16:59:37 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #tagmem
16:59:37 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2009/06/11-tagmem-irc
16:59:39 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public
16:59:41 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be TAG
16:59:41 <Zakim> ok, trackbot, I see TAG_Weekly()1:00PM already started
16:59:42 <trackbot> Meeting: Technical Architecture Group Teleconference
16:59:42 <trackbot> Date: 11 June 2009
16:59:49 <Zakim> +jar
16:59:56 <DanC> RRSAgent, make logs member
17:00:34 <DanC> agenda + Convene
17:00:45 <DanC> agenda + Approval of Minutes
17:00:54 <DanC> agenda + Administrative items
17:01:02 <DanC> agenda + TagSoupIntegration-54 (ISSUE-54) and liaison with HTML working group 
17:01:11 <DanC> agenda + LanguageVersioning-41 (formerly XMLVersioning-41) (ISSUE-41). 
17:01:33 <DanC> agenda + F2F Agenda Planning
17:01:34 <Zakim> +Sam
17:01:40 <DanC> agenda + Should the TAG look into architectural issues relating to APIs? 
17:01:57 <DanC> agenda + Pending Review Items
17:02:06 <DanC> agenda + Overdue Action Items
17:02:17 <Zakim> +[IBMCambridge]
17:02:22 <rubys1> rubys1 has joined #tagmem
17:02:23 <noah> zakim, [IBMCambridge] is me
17:02:23 <Zakim> +noah; got it
17:02:27 <noah> zakim, who is here?
17:02:27 <Zakim> On the phone I see Raman, DanC, jar, Sam, noah
17:02:30 <Zakim> On IRC I see rubys1, RRSAgent, jrees, Zakim, raman, ht_redmond, DanC, noah, trackbot
17:02:30 <johnk> johnk has joined #tagmem
17:02:33 <Zakim> +John_Kemp
17:02:37 <DanC> Zakim, take up item 1
17:02:37 <Zakim> agendum 1. "Convene" taken up [from DanC]
17:02:42 <noah> Hi Sam, thank you for joining us.
17:02:53 <rubys1> glad to be here
17:03:44 <DanC> regrets+ Ashok, Henry, Tim, Larry
17:04:30 <ht_redmond> regrets- Henry
17:05:55 <DanC> NM welcomes Sam Ruby, reviews agenda
17:06:03 <ht_redmond> zakim, please call ht-redmond
17:06:03 <Zakim> I am sorry, ht_redmond; I do not know a number for ht-redmond
17:06:08 <DanC> NM: next week's telcon is at risk; no regrets now, though
17:06:41 <DanC> RESOLVED: to approved http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2009/05/28-minutes
17:06:47 <DanC> Zakim, close item 2
17:06:47 <Zakim> agendum 2, Approval of Minutes, closed
17:06:48 <Zakim> I see 8 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
17:06:49 <Zakim> 1. Convene [from DanC]
17:06:54 <DanC> Zakim, close item 1
17:06:54 <Zakim> agendum 1, Convene, closed
17:06:56 <Zakim> I see 7 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
17:06:58 <Zakim> 3. Administrative items [from DanC]
17:06:58 <DanC> Zakim, close item 3
17:06:58 <Zakim> agendum 3, Administrative items, closed
17:07:01 <Zakim> I see 6 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
17:07:03 <Zakim> 4. TagSoupIntegration-54 (ISSUE-54) and liaison with HTML working group [from DanC]
17:07:11 <DanC> Zakim, next item
17:07:12 <Zakim> agendum 4. "TagSoupIntegration-54 (ISSUE-54) and liaison with HTML working group" taken up [from DanC]
17:07:24 <jrees> ht_redmond, possible -  _ confusion?
17:07:31 <johnk_> johnk_ has joined #tagmem
17:07:38 <ht_redmond> (no, I failed to update the dialout page properly)
17:07:48 <DanC> NM: clearly success of HTML specs in development is a high priority for W3C...
17:08:12 <ht_redmond> zakim, what is code?
17:08:12 <Zakim> I don't understand your question, ht_redmond.
17:08:17 <ht_redmond> zakim, what is the code?
