SPARQL Working Group

Minutes of 09 August 2011

Agenda
http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/wiki/Agenda-2011-08-09
Seen
Alexandre Passant, Andy Seaborne, Axel Polleres, Birte Glimm, Carlos Buil Aranda, Chimezie Ogbuji, Gregory Williams, Lee Feigenbaum, Matthew Perry, Olivier Corby, Paul Gearon, Steve Harris
Regrets
Olivier Corby, Paul Gearon, Chimezie Ogbuji
Chair
Lee Feigenbaum
Scribe
Birte Glimm
IRC Log
Original and Editable Wiki Version
Resolutions
  1. Approve minutes at http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/meeting/2011-08-02 link
Topics
13:55:41 <LeeF> Chair: LeeF
13:55:44 <LeeF> Scribe: bglimm

(Scribe set to Birte Glimm)

13:55:47 <LeeF> Scribenick: bglimm
13:56:32 <LeeF> Agenda: http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/wiki/Agenda-2011-08-09
13:56:37 <LeeF> LeeF has changed the topic to: Agenda: http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/wiki/Agenda-2011-08-09 (LeeF)

Lee Feigenbaum: LeeF has changed the topic to: Agenda: http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/wiki/Agenda-2011-08-09 (LeeF)

13:57:07 <Zakim> SW_(SPARQL)10:00AM has now started

Zakim IRC Bot: SW_(SPARQL)10:00AM has now started

13:57:15 <Zakim> +??P2

Zakim IRC Bot: +??P2

13:57:21 <bglimm> Zakim, ??P2 is me

Zakim, ??P2 is me

13:57:21 <Zakim> +bglimm; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +bglimm; got it

13:57:47 <Zakim> +??P3

Zakim IRC Bot: +??P3

13:57:54 <AndyS> zakim, ??P3 i sme

Andy Seaborne: zakim, ??P3 i sme

13:57:54 <Zakim> I don't understand '??P3 i sme', AndyS

Zakim IRC Bot: I don't understand '??P3 i sme', AndyS

13:57:58 <Zakim> + +1.617.553.aaaa

Zakim IRC Bot: + +1.617.553.aaaa

13:58:00 <AndyS> zakim, ??P3 is me

Andy Seaborne: zakim, ??P3 is me

13:58:00 <Zakim> +AndyS; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +AndyS; got it

13:58:04 <LeeF> zakim, aaaa is me

Lee Feigenbaum: zakim, aaaa is me

13:58:05 <Zakim> +LeeF; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +LeeF; got it

13:58:21 <AndyS> Hi there

Andy Seaborne: Hi there

13:58:25 <AndyS> A lot of echo

Andy Seaborne: A lot of echo

13:58:26 <Zakim> +??P4

Zakim IRC Bot: +??P4

13:58:31 <SteveH> Zakim, ??P4 is me

Steve Harris: Zakim, ??P4 is me

13:58:31 <Zakim> +SteveH; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +SteveH; got it

13:58:33 <bglimm> Zakim, mute me

Zakim, mute me

13:58:33 <Zakim> bglimm should now be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: bglimm should now be muted

13:58:38 <bglimm> better?

better?

13:59:20 <Zakim> +kasei

Zakim IRC Bot: +kasei

13:59:24 <kasei> success!

Gregory Williams: success!

14:00:06 <Zakim> +??P12

Zakim IRC Bot: +??P12

14:00:12 <cbuilara> zakim, ??P12 is me

Carlos Buil Aranda: zakim, ??P12 is me

14:00:12 <Zakim> +cbuilara; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +cbuilara; got it

14:00:29 <Zakim> + +1.603.897.aabb

Zakim IRC Bot: + +1.603.897.aabb

14:00:39 <MattPerry> zakim, aabb is me

Matthew Perry: zakim, aabb is me

14:00:39 <Zakim> +MattPerry; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +MattPerry; got it

14:01:52 <bglimm> yes

yes

14:01:56 <LeeF> topic: Admin

1. Admin

14:02:01 <LeeF> PROPOSED: Approve minutes at http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/meeting/2011-08-02

PROPOSED: Approve minutes at http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/meeting/2011-08-02

14:02:05 <Zakim> + +3539154aacc

Zakim IRC Bot: + +3539154aacc

14:02:49 <LeeF> Regrets: Olivier, Paul, Chimezie
14:02:55 <LeeF> RESOLVED: Approve minutes at http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/meeting/2011-08-02

RESOLVED: Approve minutes at http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/meeting/2011-08-02

14:03:28 <AndyS> zakim, who is on the phone?

