IRC log of core on 2009-07-15
Timestamps are in UTC.
- 18:58:18 [RRSAgent]
- RRSAgent has joined #core
- 18:58:18 [RRSAgent]
- logging to http://www.w3.org/2009/07/15-core-irc
- 18:58:23 [Zakim]
- Zakim has joined #core
- 18:58:32 [aphillip]
- zakim, this will be I18N
- 18:58:32 [Zakim]
- ok, aphillip; I see I18N_CoreWG()3:00PM scheduled to start in 2 minutes
- 18:58:40 [aphillip]
- RRSAgent, set logs world-visible
- 18:58:53 [aphillip]
- Meeting: Internationalization WG Teleconference
- 18:58:58 [aphillip]
- Chair: Addison Phillips
- 18:59:03 [aphillip]
- Scribe: Addison Phillips
- 18:59:08 [aphillip]
- ScribeNick: aphillip
- 18:59:29 [aphillip]
- Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-i18n-core/2009Jul/0014.html
- 18:59:35 [aphillip]
- rrsagent, make minutes
- 18:59:35 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/07/15-core-minutes.html aphillip
- 19:01:06 [YvesS]
- YvesS has joined #core
- 19:01:14 [r12a]
- r12a has joined #core
- 19:01:17 [Zakim]
- I18N_CoreWG()3:00PM has now started
- 19:01:23 [fsasaki]
- fsasaki has joined #core
- 19:01:24 [Zakim]
- +aphillip
- 19:01:49 [Zakim]
- +??P1
- 19:02:00 [dchiba]
- dchiba has joined #core
- 19:02:04 [r12a]
- zakim, dial richard-home
- 19:02:04 [Zakim]
- ok, r12a; the call is being made
- 19:02:06 [Zakim]
- +Richard
- 19:02:24 [r12a]
- zakim, who's here ?
- 19:02:24 [Zakim]
- On the phone I see aphillip, ??P1, Richard
- 19:02:25 [Zakim]
- On IRC I see dchiba, fsasaki, r12a, YvesS, Zakim, RRSAgent, aphillip, andrewc
- 19:02:29 [Zakim]
- + +1.303.945.aaaa
- 19:02:40 [r12a]
- zakim, P1 is Andrew
- 19:02:40 [Zakim]
- sorry, r12a, I do not recognize a party named 'P1'
- 19:02:46 [Zakim]
- +??P3
- 19:02:52 [r12a]
- zakim, ??P1 is Yves
- 19:02:52 [Zakim]
- +Yves; got it
- 19:03:02 [aphillip]
- zakim, who is here?
- 19:03:02 [Zakim]
- On the phone I see aphillip, Yves, Richard, +1.303.945.aaaa, Felix (muted)
- 19:03:04 [Zakim]
- On IRC I see dchiba, fsasaki, r12a, YvesS, Zakim, RRSAgent, aphillip, andrewc
- 19:03:06 [Zakim]
- +[Oracle]
- 19:03:19 [r12a]
- zakim, Yves is AndrewC
- 19:03:19 [Zakim]
- +AndrewC; got it
- 19:03:38 [r12a]
- zakim, +1.303 is Yves
- 19:03:38 [Zakim]
- sorry, r12a, I do not recognize a party named '+1.303'
- 19:03:44 [r12a]
- zakim, 1.303 is Yves
- 19:03:44 [Zakim]
- sorry, r12a, I do not recognize a party named '1.303'
- 19:04:05 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/07/15-core-minutes.html aphillip
- 19:04:35 [aphillip]
- Topic: Action Items
- 19:04:48 [aphillip]
- Richard: respond on our behalf to CSS on ruby issue
- 19:04:57 [aphillip]
- not yet
- 19:05:06 [aphillip]
- Addison: convert widgets comments to a table and forward to webapps@
- 19:05:18 [aphillip]
- addison: set up document edit transition with dan for ws-i18n
- 19:05:32 [aphillip]
- richard: ask IanJ if we can publish charreq as a historical Note
- 19:05:41 [aphillip]
- not yet
- 19:05:53 [aphillip]
- richard: look at framework for i18n guidelines and suggest actions to take on document
- 19:06:02 [aphillip]
- on agenda
- 19:06:10 [aphillip]
- ichard: publish qa-bidi-unicode-controls
- 19:06:19 [aphillip]
- s/^ichard/richard/
- 19:06:26 [aphillip]
- DONE
- 19:06:34 [aphillip]
- richard: ready bp-html-bidi for publication, announce a review, and publish for review
