IRC log of sparql on 2009-03-03

Timestamps are in UTC.

14:16:10 [RRSAgent]
RRSAgent has joined #sparql
14:16:10 [RRSAgent]
logging to
14:16:25 [ericP]
Zakim, space for 20 for 2 hours?
14:16:25 [Zakim]
I don't understand your question, ericP.
14:16:56 [LeeF_]
zakim, you're not alone
14:16:56 [Zakim]
I don't understand 'you're not alone', LeeF_
14:17:11 [ericP]
everyone's a critic
14:19:17 [dom]
dom has joined #sparql
14:19:21 [LeeF_]
Should I copy&paste introductions onto the wiki, or just link to public-rdf-dawg archives? leaning towards the latter, as the Internet is crowded as is
14:19:23 [dom]
dom has left #sparql
14:19:37 [ericP]
14:19:41 [ericP]
14:19:48 [LeeF_]
14:20:55 [ericP]
Zakim, room for 20 for 2 hours?
14:20:55 [Zakim]
I don't understand your question, ericP.
14:21:43 [ericP]
Zakim, room for 20 for 120 minutes?
14:21:45 [Zakim]
sorry, ericP; could not schedule an adhoc conference; passcode overlap; if you do not have a fixed code you may try again
14:21:55 [ericP]
Zakim, this will be SPARQL
14:21:55 [Zakim]
ok, ericP; I see SW_(SPARQL)10:00AM scheduled to start in 39 minutes
14:22:00 [ericP]
fine, whatever
14:22:22 [LeeF]
14:22:48 [LeeF]
ericP, can you make sure we've got a tracker request in progress? i think sandro said he didn't see one in the DB
14:23:02 [ericP]
trackbot, how's it hanging?
14:23:02 [trackbot]
Sorry, ericP, I don't understand 'trackbot, how's it hanging?'. Please refer to for help
14:24:49 [LeeF]
trackbot, status
14:25:08 [LeeF]
trackbot, you need remedial match classes
14:25:08 [trackbot]
Sorry, LeeF, I don't understand 'trackbot, you need remedial match classes'. Please refer to for help
14:25:17 [LeeF]
14:26:28 [john-l]
john-l has joined #sparql
14:27:53 [LeeF]
ericP, I have no idea how to tell if trackbot is configured for us or what or where
14:34:24 [ericP]
the sparql tracker setup is yet untested, but probably fine
14:34:44 [LeeF]
does it have a URL somewhere in Web space?
14:35:01 [LeeF]
ACTION: LeeF to see if the SPARQL tracker is setup correctly
14:35:01 [trackbot]
Sorry, couldn't find user - LeeF
14:35:27 [LeeF]
action -1
14:35:28 [trackbot]
Sorry, bad ACTION syntax
14:35:42 [LeeF]
how does this thing learn about users?
14:37:17 [LeeF]
trackbot, status?
14:38:49 [LeeF]
zakim, tracker, RRSAgent, please fight to the death
14:38:49 [Zakim]
I don't understand you, LeeF
14:39:23 [ericP]
LeeF, i'm about to gather my compost and head to the 'tute
14:39:28 [ericP]
try asking on #sysreq
14:39:38 [ericP]
'cause i have no idea how to use tracker
14:40:09 [LeeF]
ericP, ack
14:43:02 [sandro]
wow, that's a lot of users. Heh....
14:44:23 [kasei]
kasei has joined #sparql
14:44:54 [LeeF]
sandro, are you able to illuminate me in how to find the sparql tracker & how to add users?
14:46:51 [LeeF]
Scribe: ericP
14:46:54 [LeeF]
Chair: LeeF
14:47:07 [LeeF]
14:47:11 [LeeF]
14:47:27 [LeeF]
agenda + admin
14:47:31 [LeeF]
aegnda + logistics
14:47:35 [LeeF]
agenda + liaisons
14:47:38 [sandro]
Lee, I don't think tracker knows about sparql. The systems team has to tell it to connect this IRC channel to group 35463, then it should just know who is who.
14:47:55 [LeeF]
ok, thanks, I will mail them myseld
14:47:58 [LeeF]
myself, even
14:48:00 [LeeF]
agenda -2
14:48:04 [LeeF]
agenda + logistics
14:48:08 [LeeF]
agenda + liaisons
14:48:12 [LeeF]
agenda + face to face
14:48:17 [LeeF]
agenda + gathering use cases
14:48:22 [AndyS]
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14:51:22 [LeeF]
zakim, code?
