13:10:05 RRSAgent has joined #swxg 13:10:05 logging to http://www.w3.org/2009/06/03-swxg-irc 13:10:13 rrsagent, please make logs public 13:10:24 yep 13:10:30 AlexPassant++ 13:10:31 need to register as a scribe 13:10:42 Zakim, scribe: AlexPassant 13:10:42 I don't understand 'scribe: AlexPassant', AlexPassant 13:10:50 nick 13:10:56 claudio has joined #swxg 13:10:58 scribenick 13:11:06 -AlexPassant 13:11:12 zakim, who is here? 13:11:12 On the phone I see cperey (muted), +46.1.08.01.aabb, FabGandon, rreck, wonsuk, +039011228aaff, mischat (muted), +01415287aagg, karl (muted), danbri, tpa, oshani (muted), 13:11:15 ... [IPCaller], AlexKorth?, [IPcaller] 13:11:16 On IRC I see claudio, RRSAgent, Cloud, AlexKorth, oshani, hajons, renato, mischat, wonsuk, hhalpin, Zakim, AlexPassant, tpa, cperey, rreck, melvster, tinkster, FabGandon, danbri, 13:11:18 ... karl, trackbot, dom 13:11:23 zakim, who is noisy 13:11:23 I don't understand 'who is noisy', AlexKorth 13:11:25 Zakim, mute me 13:11:25 sorry, hhalpin, I do not know which phone connection belongs to you 13:11:26 zakim, mute harry 13:11:26 sorry, danbri, I do not know which phone connection belongs to harry 13:11:32 +Kingsley_Idehen 13:11:38 Zakim, +039011228aaff is me 13:11:38 +claudio; got it 13:11:45 Scribe: AlexPassant 13:11:45 zakim, who is on the phone? 13:11:45 On the phone I see cperey (muted), +46.1.08.01.aabb, FabGandon, rreck, wonsuk, claudio, mischat (muted), +01415287aagg, karl (muted), danbri, tpa, oshani (muted), [IPCaller], 13:11:48 ... AlexKorth?, [IPcaller], Kingsley_Idehen 13:11:57 ScribeNick: AlexPassant 13:11:57 Zakim, Cloud is +01415287aagg 13:11:57 sorry, Cloud, I do not recognize a party named 'Cloud' 13:11:59 Zakim, read agenda from http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/socialweb/weekly-agenda.rdf 13:11:59 working on it, hhalpin 13:12:01 done reading agenda, hhalpin 13:12:05 zakim, who is talking? 13:12:10 Zakim, who is making noise ? 13:12:12 MacTed has joined #swxg 13:12:16 danbri, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: wonsuk (14%), Kingsley_Idehen (28%), danbri (75%) 13:12:20 that's me 13:12:27 mischat, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: tpa (5%), wonsuk (24%), Kingsley_Idehen (13%), danbri (42%) 13:12:51 Zakim, next item 13:12:51 http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/socialweb/weekly-agenda.html 13:12:55 I see nothing on the agenda 13:12:57 Zakim, +01415287aagg is me 13:13:00 +Cloud; got it 13:13:21 http://www.w3.org/2009/05/27-swxg-minutes.html 13:13:35 yes, it's fine 13:13:44 resolved; true record 13:13:52 RESOLVED: approved SWXG WG Weekly -- 27 May 2009 as a true record 13:13:55 + +0785583aajj 13:13:56 zakim, mute me 13:13:56 sorry, tinkster, I do not know which phone connection belongs to you 13:14:03 me 13:14:07 zakim, mute me 13:14:07 sorry, tinkster, I do not know which phone connection belongs to you 13:14:14 also online, fighting mute... 13:14:31 i can hear you dan 13:14:43 zakim, i am +0785583aajj 13:14:43 +tinkster; got it 13:14:47 zakim, mute me 13:14:47 tinkster should now be muted 13:15:02 AlexPassant lost his IRC / Skype connection - will reconnect 13:15:06 ACTION: hhalpin to make scribelist 13:15:06 Created ACTION-25 - Make scribelist [on Harry Halpin - due 2009-06-10]. 13:15:10 ACTION [CONTINUES]: adam to find a good final report template and port it to the wiki 13:15:10 Sorry, couldn't find user - [CONTINUES] 13:15:14 General Organization and Task Forces 13:15:16 2. General Organization and Task Forces 13:15:18 ACTION: adam to find a good final report template and port it to the wiki 13:15:18 Created ACTION-26 - Find a good final report template and port it to the wiki [on Adam Boyet - due 2009-06-10]. 13:15:27 +??P30 13:15:29 yes I believe so 13:15:35 Zakim, ??P30 is me 13:15:35 +AlexPassant; got it 13:15:38 # ACTION [DONE]: tinkster to draft wiki pages for task forces 13:15:40 nice work! 13:15:45 maybe we should look at the task forces 13:15:51 see what the sign up list is? 13:16:02 cperey? 