w3.org, then re-announce as you like

Axel Polleres: wait for it on w3.org, then re-announce as you like

15:34:01 <chimezie> Zakim, unmute me

Chimezie Ogbuji: Zakim, unmute me

15:34:01 <Zakim> chimezie should no longer be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: chimezie should no longer be muted

15:34:05 <sandro> topic: graph store protocol

5. graph store protocol

15:34:25 <sandro> axel: I think this is ready?     we just need feedback from all the commenters.

Axel Polleres: I think this is ready? we just need feedback from all the commenters.

15:34:49 <sandro> chimezie: I only need to followup with people with non-substantive comment, and inconclusive comments.

Chimezie Ogbuji: I only need to followup with people with non-substantive comment, and inconclusive comments.

15:35:16 <sandro> chimezie: working through them, then it'll be ready for review

Chimezie Ogbuji: working through them, then it'll be ready for review

15:35:33 <sandro> axel: Send mail to list when it's ready to review.  Then Andy and Sandro will review

Axel Polleres: Send mail to list when it's ready to review. Then Andy and Sandro will review

15:35:41 <sandro> chimezie: okay

Chimezie Ogbuji: okay

15:36:21 <sandro> topic: Service Description

6. Service Description

15:36:34 <sandro> axel: I didn't find time to do my review yet.

Axel Polleres: I didn't find time to do my review yet.

15:37:07 <sandro> (axel having IRC problems.)

(axel having IRC problems.)

15:37:26 <sandro> topic: ENtailment Regimes

7. ENtailment Regimes

15:37:38 <sandro> axel: Birte says second review by Markus Kr.

Axel Polleres: Birte says second review by Markus Kr.

15:37:44 <sandro> topic: Update

8. Update

15:37:52 <bglimm>  Yes, Markus will review

Birte Glimm: Yes, Markus will review

15:37:52 <AxelPolleres> http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/wiki/PostLastCall#Update

Axel Polleres: http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/wiki/PostLastCall#Update

15:37:54 <sandro> axel: post-last-call page says some things have been done

Axel Polleres: post-last-call page says some things have been done

15:38:22 <bglimm> I've send out replies to Michael Schneider last week, but haven't received feedback yet

Birte Glimm: I've send out replies to Michael Schneider last week, but haven't received feedback yet

15:39:20 <sandro> axel: have one review; document is close to reviewable.

Axel Polleres: have one review; document is close to reviewable.

15:39:31 <sandro> axel: second reviewer = Matt.

Axel Polleres: second reviewer = Matt.

15:39:40 <sandro> MattPerry: I'll wait for the next version

Matthew Perry: I'll wait for the next version

15:39:49 <sandro> topic: Protocol

9. Protocol

15:39:53 <AndyS> pgearon - comments RC-4 and DB-4 -- have had time to look/complete the update parts of the draft response?

Andy Seaborne: pgearon - comments RC-4 and DB-4 -- have had time to look/complete the update parts of the draft response?

15:40:12 <sandro> lee: Greg and I have done most of what needs to be done; document is ready to review.

Lee Feigenbaum: Greg and I have done most of what needs to be done; document is ready to review.

15:40:39 <AxelPolleres> ACTION: AndyS to review protocol

ACTION: AndyS to review protocol

15:40:40 <trackbot> Created ACTION-559 - Review protocol [on Andy Seaborne - due 2011-11-22].

Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-559 - Review protocol [on Andy Seaborne - due 2011-11-22].

15:40:52 <sandro> lee: there are three open protocol issues, on tracker -- once reviewers have looked over them, we can close those issues next week, based on what's in current document.

Lee Feigenbaum: there are three open protocol issues, on tracker -- once reviewers have looked over them, we can close those issues next week, based on what's in current document.

15:41:05 <sandro> axel: reviews by Andy, and ...?

Axel Polleres: reviews by Andy, and ...?

15:41:25 <pgearon> AndyS: not sure. I've done a number of things lately, and I don't recall if those are in the mix. Will get back to you as soon as I'm done with the review from Olivier

Andy Seaborne: not sure. I've done a number of things lately, and I don't recall if those are in the mix. Will get back to you as soon as I'm done with the review from Olivier [ Scribe Assist by Paul Gearon ]

15:41:30 <chimezie> Zakim, mute me

Chimezie Ogbuji: Zakim, mute me

15:41:30 <Zakim> chimezie should now be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: chimezie should now be muted

15:41:43 <swh> what's the deadline?

Steve Harris: what's the deadline?

15:42:03 <AndyS> pgearon - I'll see updates to the wiki via RSS.

Andy Seaborne: pgearon - I'll see updates to the wiki via RSS.

15:42:23 <AxelPolleres> Olivier, Carlos, any chance foryou to take a second review on board?

Axel Polleres: Olivier, Carlos, any chance foryou to take a second review on board?

15:42:38 <Olivier_> Yes

Olivier Corby: Yes

15:42:38 <sandro> SteveH: I can't morally do it until I'm done with Query.  Maybe I can rope someone here into doing it.

