IRC log of rif on 2009-06-02
Timestamps are in UTC.
- 14:33:06 [RRSAgent]
- RRSAgent has joined #rif
- 14:33:06 [RRSAgent]
- logging to http://www.w3.org/2009/06/02-rif-irc
- 14:33:16 [csma]
- rrsagent, make logs public
- 14:33:22 [csma]
- rrsagent, make minutes
- 14:33:22 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/06/02-rif-minutes.html csma
- 14:33:47 [csma]
- Meeting: RIF telecon 2 June 2009
- 14:33:53 [csma]
- Chair: Christian de Sainte Marie
- 14:34:35 [csma]
- Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rif-wg/2009Jun/0003.html
- 14:35:22 [csma]
- Regrets: LeoraMorgenstern, JosDeBruijn
- 14:36:41 [csma]
- csma has changed the topic to: #rif RIF telecon 2 June, agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rif-wg/2009Jun/0003.html
- 14:36:57 [csma]
- agendum+ Admin
- 14:37:20 [csma]
- agendum+ liaisons
- 14:37:42 [csma]
- agendum+ Action review
- 14:37:51 [csma]
- agendum+ Last call publications
- 14:38:58 [csma]
- agendum+ rdf:PlainLiteral
- 14:39:24 [csma]
- agendum+ WG future and schedule
- 14:39:32 [ChrisW]
- ChrisW has joined #rif
- 14:39:37 [csma]
- agendum+ Test cases
- 14:39:45 [csma]
- agendum+ AOB
- 14:39:54 [ChrisW]
- you've got it?
- 14:39:54 [csma]
- Hi, Chris
- 14:40:02 [csma]
- Yep, should be done
- 14:40:12 [csma]
- I moved rdf:PlainLiteral up the agenda
- 14:40:22 [csma]
- after our LC discussions
- 14:42:14 [ChrisW]
- k
- 14:59:38 [Zakim]
- SW_RIF()11:00AM has now started
- 14:59:40 [Hassan]
- Hassan has joined #rif
- 15:00:24 [ChrisW]
- rrsagent, make logs public
- 15:00:58 [ChrisW]
- zakim, this is rif
- 15:00:58 [Zakim]
- ChrisW, this was already SW_RIF()11:00AM
- 15:00:59 [Zakim]
- ok, ChrisW; that matches SW_RIF()11:00AM
- 15:01:05 [ChrisW]
- zakim, who is on the phone?
- 15:01:05 [Zakim]
- On the phone I see no one
- 15:01:15 [ChrisW]
- zakim, whats the problem?
- 15:01:15 [Zakim]
- I don't understand your question, ChrisW.
- 15:01:30 [StellaMitchell]
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- 15:01:44 [ChrisW]
- zakim, leave
- 15:01:44 [Zakim]
- Zakim has left #rif
- 15:01:51 [Zakim]
- Zakim has joined #rif
- 15:01:55 [ChrisW]
- zakim, this is rif
- 15:01:55 [Zakim]
- ok, ChrisW; that matches SW_RIF()11:00AM
- 15:02:04 [ChrisW]
- zakim, who is on the phone?
- 15:02:04 [Zakim]
- On the phone I see no one
- 15:02:16 [Harold]
- hi
- 15:02:44 [Hassan]
- Hassan has joined #rif
- 15:02:49 [csma]
- zakim, who is on the phone?
- 15:02:49 [Zakim]
- On the phone I see no one
- 15:02:57 [cke]
- cke has joined #RIF
- 15:03:54 [csma]
- zakim, list agenda
- 15:03:54 [Zakim]
- I see nothing on the agenda
- 15:04:28 [csma]
- agendum+ Admin
- 15:04:44 [csma]
- agendum+ liaisons
- 15:05:01 [csma]
- agendum+ Action review
- 15:05:06 [csma]
- agendum+ Last call publications
- 15:05:13 [csma]
- agendum+ rdf:PlainLiteral
- 15:05:19 [csma]
- agendum+ WG future and schedule
- 15:05:31 [csma]
- agendum+ Test cases
- 15:05:38 [csma]
- agendum+ AOB
- 15:06:04 [sandro]
- I am here, on the call.
- 15:06:12 [csma]
- I am on th ephone
- 15:06:15 [Harold]
- I am here, on the call.
