15:59:51 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #html-wg
15:59:51 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2009/04/02-html-wg-irc
15:59:53 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public
15:59:55 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be HTML
15:59:55 <Zakim> ok, trackbot, I see HTML_WG()12:00PM already started
15:59:56 <trackbot> Meeting: HTML Weekly Teleconference
15:59:56 <trackbot> Date: 02 April 2009
16:00:08 <ChrisWilson> agenda+ ask for additional issues
16:00:18 <ChrisWilson> agenda+ discuss open/pending review items
16:00:22 <dsinger> dsinger has joined #html-wg
16:00:25 <ChrisWilson> agenda+ discuss overdue actions
16:00:41 <Zakim> +[Apple]
16:00:45 <ChrisWilson> zakim, who is here?
16:00:45 <Zakim> On the phone I see masinter, Julian, ChrisWilson, Shepazu, smedero, Keio, [Apple]
16:00:48 <Zakim> On IRC I see dsinger, RRSAgent, aroben, masinter, smedero, Zakim, ChrisWilson, MichaelC, dbaron, shepazu, Julian, maddiin, krijn, ROBOd, gavin_, heycam, tH, pimpbot, phenny,
16:00:51 <dsinger> zakim, [apple] has dsinger
16:00:52 <Zakim> ... MikeSmith, xover, nico, anne, drry, sryo1, deltab, timelyx, DanC, karl, Dashiva, gsnedders, hober, gavin, jmb, Philip, jgraham, hsivonen, Hixie, wilhelm, ed_work, inimino,
16:00:55 <Zakim> ... trackbot, Yudai
16:00:55 <Zakim> +dsinger; got it
16:01:08 <dbaron> dbaron has left #html-wg
16:01:10 <ChrisWilson> zakim, take up item 1
16:01:10 <Zakim> agendum 1. "ask for scribe" taken up [from ChrisWilson]
16:01:19 <MikeSmith> Zakim, Keio has MikeSmith 
16:01:19 <Zakim> +MikeSmith; got it
16:01:39 <ChrisWilson> zakim, pick a scribe
16:01:39 <Zakim> Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose Shepazu
16:01:42 <rubys1> rubys1 has joined #html-wg
16:01:56 <MikeSmith> shepazu: ↑
16:02:27 <Zakim> +Sam
16:02:56 <ChrisWilson> zakim, pick a scribe
16:02:56 <Zakim> Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose smedero
16:03:01 <smedero> sure
16:03:10 <ChrisWilson> Thanks Shawn
16:03:17 <MikeSmith> scribenick: smedero 
16:03:24 <ChrisWilson> zakim, close item 1
16:03:24 <Zakim> agendum 1, ask for scribe, closed
16:03:25 <Zakim> I see 3 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
16:03:27 <Zakim> 2. ask for additional issues [from ChrisWilson]
16:03:30 <ChrisWilson> zakin, take up 2
16:03:33 <ChrisWilson> zakin, take up item 2
16:03:34 <MikeSmith> scribe: ShawnMedero
16:03:41 <Julian> m
16:03:42 <ChrisWilson> zakim, take up 2
16:03:42 <Zakim> I don't understand 'take up 2', ChrisWilson
16:03:46 <ChrisWilson> zakim, take up item 2
16:03:46 <Zakim> agendum 2. "ask for additional issues" taken up [from ChrisWilson]
16:04:16 <ChrisWilson> zakim, close item 2
16:04:16 <Zakim> agendum 2, ask for additional issues, closed
16:04:18 <Zakim> I see 2 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
16:04:19 <Zakim> 3. discuss open/pending review items [from ChrisWilson]
16:04:21 <ChrisWilson> zakim, take up item 3
16:04:21 <Zakim> agendum 3. "discuss open/pending review items" taken up [from ChrisWilson]
16:04:40 <ChrisWilson> issue-54, action-103?
16:04:55 <ChrisWilson> action-103?