Andy Seaborne: zakim, who is on the phone?

14:03:28 <Zakim> On the phone I see bglimm (muted), AndyS, LeeF, SteveH, kasei, cbuilara, MattPerry, +3539154aacc

Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see bglimm (muted), AndyS, LeeF, SteveH, kasei, cbuilara, MattPerry, +3539154aacc

14:03:46 <alexpassant> that should be me

Alexandre Passant: that should be me

14:03:53 <alexpassant> zakim, +3539154aacc is me

Alexandre Passant: zakim, +3539154aacc is me

14:03:53 <Zakim> +alexpassant; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +alexpassant; got it

14:04:03 <Zakim> + +49.897.aadd

Zakim IRC Bot: + +49.897.aadd

14:04:25 <axelpolleres> Zakim, aadd is probably me

Axel Polleres: Zakim, aadd is probably me

14:04:25 <Zakim> +axelpolleres?; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +axelpolleres?; got it

14:04:40 <bglimm> LeeF: Next meeting next week

Lee Feigenbaum: Next meeting next week

14:05:06 <bglimm> LeeF: AndyS is set to scribe

Lee Feigenbaum: AndyS is set to scribe

14:05:20 <LeeF> Next regular meeting: 2011-08-16 @ 15:00 UK / 10:00 EST (scribe: Andy)

Lee Feigenbaum: Next regular meeting: 2011-08-16 @ 15:00 UK / 10:00 EST (scribe: Andy)

14:05:48 <bglimm> LeeF: AndyS, anything from the RDF working group?

Lee Feigenbaum: AndyS, anything from the RDF working group?

14:05:56 <bglimm> Zakim, umute me

Zakim, umute me

14:05:56 <Zakim> I don't understand 'umute me', bglimm

Zakim IRC Bot: I don't understand 'umute me', bglimm

14:06:06 <bglimm> Zakim, mute me

Zakim, mute me

14:06:08 <Zakim> bglimm was already muted, bglimm

Zakim IRC Bot: bglimm was already muted, bglimm

14:06:13 <bglimm> Zakim, unmute me

Zakim, unmute me

14:06:13 <Zakim> bglimm should no longer be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: bglimm should no longer be muted

14:06:29 <bglimm> Zakim, mute me

Zakim, mute me

14:06:29 <Zakim> bglimm should now be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: bglimm should now be muted

14:06:48 <bglimm> I didn't get what Andy said

I didn't get what Andy said

14:06:59 <bglimm> I have shitty sound :-(

I have shitty sound :-(

14:07:07 <LeeF> Andy: Nothing new from RDF WG, but they will probably be reaching a decision on language tagged literals soon

Andy Seaborne: Nothing new from RDF WG, but they will probably be reaching a decision on language tagged literals soon [ Scribe Assist by Lee Feigenbaum ]

14:07:12 <LeeF> topic: Federated Query

2. Federated Query

14:08:16 <bglimm> LeeF: We have a federated query review. Carlos, will you discuss further changes by email?

Lee Feigenbaum: We have a federated query review. Carlos, will you discuss further changes by email?

14:08:31 <axelpolleres> q+

Axel Polleres: q+

14:09:23 <bglimm> greg: The only major issues is that we agreed to not formally specify the endpoint semantics (?), the section is informative, but is wrong

Gregory Williams: The only major issues is that we agreed to not formally specify the endpoint semantics (?), the section is informative, but is wrong

14:09:28 <LeeF> ack axelpolleres

Lee Feigenbaum: ack axelpolleres

14:09:42 <bglimm> LeeF: I suggest to make the text less formal and keep the section informative

Lee Feigenbaum: I suggest to make the text less formal and keep the section informative

14:10:02 <cbuilara> +q

Carlos Buil Aranda: +q

14:10:02 <bglimm> Axel: As long as the section is informative, I think it is ok. We can change it later

Axel Polleres: As long as the section is informative, I think it is ok. We can change it later

14:10:14 <bglimm> LeeF: I think we should still get the semantics right

Lee Feigenbaum: I think we should still get the semantics right

14:10:24 <LeeF> ack cbuilara

Lee Feigenbaum: ack cbuilara

14:10:48 <bglimm> Carlos: The section was to address the changes suggested by Andy

Carlos Buil Aranda: The section was to address the changes suggested by Andy

14:11:37 <bglimm> LeeF: I think we just have to keep working towards convergence

Lee Feigenbaum: I think we just have to keep working towards convergence

14:11:58 <bglimm> ... Carlos, can you have a look at the comments and further discuss by email?