- 15:06:29 [cke]
- I'm here, on the call. I hear you
- 15:06:45 [ChrisW]
- Attendees: ChrisW, csma, cke, Harold, Sandro, Stella, Hassan,
- 15:07:15 [AdrianP]
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- 15:08:21 [AxelPolleres]
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- 15:08:42 [csma]
- Scribe: Gary Hallmark
- 15:08:51 [Gary_Hallmark]
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- 15:09:06 [csma]
- scribenick: Gary
- 15:09:15 [ChrisW]
- Attendees: ChrisW, csma, cke, Harold, Sandro, Stella, Hassan, Gary, Axel, Adrian
- 15:09:40 [csma]
- next item
- 15:10:13 [Gary]
- csma: no minutes from last telecon?
- 15:10:26 [Gary]
- chris: no not there
- 15:11:00 [csma]
- next item
- 15:12:36 [csma]
- next item
- 15:12:46 [MichaelKifer]
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- 15:14:32 [ChrisW]
- Attendees: ChrisW, csma, cke, Harold, Sandro, Stella, Hassan, Gary, Axel, Adrian, Michael
- 15:14:43 [ChrisW]
- close action-832
- 15:14:43 [trackbot]
- ACTION-832 Update wording in intro & abstract to use "SHOULD" closed
- 15:15:58 [ChrisW]
- close action-826
- 15:15:58 [trackbot]
- ACTION-826 Add, if possible, an operational definition of safety closed
- 15:16:16 [ChrisW]
- close action-825
- 15:16:16 [trackbot]
- ACTION-825 Clarify in PRD that safeness is required to guarantee that constraint solving is not needed closed
- 15:19:06 [ChrisW]
- close action-772
- 15:19:06 [trackbot]
- ACTION-772 Review swc closed
- 15:20:13 [StellaMitchell]
- done
- 15:20:17 [ChrisW]
- close action-708
- 15:20:17 [trackbot]
- ACTION-708 Add import rejection test category to test cases and add combination constant equivalence test case closed
- 15:20:36 [Hassan]
- continued ...
- 15:20:45 [AxelPolleres]
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- 15:21:48 [AdrianP]
- not sure if it was reviewed as part of the Core reviews
- 15:21:52 [ChrisW]
- close action-439, no one from Aberdeen participates anymore
- 15:21:58 [ChrisW]
- close action-439
- 15:21:58 [trackbot]
- ACTION-439 Post test cases fir RIF closed
- 15:22:04 [csma]
- next item
- 15:23:53 [Michael_Kifer]
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- 15:24:01 [Gary]
- sandro: rdf:plainLiteral (was rdf:text) ready to publish June 11 (syncing with OWL)
- 15:24:01 [sandro]
- expecting actual publication date to be June 11.
- 15:24:30 [DaveReynolds]
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- 15:25:16 [Gary]
- csma: need to review Adrian's change to mathematical English
- 15:25:58 [AdrianP]
- added ground lists to http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wiki/Core#Terms_of_RIF-Core
- 15:26:15 [Gary]
- chris: keep subscripts in <tt> for easier to read ones (1)
- 15:27:14 [Gary]
- csma: close or review?
- 15:27:50 [Gary]
- chris: lists can contain function terms?
- 15:27:58 [Gary]
- csma: yes
- 15:28:11 [Gary]
- ... provided no variables of course
- 15:28:50 [ChrisW]
- close action-803
- 15:28:51 [trackbot]
- ACTION-803 Update mathematic syntax for Core to reflect restricted lists closed
- 15:30:01 [Gary]
- axel: will complete BLD and SWC actions today
- 15:31:58 [Zakim]
- irc bot will restart shortly; reinvite a minute or two after departure
- 15:32:07 [Gary]
- ... small changes to do in DTB for rdf:text
- 15:32:26 [sandro]
- Axel, the mail from Alan I'm talking about is: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-text/2009AprJun/0267.html
- 15:35:17 [Gary]
- we will Jos' DTB actions open
- 15:35:28 [Gary]
- s/will/will leave
- 15:35:31 [sandro]
- PROPOSED: the formal semantics of list operations, ACTION-814, can wait until after Last Call for DTB.
- 15:35:32 [AxelPolleres_]
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- 15:35:38 [sandro]
- +1
- 15:35:56 [ChrisW]
- We will make the change as editorial by CR
- 15:35:58 [ChrisW]
- +1
- 15:36:01 [Harold]
- +1
- 15:36:21 [Gary]
- +1
- 15:36:23 [AdrianP]
- +1
- 15:36:30 [DaveReynolds]
- +1
- 15:36:35 [StellaMitchell]
- +1
- 15:36:37 [AxelPolleres_]
- abstain, would feel better with the changes in , but can't commit to do it
- 15:36:46 [sandro]
- RESOLVED: the formal semantics of list operations, ACTION-814, can wait until after Last Call for DTB.