14:51:22 [Zakim]
the conference code is 77277 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 tel:+ tel:+44.117.370.6152), LeeF
14:51:45 [Zakim]
SW_(SPARQL)10:00AM has now started
14:51:52 [Zakim]
14:52:00 [LeeF]
zakim, Lee_Feigenbaum is always me
14:52:00 [Zakim]
I don't understand 'Lee_Feigenbaum is always me', LeeF
14:52:02 [LeeF]
zakim, Lee_Feigenbaum is me
14:52:02 [Zakim]
+LeeF; got it
14:54:26 [LeeF]
Time zone fun. If the US starts daylight savings time but no one else does, and we fix around US time, then the meeting is (a) 1 hour earlier for everyone else, or (b) 1 hour later for everyone else?
14:54:41 [Zakim]
14:54:56 [LeeF]
I'm going with (a)
14:55:40 [iv_an_ru]
Hello LeeF, I think I'll split list of extensions tomorrow, not today. BTW is our wiki supposed to be visible for public or we do not "advertize" it?
14:55:40 [Zakim]
14:55:48 [AndyS]
zakim, ??P16 is me
14:55:48 [Zakim]
+AndyS; got it
14:56:04 [ivan]
ivan has joined #sparql
14:56:22 [LeeF]
hi iv_an_ru, tomorrow's fine - our goal is to gather by next week
14:56:34 [LeeF]
And the wiki should indeed be public, we conduct our business in public
14:56:35 [SteveH]
SteveH has joined #sparql
14:57:06 [chimezie]
chimezie has joined #sparql
14:57:10 [LeeF]
agenda + wiki & communications are public
14:57:17 [ywang4]
ywang4 has joined #sparql
14:57:27 [Zakim]
14:57:31 [Zakim]
14:57:37 [bijan]
bijan has joined #sparql
14:57:41 [LukeWM]
LukeWM has joined #sparql
14:57:49 [Zakim]
+ +1.216.445.aaaa
14:57:53 [terraces]
terraces has joined #sparql
14:57:54 [Zakim]
14:57:56 [LeeF]
zakim, bijan is P21
14:57:56 [Zakim]
sorry, LeeF, I do not recognize a party named 'bijan'
14:57:58 [LeeF]
zakim, bijan is ??P21
14:57:58 [Zakim]
sorry, LeeF, I do not recognize a party named 'bijan'
14:58:01 [bijan]
zakim, ??P21 is me
14:58:01 [Zakim]
+bijan; got it
14:58:02 [LeeF]
zakim, P21 is bijan
14:58:02 [Zakim]
sorry, LeeF, I do not recognize a party named 'P21'
14:58:13 [bijan]
zakim, mute me
14:58:13 [Zakim]
bijan should now be muted
14:58:15 [Zakim]
14:58:26 [SteveH]
Zakim, ??P29 is [Garlik]
14:58:26 [Zakim]
+[Garlik]; got it
14:58:34 [Zakim]
14:58:40 [Zakim]
14:58:47 [LeeF]
zakim, aaaa is john-l
14:58:47 [Zakim]
+john-l; got it
14:59:06 [Zakim]
14:59:11 [terraces]
Zakim: 31 is me
14:59:37 [LeeF]
zakim, ??P31 is terraces
14:59:37 [Zakim]
+terraces; got it
14:59:39 [terraces]
Zakim, ??31 is me
14:59:39 [Zakim]
sorry, terraces, I do not recognize a party named '??31'
14:59:44 [AxelPolleres]
AxelPolleres has joined #sparql
14:59:51 [LeeF]
zakim, ??P19 is AxelPolleres
14:59:51 [Zakim]
+AxelPolleres; got it
14:59:54 [terraces]
Zakim, ??P31 is me
14:59:54 [Zakim]
I already had ??P31 as terraces, terraces
14:59:58 [LeeF]
zakim, who's here?
