14:52:56 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #swd
14:52:56 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2009/08/25-swd-irc
14:52:59 <TomB> rrsagent, bookmark
14:52:59 <RRSAgent> See http://www.w3.org/2009/08/25-swd-irc#T14-52-59
14:53:07 <TomB> zakim, this will be swd
14:53:08 <Zakim> ok, TomB; I see SW_SWD()11:00AM scheduled to start in 7 minutes
14:53:12 <TomB> Meeting: SWD WG
14:53:14 <TomB> Chair: Tom
14:53:28 <TomB> Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2009Aug/0051.html
14:54:09 <berrueta> berrueta has joined #swd
14:54:11 <TomB> Previous: http://www.w3.org/2009/08/11-swd-minutes.html
14:54:35 <TomB> rrsagent, please make record public
14:55:59 <Zakim> SW_SWD()11:00AM has now started
14:56:06 <Zakim> +??P2
14:56:10 <TomB> zakim, ??p2 is me
14:56:10 <Zakim> +TomB; got it
14:56:51 <seanb> seanb has joined #swd
14:57:36 <Ralph> Ralph has joined #swd
14:59:05 <Zakim> +??P8
14:59:17 <berrueta> Zakim, ??P8 is me
14:59:17 <Zakim> +berrueta; got it
14:59:30 <Zakim> + +1.607.785.aaaa
14:59:49 <Zakim> +??P9
14:59:55 <seanb> zakim, ??P9 is me
14:59:55 <Zakim> +seanb; got it
14:59:56 <TomB> zakim, aaaa is jphipps
14:59:57 <Zakim> +jphipps; got it
15:01:36 <edsu> edsu has joined #swd
15:02:08 <Zakim> + +30889aabb
15:02:46 <Zakim> +Ralph
15:03:37 <aliman> aliman has joined #swd
15:03:52 <Zakim> Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose TomB
15:03:56 <Zakim> Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose +30889aabb
15:04:43 <Zakim> + +8686528aacc
15:04:45 <seanb> scribenick: seanb
15:04:56 <Zakim> +Ben_Adida
15:05:04 <Ralph> zakim, aacc is Alistair
15:05:04 <Zakim> +Alistair; got it
15:05:20 <benadida> benadida has joined #swd
15:05:44 <Ralph> zakim, aabb is Guus
15:05:44 <Zakim> +Guus; got it
15:05:46 <Antoine> Antoine has joined #swd
15:05:53 <Zakim> +[LC]
15:05:59 <edsu> Zakim, LC is edsu
15:05:59 <Zakim> +edsu; got it
15:06:01 <Guus> Guus has joined #swd
15:06:20 <seanb> Topic: ADMIN
15:06:26 <Zakim> + +49.440.aadd
15:06:34 <seanb> PROPOSE to accept the minutes of the last teleconhttp://www.w3.org/2009/08/11-swd-minutes.html
15:06:37 <Ralph> zakim, aadd is Antoine
15:06:37 <Zakim> +Antoine; got it
15:06:44 <seanb> PROPOSE to accept the minutes of the last telecon
15:06:44 <seanb> http://www.w3.org/2009/08/11-swd-minutes.html
15:06:51 <Ralph> Antoine: I'm on holiday :)
15:06:54 <seanb> RESOLVED: accept the minutes
15:07:17 <seanb> tom: 110th teleconference (!)
15:07:31 <seanb> ...should be last, but some discussion about continuing WG to
15:07:40 <seanb> ...finish up some RDFa things. 
15:07:59 <seanb> Topic: RDFa
15:08:20 <seanb> Ben: Been mired in discussions re HTML5. 
15:08:32 <Guus> i suggest to drop this action on UC for RDFa doc
15:08:38 <seanb> ...main reason to continute RDFa. As we figure out relationship with HTML WG,
15:08:49 <seanb> ...there are issues to address. Some extra time would be useful
15:09:03 <seanb> ...if we continue WG, then keep this action?
15:09:18 <seanb> Guus: drop it.
15:09:23 <seanb> ACTION: Ben review RDFa Use Cases and propose transition to Group Note [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/09/30-swd-minutes.html#action02]
15:09:25 <seanb> --dropped
15:09:26 <AntoineI> AntoineI has joined #swd
15:10:05 <seanb> Tom: What do we need to do to clean this up>
15:10:18 <Ralph> -> http://www.w3.org/TR/#WD-stop Working Drafts no longer in development
15:10:22 <seanb> Ralph: don't need to explicilty do anything. Category on TR page
15:10:50 <seanb> ...eventually web master does garbage collection and will move things in here. 