16:04:55 <trackbot> ACTION-103 -- Lachlan Hunt to track registration of about: URI scheme -- due 2009-03-17 -- OPEN
16:04:55 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/actions/103
16:04:56 <pimpbot> Title: ACTION-103 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
16:05:28 <Julian> q+
16:05:44 <smedero> masinter: There's something wrong with this action item, it is not clear who is tracking it
16:05:45 <pimpbot> Title: IRC logs: freenode / #whatwg / 20090331 (at krijnhoetmer.nl)
16:06:35 <rubys1> http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-holsten-about-uri-scheme-00.
16:06:36 <pimpbot> Title: draft-holsten-about-uri-scheme-00 - The 'about' URI scheme (at tools.ietf.org)
16:06:47 <tlr> tlr has joined #html-wg
16:07:32 <smedero> Julian: There were a few issues raised with the draft and no revised draft has been submitted yet
16:08:07 <Julian> http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-holsten-about-uri-scheme-00
16:08:08 <pimpbot> Title: draft-holsten-about-uri-scheme-00 - The 'about' URI scheme (at tools.ietf.org)
16:08:18 <rubys> q+
16:08:24 <Julian> q-
16:08:28 <masinter> http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/uri-review/current/maillist.html
16:08:29 <pimpbot> Title: Proposed URI Schemes Discussion List (at www.ietf.org)
16:08:31 <ChrisWilson> ack Julian
16:08:39 <ChrisWilson> ack rubys
16:08:40 <smedero> Topic: about: URI scheme
16:09:06 <shepazu> http://krijnhoetmer.nl/irc-logs/whatwg/20090331#l-336
16:09:33 <smedero> rubys: Do we want to address Henri Sivonen's objection?
16:09:39 <LHSilli> LHSilli has joined #html-wg
16:10:19 <Julian> I think the title is fine.
16:10:30 <smedero> s/objection/concerns/
16:10:33 <masinter>   Send a copy of the template or a pointer to the containing
16:10:33 <masinter>        document (with specific reference to the section with the
16:10:33 <masinter>        template) to the mailing list uri-review@ietf.org, requesting
16:10:33 <masinter>        review.  In addition, request review on other mailing lists as
16:10:37 <masinter>        appropriate.  For example, general discussion of URI syntactical
16:10:40 <masinter>        issues could be discussed on uri@w3.org; schemes for a network
16:10:43 <masinter>        protocol could be discussed on a mailing list for that protocol.
16:10:46 <masinter>        Allow a reasonable time for discussion and comments.  Four weeks
16:10:49 <masinter>        is reasonable for a permanent registration requests.
16:11:12 <Julian> q+
16:11:14 <masinter> \]
16:11:17 <shepazu> [I note this is not a very inclusive definition of "the WG", whereas he and all of the browser vendors are in the WG]
16:11:18 <ChrisWilson> ack j
16:12:17 <Zakim> +Cynthia_Shelly
16:12:24 <smedero> rrsagent, draft minutes
16:12:24 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/04/02-html-wg-minutes.html smedero
16:12:26 <masinter> http://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc/rfc4395.txt
16:13:17 <smedero> ChrisWilson: I'm confused here, because we have come with a solution that doesn't require further changes in the spec
16:13:43 <smedero> ChrisWilson: Until the registration of the about: URI scheme is completed
16:13:59 <smedero> masinter: There is a change to the spec but it is pending some other action
16:14:25 <smedero> Sam: The change to the spec has happened
16:15:27 <smedero> masinter: Ok I remember, the change to spec happened and was conditional on the about: URI scheme registration being completed.
16:15:45 <smedero> ChrisWilson: So an email has not been sent yet to complete the registration?
16:16:29 <smedero> ChrisWilson: I will update the action title and move it to next week
16:16:33 <ChrisWilson> action-68?