Steve Harris: I can't morally do it until I'm done with Query. Maybe I can rope someone here into doing it.

15:42:41 <LeeF> ACTION: Steve to make a best effort attempt to review or delegate a review for protocol

ACTION: Steve to make a best effort attempt to review or delegate a review for protocol

15:42:41 <trackbot> Created ACTION-560 - Make a best effort attempt to review or delegate a review for protocol [on Steve Harris - due 2011-11-22].

Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-560 - Make a best effort attempt to review or delegate a review for protocol [on Steve Harris - due 2011-11-22].

15:42:53 <LeeF> ACTION: Olivier to review SPARQL protocol document

ACTION: Olivier to review SPARQL protocol document

15:42:54 <trackbot> Created ACTION-561 - Review SPARQL protocol document [on Olivier Corby - due 2011-11-22].

Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-561 - Review SPARQL protocol document [on Olivier Corby - due 2011-11-22].

15:43:15 <sandro> lee: Greg and I will send an email later today saying when it's totally ready for review.

Lee Feigenbaum: Greg and I will send an email later today saying when it's totally ready for review.

15:43:28 <sandro> topic: JSON Results Format

10. JSON Results Format

15:43:43 <sandro> axel: We said this doesn't need review.   ready for CR.

Axel Polleres: We said this doesn't need review. ready for CR.

15:43:49 <sandro> topic: Comments

11. Comments

15:44:06 <sandro> axel: Nothing substantial new.   Please update the wiki page as you handle comments.

Axel Polleres: Nothing substantial new. Please update the wiki page as you handle comments.

15:44:25 <sandro> topic: Any Other Business

12. Any Other Business

15:45:17 <sandro> axel: Paul, was there anything else you needed to discuss?

Axel Polleres: Paul, was there anything else you needed to discuss?

15:45:53 <sandro> pgearon: One thing that came up was the LOAD operation, which Olivier asked about.   If RDF 1.1 has a syntax for multiple graphs, will the LOAD command need that.

Paul Gearon: One thing that came up was the LOAD operation, which Olivier asked about. If RDF 1.1 has a syntax for multiple graphs, will the LOAD command need that.

15:46:00 <AxelPolleres> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2011OctDec/0145.html

Axel Polleres: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2011OctDec/0145.html

15:46:27 <sandro> axel: which comment...?

Axel Polleres: which comment...?

15:46:37 <AxelPolleres> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2011OctDec/0143.html Olivier's review

Axel Polleres: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2011OctDec/0143.html Olivier's review

15:47:58 <AndyS> Fuseki (will be) implementing loading quads if LOAD <foo> and no INTO -- user request and expectation.

Andy Seaborne: Fuseki (will be) implementing loading quads if LOAD <foo> and no INTO -- user request and expectation.

15:48:06 <Zakim> -chimezie

Zakim IRC Bot: -chimezie

15:48:09 <sandro> pgearon: Not taking into account this direction of RDF 1.1 is a cause for concern for me

Paul Gearon: Not taking into account this direction of RDF 1.1 is a cause for concern for me

15:48:17 <sandro> axel: This would rather go into a note

Axel Polleres: This would rather go into a note

15:48:45 <sandro> pgearon: Also, the additional copy/move shortcuts.  At Risk.

Paul Gearon: Also, the additional copy/move shortcuts. At Risk.

15:48:50 <AxelPolleres> COPY, ADD MOVE... still marked as AT RISK

Axel Polleres: COPY, ADD MOVE... still marked as AT RISK

15:49:07 <LeeF> I feel the same way I felt all along

Lee Feigenbaum: I feel the same way I felt all along

15:49:08 <sandro> AxelPolleres: Only feedback was to keep it.

Axel Polleres: Only feedback was to keep it.

15:49:16 <LeeF> Keep it AT RISK and see who does / does not implement it

Lee Feigenbaum: Keep it AT RISK and see who does / does not implement it

15:49:43 <sandro> LeeF: If people implement it, we'll keep it.

Lee Feigenbaum: If people implement it, we'll keep it.

15:50:21 <sandro> lee: "At Risk" is about implementation exerpeince, during CR.

Lee Feigenbaum: "At Risk" is about implementation exerpeince, during CR.

15:50:49 <sandro> AndyS: We've had feedback already; why not decide.

Andy Seaborne: We've had feedback already; why not decide.

15:51:16 <sandro> lee: We're waiting to see how it shows up in implementation report during CR.

Lee Feigenbaum: We're waiting to see how it shows up in implementation report during CR.

15:51:27 <sandro> SteveH: We've implemented it, as has Andy.

Steve Harris: We've implemented it, as has Andy.

15:51:27 <AxelPolleres> Andy, Steve have implemented it.

Axel Polleres: Andy, Steve have implemented it.

15:51:31 <sandro> Lee: We have not.

Lee Feigenbaum: We have not.