15:11:02 <seanb> ...No explicit action needed. Once charter expires, the draft will wind up there.
15:11:16 <seanb> Tom: Any comments on other RDFa issues? Or role of SWD?
15:11:51 <seanb> Ben: Main issue is that there is a conflict in HTML5 (only HTML WG that can produce Recs).
15:12:10 <seanb> ...despite best efforts, RDFa isn't in working draft (even in draft form). What are the issues?
15:12:32 <seanb> ...some claims for technical incompatabilities, which they (e.g. Ben et al) don't necessarily believe
15:12:50 <Zakim> +??P24
15:12:56 <seanb> ...initial idea to have a new WG for RDFa. This might be premature. Should work together for 
15:13:04 <seanb> ...a bit longer to see where we can get. 
15:13:24 <Ralph> zakim, ??p24 is DanBri
15:13:24 <Zakim> +DanBri; got it
15:13:43 <danbri> danbri has joined #swd
15:14:29 <ajm65> ajm65 has joined #swd
15:14:35 <seanb> Ralph: Ben suggested that this group ask to continue past Sept. Should we consider that now>
15:14:52 <seanb> Ben: happy to chair remaining work as SKOS is done
15:15:21 <seanb> Tom: proposal is that this group ask that the group continue past december in order to continue work on RDFa. 
15:15:32 <edsu> danbri: glad you could make it :)
15:15:42 <seanb> ...WG would continue not necessarily with the current chairs or set of people. 
15:15:50 <seanb> ...any comments about that? For or against?
15:15:59 <TomB> ack Ralph
15:15:59 <Zakim> Ralph, you wanted to ask about a continued role for SKOS ?
15:16:22 <seanb> Ralph: Could we combine with ongoing SKOS discussions
15:16:40 <seanb> ...thesaurus/SKOS community questions
15:17:08 <seanb> Tom: extending charter opens possibilities of SKOS discussions past this telecon. 
15:17:18 <seanb> ...Expect technical issues for SKOS finished today.
15:17:46 <seanb> Ralph: If we ask for a charter extension, we need to say what we're going to do. 
15:19:30 <edsu> Ralph: does this not count "Finally, the SWDWG is chartered to complete the collaboration with the W3C HTML Activity to specify a W3C Recommendation on incorporating RDF semantics directly into HTML documents." in http://www.w3.org/2006/07/swdwg-charter ?
15:19:31 <seanb> PROPOSED that the WG charter be extended through to December 2009 in order to perform outreach with the SKOS, RDFa and HTML communities. 
15:19:38 <danbri> +1 on simple short extension
15:20:52 <seanb> Ralph: in my experience as team contact, this shouldn;t be controversial.
15:21:08 <seanb> PROPOSED that the WG charter be extended through to end December 2009 in order to perform outreach with the SKOS, RDFa and HTML communities.
15:21:26 <Ralph> +1
15:21:27 <seanb> Tom: propose that we resolve this text
15:21:38 <seanb> RESOLVED that the WG charter be extended through to December 2009 in order to perform outreach with the SKOS, RDFa and HTML communities.
15:22:11 <seanb> Tom: Take the administrative aspects offline.
15:22:23 <seanb> Topic: Best Practice Recipes for Publishing RDF Vocabularies
15:22:37 <seanb> ACTION: Ralph to publish http://berrueta.net/recipes-20090407/ as a WG Note [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/06/02-swd-minutes.html#action07]
15:22:40 <seanb> --continues
15:23:18 <seanb> Tom: Thanks to Diego and Jon for the excellent work. And Ralph for publishing
15:23:30 <seanb> Topic: Adding Metadata to W3C Technical Reports, Editor's Draft 02 October 2008
15:23:35 <seanb> Tom: Nothing to report
15:23:40 <seanb> Topic: SKOS
15:23:45 <seanb> Tom: SKOS now Rec. 
15:23:45 <Ralph> 3 cheers for SKOS!
15:24:24 <seanb> Tom: Quite an impressive piece of work. Honoured to have participated over the 110 telecons!