... Carlos, can you have a look at the comments and further discuss by email?

14:12:02 <bglimm> Carlos: Ok

Carlos Buil Aranda: Ok

14:12:04 <axelpolleres> I can take an action to check Greg's review and implications as well...

Axel Polleres: I can take an action to check Greg's review and implications as well...

14:12:15 <axelpolleres> (would make it easier to remember for me ;-))

Axel Polleres: (would make it easier to remember for me ;-))

14:12:17 <LeeF> ACTION: Axel to look at Greg's review of federated query

ACTION: Axel to look at Greg's review of federated query

14:12:18 <trackbot> Created ACTION-514 - Look at Greg's review of federated query [on Axel Polleres - due 2011-08-16].

Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-514 - Look at Greg's review of federated query [on Axel Polleres - due 2011-08-16].

14:12:31 <AndyS> What I see in doc is not as Carlos described (from a quick skim) is doc in CVS up to date?

Andy Seaborne: What I see in doc is not as Carlos described (from a quick skim) is doc in CVS up to date?

14:13:08 <bglimm> Carlos: I commited a change

Carlos Buil Aranda: I commited a change

14:13:12 <LeeF> topic: Other documents

3. Other documents

14:13:15 <kasei> that "ranging over all services" is the part I'm not seeing and have a problem with.

Gregory Williams: that "ranging over all services" is the part I'm not seeing and have a problem with.

14:13:17 <bglimm> AndyS: I'll read it more carefully then

Andy Seaborne: I'll read it more carefully then

14:13:42 <bglimm> LeeF: Axel did work on the overview doc and AndyS reviewed it

Lee Feigenbaum: Axel did work on the overview doc and AndyS reviewed it

14:13:50 <bglimm> Axel: I partially adressed the comments

Axel Polleres: I partially adressed the comments

14:13:59 <bglimm> ... est we can to by email

... rest we can to by email

14:14:04 <bglimm> s/est/rest/
14:14:28 <bglimm> ... I will work on it further, but nothing seems critical for publishing

... I will work on it further, but nothing seems critical for publishing

14:14:50 <bglimm> LeeF: Let's see whether we can publish th overview together with fed. query and the protocol oc

Lee Feigenbaum: Let's see whether we can publish th overview together with fed. query and the protocol oc

14:15:14 <bglimm> Axel: We should probably publish as a FPWD to get some feedback

Axel Polleres: We should probably publish as a FPWD to get some feedback

14:15:36 <bglimm> LeeF: I think it is an important document, but we probably won't get too much feedback on it

Lee Feigenbaum: I think it is an important document, but we probably won't get too much feedback on it

14:15:39 <AndyS> q+ to ask about xmlspec / respec ization

Andy Seaborne: q+ to ask about xmlspec / respec ization

14:16:13 <bglimm> LeeF: Can anybody else review the overview doc?

Lee Feigenbaum: Can anybody else review the overview doc?

14:16:16 <bglimm> (silence)

(silence)

14:16:19 <axelpolleres> q+ to ask one more question in the context off the overview doc

Axel Polleres: q+ to ask one more question in the context off the overview doc

14:16:27 <bglimm> LeeF: Matt can you review it?

Lee Feigenbaum: Matt can you review it?

14:16:32 <LeeF> ACTION: Matthew to review the overview document

ACTION: Matthew to review the overview document

14:16:32 <trackbot> Created ACTION-515 - Review the overview document [on Matthew Perry - due 2011-08-16].

Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-515 - Review the overview document [on Matthew Perry - due 2011-08-16].

14:16:33 <bglimm> Matt: Yes, I can review it

Matthew Perry: Yes, I can review it

14:16:38 <LeeF> q?

Lee Feigenbaum: q?