14:59:58 [Zakim]
On the phone I see LeeF, kasei (muted), AndyS, bijan (muted), ??P26, john-l, iv_an_ru, [Garlik], Chimezie_Ogbuji, terraces, AxelPolleres
14:59:59 [iv_an_ru]
zakim, ?31 is terraces
15:00:03 [AxelPolleres]
THanks, accifently called before logging to irc
15:00:06 [Zakim]
sorry, iv_an_ru, I do not recognize a party named '?31'
15:00:16 [Zakim]
15:00:18 [Zakim]
On IRC I see AxelPolleres, terraces, LukeWM, bijan, ywang4, chimezie, SteveH, ivan, AndyS, kasei, john-l, RRSAgent, Zakim, LeeF, AndyS_, iv_an_ru, trackbot, sandro, ericP
15:00:32 [ivan]
zakim, ivan.a is ivan
15:00:43 [Zakim]
+ivan; got it
15:01:27 [LeeF]
zakim, who's here?
15:01:31 [Zakim]
+ +656304aabb
15:01:35 [ywang4]
I am
15:01:37 [ywang4]
Yimin here
15:01:56 [LeeF]
zakim, aabb is ywang4
15:01:57 [Zakim]
On the phone I see LeeF, kasei (muted), AndyS, bijan (muted), ??P26, john-l, iv_an_ru, [Garlik], Chimezie_Ogbuji, terraces, AxelPolleres, ivan, +656304aabb
15:02:29 [Zakim]
On IRC I see AxelPolleres, terraces, LukeWM, bijan, ywang4, chimezie, SteveH, ivan, AndyS, kasei, john-l, RRSAgent, Zakim, LeeF, AndyS_, iv_an_ru, trackbot, sandro, ericP
15:02:33 [Zakim]
+ywang4; got it
15:02:34 [AxelPolleres]
who's scribing?
15:03:23 [Zakim]
15:03:49 [AxelPolleres]
scribe: AxelPolleres
15:04:11 [LeeF]
-> agenda
15:04:12 [AxelPolleres]
scribenick: AxelPolleres
15:05:06 [AxelPolleres]
Lee: clarification... Wg is open only to W3C members, although we conduct work in public
15:05:33 [AxelPolleres]
... minutes, agenda, wiki are all public and encouraged to be shared.
15:05:59 [LeeF]
15:06:09 [AxelPolleres]
... if you want to keep something non-public, mail us (team/chairs)
15:06:19 [LeeF]
topic: admin
15:06:31 [Zakim]
+ +1.603.897.aacc
15:06:48 [LeeF]
-> minutes from last week
15:06:56 [AxelPolleres]
minutes from last time are on the web.
15:07:06 [AxelPolleres]
PROPOSED: accept minutes from last week
15:07:07 [LeeF]
zakim, aacc is Souri
15:07:07 [Zakim]
+Souri; got it
15:07:12 [ericP]
Zakim, please dial ericP-office
15:07:12 [Zakim]
ok, ericP; the call is being made
15:07:14 [Zakim]
15:07:19 [Zakim]
15:07:23 [bijan]
I just look and they look ok
15:07:30 [AxelPolleres]
RESOLVED: minutes from last week approved
15:07:40 [john-l]
Zakim: mute me
15:07:44 [LeeF]
scribenick: ericP
15:08:12 [AxelPolleres]
scribe: Eric P.
15:08:13 [ericP]
next meeting: 10am US time
15:08:48 [LeeF]
zakim, who's speaking?
15:08:59 [Zakim]
LeeF, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: LeeF (31%), AndyS (13%), Souri (38%)
15:09:01 [LeeF]
14:00 UTC next meeting
15:09:06 [ericP]
lastlog trackbot
15:09:12 [AxelPolleres]
Zakim, mute Souri
15:09:12 [Zakim]
Souri should now be muted
15:09:33 [ericP]
trackbot, start teleconf
15:09:33 [LeeF]
topic: logistics
15:09:37 [trackbot]
RRSAgent, make logs world
15:09:39 [trackbot]
Zakim, this will be No Teleconference
15:09:39 [Zakim]
I do not see a conference matching that name scheduled within the next hour, trackbot
15:09:40 [trackbot]
Meeting: AC Meeting attendees group Teleconference
15:09:40 [trackbot]
Date: 03 March 2009
15:09:56 [AxelPolleres]
15:10:26 [LeeF]
zakim, mute ericP
15:10:26 [Zakim]
sorry, LeeF, I don't know what conference this is
15:10:32 [LeeF]
zakim, this is SPARQL
15:10:32 [Zakim]
ok, LeeF; that matches SW_(SPARQL)10:00AM
15:10:33 [dom]
dom has joined #sparql
15:10:37 [LeeF]
zakim, mute ericP
15:10:37 [Zakim]
EricP should now be muted
15:10:51 [LeeF]
-> p://
15:10:57 [LeeF]
15:11:15 [dom]
RRSAgent, pointer?