15:24:39 <seanb> ...few details.
15:25:01 <seanb> ACTION: Antoine to send an answer to Elliott's mail [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/08/11-swd-minutes.html#action03]
15:25:01 <seanb> -- done ->see http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2009Aug/0015.html
15:25:09 <seanb> --done
15:25:16 <seanb> ACTION: Antoine to respond to Daniel Barclay's mail by the mail in http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2009Jul/0022.html [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/08/11-swd-minutes.html#action04]
15:25:27 <seanb> --done 
15:25:33 <seanb> see -> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2009Aug/0029.html
15:25:40 <seanb> ACTION: Ed and Antoine to provide before 17 August a pointer to the latest version [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/08/11-swd-minutes.html#action02]
15:25:42 <seanb> --done
15:25:51 <seanb> see -> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2009Aug/0030.html
15:25:58 <seanb> ACTION: Ralph to publish the UC document as a group note at the time of recommendation [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/08/11-swd-minutes.html#action05]
15:26:02 <seanb> --done
15:26:09 <seanb> ACTION: Sean to update the implementation report [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/08/11-swd-minutes.html#action06]
15:26:11 <seanb> --done
15:26:16 <seanb> ACTION: Alistair to respond to Felix and implement the changes resulting from our resolution to ISSUE-224 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/08/11-swd-minutes.html#action01]
15:26:18 <seanb> --done 
15:26:28 <seanb> see -> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2009Aug/0022.html
15:26:40 <seanb> Tom: Namespace dereferencing problem
15:26:51 <seanb> ->  http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2009Aug/0050.html
15:27:14 <seanb> ...Namespace URI resolves to CR version of splash page
15:27:29 <seanb> sean: this is what there is, so it needs tidying
15:27:56 <seanb> sean: how best should I do this?
15:28:14 <Ralph> http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/SKOS/reference/20090315/skos.html
15:28:49 <seanb> ralph: edit the document in place and we'll move it into TR.
15:29:11 <seanb> ACTION: sean to fix doc at -> http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/SKOS/reference/20090315/skos.html
15:29:14 <Ralph> [may require me to buy the Webmaster a beverage]
15:29:37 <seanb> ACTION: Ralph to move into TR space -> http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/SKOS/reference/20090315/skos.html
15:29:48 <Ralph> http://www.w3.org/TR/skos-reference/
15:31:35 <seanb> Tom: Latest version URI of SKOS reference doesn't have a closing slash. 
15:32:16 <seanb> Ralph: preference is not to have trailing slash
15:33:11 <seanb> Tom: Any other issues?
15:33:26 <seanb> ...Question that Dan raised about acknowledgements to credit projects
15:33:49 <seanb> ...Ralph suggested revising the acknowledgements with an errata note. 
15:34:02 <seanb> ...Or could do it in context of SKOS community page. 
15:34:47 <seanb> ...no one shouting for fixing
15:35:01 <danbri> I don't think editing the formal acks is needed... but we can ack funding sources and projects more visibly, to encourage EU et al to do more such funding
15:35:09 <seanb> ...Community after the SWD. 
15:35:18 <seanb> ...Home page, wiki, mailing list. 
15:35:19 <danbri> (looming POWDER REC might be another opportunity , that was also EU-incubated)
15:35:39 <seanb> ...Team contact after WG ends charter is Ivan, but he's responsible for so much, it's
15:35:50 <seanb> ...unrealistic to expect much from him other than basic maintenance
15:36:16 <seanb> ...would like to propose that we think of having a designated SKOS community contact
15:36:38 <seanb> ... (or contacts) with names up there and write access to the pages/wiki etc.
15:36:48 <seanb> ...maintain mailing list and report to Ivan
15:37:03 <seanb> ...informal feedback that this would be a reasonable thing to do 
15:37:38 <seanb> ...any other proposals or approaches?
15:38:04 <seanb> Ralph: Antoine's been updating the SKOS homepage. Thanks!
15:38:13 <seanb> Antoine: Not up to date with latest rec :-)
15:38:29 <seanb> ...would be happy to keep on with keeping the site up to date.
15:38:31 <danbri> q+ to mention incubator option (eg. for extensions for subject classification languages like UDC) - is "going back to an incubator" a regress?
15:38:39 <seanb> Ralph: Alistair?