- 15:37:13 [Gary]
- chris: DTB is waiting on append and rdf:plainLiteral
- 15:37:39 [Gary]
- ...but not waiting for formal semantics of list ops
- 15:37:52 [csma]
- action: axel to do the name changes in DTB and rdf:PlainLiteral
- 15:37:52 [trackbot]
- Created ACTION-834 - Do the name changes in DTB and rdf:PlainLiteral [on Axel Polleres - due 2009-06-09].
- 15:39:58 [Gary]
- csma: PRD contingent on Chris' review of equivalence of semantics of conditions
- 15:40:21 [Gary]
- ...and Gary's review of safeness
- 15:42:53 [Zakim]
- Zakim has joined #rif
- 15:42:56 [sandro]
- zakim, who is on the call?
- 15:42:56 [Zakim]
- sorry, sandro, I don't know what conference this is
- 15:42:58 [Zakim]
- On IRC I see AxelPolleres, DaveReynolds, Michael_Kifer, Gary, AdrianP, cke, Hassan, StellaMitchell, ChrisW, RRSAgent, csma, sandro, MoZ, trackbot, Harold, hak
- 15:43:04 [sandro]
- zakim, this is rif
- 15:43:04 [Zakim]
- ok, sandro; that matches SW_RIF()11:00AM
- 15:43:06 [Gary]
- ...Gary wonders why PRD's safeness definition is completely different from Core
- 15:43:06 [sandro]
- zakim, who is on the call?
- 15:43:06 [Zakim]
- On the phone I see [IPcaller], [IBM], Hassan_Ait-Kaci, ??P11, [NRCC], Gues, Stella_Mitchell, Sandro, +1.503.533.aaaa, +3539149aabb, Michael_Kifer, ??P12
- 15:43:15 [ChrisW]
- zakim, ibm is temporarily me
- 15:43:15 [Zakim]
- +ChrisW; got it
- 15:43:37 [Zakim]
- with apologies -- another irc bot restart needed to recover a bridge connection
- 15:44:32 [Gary]
- csma: SWC status - for now, remove the proofs
- 15:44:57 [Gary]
- chris: SWC uses outdated defn of multistructures
- 15:46:02 [Gary]
- axel: can make some changes
- 15:46:16 [Gary]
- chris: will review Axel's SWC changes
- 15:46:58 [Gary]
- chris: happy w/ Michael's FLD edits
- 15:47:40 [Gary]
- chris: Core and BLD are ready to publish; others await actions
- 15:49:46 [AxelPolleres]
- q+
- 15:50:11 [csma]
- ack axel
- 15:50:25 [Gary]
- sandro: sparql and OWL now agree on syntax and semantics of rdf:plainLiteral
- 15:51:24 [Gary]
- ... oddly, rdf:plainLiteral doesn't appear in RDF graphs
- 15:52:42 [Gary]
- ... should the spec go to CR, or 2nd LC?
- 15:53:05 [Gary]
- chris: Axel needs to review
- 15:54:49 [Gary]
- csma: this doesn't affect RIF, so can't we make a resolution (for RIF)?
- 15:56:59 [Gary]
- sandro: OWL and sparql are reviewing the semweb compatibility aspects; we don't need to worry about it
- 15:57:23 [Gary]
- ... they seem to be doing the right things
- 15:57:47 [sandro]
- PROPOSED: We approve rdf:PlainLiteral (formerly rdf:text) as ready for Candidate Recommendation (or second Last Call, if others block it from being CR), pending completion of pending actions.
- 15:58:00 [sandro]
- PROPOSED: We approve rdf:PlainLiteral (formerly rdf:text) as ready for Candidate Recommendation (or second Last Call, if others block it from being CR), pending completion of pending actions and Axel's review.
- 15:59:21 [sandro]
- action-834?
- 15:59:21 [trackbot]
- ACTION-834 -- Axel Polleres to do the name changes in DTB and rdf:PlainLiteral -- due 2009-06-09 -- OPEN
- 15:59:21 [trackbot]
- http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wg/track/actions/834
- 16:01:06 [ChrisW]
- action: axel to review rdf:text this week
- 16:01:06 [trackbot]
- Created ACTION-835 - Review rdf:text this week [on Axel Polleres - due 2009-06-09].
- 16:02:23 [ChrisW]
- action: axel to address AlanR's comments
- 16:02:23 [trackbot]
- Created ACTION-836 - Address AlanR's comments [on Axel Polleres - due 2009-06-09].
- 16:02:30 [sandro]
- that's http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-text/2009AprJun/0267.html
- 16:02:31 [csma]
- PROPOSED: We approve rdf:PlainLiteral (formerly rdf:text) as ready for Candidate Recommendation (or second Last Call, if others block it from being CR), pending completion of action 834, 835 and 836.