15:11:15 [RRSAgent]
15:11:37 [Zakim]
15:11:45 [LeeF]
-> scribe list
15:13:30 [trackbot]
Getting data for channel #sparql at failed - alert sysreq of a possible bug
15:14:18 [ericP]
LeeF: we have intros linked from the wiki
15:14:29 [LeeF]
zakim, who's here?
15:14:29 [Zakim]
On the phone I see LeeF, kasei (muted), AndyS, bijan (muted), john-l, iv_an_ru, [Garlik], Chimezie_Ogbuji, terraces, AxelPolleres, ivan, ywang4, Souri (muted), EricP (muted), Ori,
15:14:30 [ericP]
... encourage others to supply intros
15:14:33 [Zakim]
... daveNewman
15:14:34 [Zakim]
On IRC I see dom, AxelPolleres, terraces, LukeWM, bijan, ywang4, chimezie, SteveH, ivan, AndyS, kasei, john-l, RRSAgent, Zakim, LeeF, AndyS_, iv_an_ru, trackbot, sandro, ericP
15:14:50 [ericP]
john-l: chime and i missed last week
15:15:03 [dom]
trackbot, start meeting
15:15:04 [ericP]
... 2nd rep for cleveland clinic (cleveburg OH)
15:15:23 [ericP]
... chime and i are working on an impl, hoping to push mods back into spec
15:15:28 [trackbot]
RRSAgent, make logs world
15:15:32 [trackbot]
Zakim, this will be No Teleconference
15:15:32 [Zakim]
I do not see a conference matching that name scheduled within the next hour, trackbot
15:15:34 [trackbot]
Meeting: SPARQL Working Group Teleconference
15:15:35 [ericP]
chime: john-l and i work on a patient registry
15:15:36 [trackbot]
Date: 03 March 2009
15:15:52 [ericP]
... we've done a hand full of improvements. expect they are useful in general
15:15:58 [ericP]
ivan: ivan the elder
15:16:07 [ericP]
... W3C semweb activity lead
15:16:13 [ericP]
... 2nd contact
15:16:28 [ericP]
yimin: working in lilly singapore
15:16:44 [ericP]
... working on data integration projects in lilly
15:16:58 [ericP]
... looking for insert/delete, stuff like that
15:17:11 [LeeF]
zakim, unmute Souri
15:17:11 [Zakim]
sorry, LeeF, I don't know what conference this is
15:17:16 [LeeF]
zakim, this is SPARQL
15:17:16 [Zakim]
ok, LeeF; that matches SW_(SPARQL)10:00AM
15:17:18 [ivan]
zakim, mute me
15:17:18 [Zakim]
ivan should now be muted
15:17:21 [LeeF]
zakim, unmute Souri
15:17:21 [Zakim]
Souri should no longer be muted
15:17:43 [ericP]
souri: Souri Das, Oracle
15:18:27 [ericP]
souri: was part of DAWG. passionate about it as i expect it to be useful for DI in general
15:18:52 [LeeF]
topic: liaisons
15:19:13 [dom]
dom has left #sparql
15:19:22 [ericP]
LeeF, we might want a tracker intro under logistics
15:19:39 [LeeF]
ericP, yes, i agree, but am not prepared to do it at the moment :)
15:19:44 [ericP]
AxelPolleres: liasons are supposed to connect us with other groups touching our work
15:20:07 [ericP]
... need liasons with three W3C groups:
15:20:10 [bijan]
15:20:11 [ericP]
... .. OWL
15:20:14 [ericP]
... .. RIF
15:20:19 [ericP]
... .. RdfRDB
15:20:21 [bijan]
HCLS interest group
15:20:27 [ericP]
... any other suggestions?
15:20:31 [ivan]
15:20:47 [ericP]
... would like liason status update at beginnings of meetings
15:21:03 [bijan]
I think it's overkill to do it each telecon...generally, there's fewer occasions to mention
15:21:06 [bijan]
15:21:24 [souri2]
souri2 has joined #sparql
15:21:25 [bijan]
zakim, unmute me
15:21:25 [Zakim]
bijan should no longer be muted
15:21:43 [LeeF]
ack bijan
15:21:56 [ericP]
RESOLVED: Bijan appointed OWL liason
15:21:57 [iv_an_ru]
Orri and I are in RDB2RDF
15:22:04 [ericP]
q+ to say i have good contact with HCLS
15:22:14 [AxelPolleres]
Bijan: additional liaison XQuery?