13:16:23 zakim, unmute me 13:16:23 cperey should no longer be muted 13:16:39 http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/socialweb/wiki/Context_Privacy_TF 13:16:42 cperey: task force situation 13:16:54 ... dataportability and architecture, lot of people interested in privacy 13:17:03 ... don't think we have critical mass for other taskforces 13:17:04 http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/socialweb/wiki/Portability_Architecture_TF 13:17:16 What we lack is people taking leaders and maybe finding goals? 13:17:22 ... contacts and privacy together ? cperey objects 13:17:58 Renato had a good idea for policy... 13:18:07 trackbot, comment action-20 the matrix is not done yet, but rreck proposed more metadata for evaluating the social networks. The matrix will be done by the end of the week and will be modified step by step on the wiki. 13:18:07 ACTION-20 Create a matrix for surveying a list of social networks notes added 13:18:25 ... fear that subjects coevered by e-mail and during the call are quite "w3c-centric" topic 13:18:33 http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xg-socialweb/2009Jun/0015.html 13:18:45 How can we help this problem, cperey? 13:19:05 ... will it change when invited guests will join ? 13:19:09 Zakim, who is scribing ? 13:19:09 I don't understand your question, AlexPassant. 13:19:16 One can suggest changes to agenda at any time, and it will change. 13:19:16 caribou has joined #swxg 13:19:44 What interests them Christine? 13:19:55 what are the topics of interests? 13:19:58 zakim, queue? 13:19:58 I see no one on the speaker queue 13:20:10 Maybe we could do a go around during the telecon? 13:20:11 ... ask who should contribute 13:20:19 Discussions have centred on meta-talk (e.g. XG structure). 13:20:22 (might take a long time) 13:20:29 ... brainstorm a list o questions that we could ask to people that can speak as invited guests (e.g. mobile operators) 13:20:55 http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xg-socialweb/2009Jun/0013.html 13:20:57 I wonder if people who are not feeling involved have read the charter? and how they fit in this charter 13:21:08 Scribe: AlexPassant 13:21:25 Scribenick: AlexPassant 13:21:31 http://www.w3.org/mid/6A22F893B30D4616B7BCF72B10F193A1@T60 13:21:44 ... charter pretty opaque 13:22:08 the email discussed can be found here : http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xg-socialweb/2009Jun/0013.html 13:22:12 Zakim, Scribe: AlexPassant 13:22:12 I don't understand 'Scribe: AlexPassant', AlexPassant 13:22:14 +q 13:22:25 Scribe: AlexPassant 13:22:30 zakim mute me 13:22:30 ScribeNick: AlexPassant' 13:22:30 Zakim, ack hajons 13:22:30 I see no one on the speaker queue 13:22:31 i agree with most of what you said 13:22:36 Hajons? 13:22:37 ... concerns about being too much 'W3C' oriented 13:22:37 zakim, unmute me 13:22:37 karl should no longer be muted 13:22:44 zakim, unmute me 13:22:44 cperey was not muted, cperey 13:22:59 ???: no context task force, no clear definition of the scope 13:23:04 zakim, mute me 13:23:04 cperey should now be muted 13:23:10 we could talk about scoping it now.... 13:23:14 agree 13:23:15 if there are suggestions 13:23:20 ... we didn't try to define a scope - should do that 13:23:20 Claudio attempted to define it 13:23:27 is Claudio on the call? 13:23:29 the shape of content. Do actions to define it, more than talking on how to define it 13:23:30 q+ 13:23:36 Zakim, ack karl 13:23:36 I see no one on the speaker queue 13:23:38 s/???/karl/ 13:23:39 Karl - 13:23:39 ack karl 13:23:52 tinkster: no it was not karl previously 13:24:05 karl: culture gap, people used to W3C culture 13:24:05 Ah, sorry. 13:24:12 yes 13:24:32 perhaps it was hajons? 13:24:36 ... people should make proposals / concrete actions to push their own topics to shape the work 13:25:05 agree 13:25:09 agree 13:25:11 zakim, who is making noise? 13:25:14 I really don't understand the proposal 13:25:17 zakim, mute me 13:25:17 karl should now be muted 13:25:22 danbri, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: wonsuk (15%), karl (9%) 13:25:28 I think karl said let's make concrete proposals that interest people. 