- 19:06:40 [aphillip]
- DONE
- 19:06:54 [aphillip]
- Topic: Info Share
- 19:07:31 [r12a]
- http://www.w3.org/International/tests/list-html-css#direction
- 19:07:32 [aphillip]
- richard: working on test suite, particulary on text direction
- 19:07:37 [aphillip]
- ... at link above
- 19:08:15 [aphillip]
- ... can run in four mode
- 19:08:23 [aphillip]
- ... also added section on vertical text
- 19:08:28 [aphillip]
- ... need more of those
- 19:09:02 [aphillip]
- ... xhtml 1.1 still works without need for css, even though served as xml
- 19:09:15 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/07/15-core-minutes.html aphillip
- 19:09:49 [aphillip]
- Topic: What to do with Framework Document for i18n Guidelines 1.0
- 19:09:57 [aphillip]
- http://www.w3.org/TR/i18n-guide-framework/
- 19:10:07 [aphillip]
- I propose that we leave as a Working Draft and set the metadata that will be available on the w3c beta site to say that this is obsolete-retired. It will then appear under Obsolete Specifications at http://beta.w3.org/standards/techs/i18n (and only on that page).
- 19:10:24 [aphillip]
- richard: had a look at this... way out of date
- 19:10:32 [aphillip]
- ... doesn't make sense to work on it any more
- 19:10:48 [aphillip]
- ... would be weird since it the ideas captured are out of date
- 19:11:01 [aphillip]
- ... spoke to IanJ and he suggested we leave it as-is
- 19:11:04 [r12a]
- http://beta.w3.org/standards/techs/i18n
- 19:11:10 [aphillip]
- ... and set metadata on beta site (above link)
- 19:11:17 [aphillip]
- ... to make it obsolete/retired
- 19:11:23 [aphillip]
- ... or say it is superseded
- 19:11:36 [aphillip]
- ... but then we need something to supercede it with
- 19:11:56 [aphillip]
- ... so propose: leave as WD and mark as retired
- 19:12:20 [aphillip]
- chair: anyone object to publishing as retired WD
- 19:12:25 [aphillip]
- ?
- 19:12:35 [aphillip]
- no objections
- 19:13:01 [aphillip]
- ACTION: richard: publish i18n-guide-frameword as (retired, obsolete) WD
- 19:13:32 [aphillip]
- Topic: Widgets responses
- 19:14:00 [aphillip]
- http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-i18n-core/2009JulSep/0019.html
- 19:14:14 [r12a]
- http://www.w3.org/International/reviews/0907-widgets-pc/
- 19:15:32 [aphillip]
- addison: note their concern about ITS, our responses
- 19:15:43 [aphillip]
- richard: possibly <widget> element should have dir?
- 19:16:09 [aphillip]
- ... some confusion about scope of 'dir'
- 19:16:30 [aphillip]
- ... they are talking about support for ITS, when they should talk about bidi support in widget packaging
- 19:18:07 [fsasaki]
- q+
- 19:18:25 [aphillip]
- ack
- 19:18:25 [fsasaki]
- http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-i18n-core/2009JulSep/0028.html
- 19:19:13 [aphillip]
- felix: marcos happier to have dir without its namespace
- 19:19:18 [aphillip]
- ... can we porpose that?
- 19:19:52 [aphillip]
- addison: yes, can do that
- 19:20:16 [aphillip]
- felix: could also map from their namespace to the its rules
- 19:20:25 [aphillip]
- ... want to avoid control characters
- 19:20:39 [aphillip]
- yves: part of response is still weird
- 19:29:37 [aphillip]
- propose putting it on <widget> and removing its namespace?