16:16:33 <trackbot> ACTION-68 -- Dan Connolly to try factoring URI/URL stuff out as a separate draft -- due 2009-03-18 -- PENDINGREVIEW
16:16:33 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/actions/68
16:16:34 <pimpbot> Title: ACTION-68 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
16:16:50 <smedero> Topic: ACTION-68 - factoring URI/URL stuff out as a separate draft
16:17:04 <smedero> masinter: There was discussion of this at the IETF meeting last week
16:17:36 <smedero> masinter: There's been some discussion on the list about merging this with the IRI or URI spec
16:18:01 <masinter> action-118?
16:18:01 <trackbot> ACTION-118 -- Dan Connolly to reformat the document on URLs in HTML 5 as an Internet Draft -- due 2009-04-06 -- OPEN
16:18:01 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/actions/118
16:18:03 <pimpbot> Title: ACTION-118 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
16:18:23 <ChrisWilson> action-72?
16:18:23 <trackbot> ACTION-72 -- Sam Ruby to monitor progress of testing re 20 Dec HTML 5 spec draft and test materials from WCAG 2 -- due 2009-03-26 -- OPEN
16:18:23 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/actions/72
16:18:24 <smedero> Sam: I suggest we close out ACTION-68 and leave ACTION-118 open
16:18:24 <pimpbot> Title: ACTION-72 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
16:19:49 <MikeSmith> I suggest just closing that
16:19:52 <MikeSmith> it was about headers
16:19:56 <smedero> Topic: ACTION-72: monitor progress of testing table-headers re 20 Dec HTML 5 spec draft and test materials from WCAG 2
16:19:59 <MikeSmith> somebody retitled it
16:20:13 <ChrisWilson> q?
16:20:20 <smedero> Sam: I suggested we closed this and DanC had some concerns surrounding the test materials.
16:20:43 <MikeSmith> I would just close it and let Dan re-open it if he objects
16:20:45 <smedero> ChrisWilson: Lets leave it up to DanC to decide whether to close it or make it something actionable.
16:21:12 <ChrisWilson> action-99?
16:21:12 <trackbot> ACTION-99 -- Sam Ruby to review @profile -- due 2009-03-26 -- OPEN
16:21:12 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/actions/99
16:21:13 <pimpbot> Title: ACTION-99 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
16:21:24 <jgraham> Since nothing else has blocked on tests, it seems strange for this one issue to do so
16:21:26 <smedero> Topic: ACTION-99 - Review @profile
16:22:08 <ChrisWilson> action-108?
16:22:08 <trackbot> ACTION-108 -- Larry Masinter to ask the TAG to consider HTML in particular in its work on versioning -- due 2009-03-30 -- OPEN
16:22:08 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/actions/108
16:22:10 <pimpbot> Title: ACTION-108 - HTML Weekly Tracker (at www.w3.org)
16:22:34 <smedero> Topic: ACTION-108 - Ask the TAG to consider HTML in particular in its work on versioning
16:23:34 <smedero> masinter: I did bring this up with the TAG. Most of the discussion has been without a framework to discuss alternatives
16:23:46 <tlr> tlr has joined #html-wg
16:24:18 <smedero> masinter: I don't mind keeping the action open and changing the title.
16:24:35 <ChrisWilson> action-114?
16:24:35 <trackbot> ACTION-114 -- Cynthia Shelly to report progress on ARIA TF due 26 Mar 2009 -- due 2009-03-26 -- OPEN
16:24:35 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/actions/114
16:24:41 <smedero> ChrisWilson: I'll move it out two weeks and change the title to say "Report back..."
16:25:31 <smedero> Cynthia_Shelly: I am going to put a placeholder for the API mapping draft up this afternoon
16:25:51 <smedero> Cynthia_Shelly: We're having status meetings every two weeks
16:26:02 <ChrisWilson> action-115?
16:26:02 <trackbot> ACTION-115 -- Dan Connolly to set up WBS for HTML WG participants to @@ reTPAC 2009 -- due 2009-04-07 -- OPEN
16:26:02 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/actions/115
16:26:21 <smedero> ChrisWilson: I don't know that DanC actually did this
16:26:32 <ChrisWilson> action-116?