- 16:02:46 [ChrisW]
- +1
- 16:02:51 [sandro]
- +1 (W3C)
- 16:02:55 [DaveReynolds]
- 0 [Don't object, think current position is probably best that can be achieved]
- 16:03:07 [Harold]
- +1
- 16:03:10 [Gary]
- +1
- 16:03:16 [Michael_Kifer]
- +1
- 16:03:22 [AdrianP]
- +1
- 16:03:26 [AxelPolleres]
- +1
- 16:04:15 [sandro]
- http://www.w3.org/Member/ACList still lists CSMA.
- 16:04:48 [csma]
- RESOLVED: We approve rdf:PlainLiteral (formerly rdf:text) as ready for Candidate Recommendation (or second Last Call, if others block it from being CR), pending completion of action 834, 835 and 836.
- 16:06:00 [Gary]
- csma: RIF needs FAQ
- 16:06:56 [Gary]
- ... all please submit some Qs
- 16:07:05 [Harold]
- >>What does "RIF" stand for, literally?<<
- 16:08:08 [csma]
- action: sandro to start an FAQ wiki
- 16:08:08 [trackbot]
- Created ACTION-837 - Start an FAQ wiki [on Sandro Hawke - due 2009-06-09].
- 16:08:12 [sandro]
- "literally", Harold?
- 16:09:40 [Gary]
- sandro: will check pubs fr broken inks, etc. Please fix problems promptly!
- 16:09:53 [Gary]
- s/fr/for
- 16:10:02 [Gary]
- s/inks/links
- 16:12:16 [ChanghaiKe]
- ChanghaiKe has joined #RIF
- 16:12:20 [Gary]
- sandro: RIF extended until end of Nov 2009
- 16:14:01 [sandro]
- that's NOT what I said Gary. I said I expected it would be, but such things are announced to the AC first, and this has not been announced.
- 16:14:08 [csma]
- http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wg/meeting/2009-04-17#future_of_the_WG
- 16:14:08 [Harold]
- Sandro, what about another (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GNU) recursive acronym: "RIF's In Flux"
- 16:14:42 [ChrisW]
- http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wiki/Extension_Request_2009
- 16:14:46 [sandro]
- Harold, is there some problem with "Rule Interchange Format"? That's what I've typed about 1000 times.
- 16:15:20 [ChrisW]
- I think Harold is being facetious
- 16:15:43 [ChrisW]
- ...as well as pointing out a legitimate faq
- 16:15:47 [ChanghaiKe]
- Christian, the network here is extremely slow
- 16:16:14 [Gary]
- s/extended/extension asked for/
- 16:16:38 [sandro]
- http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wg/meeting/2009-04-17
- 16:18:02 [Gary]
- csma: we plan 4 week last call comment deadline
- 16:18:29 [sandro]
- chris: July 10 as deadline for comments.
- 16:19:24 [sandro]
- chris: CR decision on July 31
- 16:20:34 [Gary]
- chris: (proposal) meet June 9, then every other week
- 16:21:13 [Gary]
- ... meet = RIF telecon
- 16:21:19 [sandro]
- chris: (4 weeks last call period)
- 16:22:41 [Gary]
- csma: if REC in Nov, when do we need implementations?
- 16:23:11 [Gary]
- sandro: transition from LC to CR may be overly optimistic
- 16:23:30 [Gary]
- ... at least 5 weeks
- 16:24:04 [sandro]
- csma: we need implementations done by the end of September.
- 16:24:13 [Gary]
- csma: implementors should start now (last call)
- 16:24:26 [Gary]
- sandro: implement what?
- 16:24:49 [Gary]
- ... e.g. all the different entailments, etc
- 16:25:20 [StellaMitchell]
- StellaMitchell has joined #rif
- 16:27:06 [ChrisW]
- Attendees: ChrisW, csma, cke, Harold, Sandro, Stella, Hassan, Gary, Axel, Adrian, Michael
- 16:27:21 [DaveReynolds]
- Dave
- 16:27:28 [ChrisW]
- Attendees: ChrisW, csma, cke, Harold, Sandro, Stella, Hassan, Gary, Axel, Adrian, Michael, Dave
- 16:27:52 [csma]
- rrsagent, make minutes
- 16:27:52 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/06/02-rif-minutes.html csma
- 16:28:06 [AxelPolleres]
- Sandro...( maybe also dave?) can you stay on the phgone for some question on the recent discussions on rdf:text?
- 16:28:37 [AxelPolleres]
- too late to catch dave... :-/
- 16:40:17 [AxelPolleres]
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