14:16:40 <LeeF> ack AndyS

Lee Feigenbaum: ack AndyS

14:16:40 <Zakim> AndyS, you wanted to ask about xmlspec / respec ization

Zakim IRC Bot: AndyS, you wanted to ask about xmlspec / respec ization

14:18:14 <bglimm> Axel: I asked on the mailing list about the wiki to HTML script

Axel Polleres: I asked on the mailing list about the wiki to HTML script

14:18:19 <bglimm> Zakim, unmute me

Zakim, unmute me

14:18:19 <Zakim> bglimm should no longer be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: bglimm should no longer be muted

14:18:33 <LeeF> zakim, mute bglimm

Lee Feigenbaum: zakim, mute bglimm

14:18:33 <Zakim> bglimm should now be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: bglimm should now be muted

14:18:33 <AndyS> q+

Andy Seaborne: q+

14:18:41 <bglimm> Zakim, mute

Zakim, mute

14:18:41 <Zakim> I don't understand 'mute', bglimm

Zakim IRC Bot: I don't understand 'mute', bglimm

14:18:46 <bglimm> Zakim, mute me

Zakim, mute me

14:18:46 <Zakim> bglimm was already muted, bglimm

Zakim IRC Bot: bglimm was already muted, bglimm

14:18:56 <bglimm> Sandro said it is a lot of work to set the scrpt up

Sandro said it is a lot of work to set the scrpt up

14:19:08 <bglimm> It is only worth doing if we use it several times

It is only worth doing if we use it several times

14:19:25 <axelpolleres> ok, I can do it manually, just wanted to know whether there's an easy way.

Axel Polleres: ok, I can do it manually, just wanted to know whether there's an easy way.

14:20:05 <LeeF> q?

Lee Feigenbaum: q?

14:20:07 <LeeF> ack axelpolleres

Lee Feigenbaum: ack axelpolleres

14:20:07 <Zakim> axelpolleres, you wanted to ask one more question in the context off the overview doc

Zakim IRC Bot: axelpolleres, you wanted to ask one more question in the context off the overview doc

14:20:13 <AndyS> ack me

Andy Seaborne: ack me

14:20:14 <bglimm> LeeF: I think we can keep working on the wiki for a while and then manually convert to XML

Lee Feigenbaum: I think we can keep working on the wiki for a while and then manually convert to XML

14:20:31 <bglimm> Axel: Andy had a comment about using named graphs

Axel Polleres: Andy had a comment about using named graphs

14:20:56 <bglimm> .. I can avoid using named graphs, so we can get away without them

.. I can avoid using named graphs, so we can get away without them

14:21:12 <bglimm> ... The other thing was the list of all documents, which we now have in all dcs

... The other thing was the list of all documents, which we now have in all dcs

14:21:23 <bglimm> ... I used a different order than the other docs

... I used a different order than the other docs

14:21:38 <bglimm> ... I ordered to make a nice story in the overview

... I ordered to make a nice story in the overview

14:22:19 <bglimm> ... in some of the other documents, we don't have the list. I suggest to link from all other docs to the overview, where we have the list

... in some of the other documents, we don't have the list. I suggest to link from all other docs to the overview, where we have the list

14:22:40 <bglimm> ...so we would only have one list, which is in the overview doc

...so we would only have one list, which is in the overview doc

14:22:48 <bglimm> +1 to Axel's suggestion

+1 to Axel's suggestion

14:23:15 <bglimm> AndyS: I personally don't find it useful to be directed to the overview

Andy Seaborne: I personally don't find it useful to be directed to the overview

14:23:33 <bglimm> ... I find the order we ended up with appropriate

... I find the order we ended up with appropriate

14:24:15 <bglimm> Axel: I don't have a particular order preference for thenon-overview docs, but I do have one for the overview

Axel Polleres: I don't have a particular order preference for thenon-overview docs, but I do have one for the overview

14:24:51 <bglimm> ... would you be ok to keep the structure of the document, but adjust the list?

... would you be ok to keep the structure of the document, but adjust the list?

14:25:21 <bglimm> AndyS: I think the structure should be major areas first and then the minor areas

Andy Seaborne: I think the structure should be major areas first and then the minor areas

14:25:21 <SteveH> I have no preference

Steve Harris: I have no preference

14:25:30 <kasei> I tend to favor Andy's approach

Gregory Williams: I tend to favor Andy's approach

14:26:51 <bglimm> LeeF: We have slightly more votes for Andy's sugggestion. Axel, can you restructure?