13:25:37 zakim, unmute me 13:25:37 karl should no longer be muted 13:25:39 I understand that nothing get 13:25:39 and then interested people should take "Actions" over these. 13:25:51 nothing gets done without activity 13:25:52 I have started this model....make proposal...on a topic of interest < http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/socialweb/wiki/PolicyCommons> 13:26:04 zakim, mute me 13:26:04 wonsuk should now be muted 13:26:07 renato, can you queue and talk on the call? 13:26:08 ... people that do not feel confortable inside the group should propose topics of interest, actions, etc 13:26:09 +1 renato's policy proposal, very concrete. 13:26:23 am only on IRC 13:26:26 renato, how will people they know about this topic of interest list? 13:26:51 OK. They can also express their interests to us as invited guests 13:26:53 It has been sent to the list and I will send to the W3C PLING list as well 13:27:06 looking at christine's proposal 13:27:13 maybe we could do a survey for the social networking companies out there 13:27:17 both in this list and outside the list. 13:27:22 would that be a good idea? 13:27:29 claudio has joined #swxg 13:27:33 Would anyone want to take an action on that? 13:27:39 sorry, I missed the e-mail on the list. Some people have remarked that there is too much traffic on the list which they do not feel is relevant to them 13:27:43 hat would the survey ask for? 13:27:45 so they "tune out" 13:27:48 hhalpin: can we get a rough idea of what would be in that survey? 13:27:49 renato, the policy commons looks like a ACL for SNs 13:27:52 http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/socialweb/wiki/QuestionsForDiscussion 13:28:05 That's the survey for questions on Christine. 13:28:06 thank you Harry! 13:28:10 claudio has joined #swxg 13:28:21 zakim, mute me 13:28:21 karl should now be muted 13:28:29 Yes, at the moment - most of the SN privacy/permission concepts are ACL like 13:28:39 Are there contributions which you can make to, or how would you support the SWXG? If not your company, who do you trust most to contribute to the SWXG in your best interest (general or specific suggestions)? 13:28:40 tpa: should send survey to companies 13:28:47 ... wait a few days to let people edit the wiki 13:28:55 maybe people should take a close look at those questions. 13:29:01 I think what tim is suggesting is that we make a wiki page iwth questions 13:29:03 a survey 13:29:07 claudio has joined #swxg 13:29:07 Also, perhaps we could have a different kind of survey for non-profits. 13:29:13 compose a survey for social networks to take 13:29:23 Did people like using WBS Questionnaire? 13:29:28 I could convert that questions into WBS format? 13:29:30 first question is Are there contributions which you can make to, or how would you support the SWXG? 13:29:32 Or use surveymonkey? 13:29:43 Once the questions have been talked about for a week 13:29:43 either is fine I think 13:29:49 second question could be If not your company, who do you trust most to contribute to the SWXG in your best interest (general or specific suggestions)? 13:29:58 WBS is ok 13:30:10 these are just examples 13:30:10 of possible questions 13:30:19 so new action to work on that questionaire? 13:30:20 action: danbri follow up re whether to use survey tool at w3c or elsewhere 13:30:20 Created ACTION-27 - Follow up re whether to use survey tool at w3c or elsewhere [on Dan Brickley - due 2009-06-10]. 13:30:27 yes 13:30:34 hi Claudio 13:30:51 context task force 13:30:58 maybe we should consider doing a survey for ourselves, too. I doubt that we all have the same vision on how things are gonna be or should be 13:31:18 AlexKorth: didn't we do that at the start of the XG? 13:31:27 thanks 13:31:38 claudio: try to gave a defintion of context in a previous e-mail 13:31:42 tpa, yes but not so vision-focused 13:31:59 ... wanted to check if the proposal was coherent with the scope of the XG 13:32:10 ... hope to get some feedback 13:32:19 yes, there are problems with getting feedback from others on the list as well 13:32:32 http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-social-web-talk/2009Feb/0082.html 13:32:32 are you venezia claudio ? 