15:51:58 <AxelPolleres> (Discussion whether or not to leave the AT RISK note in)

Axel Polleres: (Discussion whether or not to leave the AT RISK note in)

15:52:11 <AxelPolleres> sandro: let's strive for only as many AT RISK notes as we need.

Sandro Hawke: let's strive for only as many AT RISK notes as we need. [ Scribe Assist by Axel Polleres ]

15:52:47 <pgearon> +1 to remove AT RISK note

Paul Gearon: +1 to remove AT RISK note

15:52:58 <AndyS> Note it is the grammar in rq25

Andy Seaborne: Note it is the grammar in rq25

15:53:01 <swh> +1 -- IFF there's 3+ implementations, -1 otherwise

Steve Harris: +1 -- IFF there's 3+ implementations, -1 otherwise

15:53:04 <MattPerry> +1

Matthew Perry: +1

15:53:05 <LeeF> -1

Lee Feigenbaum: -1

15:53:09 <Olivier_> +1

Olivier Corby: +1

15:53:10 <AndyS> +1

Andy Seaborne: +1

15:53:13 <kasei> -1

Gregory Williams: -1

15:53:14 <sandro> 0 insufficient data

0 insufficient data

15:53:19 <AxelPolleres> strawpoll: +1 to remove the at risk note at http://www.w3.org/TR/sparql11-update/#copy

STRAWPOLL: +1 to remove the at risk note at http://www.w3.org/TR/sparql11-update/#copy

15:53:29 <AxelPolleres> 0

Axel Polleres: 0

15:53:50 <swh> pgearon, have you implemented it?

Steve Harris: pgearon, have you implemented it?

15:54:03 <pgearon> no. Have only just started on Update implementation

Paul Gearon: no. Have only just started on Update implementation

15:54:11 <pgearon> yes

Paul Gearon: yes

15:54:11 <swh> then I'm -1

Steve Harris: then I'm -1

15:55:28 <AxelPolleres> Has sesame implemented it?

Axel Polleres: Has sesame implemented it?

15:55:31 <LeeF> I think Anzo does implement it

Lee Feigenbaum: I think Anzo does implement it

15:56:14 <LeeF> 3 on the call

Lee Feigenbaum: 3 on the call

15:56:22 <LeeF> including 1 who thinks it's a bad idea anyway :D

Lee Feigenbaum: including 1 who thinks it's a bad idea anyway :D

15:56:50 <sandro> axel: Is that an objection Lee?

Axel Polleres: Is that an objection Lee?

15:57:15 <sandro> Lee: Turns we did implement it, so that's three impls on the call now.

Lee Feigenbaum: Turns we did implement it, so that's three impls on the call now.

15:57:29 <sandro> lee: no objection

Lee Feigenbaum: no objection

15:58:13 <AxelPolleres> PROPOSED: remove the AT RISK note for COPY, ADD, MOVE in Update

PROPOSED: remove the AT RISK note for COPY, ADD, MOVE in Update

15:58:15 <swh> seconded

Steve Harris: seconded

15:58:17 <sandro> +1

+1

15:58:22 <AxelPolleres> +1

Axel Polleres: +1

15:58:23 <Olivier_> +1

Olivier Corby: +1

15:58:24 <kasei> 0

Gregory Williams: 0

15:58:27 <MattPerry> +1

Matthew Perry: +1

15:58:35 <AndyS> +1

Andy Seaborne: +1

15:58:38 <LeeF> 0

Lee Feigenbaum: 0

15:59:07 <pgearon> +1

Paul Gearon: +1

15:59:31 <AxelPolleres> RESOLVED: remove the AT RISK note for COPY, ADD, MOVE in Update (7 pro, 2 abstentions, no objections)

RESOLVED: remove the AT RISK note for COPY, ADD, MOVE in Update (7 pro, 2 abstentions, no objections)

15:59:55 <AxelPolleres> adjourned

Axel Polleres: adjourned

15:59:55 <sandro> ADJOURNED

ADJOURNED

15:59:56 <Zakim> -LeeF

Zakim IRC Bot: -LeeF

15:59:57 <MattPerry> bye

Matthew Perry: bye

15:59:58 <Zakim> -[Sophia]

Zakim IRC Bot: -[Sophia]

15:59:59 <Zakim> -swh

Zakim IRC Bot: -swh

16:00:00 <Zakim> -kasei

Zakim IRC Bot: -kasei

16:00:03 <Zakim> -sandro

Zakim IRC Bot: -sandro

16:00:04 <Zakim> -pgearon

Zakim IRC Bot: -pgearon

16:00:09 <Zakim> -AxelPolleres

Zakim IRC Bot: -AxelPolleres

16:00:10 <Zakim> -MattPerry

Zakim IRC Bot: -MattPerry

16:00:26 <AxelPolleres> rrsagent, make records public

Axel Polleres: rrsagent, make records public



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This revision (#1) generated 2011-11-15 16:05:00 UTC by 'sandro', comments: None