Lee Feigenbaum: We have slightly more votes for Andy's sugggestion. Axel, can you restructure?

14:27:01 <bglimm> Axel: Yes and it is anyway a FPWD

Axel Polleres: Yes and it is anyway a FPWD

14:27:14 <axelpolleres> I can restructure, finding time is more the issue.

Axel Polleres: I can restructure, finding time is more the issue.

14:27:24 <bglimm> AndyS: I can't remember how long it takes overall from FPWD to LC

Andy Seaborne: I can't remember how long it takes overall from FPWD to LC

14:27:37 <bglimm> LeeF: FPWD has no fixed duration

Lee Feigenbaum: FPWD has no fixed duration

14:27:54 <bglimm> ... LC has a minimum time of three weeks I believe

... LC has a minimum time of three weeks I believe

14:27:57 <axelpolleres> Shall we tendentially decide for a short name? proposal: sparql11-overview

Axel Polleres: Shall we tendentially decide for a short name? proposal: sparql11-overview

14:28:21 <bglimm> LeeF: I am happy with the short name

Lee Feigenbaum: I am happy with the short name

14:28:29 <bglimm> AndyS: Looks good

Andy Seaborne: Looks good

14:28:41 <bglimm> LeeF: Let's decide when we decide to publish

Lee Feigenbaum: Let's decide when we decide to publish

14:29:21 <bglimm> ... Neither the chairs nor team contacts did make progress on the CVS document (scribed correctly?)

... Neither the chairs nor team contacts did make progress on the csv-tsv and json document (scribed correctly?)

14:29:48 <axelpolleres> s/CVS/csv-tsv and json/
14:30:07 <bglimm> ... I addressed most of Andy's comments for the protocol doc

... I addressed most of Andy's comments for the protocol doc

14:30:39 <axelpolleres> it should follow the same rules as FROM FROM NAMED, shouldn't it? (didn't check the mails in detail)

Axel Polleres: it should follow the same rules as FROM FROM NAMED, shouldn't it? (didn't check the mails in detail)

14:30:41 <bglimm> ... we still have some discussions

... we still have some discussions

14:31:17 <bglimm> ... Andy can you outline the usecase that you had on the mailing list?

... Andy can you outline the usecase that you had on the mailing list?

14:31:41 <bglimm> Didn't get what Andy said :-(

Didn't get what Andy said :-(

14:33:33 <AndyS> AndyS: One possible UC is that the dataset for matching is a new, temporary dataset (maybe retrieved from the web)

Andy Seaborne: One possible UC is that the dataset for matching is a new, temporary dataset (maybe retrieved from the web) [ Scribe Assist by Andy Seaborne ]

14:33:49 <axelpolleres> Lee's way sounds good, USING/USING NAMED is described in Table 2 of the update doc

Axel Polleres: Lee's way sounds good, USING/USING NAMED is described in Table 2 of the update doc

14:34:26 <bglimm> LeeF: Clearly the spec still needs to be improved

Lee Feigenbaum: Clearly the spec still needs to be improved

14:34:40 <bglimm> ... but the question whether the current model is acceptable

... but the question whether the current model is acceptable

14:35:01 <axelpolleres> see http://www.w3.org/TR/sparql11-update/#mappingRequestsToOperations

Axel Polleres: see http://www.w3.org/TR/sparql11-update/#mappingRequestsToOperations

14:35:06 <bglimm> AndyS: Regardless what we decide, the change will change the update doc

Andy Seaborne: Regardless what we decide, the change will change the update doc

14:36:06 <bglimm> Axel: Sounds to me that removing the parameters is in line with the update document

Axel Polleres: Sounds to me that removing the parameters is in line with the update document

14:36:13 <bglimm> LeeF: If that

Lee Feigenbaum: If that

14:36:25 <axelpolleres> Are you sure that  we need to change Update, I don't think so.

Axel Polleres: Are you sure that we need to change Update, I don't think so.