17:08:17 <Zakim> the conference code is 0824 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 tel:+33.4.89.06.34.99 tel:+44.117.370.6152), ht_redmond
17:08:52 <DanC> NM: evolution of HTML interacts with our issues on language versioning and error handling
17:09:07 <DanC> NM: we've talked about RDFa some
17:09:22 <ht_redmond> zakim, please call ht-mobile
17:09:23 <Zakim> ok, ht_redmond; the call is being made
17:09:24 <Zakim> +Ht
17:10:26 <ht_redmond> zakim, disconnect me
17:10:26 <Zakim> sorry, ht_redmond, I do not see a party named 'ht_redmond'
17:10:30 <ht_redmond> zakim, disconnect ht
17:10:30 <Zakim> Ht is being disconnected
17:10:31 <Zakim> -Ht
17:11:13 <DanC> TVR: what news since the AC meeting; any news of your work with Steven P?
17:12:12 <DanC> SR: the work with Steven... we looked at RDFa as a test case...
17:13:09 <DanC> ... Ian Hickson took the RDFa requirements and produced something different
17:14:58 <Zakim> +??P6
17:15:01 <DanC> SR: I think the review of RDFa by the HTML WG has turned up technical issues...
17:15:12 <ht_redmond> zakim, ? is ht_redmond
17:15:12 <Zakim> +ht_redmond; got it
17:15:33 <DanC> ... RDFa was designed in the context of XHTML, but it's deployed in text/html, and that raises issues...
17:15:46 <DanC> ... there are test cases and a spec being written
17:16:15 <DanC> (test cases? I try to keep an eye out for those. maybe I'll q+ to ask for pointers.)
17:17:32 <noah> q?
17:17:32 <ht_redmond> Browsers are not the only HTML-consuming application. . .
17:17:40 <DanC> NM: suppose this new spec depended on head/@profile but the editor of the main HTML 5 spec didn't specify @profile...
17:18:18 <DanC> SR: yes, that's somewhat likely... @profile works a certain way in browsers; that's not really an issue, operationally. The only operational issue is what validator should say
17:18:35 <ht_redmond> q+ to ask about extensibility/namespaces
17:18:41 <DanC> ack ht
17:18:41 <Zakim> ht_redmond, you wanted to ask about extensibility/namespaces
17:18:56 <rubys1> I can hear Henry fine
17:19:28 <DanC> HT: ~1.5years ago, we discussed ARIA attributes in HTML 5...
17:19:33 <DanC> SR: yes, I recall...
17:20:22 <DanC> HT: it didn't work out as I would have liked, despite my spending a lot of energy... we seem to have aria_* attributes [or aria-* ]
17:21:10 <DanC> HT: "extensibility is pretty much done" is one of the main arguments, especially from hsivonen. Where are we on that discussion?
17:21:35 <jrees> q+ to say I want to understand html5 attitude to extension... agree with assessment "it's going to happen, how to channel it"
17:21:48 <DanC> SR: I think hsivonen hasn't changed his position. I don't agree, but I don't see how to convince people such as hsivonen
17:22:01 <noah> q+ to ask more about particular extensibility mechanisms
17:22:20 <DanC> ack next
17:22:21 <Zakim> jrees, you wanted to say I want to understand html5 attitude to extension... agree with assessment "it's going to happen, how to channel it"
17:23:00 <DanC> [scribe missed what jar refers to re attributes]
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17:23:29 <DanC> SR: [earlier] people use new attributes all the time...
17:24:18 <DanC> TVR: Chris Wilson seems to support extensibilty; he's moved away from the IE browser team... is he [doing something]?
17:24:50 <noah> q?
17:24:52 <DanC> ... it seems to be that anyone who has a different opinion walks away.
17:25:43 <johnk> johnk has joined #tagmem
17:25:56 <DanC> [scribe struggles to record the gist of TVR's comment and SR's response]
17:26:44 <DanC> NM: what sorts of extensibility mechanisms do you think are in play?
17:27:02 <noah> q?
17:27:13 <noah> ack next
17:27:14 <DanC> SR: I think various extensions for things that people care about will happen, even without an overall mechanism. ARIA, fb: etc.