15:22:20 [bijan]
+1 to eric for liasing with HCLS
15:22:27 [ericP]
RESOLVED: ericP appointed HCLS liason
15:22:31 [ivan]
q+ can also liaise with OWL if bijan has a problem of timing, for example
15:22:46 [ericP]
RESOLVED: orri appointed RDB2RDF liason
15:22:58 [ericP]
RESOLVED: axel appointed RIF liason
15:23:29 [ericP]
ack me
15:23:31 [Zakim]
ericP, you wanted to say i have good contact with HCLS
15:24:18 [AxelPolleres]
Should we "advertise" to them? maybe someone was interested to join us, at least to follow?
15:24:21 [AndyS]
XQuery arealos working on full text search
15:24:33 [LeeF]
zakim, mute ericP
15:24:33 [Zakim]
EricP should now be muted
15:24:40 [ericP]
but i was locally muted
15:24:46 [AndyS]
s/arealoo/are also/
15:24:49 [ericP]
ericP: expect that we will need to touch XQuery if we import more XPath functions
15:24:51 [LeeF]
topic: F2F
15:24:58 [AndyS]
s/arealos/are also/
15:25:23 [ericP]
LeeF: most folks have tougher travel restrictions than in the past
15:25:37 [iv_an_ru]
we will need to touch XQuery if we extend XQuery with SPARQL :)
15:25:37 [ericP]
... don't expect to have our four meetings this year
15:25:56 [ericP]
... hope to have a f2f a couple months from now when we settle on our deliverables
15:27:24 [ericP]
PROPOSED: host first f2f 5-6May in Cambridge, MA, USA -- (other telecon sites may be amendmants)
15:27:43 [bijan]
tues are potentially bad
15:28:09 [AndyS]
May 6,7 is preferrable to me as well. Can make May 5 if necessary
15:28:25 [bijan]
I can't do tues easily
15:28:53 [LeeF]
zakim, unmute ericP
15:28:53 [Zakim]
EricP should no longer be muted
15:29:26 [AxelPolleres]
eric: rooms might be a problem 7-8
15:31:17 [bijan]
2 days
15:31:22 [chimezie]
+1 2 days
15:31:24 [ywang4]
2 days should be fine
15:31:28 [SteveH]
+1 2 days
15:31:30 [ivan]
2 days (it is hard to keep up work of that intensity for 3 days)
15:31:40 [souri2]
May 6-7 is better for me. 2 days.
15:31:42 [AndyS]
2 days unless it is clear 3 is needed
15:31:52 [bijan]
Can't do the 5th
15:31:58 [bijan]
(most likely)
15:32:07 [AxelPolleres]
no preference
15:32:24 [ywang4]
okay, i can try to adapt
15:33:04 [iv_an_ru]
My US visa has expired so I'm probably missing the f2f.
15:33:14 [AxelPolleres]
let's tentatively fix 6-7 shall we also set up a questionaire?
15:33:15 [SteveH]
+q to ask about multi site
15:33:56 [ivan]
15:34:00 [bijan]
I think chairs decision is fine
15:34:14 [LeeF]
ack SteveH
15:34:14 [Zakim]
SteveH, you wanted to ask about multi site
15:34:19 [bijan]
As long as it's announced far enough in advance...8 weeks
15:34:57 [AndyS]
I can ask our comms people about a telecon link
15:35:07 [bijan]
I can ask about access grid access
15:35:27 [LeeF]
zakim, mute ericP
15:35:27 [Zakim]
EricP should now be muted
15:35:56 [LeeF]
Pick other (U.K. / Europe?) site in the next week or two, please send possibilities to mailing list
15:36:27 [ericP]
PROPOSED: host first f2f 6-7May in Cambridge, MA, USA -- (other telecon sites may be amendmants)
15:36:39 [souri2]
What will be the hours for F2F?