14:36:29 <bglimm> LeeF: If you specified it like this, then we might not need a change

Lee Feigenbaum: If you specified it like this, then we might not need a change

14:37:04 <bglimm> AndyS: We have time to do a last cal for update in parallel with the protocol doc

Andy Seaborne: We have time to do a last cal for update in parallel with the protocol doc

14:37:23 <bglimm> LeeF: Are we happy with the semantics of the protocol or should we consider alternatives?

Lee Feigenbaum: Are we happy with the semantics of the protocol or should we consider alternatives?

14:37:38 <bglimm> ... AndyS, do you need more time to think about it?

... AndyS, do you need more time to think about it?

14:38:00 <axelpolleres> I understand that protocol says that updateReq with parameters simply means that the requested endpoint needs to answer Tr(updateReq,parameters) where Tr just replaces the USING USINGCLAUSES

Axel Polleres: I understand that protocol says that updateReq with parameters simply means that the requested endpoint needs to answer Tr(updateReq,parameters) where Tr just replaces the USING USINGCLAUSES

14:38:05 <bglimm> AndyS: Yes and we are a small group of people and I want to make sure we address the right problem

Andy Seaborne: Yes and we are a small group of people and I want to make sure we address the right problem

14:38:19 <bglimm> ... we are not getting enough input

... we are not getting enough input

14:38:33 <axelpolleres> this can be defined similarly as the tables in the update document, but it is ok if it defined in the protocol dfocument.

Axel Polleres: this can be defined similarly as the tables in the update document, but it is ok if it defined in the protocol dfocument.

14:39:11 <bglimm> AndyS: Steve, you are another major update implementor. Did you get your head around that?

Andy Seaborne: Steve, you are another major update implementor. Did you get your head around that?

14:39:26 <bglimm> Steve: It is not a feature that we currently use, so I can't give input

Steve Harris: It is not a feature that we currently use, so I can't give input

14:39:43 <bglimm> LeeF: Anybody else implementing it?

Lee Feigenbaum: Anybody else implementing it?

14:40:03 <bglimm> Axel: How is it for query request now when there are parameters?

Axel Polleres: How is it for query request now when there are parameters?

14:40:50 <SteveH> Lee's interpretation is the only one that makes sense to me

Steve Harris: Lee's interpretation is the only one that makes sense to me

14:40:54 <bglimm> LeeF: The design for update is different because there are different update requests

Lee Feigenbaum: The design for update is different because there are different update requests

14:41:18 <axelpolleres> LeeF: my proposal was that parameters replace any using/using named in any operation part of a request.

Lee Feigenbaum: my proposal was that parameters replace any using/using named in any operation part of a request. [ Scribe Assist by Axel Polleres ]

14:41:27 <bglimm> ... We don't want to do something that we regret later. Maybe I write up the current design and send it to the list to get feedback

... We don't want to do something that we regret later. Maybe I write up the current design and send it to the list to get feedback

14:41:46 <bglimm> AndyS: That might be a good idea. Any other points, where you need feedback?

Andy Seaborne: That might be a good idea. Any other points, where you need feedback?

14:42:00 <bglimm> LeeF: I think I addressed most points, but I will get back to it

Lee Feigenbaum: I think I addressed most points, but I will get back to it

14:42:12 <bglimm> AndyS: Add more example

Andy Seaborne: Add more example

14:43:16 <bglimm> LeeF: There is still an issue with characters in query strings

Lee Feigenbaum: There is still an issue with characters in query strings

14:44:32 <bglimm> ... I'll rewrite the text, to make it clearer

... I'll rewrite the text, to make it clearer

14:44:50 <LeeF> ACTION: Lee to email list with proposed design for dataset parameters in protocol for update requests

ACTION: Lee to email list with proposed design for dataset parameters in protocol for update requests

14:44:50 <trackbot> Created ACTION-516 - Email list with proposed design for dataset parameters in protocol for update requests [on Lee Feigenbaum - due 2011-08-16].

Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-516 - Email list with proposed design for dataset parameters in protocol for update requests [on Lee Feigenbaum - due 2011-08-16].