- 19:30:15 [fsasaki]
- +1
- 19:30:17 [aphillip]
- any objections?
- 19:31:44 [r12a]
- http://www.w3.org/International/wiki/Bp_spec_bidi
- 19:33:23 [aphillip]
- addison: good start... wants to be more than just a BP?
- 19:33:57 [aphillip]
- ... some in xml BP from ITS
- 19:34:09 [r12a]
- http://www.w3.org/International/publications
- 19:34:31 [r12a]
- http://www.w3.org/TR/xml-i18n-bp/
- 19:34:51 [r12a]
- http://www.w3.org/TR/xml-i18n-bp/#DevDir
- 19:35:19 [aphillip]
- ... not so much in UTR#20
- 19:36:13 [aphillip]
- richard: needs some rationales, etc.
- 19:36:31 [aphillip]
- ... very bare-bones at moment, so please send comments or comment in wiki
- 19:37:59 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/07/15-core-minutes.html aphillip
- 19:39:00 [aphillip]
- Topic: Charmod
- 19:39:04 [r12a]
- http://www.w3.org/International/wiki/Charmod_norm
- 19:39:09 [aphillip]
- richard: charmodnorm wiki available
- 19:39:17 [aphillip]
- ... (link above)
- 19:39:29 [aphillip]
- ... conformance criteria listed in first section
- 19:39:40 [aphillip]
- ... and then have a new section for writing enw conformance criteria
- 19:39:45 [aphillip]
- s/enw/new/
- 19:39:58 [aphillip]
- ... put proposals in wiki or send via email
- 19:40:05 [aphillip]
- ... have thought off-and-on about it
- 19:40:16 [aphillip]
- ... gonna have to go back to CSS with late normalization
- 19:43:26 [aphillip]
- addison: concerned that we've already lost that battle
- 19:43:38 [aphillip]
- richard: clarify position and state it
- 19:43:44 [aphillip]
- ... how far to push?
- 19:44:11 [aphillip]
- andrew: how far to push vs. what can we do?
- 19:44:30 [aphillip]
- ... put together BP for what is broken, what developers have to do, etc.
- 19:45:08 [aphillip]
- ... may be no point pushing it, but they might react to "css is broken, do this to work around"
- 19:50:40 [aphillip]
- Topic: AOB?
- 19:51:27 [aphillip]
- richard: changed the write up about internationalization
- 19:51:52 [aphillip]
- http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-i18n-core/2009Jul/0012.html
- 19:52:02 [r12a]
- http://beta.w3.org/standards/webdesign/i18n
- 19:52:34 [aphillip]
- typo: This is widely used abbreviation (should have 'a' in there)
- 19:53:25 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/07/15-core-minutes.html aphillip
- 19:53:51 [Zakim]
- -dchiba
- 19:53:52 [Zakim]
- -aphillip
- 19:53:52 [Zakim]
- -YvesS
- 19:53:53 [Zakim]
- -Felix
- 19:53:53 [Zakim]
- -AndrewC
- 19:54:04 [Zakim]
- -Richard
- 19:54:06 [Zakim]
- I18N_CoreWG()3:00PM has ended
- 19:54:07 [Zakim]
- Attendees were aphillip, Richard, +1.303.945.aaaa, Felix, [Oracle], AndrewC, YvesS, dchiba
- 20:19:29 [aphillip]
- rrsagent, make minutes
- 20:19:29 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/07/15-core-minutes.html aphillip
- 20:19:34 [aphillip]
- rrsagent, bye
- 20:19:34 [RRSAgent]
- I see 1 open action item saved in http://www.w3.org/2009/07/15-core-actions.rdf :
- 20:19:34 [RRSAgent]
- ACTION: richard: publish i18n-guide-frameword as (retired, obsolete) WD [1]
- 20:19:34 [RRSAgent]
- recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/07/15-core-irc#T19-13-01
- 20:19:38 [aphillip]
- zakim, bye
- 20:19:38 [Zakim]
- Zakim has left #core