15:38:52 <seanb> Alistair: unlikely to have any time
15:38:58 <edsu> +q
15:39:37 <seanb> Tom: Would be good if whoever it is (e.g. Antoine) is acknowledged on the web page as a 
15:40:18 <seanb> ...contact person. Ideally that contact would also take requests from community and discuss with Ivan. 
15:40:42 <seanb> ...slightly bigger scope than just maintaining a web page. Antoine?
15:41:15 <seanb> Antoine: Ok. Think we can go far with existing infrastructure. Already a good starting point
15:41:26 <danbri> q?
15:42:00 <seanb> Tom: how much activity on the ESW wiki?
15:42:01 <Ralph> -> http://esw.w3.org/topic/SkosDev SkosDev on ESW Wiki
15:42:16 <seanb> Antoine: Not much, but many of the issues and developments were taken care of. 
15:42:22 <seanb> ...No need to do much with the wiki
15:42:22 <Ralph> "SkosDev (last edited 2006-09-21 12:37:34 by JakobVoss)"
15:42:40 <seanb> Tom: Is wiki linked to SKOS home page?
15:42:50 <seanb> ...if we have an existing wiki and it's functioning, then ok, 
15:43:29 <aliman> q+
15:44:15 <danbri> TomB? I'm afraid I have to leave (unexpectedly) v soon too
15:45:13 <seanb> Tom: Proposal on the table for SKOS community is to have Antoine function as a community contact listed on the SKOS homepage. Community contact will maintain wiki (SkosDev on esw) and mailing list (esw) and function as a point of contact for those wishing to do any further. 
15:45:25 <Zakim> danbri, you wanted to mention incubator option (eg. for extensions for subject classification languages like UDC) - is "going back to an incubator" a regress?
15:45:32 <TomB> ack danbri
15:45:53 <seanb> danbri: Wanted to draw attention to W3C Incubator. May seem retrograde to go back to incubator
15:46:09 <Ralph> +1 to XG for SKOS Extensions
15:46:09 <seanb> ...but there are things bubbling under. Incubators come with infrastructure, wiki etc.
15:46:15 <TomB> ack edsu
15:46:41 <seanb> ed: Curious about proposal for dublin core community to assume some kind of role.
15:46:55 <danbri> (people's bosses also understand the idea of a named w3c group, and they don't much notice difference IG XG WG .... so having incubators might help people get permission to work on skos extensions)
15:46:59 <danbri> gotta run, sorry guys
15:47:10 <seanb> Tom: proposal with DCMI hat on. 
15:47:10 <danbri> great work and congrats again! i will read logs and sync with Tom/Guus
15:47:18 <aliman> cheers danbri
15:47:31 <Zakim> -DanBri
15:48:21 <seanb> Tom: want to encourage community activities about SKOS, but need minimal mechanism to ensure communication and discussion
15:48:32 <TomB> ack Ralph
15:49:09 <seanb> Ralph: thanks to Antoine for volunteering. Suggest reowrding that the WG nominate Antoine.
15:49:27 <seanb> ...ultimately Ivan's decision, but would be good to nominate
15:49:36 <TomB> ack aliman
15:50:16 <seanb> Alistair: Thanks Antoine. Links into pages on wiki. SKOS data zone and SKOS tool shed.
15:50:22 <seanb> ...places to register data and tools. 
15:50:30 <Ralph> Ralph: alternative wording "The SWD WG nominates Antoine to be the maintainer of the SKOS Home page http://www.w3.org/2004/02/skos/ and the public-esw-thes mailing list"
15:50:38 <seanb> ...being able to find data and tools to process it are crucial 
15:50:54 <seanb> ...haven't been able to keep these up to date. If someone had some time to keep thse
15:50:59 <seanb> up to date would be great
15:51:32 <seanb> ...some forum for support for definition of extensions. Getting together to develop an share extensions. XG for that
15:51:37 <seanb> ...sounds a reasonable idea.
15:51:43 <TomB> q?
15:53:58 <seanb> PROPOSED The WG would like to nominate Antoine as a "SKOS Community Contact" to maintain the SKOS homepage, moderate the public-esw-thes mailing list, oversee the ESW wiki and discuss further issues within the community with Ivan (as head of SW Activity). 