14:45:44 <bglimm> LeeF: Test case covering

Lee Feigenbaum: Test case covering

14:45:55 <bglimm> ... Axel, can you give an overview of the status

... Axel, can you give an overview of the status

14:46:13 <bglimm> Axel: We had a couple of actions to evaluate coverage

Axel Polleres: We had a couple of actions to evaluate coverage

14:46:28 <bglimm> ... 492 and following

... 492 and following

14:46:36 <bglimm> ... for update, the action is done

... for update, the action is done

14:46:47 <axelpolleres> close ACTION-492

Axel Polleres: close ACTION-492

14:46:47 <trackbot> ACTION-492 Check coverage of test suite (on Update) closed

Trackbot IRC Bot: ACTION-492 Check coverage of test suite (on Update) closed

14:47:17 <bglimm> 493 is create a summary on the wiki

493 is create a summary on the wiki

14:47:23 <axelpolleres> http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/wiki/TestSuiteCoverage

Axel Polleres: http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/wiki/TestSuiteCoverage

14:48:00 <bglimm> ... For each area we wanted to have statements from implementors as to who implements the features

... For each area we wanted to have statements from implementors as to who implements the features

14:48:26 <bglimm> ... please have a look and add yourself under implementation or remove yourself as appropriate

... please have a look and add yourself under implementation or remove yourself as appropriate

14:48:50 <bglimm> ... action 494 is query on greg

... ACTION-494 is query on greg

14:49:02 <bglimm> greg: I still need to finish it

Gregory Williams: I still need to finish it

14:49:11 <AndyS> JSON results test suite broken.

Andy Seaborne: JSON results test suite broken.

14:49:13 <bglimm> Axel: Yes, it is a lot of work

Axel Polleres: Yes, it is a lot of work

14:49:51 <bglimm> Axel: 495 is protocol test cases coverage, which should also cover how we test protocol at all

Axel Polleres: 495 is protocol test cases coverage, which should also cover how we test protocol at all

14:49:57 <bglimm> LeeF: No progress yet

Lee Feigenbaum: No progress yet

14:50:04 <bglimm> Axel: Action 496 is on Chime

Axel Polleres: ACTION-496 is on Chime

14:50:47 <bglimm> ... for the graph store protocol

... for the graph store protocol

14:50:59 <bglimm> ... it might need an extension for the manifest structure

... it might need an extension for the manifest structure

14:51:26 <axelpolleres> close ACTION-497

Axel Polleres: close ACTION-497

14:51:27 <trackbot> ACTION-497 Check entailment regimes test case coverage closed

Trackbot IRC Bot: ACTION-497 Check entailment regimes test case coverage closed

14:51:31 <bglimm> Axel: Action 497 is on entailment reg.

Axel Polleres: ACTION-497 is on entailment reg.

14:51:36 <bglimm> .. that is completed

.. that is completed

14:51:50 <bglimm> ... That is the last action on test case coverage

... That is the last action on test case coverage

14:52:12 <AndyS> Close ACTION-507

Andy Seaborne: Close ACTION-507

14:52:12 <trackbot> ACTION-507 Draft text for CSV/TSV status para closed

Trackbot IRC Bot: ACTION-507 Draft text for CSV/TSV status para closed

14:52:28 <AndyS> Close ACTION-500

Andy Seaborne: Close ACTION-500

14:52:29 <trackbot> ACTION-500 Review updates in Fed query doc (particularly section 2.4 and 4) for LC readiness closed

Trackbot IRC Bot: ACTION-500 Review updates in Fed query doc (particularly section 2.4 and 4) for LC readiness closed

14:52:41 <bglimm> ... for update, we have not yet everything covered: http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/wiki/TestSuiteCoverage#Update

... for update, we have not yet everything covered: http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/wiki/TestSuiteCoverage#Update

14:52:50 <bglimm> ... Do we need to test silent?

... Do we need to test silent?

14:53:16 <bglimm> ... In syntax tests that is covered, but sine we cannot test error, it is hard for non-syntax test

... In syntax tests that is covered, but sine we cannot test error, it is hard for non-syntax test

14:53:17 <AndyS> Is there not a EvalFail test type?

Andy Seaborne: Is there not a EvalFail test type?

14:53:24 <bglimm> ... I propose to not test that

... I propose to not test that

14:53:30 <bglimm> ... any objections?

... any objections?

14:53:39 <bglimm> ... silence=agreement?

... silence=agreement?