16:26:32 <trackbot> ACTION-116 -- Michael(tm) Smith to coordinate review of current H:TML draft -- due 2009-04-23 -- OPEN
16:26:32 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/actions/116
16:27:21 <ChrisWilson> action-117?
16:27:21 <trackbot> ACTION-117 -- Doug Schepers to get svg working group to propose specific text -- due 2009-03-26 -- OPEN
16:27:21 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/actions/117
16:27:21 <smedero> MikeSmith: I think this is a duplicate of another action item
16:27:43 <smedero> Shepazu: We followed through on this but the editor doesn't like to work that way
16:28:23 <smedero> Shepazu: The SVG WG has decided it is not good use of time to discuss things just on our mailing list or telecons. It is faster to cross-post our threads to HTML.
16:28:46 <smedero> Shepazu: We spent a lot of time putting the proposal together and we didn't feel like it was a good use of our time
16:28:54 <smedero> Sam: So this action is done?
16:29:07 <smedero> Shepazu: Yes, though the larger topic is still ongoing
16:29:30 <Julian> We have http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/37
16:29:35 <smedero> issue-37?
16:29:35 <trackbot> ISSUE-37 -- Integration of SVG and MathML into text/html -- OPEN
16:29:35 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/37
16:30:01 <smedero> ChrisWilson: I'm under the impression that the SVG WG isn't happy with the current draft
16:30:23 <smedero> Shepazu: It is not that we're not happy with the current draft but there are certain changes we'd like to see made.
16:30:30 <smedero> Shepazu: We're just not sure how to move forward
16:31:04 <smedero> Shepazu: The only way we see things moving is if a browser vendor comes forward and notes implementation issues 
16:32:23 <smedero> masinter: That's your prediction of the future given past behavior of this working group?
16:32:51 <smedero> Shepazu: That's the way I see it working
16:33:46 <tlr> tlr has joined #html-wg
16:34:17 <smedero> Shepazu: I think the larger goal of trying to get SVG into HTML is what we are all working for... some of the details may not be the way HTML WG or SVG WG would like.
16:34:42 <smedero> Shepazu: Implementation experience tends to carry a lot of weight in this group
16:35:05 <smedero> ChrisWilson: Sounds like we should close this action item.
16:35:26 <smedero> masinter: Is there a way we could encourage implementations
16:35:54 <smedero> Shepazu: There is implementation work. Henri Sivonen is working on updating his parser
16:36:42 <smedero> Shepazu: I could outline in a wiki some work that the SVG WG think needs to be done to test performance issues
16:37:05 <smedero> Shepazu: The existing action is done though. 
16:37:25 <ChrisWilson> issue-20?
16:37:25 <trackbot> ISSUE-20 -- Improvements to the table-headers algorithm in the HTML 5 spec -- RAISED
16:37:25 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/20
16:37:28 <masinter> will we raise a new action to track the implementaiton work?
16:37:34 <jmb> fwiw, hubbub (http://netsurf-browser.org/projects/hubbub) supports the SVG parsing parts of the current specification
16:38:01 <ChrisWilson> masinter: if you can come up with an actionable action, go ahead and file it
16:38:23 <smedero> Topic: ISSUE-20 table-headers
16:38:29 <shepazu> s/Henri Sivonen is working on updating his parser/Henri Sivonen is working on a parser for Mozilla/
16:39:08 <ChrisWilson> has anyone reviewed the spec changes for th/td association, wrt issue-20?
16:39:32 <smedero> wasn't this the point of DanC's action?
16:39:43 <smedero> to write and run tests on table-headers...
16:40:24 <smedero> ACTION-72?
16:40:24 <trackbot> ACTION-72 -- Sam Ruby to monitor progress of testing re 20 Dec HTML 5 spec draft and test materials from WCAG 2 -- due 2009-04-09 -- OPEN
16:40:24 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/actions/72
16:41:34 <adele> adele has joined #html-wg
16:42:40 <ChrisWilson> issue-52?