15:36:41 [AxelPolleres]
15:36:49 [AxelPolleres]
15:36:56 [ericP]
q+ to mention video room availability
15:37:52 [LeeF]
ack ericP
15:37:54 [Zakim]
ericP, you wanted to mention video room availability
15:37:59 [LeeF]
ack AxelPolleres
15:38:16 [ivan]
15:38:23 [bijan]
Manchester has a room
15:38:35 [bijan]
HP has one...I've seen it :)
15:39:10 [ivan]
ack ivan
15:40:41 [LeeF]
zakim, mute ericP
15:40:41 [Zakim]
EricP should now be muted
15:41:02 [LeeF]
topic: use cases
15:41:24 [iv_an_ru]
use case 1: TPC-H
15:41:36 [iv_an_ru]
(we pass it in SPARQL :)
15:41:39 [ericP]
LeeF: 1st phase: define what features we want to work on
15:41:56 [ericP]
... we're bound to 18 months, including spec, tests, impl report
15:42:13 [ericP]
... likely a very small set. need to settle on them in the next month
15:42:25 [bijan]
15:42:38 [AxelPolleres]
Please indicate your availability for F2F1 on the wiki page:
15:42:53 [ericP]
... we're blurring the line between use case and feature
15:43:15 [ericP]
... e.g. "peform aggregate functions", "query over arbitrary length tasks"
15:43:46 [AndyS]
q+ to ask about outside contributions
15:43:51 [ericP]
... we're not aiming for higher-level use cases, à la "Bob runs a stereo store..."
15:44:16 [ericP]
... looking for examples, implementations
15:44:27 [LeeF]
ack bijan
15:44:29 [iv_an_ru]
use case 2: a graph with Gantt chart, personal calendars and some trivial validation.
15:44:29 [bijan]
zakim, unmute me
15:44:29 [Zakim]
bijan was not muted, bijan
15:44:34 [ericP]
... need a champions who will speak in depth about the feature
15:44:52 [ericP]
bijan: would we do one req, or stagger them?
15:45:10 [ivan]
15:45:22 [bijan]
zakim, mute me
15:45:22 [Zakim]
bijan should now be muted
15:45:36 [ericP]
LeeF: should we write todo list or a priority list?
15:45:38 [bijan]
zakim, unmute me
15:45:38 [Zakim]
bijan should no longer be muted
15:45:47 [ericP]
bijan: i like getting things done
15:46:02 [ericP]
... but there's value publicity of a slew of things
15:46:09 [ericP]
... but if we can get stuff out
15:46:11 [ericP]
15:46:13 [AxelPolleres]
15:46:16 [bijan]
zakim, mute me
15:46:16 [Zakim]
bijan should now be muted
15:46:48 [ericP]
AndyS: knocking off some easy ones would get the community engaged
15:46:52 [bijan]
+1 to AndyS
15:46:59 [LeeF]
ack ivan
15:47:03 [SteveH]
+1 to AndyS
15:47:04 [ericP]
... i like to work on one thing at a time, and do i properly
15:47:16 [ericP]
ivan: short charter, and rec process takes time and energy
15:47:26 [AndyS]
s/do i /do it /
15:47:30 [ericP]
... publishing several things in a staggered way could backfire
15:47:42 [bijan]
q+ to answer
15:47:51 [ericP]
... bijan, is the idea to pub sparql1,1, 1,2, 1.3?
15:47:52 [bijan]
zakim, unmute me
15:47:52 [Zakim]
bijan should no longer be muted
15:48:05 [AxelPolleres]
15:48:09 [iv_an_ru]
15:48:12 [ericP]
bijan, was wondering if we could modularize parts into specs.
15:48:24 [bijan]
zakim, mute me
15:48:24 [Zakim]
bijan should now be muted
15:48:26 [ericP]
... e.g. separate owl semantics spec
15:48:59 [Zakim]
15:49:01 [Zakim]
15:49:01 [LeeF]
ack ericP
15:49:11 [bijan]
The HTML5 spec indicates the stability levels of different *sections* of the spec...which might be good for implementors
15:49:13 [ericP]
LeeF: modularizing sounds great, if we can modularize ourselves
15:49:17 [AndyS]
+1 to modularization (if it does not cause rework just for modulrity)
15:49:26 [LeeF]
ack bijan
15:49:27 [Zakim]
bijan, you wanted to answer
15:49:32 [LeeF]
zakim, mute bijan
15:49:33 [Zakim]
bijan should now be muted
15:49:35 [bijan]
zakim, mute me
15:49:35 [Zakim]
bijan was already muted, bijan
15:50:38 [LeeF]
ack AxelPolleres
15:50:44 [sandro]
RRSAgent, pointer?