14:53:56 <kasei> q+

Gregory Williams: q+

14:54:35 <bglimm> greg: We could create a negative evaluation test

Gregory Williams: We could create a negative evaluation test

14:54:45 <SteveH> a test would be DROP SILENT GRAPH <http://nosuchgrah>

Steve Harris: a test would be DROP SILENT GRAPH <http://nosuchgrah>

14:55:16 <SteveH> I think minimal testing for SILENT is OK

Steve Harris: I think minimal testing for SILENT is OK

14:55:22 <SteveH> but we can test it to an extent

Steve Harris: but we can test it to an extent

14:55:24 <bglimm> greg: we could probably add something to make such tests possible

Gregory Williams: we could probably add something to make such tests possible

14:55:44 <bglimm> Axel: So the proposal is to add negative evaluation tests

Axel Polleres: So the proposal is to add negative evaluation tests

14:56:28 <bglimm> greg: We might need a test for success, not a test for the state of the graph store

Gregory Williams: We might need a test for success, not a test for the state of the graph store

14:56:48 <bglimm> AndyS: A test without result, just saying that you somehow got through

Andy Seaborne: A test without result, just saying that you somehow got through

14:56:57 <bglimm> Axel: I will look into that

Axel Polleres: I will look into that

14:57:30 <bglimm> LeeF: Shall we record an action?

Lee Feigenbaum: Shall we record an action?

14:57:35 <axelpolleres> ACTION: Axel to look into negative evaluation tests and "silent success test" possibility for update tests.

ACTION: Axel to look into negative evaluation tests and "silent success test" possibility for update tests.

14:57:36 <trackbot> Created ACTION-517 - Look into negative evaluation tests and "silent success test" possibility for update tests. [on Axel Polleres - due 2011-08-16].

Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-517 - Look into negative evaluation tests and "silent success test" possibility for update tests. [on Axel Polleres - due 2011-08-16].

14:58:34 <bglimm> Axel: Andy suggested to move the negative syntax tests to the syntax test folder

Axel Polleres: Andy suggested to move the negative syntax tests to the syntax test folder

14:59:32 <bglimm> Axel: It is probably o t o move them there. Some tests are negative syntax tests because we disallowed bnodes, but they have not been moved after the decision

Axel Polleres: It is probably o t o move them there. Some tests are negative syntax tests because we disallowed bnodes, but they have not been moved after the decision

14:59:51 <LeeF> Suggest just leaving it as is for now then

Lee Feigenbaum: Suggest just leaving it as is for now then

14:59:59 <bglimm> Axel: Any volunteers to move the tests?

Axel Polleres: Any volunteers to move the tests?

15:00:52 <bglimm> Axel: We anyway need to action somebody to create the missing update tests. Maybe that person can then also move the tests.

Axel Polleres: We anyway need to action somebody to create the missing update tests. Maybe that person can then also move the tests.

15:00:57 <axelpolleres> Zakim, pick a victim

Axel Polleres: Zakim, pick a victim

15:00:57 <Zakim> Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose SteveH

Zakim IRC Bot: Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose SteveH

15:01:26 <bglimm> Steve: No way I can find the time

Steve Harris: No way I can find the time

15:01:35 <bglimm> LeeF: Let's leave it as it is for now

Lee Feigenbaum: Let's leave it as it is for now

15:01:42 <bglimm> Axel: Next is entailment

Axel Polleres: Next is entailment

15:02:13 <bglimm> ... we should also have negative tests for container membership properties

... we should also have negative tests for container membership properties

15:02:25 <Zakim> -alexpassant

Zakim IRC Bot: -alexpassant

15:02:27 <bglimm> no tests for axiomatic triples yet

no tests for axiomatic triples yet

15:02:51 <bglimm> ... we could just add an ask query for the triples

... we could just add an ask query for the triples

15:03:08 <bglimm> http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/wiki/TestSuiteCoverage#Entailment

http://www.w3.org/2009/sparql/wiki/TestSuiteCoverage#Entailment

15:04:30 <bglimm> Axel: It seems we are out of time

Axel Polleres: It seems we are out of time

15:04:33 <bglimm> yes

yes

15:04:45 <bglimm> Axel: Birte, can you look into completing the test cases

Axel Polleres: Birte, can you look into completing the test cases

15:04:48 <bglimm> Birte: Yes

Birte Glimm: Yes

15:04:52 <bglimm> adjourned

adjourned



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This revision (#1) generated 2011-08-09 15:09:49 UTC by 'bglimm', comments: None