17:27:15 <Zakim> noah, you wanted to ask more about particular extensibility mechanisms
17:27:30 <DanC> q+ to add the palm pre stuff to the list
17:27:58 <DanC> SR: I hope to see, if not help build, validators that have some helpful approach to extensibility
17:29:17 <DanC> NM: there's a self-describing sense to the web with a few registries (URI schemes, media types) and URI-based hooks... it looks like that's being lost with this free-for-all of fb: and aria-* 
17:29:46 <noah> q?
17:30:13 <DanC> SR: I think it's worth encouraging a few other vocabularies before building the extensibility bridge
17:30:37 <DanC> NM: but doesn't that risk 3 or 4 mechanisms that we have to support?
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17:31:06 <DanC> TVR: yes, that does look like a risk
17:31:09 <noah> ack next
17:31:10 <Zakim> DanC, you wanted to add the palm pre stuff to the list
17:31:38 <DanC> http://www.w3.org/QA/2009/02/palm_webos_approach_to_html_ex.html
17:31:57 <DanC> <div x-mojo-element="ToggleButton"
17:32:23 <johnk__> johnk__ has joined #tagmem
17:33:27 <jrees> original question was how can tag be helpful.  no answer?
17:34:14 <noah> q?
17:34:47 <johnk_> johnk_ has joined #tagmem
17:35:08 <jrees> so does the html5 wg need to know anything?
17:35:51 <ht_redmond> q+ to ask about the AC meeting question: managing the namespace, who's on top?
17:36:08 <DanC> TVR meant this for the public record: TVR: I hear that unification efforts winding down and polarization remaining; this seems that there's little opportunity for the TAG to make a difference in the coming months
17:36:13 <DanC>  NM: we'd have to show people something they don't know. "we're the tag and we think X" doesn't help much
17:36:33 <DanC> s/TVR meant this for the public record: //
17:38:15 <noah> q?
17:38:21 <noah> ack nt
17:38:24 <DanC> ack ht
17:38:24 <Zakim> ht_redmond, you wanted to ask about the AC meeting question: managing the namespace, who's on top?
17:38:25 <noah> ack next
17:39:23 <johnk__> johnk__ has joined #tagmem
17:39:35 <Zakim> -Sam
17:39:47 <DanC> NM: thanks for coming, Sam; if there's anything we can do to catalyze things, please let us know
17:40:01 <DanC> Zakim, next item
17:40:01 <Zakim> agendum 5. "LanguageVersioning-41 (formerly XMLVersioning-41) (ISSUE-41)." taken up [from DanC]
17:40:07 <DanC> Zakim, close item 5
17:40:08 <Zakim> agendum 5, LanguageVersioning-41 (formerly XMLVersioning-41) (ISSUE-41)., closed
17:40:10 <Zakim> I see 4 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
17:40:10 <DanC> Zakim, next item
17:40:11 <Zakim> 6. F2F Agenda Planning [from DanC]
17:40:13 <Zakim> agendum 6. "F2F Agenda Planning" taken up [from DanC]
17:40:15 <noah> http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2009/06/23-agenda
17:41:20 <DanC> NM: one constraint I'm working with is that TVR is only available to dial in in our afternoons
17:42:30 <DanC> NM: major goals of the meeting are * work on client-side URL patterns [?] and * versioning
17:42:40 <noah> q?
17:43:06 <johnk__> +1, agenda looks ok to me too
17:43:32 <DanC> ACTION-33 due next week
17:43:32 <trackbot> ACTION-33 revise naming challenges story in response to Dec 2008 F2F discussion due date now next week
17:44:08 <Zakim> -ht_redmond
17:44:35 <DanC> NM: note people identified as shepherds for sessions
17:44:52 <johnk_> johnk_ has joined #tagmem
17:45:07 <noah> q?
17:46:07 <DanC> Zakim, next item
17:46:07 <Zakim> agendum 7. "Should the TAG look into architectural issues relating to APIs?" taken up [from DanC]
17:46:51 <DanC> ACTION-273?
17:46:51 <trackbot> ACTION-273 -- Ashok Malhotra to carry forward framing issues around Archicture of APIs, with help from JK and LM -- due 2009-06-04 -- OPEN
17:46:51 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/273
17:47:06 <DanC> JK: AM and LM and I talked about this and drafted something...
17:47:46 <DanC> ... trying to frame the issue...
17:50:29 <DanC> Zakim, next item
17:50:29 <Zakim> agendum 8. "Pending Review Items" taken up [from DanC]
17:50:51 <DanC> action-255?