13:32:33 yes 13:32:36 This is Claudio's proposal I think 13:32:37 +1 13:32:49 I will make a wiki page for context, separate it from privacy 13:32:55 so that is a different mailing list 13:33:00 give me a second... 13:33:02 next agendum 13:33:09 what's the scripting voodoo 13:33:14 Optional Face-to-Face Meeting 13:33:23 I think we need separate mailing lists 13:33:26 3 Optional Face-to-Face Meeting 13:33:28 claudio's email was sent to : public-social-web-talk@w3.org 13:33:29 so that the focus of a group is clear 13:33:32 hajons_ has joined #swxg 13:33:35 danbri - http://www.w3.org/2001/12/zakim-irc-bot 13:33:40 and there is specific (focused) discussions 13:33:41 * Note that W3C TPAC 2009 (Nov 2-6th) and the Internet Identity Workshop are both meeting November (2-5th) this year in Silicon Valley, California. 13:33:41 * Should we have our face-to-face there? If so, at which event? How to encourage overlap? 13:33:41 Basically, TPAC is Nov 2-6th in Santa Clara. 13:33:50 which as far as I can tell is not this group's mailing list 13:34:02 -rreck 13:34:03 Internet Identity Workshop is 2-5th in Silicon Valley 13:34:05 i/3 Optional Face-to-Face Meeting/TOPIC: Optional Face-to-Face Meeting/ 13:34:05 ah, ok can someone sensd a pointer 13:34:06 Basically 10 minutes away 13:34:17 http://www.w3.org/2009/11/TPAC/overview.html 13:34:36 Do people want to have an option face-to-face? 13:34:46 And do it either at TPAC or INternet Identity Workshop? 13:34:48 In Nov 2009? 13:34:53 We need to book space now-ish. 13:34:54 moving on 13:34:56 if we wish to do so. 13:34:57 next agendum 13:35:03 Invited Guests 13:35:09 vcard telecon 13:35:14 OK, so no interest in TPAC or Internet Identity Workshop? 13:35:17 Dan, I don't believe we have finished discussion topics! 13:35:18 "# VCard Invited Guest Telecon went well, with Tim Berners-Lee (W3C), Norm Walsh (Mark Logic), and Peter Mika (Yahoo!) showing up." 13:35:36 has anyone responded to the question of a face-to-face meeting? 13:35:42 I have something to say on that topic... 13:35:56 zakim, who is on the phone? 13:35:56 On the phone I see cperey (muted), +46.1.08.01.aabb, FabGandon, wonsuk (muted), claudio, mischat (muted), Cloud, karl (muted), danbri, tpa, oshani (muted), [IPCaller], AlexKorth?, 13:36:01 ... [IPcaller], Kingsley_Idehen, tinkster (muted), AlexPassant 13:36:01 Chair person: can I come back to the topic of Face to face meeting 13:36:08 I have to check out the Internet Identity Workshop first... 13:36:09 +q 13:36:14 i/Zakim, read agenda from http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/socialweb/weekly-agenda.rdf/TOPIC: Convene SWXG WG meeting of 2009-06-03T13:00-15:00Z/ 13:36:16 DanBri - let's finish up face-to-face discussion. 13:36:17 +??P12 13:36:17 zakim, unmute me 13:36:18 cperey should no longer be muted 13:36:25 who is speaking? 13:36:34 Zakim, who is making noise ? 13:36:35 yes 13:36:47 zakim, ??P12 is me 13:36:48 mischat, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: cperey (80%), Kingsley_Idehen (60%) 13:36:50 +rreck; got it 13:36:59 q? 13:37:06 go for it christine. 13:37:11 i/2. General Organization and Task Forces/TOPIC: General Organization and Task Forces/ 13:37:39 ah 13:37:43 i think my phone muted 13:37:46 for dunno how long 13:37:52 danbri: probably, we couldn't hear anything 13:37:53 might explain why i felt i was shouting into a cave 13:37:58 ahhhhhh 13:38:04 f*!*! 13:38:12 danbri: glad to have you back :) 13:38:16 yes 13:38:17 I would suggest we meet at internet identity workshop - there's a lot of people there. 13:38:20 s/danbri: probably,/danbri, probably,/ 13:38:23 ah! zakim thinks I'm Kingsley :-/ 13:38:23 Kingsley_Idehen is really MacTed 13:38:29 http://iiw.idcommons.net/Index.php/Main_Page 13:38:38 q+ 13:38:39 zakim, unmute me 13:38:39 karl should no longer be muted 13:38:46 cperey: I second that 13:38:50 Zakim, Kingsley_Idehen is really MacTed 13:38:50 +MacTed; got it 13:38:58 I volunteer to organize the workshop 13:39:06 I volunteer too 13:39:06 in the same fashion as in Barceona 13:39:09 danbri: lots of people on the group don't have easy access to resources for traveling 13:39:13 yes, for all those reasons 13:39:21 perhaps chrstine and tim can help communicate to set-up a workshop at internet identity workshop? 