15:50:44 [RRSAgent]
15:50:47 [ericP]
ericP: could modularize sections, do tests and impl reports, and package as a spec when we get near the end
15:51:10 [ericP]
AxelPolleres: use cases should identify which spec they affect (e.g. protocol, xml results format)
15:51:25 [ericP]
... we've listed deliverables in the charter. we're not bound to that?
15:51:42 [ericP]
LeeF: nope. our deliverables will fall out from our use cases
15:52:04 [SteveH]
q+ to ask about terminology
15:52:16 [LeeF]
ack iv_an_ru
15:52:57 [ericP]
iv_an_ru: not sure the final doc should be a single spec, e.g. SPARQL1.1
15:53:09 [ericP]
... they [features] are more useful when used together
15:53:24 [ericP]
... when i need business intelligence, i need it on everything
15:53:29 [ivan]
+1 to iv_an_ru
15:53:34 [ericP]
LeeF: don't expect us to break up core parts
15:54:07 [LeeF]
15:54:13 [LeeF]
ack SteveH
15:54:13 [Zakim]
SteveH, you wanted to ask about terminology
15:54:13 [bijan]
The spec shouldn't have everything it but neither should it be the minimal publishable unit
15:54:17 [ericP]
... don't want to lose interop if all these features are on their own specs
15:54:21 [bijan]
15:55:01 [ericP]
SteveH: do we want use cases?
15:55:09 [bijan]
New features + rationale?
15:55:14 [ericP]
... am nagged by calling features "use cases"
15:55:14 [iv_an_ru]
15:55:20 [AxelPolleres]
15:55:31 [ericP]
... just want to call them what they are
15:55:32 [chimezie]
then perhaps we should be a little more explicit in the request for what we want (usecase v.s. feature request)
15:55:32 [bijan]
(The OWL document is called "new features and rationales"
15:55:42 [ericP]
LeeF: agreed. would like to dive straight into features
15:56:11 [ericP]
SteveH: when we prioritize, we'll talk about use cases, regardless of whether we write them down
15:56:36 [AndyS]
While features are natural/obvious this is OK but if one comes along which the WG as a whole finds unobvious, we need to back off to use cases.
15:56:49 [LeeF]
+1 to AndyS_
15:56:53 [SteveH]
15:56:53 [ericP]
AxelPolleres: template rationale: thought the features we want to add should be driven by practical examples
15:57:07 [iv_an_ru]
use cases should be written down at least in our wiki, if not in final docs, because they demonstrate how features "interoperate".
15:57:14 [bijan]
Use cases doesn't exhaust...e.g., implementability are also considerations
15:57:17 [ericP]
... had in mind to merge use cases in the 2nd phase
15:57:28 [ericP]
... good feature requests often have a use case around them
15:57:57 [iv_an_ru]
Let's think that everything is implementable :)
15:58:01 [bijan]
So, new feature: "Awesome feature"; rationale: "here's the intuition", "here's the implementation considerations", "here's some use cases"
15:58:10 [ericP]
... if you a system with .e.g aggregates, add you syntax to that feature
15:58:58 [bijan]
Are we all registered in the wiki? If not what do we do?
15:59:21 [SteveH]
+1 to calling the features and having a usecase subsection
15:59:27 [ericP]
LeeF: let's call them features (tweak the template), add a section for use cases under each feature, and have example syntaxes for the feature
15:59:44 [LukeWM]
+1 to that too
15:59:49 [ywang4]
will go offline shortly, have fun :)
15:59:59 [ericP]
APPROVED: rename "use cases" to "features"
16:00:10 [Zakim]
16:00:14 [bijan]
Did I miss the in
16:00:18 [ywang4]
ywang4 has left #sparql
16:00:25 [bijan]
structiosn for getting on the wiki?
16:00:33 [Zakim]
16:00:53 [bijan]
Oh. Ewwwww
16:00:57 [LeeF]
I'll send a bunch about this in email
16:01:09 [Zakim]
16:02:12 [LeeF]
ack AndyS
16:02:12 [Zakim]
AndyS, you wanted to ask about outside contributions
16:02:26 [AxelPolleres]
16:02:52 [ericP]
AndyS: what about folks who are not in the group, but plan to join
16:02:58 [ericP]
... ?