17:50:51 <trackbot> ACTION-255 -- John Kemp to contact Sam to ask (a) how can the TAG be helpful (b) offer set up phone call involving Sam & 1 or 2 others -- due 2009-05-13 -- PENDINGREVIEW
17:50:51 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/255
17:50:58 <DanC> close ation-255
17:51:01 <DanC> close action-255
17:51:01 <trackbot> ACTION-255 Contact Sam to ask (a) how can the TAG be helpful (b) offer set up phone call involving Sam & 1 or 2 others closed
17:51:41 <DanC> ack danc
17:52:32 <DanC> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-tag/2009Jun/0013.html
17:52:52 <johnk__> johnk__ has joined #tagmem
17:53:44 <noah> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-tag/2009Jun/0028.html
17:54:12 <noah> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-tag/2009Jun/0013.html
17:55:52 <johnk_> johnk_ has joined #tagmem
17:56:15 <noah> http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/doc/whenToUseGet.html
17:58:19 <DanC> NM: maybe the "when to use get" finding should be updated to deal with malicious actors?
17:58:23 <johnk__> johnk__ has joined #tagmem
18:00:55 <DanC> ACTION-255: the tag considered updating the "when to use get" finding but didn't find a critical mass of interest
18:00:56 <trackbot> ACTION-255 Contact Sam to ask (a) how can the TAG be helpful (b) offer set up phone call involving Sam & 1 or 2 others notes added
18:00:59 <DanC> close action-255
18:00:59 <trackbot> ACTION-255 Contact Sam to ask (a) how can the TAG be helpful (b) offer set up phone call involving Sam & 1 or 2 others closed
18:01:12 <noah> zakim, who is here?
18:01:12 <Zakim> On the phone I see Raman, DanC, jar, noah, John_Kemp
18:01:13 <Zakim> On IRC I see johnk__, rubys1, RRSAgent, jrees, Zakim, ht_redmond, DanC, noah, trackbot
18:01:30 <DanC> ACTION-257?
18:01:30 <trackbot> ACTION-257 -- Noah Mendelsohn to invite Mark Not or Lisa D to revisit progress in IETF/HTML liaison on content sniffing -- due 2009-05-28 -- OPEN
18:01:30 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/257
18:01:38 <johnk_> johnk_ has joined #tagmem
18:03:28 <DanC> ACTION-264 due july 11
18:03:28 <trackbot> ACTION-264 Draft agenda item for upcoming telcon discussion of geolocation and privacy due date now july 11
18:03:53 <DanC> close ACTION-270
18:03:53 <trackbot> ACTION-270 Provide additional material for review at F2F for Issue 41 closed
18:04:18 <johnk__> johnk__ has joined #tagmem
18:04:22 <DanC> action-270?
18:04:22 <trackbot> ACTION-270 -- Larry Masinter to provide additional material for review at F2F for Issue 41 -- due 2009-06-22 -- PENDINGREVIEW
18:04:22 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/270
18:06:02 <DanC> ACTION-272 due 15 June
18:06:02 <trackbot> ACTION-272 Report back to the TAG on outcome of collaboration with LM on Versioning due date now 15 June
18:06:52 <DanC> ACTION-273 due 15 June
18:06:52 <trackbot> ACTION-273 Carry forward framing issues around Archicture of APIs, with help from JK and LM due date now 15 June
18:07:56 <DanC> RESOLVED: to cancel the TAG telcon of 18 June
18:08:58 <Zakim> -DanC
18:08:58 <Zakim> -Raman
18:09:00 <Zakim> -noah
18:09:02 <Zakim> -jar
18:09:04 <Zakim> -John_Kemp
18:09:04 <Zakim> TAG_Weekly()1:00PM has ended
18:09:05 <Zakim> Attendees were Raman, DanC, jar, Sam, noah, John_Kemp, Ht, ht_redmond
22:01:34 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #tagmem
22:01:34 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2009/06/11-tagmem-irc
22:01:37 <DanC> RRSAgent, draft minutes
22:01:37 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/06/11-tagmem-minutes.html DanC
22:01:54 <DanC> RRSAgent, make logs world-access
22:02:13 <DanC> chair: NM
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