16:42:40 <trackbot> ISSUE-52 -- Respond to XHTML2 WG objections to language in HTML5 draft regarding XHTML1 -- RAISED
16:42:40 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/52
16:42:57 <smedero> Topic: ISSUE-52 - Respond to XHTML2 WG objections to language in HTML5 draft regarding XHTML1
16:43:22 <Julian> q+
16:43:43 <smedero> ChrisWilson: You filed this initially, do you have an update?
16:44:00 <ChrisWilson> ack j
16:44:00 <smedero> MikeSmith: Things have happened since this issue has opened that invalidate this issue
16:44:12 <ChrisWilson> s/You/MikeSmith, you
16:44:23 <smedero> s/since this issue has opened/since this issue was opened/
16:45:21 <ChrisWilson> issue-72?
16:45:21 <trackbot> ISSUE-72 -- Need to make it publicly clear that http://www.w3.org/TR/web-forms-2/ is obsoleted by HTML5 -- RAISED
16:45:21 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/tracker/issues/72
16:45:50 <smedero> MikeSmith: The placeholder was put up for ISSUE-72, it can be closed out
16:45:51 <ChrisWilson> zakim, agenda?
16:45:51 <Zakim> I see 2 items remaining on the agenda:
16:45:52 <Zakim> 3. discuss open/pending review items [from ChrisWilson]
16:45:54 <Zakim> 4. discuss overdue actions [from ChrisWilson]
16:45:58 <ChrisWilson> zakim, close item 3
16:45:58 <Zakim> agendum 3, discuss open/pending review items, closed
16:45:59 <Zakim> I see 1 item remaining on the agenda:
16:46:00 <Zakim> 4. discuss overdue actions [from ChrisWilson]
16:46:02 <ChrisWilson> zakim, close item 4
16:46:02 <Zakim> agendum 4, discuss overdue actions, closed
16:46:03 <Zakim> I see nothing remaining on the agenda
16:46:06 <smedero> rrsagent, draft minutes
16:46:06 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/04/02-html-wg-minutes.html smedero
16:46:14 <Julian> q+
16:46:16 <ChrisWilson> any other discussions people want to have?
16:46:19 <ChrisWilson> ack j
16:47:03 <smedero> Chair: ChrisWilson
16:49:18 <smedero> ( scribe misses a bunch of discussion surrounding whether or not to open an issue concerning this thread: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2009Apr/0017.html )
16:49:33 <Julian> I will open an issue.
16:51:04 <dsinger> q+
16:51:32 <Julian> q+
16:52:40 <ChrisWilson> ack dsinger
16:54:56 <Julian> RFC 4329
16:55:06 <ChrisWilson> ack j
17:01:21 <Zakim> -masinter
17:01:28 <Zakim> -Keio
17:01:29 <ChrisWilson> bye
17:01:30 <Zakim> -Julian
17:01:31 <Zakim> -ChrisWilson
17:01:32 <Zakim> -[Apple]
17:01:34 <smedero> rrsagent, draft minutes
17:01:34 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/04/02-html-wg-minutes.html smedero
17:01:34 <Zakim> -Cynthia_Shelly
17:01:35 <Zakim> -Sam
17:01:51 <Zakim> -Shepazu
17:03:47 <smedero> Regrets: DanC, Joshue
17:05:14 <LHSilli> LHSilli has left #html-wg
17:06:04 <smedero> rrsagent, draft minutes
17:06:04 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/04/02-html-wg-minutes.html smedero
17:06:28 <smedero> rrsagent, make minutes public
17:06:28 <RRSAgent> I'm logging. I don't understand 'make minutes public', smedero.  Try /msg RRSAgent help
17:06:39 <smedero> rrsagent, make log public
17:06:44 <smedero> rrsagent, bye
17:06:44 <RRSAgent> I see no action items