15:54:48 <Ralph> [the SKOS parts of the ESW wiki, specifically]
15:54:56 <seanb> Antoine: homepage yes, mailing list yes, wiki may take a little more time
15:55:00 <seanb> ...discuss with Ivan is fine.
15:55:09 <Ralph> +1 to Antoine for SKOS King :)
15:55:32 <seanb> Tom: overseeing doesn't mean updating pages. Means managing access/spam etc.
15:55:48 <seanb> ..."keeping an eye on it" rather than updating it.
15:57:34 <edsu> +1 for Antoine :)
15:57:47 <seanb> Tom: this doesn't mean there's only *one* community contact....
15:58:40 <AntoineI> +1
15:58:59 <seanb> RESOLVED The WG would like to nominate Antoine as a "SKOS Community Contact" to maintain the SKOS homepage, moderate the public-esw-thes mailing list, oversee the ESW wiki and discuss further issues within the community with Ivan (as head of SW Activity).
15:59:04 <Ralph> 3 cheers for Antoine
15:59:07 <seanb> Tom: Thanks Antoine!
15:59:23 <aliman> +1 :)
15:59:36 <seanb> Tom: Reached the end of the call and reached next steps for continuity with SKOS development.
15:59:41 <Guus> q+
15:59:53 <seanb> ...Opportunity if charter is extended to follow up.
16:00:08 <seanb> ...although not everyone will necessarily want to participate
16:00:51 <seanb> Guus: Seven and a half years ago started as WG chair for OWL
16:01:01 <seanb> ...this has been a small and efficient group. 
16:01:07 <seanb> ...It has been a real pleaure.
16:01:19 <seanb> ...hope to see you all in the future. Thanks!
16:01:22 <Ralph> 3 cheers for Guus and Tom!
16:01:28 <AntoineI> ++
16:01:35 <seanb> Tom: It's been gr8. 
16:01:37 <jphipps> +1 :)
16:02:09 <Ralph> [all out for beers :) ]
16:02:12 <Zakim> -Ben_Adida
16:02:16 <seanb> meeting adjourned!
16:02:21 <Zakim> -edsu
16:02:28 <seanb> zakim, list attendees
16:02:28 <Zakim> As of this point the attendees have been TomB, berrueta, +1.607.785.aaaa, seanb, jphipps, +30889aabb, Ralph, +8686528aacc, Ben_Adida, Alistair, Guus, edsu, +49.440.aadd, Antoine,
16:02:31 <Zakim> ... DanBri
16:02:37 <edsu> edsu has left #swd
16:02:40 <seanb> rrsagent, please draft minutes
16:02:40 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/08/25-swd-minutes.html seanb
16:02:46 <Zakim> -Alistair
16:03:01 <Zakim> -berrueta
16:03:24 <aliman> thank you all, hope to see you soon
16:03:39 <Zakim> -seanb
16:05:25 <TomB> Ralph, I didn't think fast enough on the call to thank you again for the fantastic support over the years - I can't thank you enough...!
16:05:41 <Ralph> it's my job :)
16:05:49 <Ralph> or, at least, my old job ;/
16:06:04 <TomB> at any rate, one of your several jobs :-)
16:06:14 <Ralph> but, more seriously, it's always a pleasure to work with this community
16:09:48 <Zakim> -jphipps
16:10:14 <Zakim> -Antoine
16:11:50 <Guus> zakim, who is here?
16:11:50 <Zakim> On the phone I see TomB, Guus, Ralph
16:11:51 <Zakim> On IRC I see danbri, Guus, benadida, Ralph, seanb, berrueta, RRSAgent, Zakim, TomB, jphipps
16:22:57 <Zakim> -Ralph
16:25:10 <Zakim> -Guus
16:25:15 <seanb> Ralph -- are you still there?
16:25:49 <seanb> (on IRC rather than phone)
16:30:11 <Zakim> disconnecting the lone participant, TomB, in SW_SWD()11:00AM
16:30:13 <Zakim> SW_SWD()11:00AM has ended
16:30:15 <Zakim> Attendees were TomB, berrueta, +1.607.785.aaaa, seanb, jphipps, +30889aabb, Ralph, +8686528aacc, Ben_Adida, Alistair, Guus, edsu, +49.440.aadd, Antoine, DanBri
18:31:42 <Zakim> Zakim has left #swd