16:03:08 [ivan]
16:03:09 [ericP]
LeeF: would like folks to send to public-rdf-dawg-comments
16:03:35 [LeeF]
ack ivan
16:03:39 [bijan]
+1 to open solicitation
16:03:40 [SteveH]
risks a lot of work sorting out duplicates
16:03:44 [ericP]
AndyS: danger of opening floodgate
16:03:46 [SteveH]
but still +1
16:03:50 [bijan]
We can always say "no" :)
16:03:59 [LeeF]
I'll take the responsibility for sorting out dupes :-)
16:04:10 [AxelPolleres]
16:04:25 [bijan]
No specification without championiation!
16:04:27 [iv_an_ru]
We can invite people to read the wiki before (re)submitting proposals :)
16:04:39 [LeeF]
iv_an_ru +1
16:04:53 [AxelPolleres]
heavy echo
16:05:04 [Zakim]
16:05:08 [Zakim]
16:05:10 [bijan]
ta ta
16:05:18 [AxelPolleres]
scribenick: AxelPolleres
16:05:48 [AxelPolleres]
Ivan: we can allow input from those who intend to join.
16:05:52 [ericP]
RRSAgent, please draft minutes
16:05:52 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate ericP
16:05:57 [ericP]
RRSAgent, please make log world-visible
16:06:14 [AxelPolleres]
Lee: Will sned an email on the list to gather as many features as we can by next week.
16:06:19 [iv_an_ru]
Even more, implementation providers may announce in their support mailing lists that they collect wishes for SPARQL 2.0 and act as proxies.
16:06:38 [AndyS]
SPARQL 1.1 please. Not 2.0. It's incremental!
16:06:44 [AxelPolleres]
... Is it appropriate to list that on the blog as well.
16:06:46 [SteveH]
+1 to SPARQL 1.1
16:06:48 [AxelPolleres]
Ivan: sure.
16:07:03 [iv_an_ru]
ok, SPARQL 1.1
16:07:18 [AxelPolleres]
Ivan: Next week will be messy, since meeting is one hour earlier!!!
16:07:38 [SteveH]
16:07:40 [AxelPolleres]
meeting adjourned
16:07:41 [Zakim]
16:07:43 [Zakim]
16:07:44 [Zakim]
16:07:44 [Zakim]
16:07:44 [Zakim]
16:07:46 [Zakim]
16:07:49 [Zakim]
16:07:51 [Zakim]
16:07:53 [Zakim]
16:07:59 [AxelPolleres]
RRSAgent, please draft minutes
16:07:59 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate AxelPolleres
16:08:22 [Zakim]
16:08:30 [AxelPolleres]
RRSAgent, list attendees
16:08:30 [RRSAgent]
I'm logging. I don't understand 'list attendees', AxelPolleres. Try /msg RRSAgent help
16:08:38 [LeeF]
AxelPolleres, do you want to try to follow the scribe instructions, or would you like me to?
16:08:38 [AxelPolleres]
Zakim, list attendees
16:08:38 [Zakim]
As of this point the attendees have been LeeF, kasei, AndyS, +1.216.445.aaaa, iv_an_ru, bijan, [Garlik], Chimezie_Ogbuji, john-l, terraces, AxelPolleres, ivan, +656304aabb, ywang4,
16:08:42 [Zakim]
... +1.603.897.aacc, Souri, EricP, Ori, daveNewman, Souri_Das
16:08:43 [AxelPolleres]
RRSAgent, list attendees
16:08:43 [RRSAgent]
I'm logging. I don't understand 'list attendees', AxelPolleres. Try /msg RRSAgent help
16:08:45 [AxelPolleres]
RRSAgent, please draft minutes
16:08:45 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate AxelPolleres
16:08:57 [Zakim]
16:08:59 [Zakim]
SW_(SPARQL)10:00AM has ended
16:09:01 [Zakim]
Attendees were LeeF, kasei, AndyS, +1.216.445.aaaa, iv_an_ru, bijan, [Garlik], Chimezie_Ogbuji, john-l, terraces, AxelPolleres, ivan, +656304aabb, ywang4, +1.603.897.aacc, Souri,
16:09:03 [Zakim]
... EricP, Ori, daveNewman, Souri_Das
16:11:12 [LukeWM_]
LukeWM_ has joined #sparql
16:11:23 [SteveH]
SteveH has joined #sparql
16:12:05 [LeeF]
ok, I'm on the minutes, plus sending variety of emails to people
16:12:13 [LeeF]
but not for a few hours :D