13:39:26 ... but would be great as lots of people doing social networking in the westcost 13:39:32 ... wht about a new W3C workshop ? 13:39:33 We can put eveyrone in touch. 13:39:36 I accept action item 13:39:42 if you can articulate it 13:39:47 ACTION: cperey to draft e-mail about a follow-up workshop 13:39:47 Created ACTION-28 - Draft e-mail about a follow-up workshop [on Christine Perey - due 2009-06-10]. 13:39:55 done 13:40:00 Tehre's a Social Data on the Web workshop at ISWC in november in Washington 13:40:01 q? 13:40:08 ack cperey 13:40:28 The Internet Identity Workshop is non-W3C, but includes lots of OpenID, OpenSocial, most of non-W3C Social Web people will be there. 13:40:32 Not sure about its mobile staff. 13:40:58 + +1.203.276.aakk 13:41:15 q+ 13:41:17 cperey: people can participate in the community in the XG 13:41:19 Here is Internet Identity Workshop list: 13:41:20 http://iiw8.eventbrite.com/ 13:41:22 Of attendees. 13:41:26 Note almost no W3C people :) 13:41:34 However, also note 450 dollar registration charge :( 13:41:35 ... some people used to academic system (organizing workshops, participating, etc) 13:41:35 q+ to say that w3c is not academic :) 13:41:42 W3C TPAC is 50 bucks! 13:41:47 ... not in the commercial cultuer 13:41:53 hhalpin: reserved for W3C members though 13:41:59 ... people in the commercial culture want to go to a meeting where the meet partners, etc. 13:42:07 ... people advancing their business 13:42:11 “ Participation in the Technical Plenary is open to participants in good standing in a W3C Working or Interest Group, Advisory Committee Representatives, the TAG, the Advisory Board, Offices staff or Team. ” 13:42:16 how much is the identity workshop? does anyone know? 13:42:20 you're welcome 13:42:25 Alex - 450 bucks later. 13:42:29 450 bucks last year. 13:42:29 danbri, "drinking cool aid"@en-US = "toeing the party line"@en-GB . 13:42:30 phew 13:42:37 thanks harry 13:42:38 q? 13:42:43 any people attending semtech ? 13:42:50 The internet identity workshop has Google, Microsoft, Facebook, looks like a good crowd. 13:43:17 zakim, mute me 13:43:18 cperey should now be muted 13:43:25 q- 13:43:29 Problem is that W3C wants an answer on TPAC asap. 13:43:30 take what to mailing list? 13:43:31 They have to book rooms. 13:43:32 ( http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=drink+the+kool-aid ) 13:43:36 I'm sorry didn't understand what Harry said 13:43:39 zakim, unmute me 13:43:39 karl was not muted, karl 13:43:39 Ah, OK. 13:43:49 +1 13:44:02 q- 13:44:03 Invited Guests 13:44:04 I was 13:44:04 vcard? 13:44:06 4. Invited Guests 13:44:12 anyone here who was on that call... 13:44:16 anyone wants to TALK. 13:44:17 was (mostly listening) 13:44:20 I can give a quick summary in IRC 13:44:23 s/4. Invited Guests/Topic: Invited Guests/ 13:44:25 yes 13:45:02 hhalpin: summary of the vcard / foaf 13:45:15 ... meeting in ESWC with martin hepp and renato 13:45:23 ... looking into OWL-DL 13:45:29 .... one single vcard in RDF 13:45:33 Viktor has joined #swxg 13:45:36 ... renato liaison with the vcard community 13:46:01 ... very technical and productive 13:46:07 :) 13:46:15 ... invited guests are very useful conferences 13:46:21 claudio has joined #swxg 13:46:49 Actions from the vCard/RDF meet < http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xg-socialweb/2009Jun/0000.html> 13:47:45 milstan has joined #swxg 13:49:04 googlewave, is awesome, XMPP > email 13:49:31 that sounds great hhalpin 13:49:48 daniela or chris would be great. 13:49:57 Could we suggest the 10th? 13:50:00 Or 17th? 13:50:00 danbri: F2F dataportability meeting in semtech 13:50:19 (goo is in top 100 social network list) 13:50:30 ... contacted japanese company goo regarding localisation issues 13:50:35 (sorry, social networks in top 100 sites on Web as a *whole*) 13:51:11 How about we create a doodle for their times? 13:51:16